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Phi230 posted:Love to empower the state against people So we legalize extrajudicial punishment then? You see where this is going, right?
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Nov 25, 2018 19:54
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KickerOfMice posted:The government "removing people" is a conversation with a million frayed edges. What happens if that were policy now? I tend to agree. A single punch in a generally civilized community is a much better outcome and probably more effective than a giant governmental program deciding who needs to be "removed". Everyone went home afterwards safely and hopefully the Nazi learned he should not pop off at people with Nazi propaganda while wearing a swastika in downtown Seattle. I'm not an advocate for violence, but sometimes nothing more than a strong punch to the face can correct bad behavior. Not always, obviously, but if I got punched in the face by a stranger and the group around us cheered I might reconsider my recent behavior that led to me being punched in the face on the street and having people around clapping. And he did get the message because he removed the armband, didn't press charges, and left. The non-system works!
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Nov 25, 2018 19:54
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Lightning Knight posted:I would argue there’s a distinct difference between understanding a worldview and empathizing with a worldview. I empathize with conservatism because I come from a conservative place and was conservative, and it takes practice and active thought to empathize with the marginalized instead given that privilege. Yes it does and there is. But how did you get to where you are? Can you teach someone else to empathize with the marginalized?
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Nov 25, 2018 19:54
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Koalas Massacre posted:As someone who has had experience with racism of all kinds both online and off (I told y'all about the time I had a bottle thrown at me right??) the best thing you can do when they go full fash is clock them square in the jaw. 
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Nov 25, 2018 19:54
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E: wrong thread
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Nov 25, 2018 19:54
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KillHour posted:So we legalize extrajudicial punishment then? You see where this is going, right? morality isn't about legality all the time
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Nov 25, 2018 19:54
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KillHour posted:So we legalize extrajudicial punishment then? You see where this is going, right? Nah it shouldn’t be legal (well maybe it should but that would never happen) to punch Nazis. It is 100% moral, however.
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Nov 25, 2018 19:55
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Dapper_Swindler posted:there are liberal/socialy progressive evangelicals around still. alot of young ones are pretty big into environmental protection and conservation. Fred Slacktivist Clark is worth reading.
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Nov 25, 2018 19:55
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BrandorKP posted:Yes it does and there is. But how did you get to where you are? Can you teach someone else to empathize with the marginalized? I was taught by people with extraordinary patience and even then it was a lot of 100% justified name calling and making GBS threads on me until my opinions improved. Marginalized people should not be expected automatically to shoulder that burden however.
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Nov 25, 2018 19:56
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KillHour posted:So we legalize extrajudicial punishment then? You see where this is going, right? Nope, it should remain illegal to punch nazis, but also everyone should continue to punch nazid anyway.
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Nov 25, 2018 19:56
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Lightning Knight posted:I don’t really think you’re going to effectively organize and win over Republican voters or evangelical Christians to the Democratic Party without making unacceptable compromises on the rights of marginalized people but maybe I’m misunderstanding you here. who said anything about organizing republican voters. i said not alienating the evangelicals that are already an extremely important part of the democratic base with ignorant generalizations. evangelical christians are democrats, because the term is near-meaningless eke out fucked around with this message at 20:00 on Nov 25, 2018 |
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Nov 25, 2018 19:56
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Your Taint posted:This is why I laugh when people prasie him for donating his salary. "HE'S SO SELFLESS HE'S DOING THIS JOB FOR FREE!!" gently caress you. which iirc theres still no proof he's done that.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:01
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eke out posted:who said anything about organizing republican voters. i said not alienating the evangelicals that are already an extremely important part of the democratic base with ignorant generalizations. evangelical christians are democrats, because the term is near-meaningless So you’re making a semantic argument? I don’t mean that to be sarcastic I think I genuinely confused myself here.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:03
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tehinternet posted:Dude just posted like 15 paragraphs and this is the lazy poo poo you post. C’mon. my post had more words than this retort so its invalid, sorry
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Nov 25, 2018 20:07
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Condiv posted:check out this article Actually, the elephant in the room is that 30 loving million people in America today have Type 2 Diabetes (which is overwhelmingly caused by lifestyle factors). That's almost 10% of the population. In 2015, it was estimated that almost 8% of total US healthcare spending was going to treating obesity-related problems. And that's just the average. Some states spend as much as 20% of their Medicaid budget on obesity-related illness.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:07
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Lightning Knight posted:I was taught by people with extraordinary patience and even then it was a lot of 100% justified name calling and making GBS threads on me until my opinions improved. Marginalized people should not be expected automatically to shoulder that burden however. Oh absolutely. We should not be expecting the marginalized to do it. Those of us not marginalized should be changing the people around us and potentially considering the people around them, that they might change in turn. That takes empathy.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:07
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lol at having both obesity and starvation problems. Merica. The fact that regressives do the whole "but poors have fridges", pre-change Scrooge was the real hero, War on Xmas, and parents of those poors should spend more money on food than ringtones, is such loving bullshit. PhazonLink fucked around with this message at 20:12 on Nov 25, 2018 |
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Nov 25, 2018 20:08
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BrandorKP posted:Oh absolutely. We should not be expecting the marginalized to do it. Those of us not marginalized should be changing the people around us and potentially considering the people around them, that they might change in turn. That takes empathy. I mean I actually do this irl. But on SA imma poo poo on terrible people for being terrible.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:09
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How many Type 1 patients are there compared to Type 2?
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Nov 25, 2018 20:10
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:How many Type 1 patients are there compared to Type 2? I think something like 5% of diabetics are type 1. It's a lot harder to be born with a hosed up pancreas than it is to eat yourself into a permanent food coma.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:11
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Lightning Knight posted:So you’re making a semantic argument? this was all in response to things like sexpig by night posted:American evangelical Christianity is a political movement with religious trappings. There are plenty of true believers in the rank and file but none of their leaders have enough of a soul to have actual religious principles that would ever supersede their political ambitions Radish posted:The fundamental ideology of American evangelical Christianity is racism. it's a semantic argument in the sense that i'm saying that using the word 'evangelical' this way is both literally wrong, because it describes a broad tendency by only referring to the most conservative whitest strain of it, and pragmatically wrong as well because you erase or elide the sincerely held beliefs of people that actually agree with us already
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Nov 25, 2018 20:13
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PhazonLink posted:which iirc theres still no proof he's done that. there was "proof" in the form of him donating his salary to the national parks service with the ranger receiving the check and looking nonplussed 
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Nov 25, 2018 20:14
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Mr Luxury Yacht posted:I think something like 5% of diabetics are type 1. It's a lot harder to be born with a hosed up pancreas than it is to eat yourself into a permanent food coma. I bet there’s a nice line graph of people with type 2 that starts in the 80s and just shoots straight up.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:14
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KillHour posted:I agree. There just needs to be some way for society to say "you can't go around waiving swastikas" without either jailing non-fascist minority groups or bringing back lynching. Or maybe there doesn't. Maybe we just say being a Nazi is a first amendment right. But we need to pick. We can't just rely on cops looking the other way because that's going to lead to lynching in places where the cops are the Nazis. I think you're trying to slice this issue a bit too thinly. It's easy to say "Nazis are bad and shouldn't exist". But when the government is made up by a large portion of Nazis and Nazi-sympathizers any law created to target Nazis would inevitably ensnare people who aren't Nazis and who just have opinions the government currently doesn't approve of (and might not end up targeting Nazis at all!). I believe in the first amendment and free speech and I'm very hesitant to give the government any foothold to restrict it. Being a Nazi or a racist is a first amendment right. But you might also get punched in the face for it. If someone had punched out George Zimmerman for weird racist stalking before he started carrying a gun around and thinking he was Batman maybe he would have sat at home a lot more pouting and Trayvon Martin would be alive. I think spanking children is wrong, but it's allowed. If hitting children to correct their behavior is allowed and accepted then punching a grown man for yelling Nazi poo poo at people on the street shouldn't make us get out the fainting couch.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:17
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Sounds like the best term would be to call them fundamentalist evangelicals to account for the diversity that exists in the purely evangelical column, but to clarify their focus on alternate history, etc which further defines the “fundie” strain.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:20
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PhazonLink posted:lol at having both obesity and starvation problems. Merica. Actually, contrary to popular belief, obesity is almost exclusively related to how the body regulates fat. The whole "calories in, calories out" thing is a myth. It is entirely possible to become obese even at a caloric deficit. Your body simply cannibalizes other tissues (starting with muscles) to make up the deficit.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:20
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enraged_camel posted:Actually, the elephant in the room is that 30 loving million people in America today have Type 2 Diabetes (which is overwhelmingly caused by lifestyle factors). Right, but that doesn't really change the situation and gives detractors a believable talking point of "the trick is prevention" despite the fact it'll do nothing for the vast majority of people already diagnosed, and the fact that obesity education/prevention/early treatment also requires money.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:21
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enraged_camel posted:Actually, contrary to popular belief, obesity is almost exclusively related to how the body regulates fat. The whole "calories in, calories out" thing is a myth. It is entirely possible to become obese even at a caloric deficit. Your body simply cannibalizes other tissues (starting with muscles) to make up the deficit. This is... controversial to say the least.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:22
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enraged_camel posted:Actually, contrary to popular belief, obesity is almost exclusively related to how the body regulates fat. The whole "calories in, calories out" thing is a myth. It is entirely possible to become obese even at a caloric deficit. Your body simply cannibalizes other tissues (starting with muscles) to make up the deficit. This is not correct.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:23
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KillHour posted:So we legalize extrajudicial punishment then? You see where this is going, right? Hell yeah dude, I love to concern troll about non-issues to defend nazis in the street
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Nov 25, 2018 20:23
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Let me ask you, was it right for black sharecroppers to arm themselves against the KKK? I, the very white, privileged liberal am extremely concerned about this issue! There must be law and order so I can feel comfortable!
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Nov 25, 2018 20:25
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this dude rules by the way https://twitter.com/DamianCollins/status/1066773746491498498
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Nov 25, 2018 20:26
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Direct anti-fascist action works, and your method does not. It is that simple. The only reason you are so concerned about it is that you aren't the target of nazi violence and are comfortable enough to feel upset when a nazi gets punched in the face for some reason Like you are so concerned about a lesser violence when the right is literally killing people on a regular basis
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Nov 25, 2018 20:27
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Phi230 posted:Hell yeah dude, I love to concern troll about non-issues to defend nazis in the street Dude is obviously not trolling, or supporting nazis  lay off with that.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:28
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eke out posted:this was all in response to things like Alright I think I understand and I don’t think I disagree.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:29
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KickerOfMice posted:Dude is obviously not trolling, or supporting nazis He is making a trade off. To him, allowing nazis to organize in the effort of mass violence is preferable to punching them to prevent that mass violence. He just wants law and order, he seems to be fine when cops do the same violence that the right does.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:29
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Lightning Knight posted:I mean I actually do this irl. But on SA imma poo poo on terrible people for being terrible. Well yeah and we all do here. But that distinction (SA vs irl) you're drawing is a false one.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:30
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Lightning Knight posted:I know I’m late but this seems slightly absurd, not in that I doubt they would if they thought that they could get away with it I suppose, but that I don’t think we’re close to that point. That’s the kind of thing that would happen if the comfort of the powerful was legitimately threatened, which we aren’t at yet. Yeah, but I'm not saying it happens right now, I'm proposing a thought experiment where it clearly would happen in order to demonstrate a logical contradiction in the whole "vote left in the primaries, but always vote Dem in the general no matter what" idea that's being thrown about ITT. KillHour posted:We will have to disagree with the means then. Doesn't mean I don't smile watching that gif of Richard Spencer getting clocked, but it didn't achieve any actual progress besides making that one person afraid of getting punched again and if he died, the guy who hit him would absolutely be facing manslaughter charges or worse (and should). This is dead wrong and completely misunderstands how nazis work. The appeal of fascism is entirely built on the idea that the fascists are a group of invincible supermen that can do whatever they want to the weak, so when they get the piss beaten out of them it strikes at the very core of their worldview and is therefore a very efficient way of discrediting the entire nazi movement. And doubly so when a high-profile nazi is exposed as a sniveling pissbaby.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:30
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eke out posted:who said anything about organizing republican voters. i said not alienating the evangelicals that are already an extremely important part of the democratic base with ignorant generalizations. evangelical christians are democrats, because the term is near-meaningless Copy / paste "Evangelicals" with "White Evangelicals" and you got it made You will insult precisely nobody that would vote for you, because White Evangelical support for Trump is nearly unanimous (>90%) and the very few ones that don't back him still know what you are talking about Feldegast42 fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Nov 25, 2018 |
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Nov 25, 2018 20:31
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Mr Luxury Yacht posted:I think something like 5% of diabetics are type 1. It's a lot harder to be born with a hosed up pancreas than it is to eat yourself into a permanent food coma. I'm so glad that I got born into this elite club rather than being extremely wealthy or something like that. That said people with Type 2 Diabetes deserve treatment for their disease as much as anyone else, and I'm a little sad that Type 1 Diabetes made me so angry and bitter and resentful toward them for so long.
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Nov 25, 2018 20:31
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