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Thanks all - live in Slovakia now (though set up to “retire” to Austria at moments notice if needed). The loan thing was hyperbole, kind of a “what would I do if I had x days live left” thought - honestly having a concrete expiry date would make this all so much easier. Sad to say the facist thing is pretty likely now - we got honest to good nazi’s in our pairlament because the opposition can’t get their poo poo together. Kind of how us ended up with Trump.
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Nov 27, 2018 16:09
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Avalerion posted:Sad to say the facist thing is pretty likely now - we got honest to good nazi’s in our pairlament because the opposition can’t get their poo poo together. Most countries do these days, but we're not allowed to talk about fixing it in this thread.
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Nov 27, 2018 16:12
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Avalerion posted:Are we talking ice age like in Day after tommow - like freeze to death overnight? Climate Change is the Slow Death, not an awesome cinematic. As has been mentioned, how things will affect your welfare depends almost entirely on your personal wealth, as that's our insulation layer versus adversity in society. IE dramatically increased food prices, extended winters, or horrible heatwaves aren't going to kill you unless you're already struggling to make ends meet and can't afford air conditioning, or go homeless. But you'll definitely feel it. Unless you're really wealthy there's no way for your quality of life to be unaffected, and even then you'll still see the gears that makes that turn, like the global logistics network that sustains modern civilization, stutter then flop to the side. States will either fail or turn authoritarian left and right, often both, nevermind wars. And of course, a global, permanent, economic depression that gets worse and worse for the rest of your natural life. Because let me make this clear: even if we started doing everything right, making all the right calls to mitigate catastrophic Climate Change right this instant, you who are in your 30s will not live to see things start to get better before you die. We're 20 years too late for that party, so anything we do now is to prevent things from getting even worse than they'll already be. As of how to make the best of it, well, make a shitton of money. Build a strong and distributed support network. Keep yourself informed. Learn how to make do with drastically reduced consumption right now, on your own terms, rather than when circumstances force it upon you. Do not have children.
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Nov 27, 2018 16:42
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Conspiratiorist posted:As of how to make the best of it, well, make a shitton of money. Build a strong and distributed support network. Keep yourself informed. Learn how to make do with drastically reduced consumption right now, on your own terms, rather than when circumstances force it upon you. Do not have children. If you desire children though, consider adoption to biological procreation as it is already a sunk cost for carbon and population.
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Nov 27, 2018 16:45
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Is there a world map of possible changes to sea level and temperatures? I'm in Chile so I wonder how screwed I am.
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Nov 27, 2018 16:49
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For real, though, the answers to "what can I do to make climate change suck less for me?" are so boring that I think most people just outright ignore them. It basically boils down to living on less and being more involved in your community. Learning to garden is probably a good idea too. Not because you're going to starve or anything, but because it may become a lot more expensive to get food that isn't grown locally and knowing how to garden means you might not have to give up certain foods you enjoy. All of that assumes that you're in a fairly well off country, though. The flip side if you're in a particularly poor, vulnerable country is that there's absolutely nothing you can do and your country will probably collapse entirely.
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Nov 27, 2018 16:52
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gmq posted:Is there a world map of possible changes to sea level and temperatures? I'm in Chile so I wonder how screwed I am. For SLR check out a topology map: any area below 5ft above sea level is at risk but since Chile doesn't get hurricanes (and won't start anytime soon) it's more of a problem for coastal real estate developers and urban planners. The real issue is that every country north of Paraguay is a total write-off, and what a clusterfuck the ensuing refugee migrations and wars that'll be.
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Nov 27, 2018 17:18
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Answer might be boring but also the complete oposite of my knee jerk so thanks all, prob saved me from making some huge dumb mistakes. What would be some good countries to consider to move/migrate to in the longterm?
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Nov 27, 2018 17:26
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gmq posted:Is there a world map of possible changes to sea level and temperatures? I'm in Chile so I wonder how screwed I am. Temp and sea level wise? Not terrible, probably. Right now it's looking like the Northern Hemisphere will warm faster than the Southern, which will likely shift the tropical rain that hits Ecuador/Peru/Brazil north. What you'll need to worry about is shifting agricultural zones and refugees/political crisis.
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Nov 27, 2018 17:30
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Avalerion posted:Answer might be boring but also the complete oposite of my knee jerk so thanks all, prob saved me from making some huge dumb mistakes. Look into getting New Zealand citizenship within the next 5 to 10 years.
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Nov 27, 2018 17:35
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Conspiratiorist posted:Look into getting New Zealand citizenship within the next 5 to 10 years. I honestly don't think that NZ is the be all end all of climate change escapism that people claim. Sure maybe for the hyperwealthy. But for the rest of us, it doesn't really make much sense. For most people it would be far better for them to leverage their local and near local knowledge in the face of climate change. Figure out where near you will be able to continue to support your way of life and use your local knowledge to help predict how other people will act. Leaving for a new country puts you at extreme risk because it gives up your local knowledge and community engagement.
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Nov 27, 2018 19:04
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I don't think I would meet visa requirements anyway (only notable skills are a bunch of common languages) so would need to stick within the EU for this.
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Nov 27, 2018 19:33
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Avalerion posted:I don't think I would meet visa requirements anyway (only notable skills are a bunch of common languages) so would need to stick within the EU for this. And if you're in the EU, as long as the EU remains, the hyper local probably matters more than which country you're in. Like, don't live somewhere that's going to get destroyed by worsening floods, worsening storms, worsening fires, etc. But that'll occur in all the countries. If the EU is collapsing, your choices will be far more political based than climate.
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Nov 27, 2018 19:37
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ChairMaster posted:Most countries do these days, but we're not allowed to talk about fixing it in this thread. You're in love with this passive aggressive way of saying "the answer is political violence" and you ought to stop. We are well aware of what your stance on the matter is and you're well aware of the reasoning for why it can't be discussed itt.
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Nov 27, 2018 19:39
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NYT has a lengthy piece today on the side effects of collapsing food webs re: insects. A highlight:quote:The strange thing, Lister said, is that, as staggering as they are, all the declines he documented would still be basically invisible to the average person walking through the Luquillo rain forest. On his last visit, the forest still felt “timeless” and “phantasmagorical,” with “cascading waterfalls and carpets of flowers.” You would have to be an expert to notice what was missing. But he expects the losses to push the forest toward a tipping point, after which “there is a sudden and dramatic loss of the rain-forest system,” and the changes will become obvious to anyone. The place he loves will become unrecognizable. The scientists interviewed agree that a world without insects wouldn't cause human extinction on its own, just mass famine and resource wars, so there's that.
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Nov 27, 2018 20:51
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Good job christmas is on the way or I'd be getting really depressed :P
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Nov 27, 2018 22:08
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Lightning Knight posted:You're in love with this passive aggressive way of saying "the answer is political violence" and you ought to stop. We are well aware of what your stance on the matter is and you're well aware of the reasoning for why it can't be discussed itt. That's fair and I shouldn't have said it unprovoked, but am I not allowed to say it when people demand a substantive solution to problems that have no other solution? Am I just supposed to say "there isn't one", or in that circumstance can I still say we're not allowed to talk about it?
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Nov 27, 2018 22:16
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ChairMaster posted:That's fair and I shouldn't have said it unprovoked, but am I not allowed to say it when people demand a substantive solution to problems that have no other solution? Am I just supposed to say "there isn't one", or in that circumstance can I still say we're not allowed to talk about it? I think the bottom line as to why your not allowed to talk about revolution & eating the rich is that this site will get shut down pretty pronto.
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Nov 27, 2018 22:20
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Well obviously, but the issue here is that I'm saying that we're not allowed to talk about the thing, so assumedly he thinks that that's also enough to get the site in trouble, but that doesn't make a lot of sense really so I'm asking for clarification.
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Nov 27, 2018 22:24
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I promised I would post in this thread and here we go: First news as to what I'm doing. A few friends and I were tired of powerful NIMBY groups in our area preventing more affordable and denser housing and mass transit being built, so we founded our own YIMBY group. So far we've gotten the ears of local county council members, and are trying to talk to other local activist groups (DSA, local Sierra Club chapters, ect) to promote YIMBYism. How does this apply to climate change? Well its clear that one way to reduce carbon emissions is to have denser, more affordable housing with walk able amenities and transit options. I personally got really into YIMBYism after spending some time exploring European major cities, and it is almost night and day compared to most American cities / suburbs. We're going to need better transit options, dense (affordable!) housing, and newer more efficient buildings with roof gardens, rain gardens, LEED lighting, ect. It may not seem like it will be help in a big way in a macro way, but with an issue as big and seemingly impossible to tackle as climate change, any local differences we can make are a step in the right direction. Also I am almost done watching this excellent PBS series called "Sinking Cities". https://www.pbs.org/show/sinking-cities/ They profile several cities (London, Tokyo, Miami, New York) and the challenge they face from rising sea levels, and what they are doing to combat it. From watching it, it seems Tokyo and London have several huge projects in the works to combat future rising seas and flooding. New York's idea seems to be to just build a sea wall. Miami is..lol Miami is hosed and is just building more luxury condominiums.
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Nov 27, 2018 22:46
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Reminds me of how bugs get thrown around as the food of the future when meat runs out or gets too expensive a lot. What I always thought was dumb is how eating bugs is always presented as that - eating bugs, like someone taking a bite of a scorpion or a handful of ants, of course people will be turned off by that. Why not ground them up into flour, or like a hamburger patty first - anything to make it not look like I'm eating bugs.
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Nov 27, 2018 22:47
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Avalerion posted:Reminds me of how bugs get thrown around as the food of the future when meat runs out or gets too expensive a lot. What I always thought was dumb is how eating bugs is always presented as that - eating bugs, like someone taking a bite of a scorpion or a handful of ants, of course people will be turned off by that. Why not ground them up into flour, or like a hamburger patty first - anything to make it not look like I'm eating bugs. They already make those.  Tried them myself. They're not bad.
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Nov 27, 2018 23:08
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ChairMaster posted:Well obviously, but the issue here is that I'm saying that we're not allowed to talk about the thing, so assumedly he thinks that that's also enough to get the site in trouble, but that doesn't make a lot of sense really so I'm asking for clarification. Pretty sure it's fine to talk about direct action, just not fine to promote it, incite it, organize it, glorify it, etc. I think making it taboo gives it some mystical appeal, which it doesn't deserve. Political violence is common, it's happening right now. Last month an individual shot up a synagogue in Pittsburgh. He was convinced, in part by an online community not terribly dissimilar to this one, that his very civilization is under dire threat. So he killed a bunch of people. Did he do it? Did he protect his white nation? If you convince some sad sack in this thread, or yourself, to undertake a similar drastic action, it will similarly result in tragedy and zero progress. Progress towards helping climate change or whatever the goal would be. The "action we can't speak of" is, same as eating less beef, not going to accomplish anything without being part of a larger global effort. You're not going to organize a global Monkey Wrench Gang on somethingawful dot com. You're just going to get yourself or the website in trouble, or maybe even cause something terrible to happen. Epitope fucked around with this message at 23:22 on Nov 27, 2018 |
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Nov 27, 2018 23:20
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Trabisnikof posted:Leaving for a new country puts you at extreme risk because it gives up your local knowledge and community engagement. How do you engage in your community if you live in a big city? I don't think my neighbors ever talked to me or my family more than cursory introductions in no place I ever lived in.
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Nov 27, 2018 23:30
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Uh that's a pretty dishonest comparison, and also hilariously ignorant and tainted by years of rich white people convincing you that MLK got the civil rights act passed all by himself without the influence of Malcom X, who clearly got what was coming. e: and even aside from that, I've certainly never expected to organize an eco-terrorist group on SA or even tell people that they should, and what you're misunderstanding is the fact that we are explicitly not allowed to bring it up in any context, and I'm only talking about it now because a mod brought it up and there's no other way to get clarification on what circumstances I'm allowed to even say that we're not allowed to talk about it. ChairMaster fucked around with this message at 23:37 on Nov 27, 2018 |
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Nov 27, 2018 23:30
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You can talk about it here, people just don't want you making GBS threads up this thread about it https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3845777&pagenumber=131&perpage=40
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Nov 27, 2018 23:48
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ChairMaster posted:That's fair and I shouldn't have said it unprovoked, but am I not allowed to say it when people demand a substantive solution to problems that have no other solution? Am I just supposed to say "there isn't one", or in that circumstance can I still say we're not allowed to talk about it? I am not entirely sure I agree with your premise that the only solution is political violence, but as noted it's not like you can't discuss its existence, it's that you can't use this website to incite or plan it because, you know, we'll get shut down. I'm not disagreeing with your politics here, it's just that I also don't want to get emails from Lowtax asking why the FBI visited him again.
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Nov 27, 2018 23:49
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Lightning Knight posted:I am not entirely sure I agree with your premise that the only solution is political violence, but as noted it's not like you can't discuss its existence, it's that you can't use this website to incite or plan it because, you know, we'll get shut down. I'm not disagreeing with your politics here, it's just that I also don't want to get emails from Lowtax asking why the FBI visited him again. You explicitly told me that I'm not allowed to say that the only solution that would have any meaningful impact whatsoever is political violence, I've been probated for exactly that. I have never told someone that they should join or form an eco-terrorist group, or even crafted ideas or theories on how it should be done. I've been probated simply for saying that the only solution is political violence. I'm not complaining, since I was kinda breaking what I thought the rule was at the time, but I am very confused about what exactly the rules are now. Is this post meant as a change to the previous standard? ChairMaster fucked around with this message at 23:55 on Nov 27, 2018 |
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Nov 27, 2018 23:50
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AceOfFlames posted:How do you engage in your community if you live in a big city? I don't think my neighbors ever talked to me or my family more than cursory introductions in no place I ever lived in. You reach out to your neighbors, you join local community groups, you engage in local politics, and you do some volunteering with local groups if you can.
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Nov 27, 2018 23:56
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ChairMaster posted:You explicitly told me that I'm not allowed to say that the only solution that would have any meaningful impact whatsoever is political violence, I've been probated for exactly that. I have never told someone that they should join or form an eco-terrorist group, or even crafted ideas or theories on how it should be done. I've been probated simply for saying that the only solution is political violence. The one time I probed you for it, you had phrased it in a baity way that was unnecessarily passive-aggressive. What I know is that in general, Something Awful does not take kindly to incitements to violence. This is a site-wide thing that is generally acknowledged. The politics boards tend to be the ones that skirt this rule the most. I will ask PPJ about it but in general my stance is that general discussions of political acts of violence as a concept may be ok, but it's a problem area. I'll ask the other two mods and we'll try and hammer out some kind of explicit ruling to put in the OP.
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Nov 28, 2018 00:02
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Avalerion posted:I’ve been hearing a lot about global warming lately but having trouble parsing it all and if/how/when it will affect me. I’m 30 years old, middle class, live in the EU, no kids. Do I get to live out my natural life span in relative peace or not?
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Nov 28, 2018 00:04
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Lightning Knight posted:I'll ask the other two mods and we'll try and hammer out some kind of explicit ruling to put in the OP. Thanks, it'd be nice to be able to say "There's no non-violent way to make any meaningful difference as to the actual effects of climate change, I suggest that you focus on helping yourself and your community survive the oncoming effects because you'd probably just get yourself killed trying to do something actually effective", which is what I actually believe anyways.
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Nov 28, 2018 00:08
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Avalerion posted:Reminds me of how bugs get thrown around as the food of the future when meat runs out or gets too expensive a lot. What I always thought was dumb is how eating bugs is always presented as that - eating bugs, like someone taking a bite of a scorpion or a handful of ants, of course people will be turned off by that. Why not ground them up into flour, or like a hamburger patty first - anything to make it not look like I'm eating bugs. Or just eat legumes. Seriously, this is silly.
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Nov 28, 2018 00:47
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ChairMaster posted:There's no non-violent way to make any meaningful difference as to the actual effects of climate change This is equivalent to saying "violence is a way to make a meaningful difference" even if that's not what you're intending to say. You're using language that incites violence. There's no Malcolm X in here, but there may be a mentally unstable person with access to guns.
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Nov 28, 2018 00:51
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It literally is the only way to make a meaningful difference at this point. I think the stumbling block here for a lot of people is that "doing this will make the world better" is not the same thing as "you should do this" or "you will be successful at doing this". I have not and will not ever join or form an eco-terrorist organization because I value my life enough that I don't want to risk it, and because I do not believe that I am capable of organizing and getting that many people together, especially not after 50 years of rich white people insisting that violence never solved anything and having most non-political or non-educated people believing that drivel. e: aw poo poo I got into the thread title, too bad my grammar is probably bad ChairMaster fucked around with this message at 01:46 on Nov 28, 2018 |
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Nov 28, 2018 01:29
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Hurting people is not an answer to existential angst re: your place in the world.
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Nov 28, 2018 02:16
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Yea my place in the world is sooooo awful, I got born into a wealthy nation, I'm the gender that gets it easy, and above all I'm white. I'm practically dying here. 
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Nov 28, 2018 02:18
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this thread is so strange..im sure we're done doomed
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Nov 28, 2018 02:26
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ChairMaster posted:It literally is the only way to make a meaningful difference at this point. It's not though. Even if eco terrorism were able to act as an emergency brake on this runaway train, the rest of civilization still has to function if civilization is going to survive. That's what you mean by meaningful, right? Civilization surviving? Cuz there's plenty of other ways to find meaning in your life, that don't hinge on civilization's fate.
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Nov 28, 2018 02:35
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As I said in the last thread: anyone who has discussed this topic on the Internet is already on enough watch lists that your chances of success are nil. Our only hope is that kids, who are currently ten or twelve, are smart enough to stfu about smashing the state when online and put their phones in faradu cages when they meet up offline. Thusly, there is very little point in discussing direct action besides a desire to feed ones own ego. You can't do it effectively, and you won't do it anyways because the risk to your comfortable existence is far too great VS. what is still an uncertain future calamity in the back of your mind, so instead set that discussion aside for your own safety and sanity. Lowtax has enough to deal with.
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