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Yes, that is literally what Donald Tusk has been saying all afternoon. He, and Barnier, really have been playing 3 dimensional chess, compared to the Conservatives, who have just been playing snap with their own poop.
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Nov 15, 2018 18:49
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If labour were to win an election couldn't they just say: brexit has caused the collapse of one government, we are not about to continue exploring such a disruptive policy, and then just withdraw their art. 50 letter (which the EU seems keen on)? What is the ramifications of doing that? So long as they keep backbench support they should be safe, though I guess you could argue it's abandoning the principle of responsible government as it is currently understood. Edit: beaten sort of, but I guess I am asking is there a statuatory requirement for government to keep pushing the issue. My understanding is..maybe. but I haven't kept up on my parliamentary knowledge as much as I should.
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Nov 15, 2018 18:50
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I don't think the EU will accept it though? Or they will make them jump through so many hoops it will be humiliating
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Nov 15, 2018 18:52
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looking at this from a US perspective it seems to match our problem in that a rather non-trivial amount of elected officials are financially compromised and like 40% of the country thinks theyre owning the British equivalent of Mexicans by doing it
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Nov 15, 2018 18:52
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But if they withdrew then the UK would have to admit they made a mistake and look silly in the eyes of the world and we couldn't have that now, could we.
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Nov 15, 2018 18:53
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Bernard McFacknutah posted:who have just been playing snap with their own poop. That's an amazing image.
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Nov 15, 2018 18:53
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Brexit is going to be the textbook example (until someone else tops them) on why you don't crowdsource a decision like this.
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Nov 15, 2018 18:55
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Bernard McFacknutah posted:Pretty strong chance the UK government falls by the end of the week. 3 Ministers gone today and Theresa May has poo poo the bed massively at Parliament today. Bernard McFacknutah posted:This round of negotiations is hosed anyway. There is close to a zero chance that the current bill will make it through Parliament and when it doesn't, May doesn't really have any other option than quit, call a vote of no confidence herself, or let some fuckface like Gove try and renegotiate the deal, which won't happen because the EU isn't stupid. I'm really curious. Do you feel at all complicit for the fact that your country is facing a massive disaster?
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Nov 15, 2018 18:57
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Hot Karl Marx posted:I don't think the EU will accept it though? Or they will make them jump through so many hoops it will be humiliating Tusk has said openly that the EU would be happy to toss the art. 50 letter. As recently as today. Phone posting though so don't have a link.
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Nov 15, 2018 18:58
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EBB posted:But if they withdrew then the UK would have to admit they made a mistake and look silly in the eyes of the world and we couldn't have that now, could we. Corbyn has no issue doing this, I'm no Labour fan but I like the fact that he seems broadly prepared to admit uncomfortable national truths (just don't ask him about antisemitism.) As I understand it, article 50 can be repealed if there is a unanimous agreement between EU members, and I suspect that that wouldn't be a problem. Obviously massive national hat eating would follow. On the UK side, if there was a general election and Labour campaigned with the pledge to have another referendum, then won, then passed another act of parliament superceeding the brexit one, then yes, it would kill brexit. There is a pretty hefty movement calling for that already, a march in London last month had more than half a million people calling for a second vote.
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Nov 15, 2018 18:58
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Bernard McFacknutah posted:Corbyn has no issue doing this, I'm no Labour fan but I like the fact that he seems broadly prepared to admit uncomfortable national truths (just don't ask him about antisemitism.) A lot of the damage from companies leaving will be permanent but it won't be a complete disaster at least here. If Brexit goes through theres no way they could ever rejoin and keep the GBP.
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Nov 15, 2018 19:01
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they should do a second vote then all the olds that didn't vote the first time come out and push it in favor again DOUBLE BREXIT
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Nov 15, 2018 19:01
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TF CURES GENERATOR posted:I'm really curious. Do you feel at all complicit for the fact that your country is facing a massive disaster? Honestly, yes. I thought we would have handled the exit better, I wasn't dumb enough to think we would come out of it unscathed. This is just a farce. By exit, I thought we would just leave without a deal, a year ago, take the initial hit and probably year of recession and re-negotiate a trade deal afterwards. Instead its hosed from start to finish because no one bothered actually negotiating with any urgency or a formative plan and really wasn't what I voted for at all. I have a distinct feeling that this will drag on until January when we will end up with another General election, a repealing of Brexit and then a weak Labour government that hasn't got it's own house in order yet.
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Nov 15, 2018 19:02
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So you're gonna vote stay this time, right?
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Nov 15, 2018 19:04
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EBB posted:So you're gonna vote stay this time, right? Yep, I still want out, but we can't seem to loving manage it.
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Nov 15, 2018 19:05
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Bernard McFacknutah posted:Yep, I still want out, but we can't seem to loving manage it. But... why
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Nov 15, 2018 19:13
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I don't like how the EU manages trade with the rest of the world, mainly. Because of dumping taxes being used punitively in my industry in particular, we can't import from Asia and are forced to import, at a much inflated price, from French and German manufacturers. EU regulations and product standards get abused to act as a form of trade protectionism, which doesn't protect the consumer, just ends up driving up prices etc. I'm not dumb enough to think that leaving will bring manufacturing back to the UK, in fact my family moved our manufacturing base out mostly to Turkey, but structured trade, collective trade negotiations and regulation are just by-words for trade protectionism.
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Nov 15, 2018 19:19
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Guess who Donnie Smooth Brains is considering offering to Turkey to ease Khashoggi tensions?
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Nov 15, 2018 19:20
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Vasudus posted:DOUBLE BREXIT whelp now I know what I want for Christmas
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Nov 15, 2018 19:20
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Casimir Radon posted:Guess who Donnie Smooth Brains is considering offering to Turkey to ease Khashoggi tensions? also god dammit I knew who it was before I clicked
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Nov 15, 2018 19:21
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Bernard McFacknutah posted:I don't like how the EU manages trade with the rest of the world, mainly. Because of dumping taxes being used punitively in my industry in particular, we can't import from Asia and are forced to import, at a much inflated price, from French and German manufacturers. EU regulations and product standards get abused to act as a form of trade protectionism, which doesn't protect the consumer, just ends up driving up prices etc. oh so it's stopping you from getting even wealthier
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Nov 15, 2018 19:25
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Yes, in part. It also keeps prices higher for the general public, instead of importing from South Korea, we have to buy semi-processed materials from Germany at prices that are 60% higher, that gets passed on. I fail to see how any part of that equation benefits the UK. It was a similar story when I worked for another family business about 10 years ago, they manufactured chemicals for the dry cleaning industry.
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Nov 15, 2018 19:29
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Bernard McFacknutah posted:I don't like how the EU manages trade with the rest of the world, mainly. Because of dumping taxes being used punitively in my industry in particular, we can't import from Asia and are forced to import, at a much inflated price, from French and German manufacturers. EU regulations and product standards get abused to act as a form of trade protectionism, which doesn't protect the consumer, just ends up driving up prices etc. You hate Europe for being Europe it sounds like
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Nov 15, 2018 19:31
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Love 2 destroy my Nation for my families profit and pretend that it's for the people
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Nov 15, 2018 19:31
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Bernard McFacknutah posted:Yes, in part. tell me more you bougie cocksucker
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Nov 15, 2018 19:39
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Hot Karl Marx posted:I don't think the EU will accept it though? Or they will make them jump through so many hoops it will be humiliating Compared to what they've been doing for the past 2 years? Vasudus posted:Brexit is going to be the textbook example (until someone else tops them) on why you don't crowdsource a decision like this. The Boaty McBoatface of global politics.
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Nov 15, 2018 19:39
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https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/...ingawful.com%2F
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Nov 15, 2018 19:41
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How else am I supposed to afford the third Jaguar if brexit doesn't happen
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Nov 15, 2018 19:41
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Aren't jags just BMWs with a bit of a makeover, like the rest of british cars? Plus I'm pretty sure my Camaro is faster 😎
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Nov 15, 2018 19:42
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Proud Christian Mom posted:they painted themselves into one hell of a corner with Brexit and have spent the past however long doing nothing to get out of it lololol I will be so glad if at the last minute everybody just agrees to a brexit deal that is equivalent to not ever voting to leave in the first place.
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Nov 15, 2018 19:43
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Hot Karl Marx posted:Aren't jags just BMWs with a bit of a makeover, like the rest of british cars? They used to be Fords with more questionable electronics, until Jag was sold to Tata. Edit: And with a tune, a Taurus was faster than a Camaro until recently.
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Nov 15, 2018 19:43
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Godholio posted:They used to be Fords with more questionable electronics, until Jag was sold to Tata. A Ford Taurus? Also I got a 2017 so it's a newer one but I haven't done any work on it yet cause I was saving for a house. But I'm going to do an engine swap on my '87 supra for a 2jz first I think
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Nov 15, 2018 19:46
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hjVe_PTODcM
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Nov 15, 2018 19:46
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...isn't that the entire point of why the EU trade agreements exist? To prevent capitalism from running rampant and destroying national economies for the sake of saving ten cents on the dollar, driving a colossal wedge of inequality and resentment into a region of the world that's largely been at war with itself since time began? or is that 
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Nov 15, 2018 19:47
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Vasudus posted:...isn't that the entire point of why the EU trade agreements exist? To prevent capitalism from running rampant and destroying national economies for the sake of saving ten cents on the dollar, driving a colossal wedge of inequality and resentment into a region of the world that's largely been at war with itself since time began? loving the poor is an English tradition
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Nov 15, 2018 19:47
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Vasudus posted:...isn't that the entire point of why the EU trade agreements exist? To prevent capitalism from running rampant and destroying national economies for the sake of saving ten cents on the dollar, driving a colossal wedge of inequality and resentment into a region of the world that's largely been at war with itself since time began? That's a pretty good description of it. It was to prevent the industrial and economic powerhouses of the EU from crushing the lesser members, and introduce some semblance of equality. Of course someone who says "gently caress the poor I want to be rich" would have a dim view of the EU regs.
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Nov 15, 2018 19:50
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Hot Karl Marx posted:A Ford Taurus? Also I got a 2017 so it's a newer one but I haven't done any work on it yet cause I was saving for a house. But I'm going to do an engine swap on my '87 supra for a 2jz first I think The Taurus SHO I'm guessing
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Nov 15, 2018 19:52
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Vasudus posted:...isn't that the entire point of why the EU trade agreements exist? To prevent capitalism from running rampant and destroying national economies for the sake of saving ten cents on the dollar, driving a colossal wedge of inequality and resentment into a region of the world that's largely been at war with itself since time began? Well it is the joke, but one that bernard is making on everyone's expense but his
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Nov 15, 2018 19:54
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another house seat for dems in Maine was called. +33 seats now, 7 still to be called
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Nov 15, 2018 19:56
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https://twitter.com/miketokes/status/1062908981281120256?s=21
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Nov 15, 2018 20:01
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