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I mean, it has been understood that the HL queues are bad. Blizzard didn't break the HL queue itself, tons of players just went to TL instead or quit. He's also a GM which wouldn't have that many players available anyway. Isn't that the direct result of people bitching about GMs and Diamond 1s being matched into HL league games? I feel like a huge amount of the complaints about queues and matchmaking boil down to "THERE ARE NOT ENOUGH PEOPLE PLAYING, THE GAMES WILL BE UNFAIR OR THE QUEUES WILL BE LONG."
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Dec 9, 2018 17:41
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ToastyPotato posted:I mean, it has been understood that the HL queues are bad. Blizzard didn't break the HL queue itself, tons of players just went to TL instead or quit. He's also a GM which wouldn't have that many players available anyway. Isn't that the direct result of people bitching about GMs and Diamond 1s being matched into HL league games? I feel like a huge amount of the complaints about queues and matchmaking boil down to "THERE ARE NOT ENOUGH PEOPLE PLAYING, THE GAMES WILL BE UNFAIR OR THE QUEUES WILL BE LONG." Sometimes I and another 7+ masters and gm players will be in queue at once, then 2-4 of us get put into a diamond game while the others have to wait 30 mins
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Dec 9, 2018 20:08
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I would rather quick queues because the long queues still have awful players in them Give me quicker queues and shorter games TIA
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Dec 9, 2018 20:10
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SSJ_naruto_2003 posted:Sometimes I and another 7+ masters and gm players will be in queue at once, then 2-4 of us get put into a diamond game while the others have to wait 30 mins Probably took into account how long the diamond players were waiting. Now if they were not waiting long then that would probably be bad.
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Dec 9, 2018 20:13
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Yeah, I'm really nearing quit-point - Every night in APAC, even QM queues have hit >5m on a regular basis, and I quit last night when we hit 10m. We queued as a 3 man on Auto-Select/Any Role all 3 of us and it still took 3m (and of course then the game that followed was awful, because you end up with some horrendous off-meta lineup.)
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Dec 10, 2018 02:01
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They need to rollback the QM MM changes. I don't think it matters if QM MM is wonky and giving matchups like no tanks/supports on either team, that's fine as long as its mirrored. If people want proper compositions they can go to Unranked Draft. But these 8 min queues this morning as I'm trying to spam Zagara games for the last bit of XP to hit 20 with her are frustrating. On a whim I've decided to buy Kel'thuzad despite knowing he's difficult to play. One of the factors is that I find his voice lines hilarious for some reason.
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Dec 10, 2018 10:29
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Playing KTZ with the KTZ announcer is pure joy.
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Dec 10, 2018 14:51
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Ort posted:Playing KTZ with the KTZ announcer is pure joy. You’re dead... ...but aren’t we all?
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Dec 10, 2018 15:30
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kaesarsosei posted:They need to rollback the QM MM changes. I don't think it matters if QM MM is wonky and giving matchups like no tanks/supports on either team, that's fine as long as its mirrored. If people want proper compositions they can go to Unranked Draft. But these 8 min queues this morning as I'm trying to spam Zagara games for the last bit of XP to hit 20 with her are frustrating. I don't think it matters if QM queues are a little long, that's fine as long as it can make a decent matchup. If people want super short queues, they can go to Unranked Draft which usually pops in 2 mins or less. Obviously I understand the allure of QM, but here's the thing, old QM wasn't fun for a lot of people either, because there are plenty of people who don't just slam pick dps/specialist characters all day. The MM taking so long is clearly bad, but there might legit be something wrong with it since people rolling random still take forever to get placed. Either that or people just aren't playing the game, which means it isn't broken and changing it back wouldn't fix it.
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Dec 10, 2018 17:39
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Over the weekend it seems most of the pros and staff went from I'm sure HGC is fine to oh god am I fired
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Dec 10, 2018 18:09
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Midnightghoul posted:Over the weekend it seems most of the pros and staff went from I'm sure HGC is fine to oh god am I fired Last week Gilly said she wasn't coming back for 2019 and Trisk I believe said they still hadn't asked him back. Jhow has been streaming, but I haven't heard if he said anything. I assume no. Khaldor was streaming Warcraft 3 this weekend...
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Dec 10, 2018 18:12
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Midnightghoul posted:Over the weekend it seems most of the pros and staff went from I'm sure HGC is fine to oh god am I fired What happened?
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Dec 10, 2018 18:41
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There was supposed to be news about the next season and there was tumbleweeds.
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Dec 10, 2018 18:54
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That kind of stuff always blows my mind. Like, it must be someone's responsibility to handle that, right? There must be some chain of command that is supposed to ensure stuff like that doesn't just get...forgotten? It's just hard to fathom a massive company collectively missing a deadline with zero messaging to customers whatsoever.
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Dec 10, 2018 19:04
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I think Blizzard has kind of shown that given their relative size and experience, they qualify as one of the most incompetent games companies around currently, with the constant weird missteps they make. That said, the only theory I have seen that both makes sense and excuses Blizzard, is that Activision is trying to wrangle costs, and Blizzard is in negotiations over budgeting for stuff like HGC and its on going which is why there is no news. They also can't outright come out and say "we are fighting for money from daddy".
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Dec 10, 2018 19:11
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Blizz can treat everyone involved like garbage and they'll still crawl over glass for a job in ESPORTS. Still seems bad for business to do so though it makes HotS look amateur no matter what happens.
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Dec 10, 2018 19:13
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ToastyPotato posted:I don't think it matters if QM queues are a little long, that's fine as long as it can make a decent matchup. If people want super short queues, they can go to Unranked Draft which usually pops in 2 mins or less. At least half of the reason QM is alluring is because its supposed to be quick. There used to be a nice spectrum of choice where you had QM with fast queue times and horrible team comps, Unranked with average queue times and average team comps, and Hero/Team League with horrible queue times and good team comps. Now it's all hosed up, and if your interested in having the shortest queue times you're left guessing between QM and Unranked with both of them being substantially longer than the old QM queue. It probably depends on your MMR but QM queues aren't just "a little longer", for me it went from about 100-200s to 400-500s which is crazy. I was all for the QM changes before they were implemented but I wouldn't have been if you had told me how much longer the queue would be. I think this goes for a lot of career QM players because you can still have fun playing a specific hero even if the match-up is completely ridiculous or lop-sided.
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Dec 10, 2018 20:29
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That's all well and good, but again, considering that the queue is long even for people randoming, or playing low pop roles, I'd say something is actually wrong with the MM. People, however, are just using it as an excuse to demand being able to just queue dps all day with 30s queues again. The queues have probably also been made worse by said people tantruming and not playing QM anymore, which a bunch of people are alleging they have done. I definitely noticed queues got worse after the first day or so, which makes me think a bunch of people gave up after a couple of bad queues where they refused to play a different character.
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Dec 10, 2018 20:36
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ToastyPotato posted:People, however, are just using it as an excuse to demand being able to just queue dps all day with 30s queues again. The queues have probably also been made worse by said people tantruming and not playing QM anymore, which a bunch of people are alleging they have done. Also blame the players for not playing the game when the queues are too long. They are not devoted enough to play Blizzard's Heroes of the Storm. No Wave fucked around with this message at 20:40 on Dec 10, 2018 |
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Dec 10, 2018 20:38
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hey guys i wrote an absolutely enormous list of changes that would make valla not poopy
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Dec 10, 2018 20:46
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"Literally no one disliked old QM and everyone always got to play what they wanted (which was only ever dps) and they always had good games." 
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Dec 10, 2018 20:52
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ToastyPotato posted:"Literally no one disliked old QM and everyone always got to play what they wanted (which was only ever dps) and they always had good games."
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Dec 10, 2018 20:54
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No Wave posted:"I talk poo poo about players who don't like current QM" Nah. Only selfish people. Plenty of people are legit being screwed by the current MM, as I have mentioned. But I have no qualms about poo poo talking people who want to play a team based game in the most selfish way possible and then whine when there is a mere suggestion that they slightly alter their play style to improve everyone's, including their own, experience. People are free to queue as they want, but I am not going to agree that the game should be built around them and if they are seriously rage quitting because they had to wait 5 mins because they refused to switch off of Illidan then yeah, I am gonna laugh at them.
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Dec 10, 2018 20:59
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What is "selfish" about being fine with 5 DPS vs 5 DPS?
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Dec 10, 2018 21:01
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No Wave posted:"I talk poo poo about players who don't like current QM" why are you always so weirdly lovely about people saying things that you don't agree with edit: wording Kith fucked around with this message at 21:14 on Dec 10, 2018 |
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Dec 10, 2018 21:01
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No Wave posted:What is "selfish" about being fine with 5 DPS vs 5 DPS? Not everyone wants to play DPS characters. Are you aware of the other roles in this game and how they function? Do you think there might be a reason why all dps teams aren't really a thing outside of old QM or weird meme drafts? Do you believe then that a non dps player being thrown into an all dps match against their will is going to be having an optimally good time? Why should the fun of dps players be more important than everyone else? Why should they have their own game mode?
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Dec 10, 2018 21:15
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If a non-dps player queues as a non-dps, they won't be thrown into a 5 dps vs 5 dps game. It might be a 1 support 4 dps vs 1 support 4 dps, but it won't be 5 dps. At least that's what I'd like to say if the matchmaker actually mirror matches properly.
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Dec 10, 2018 21:19
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Being a tank main, the QM changes have been great. Almost instant queue pops and always a healer in my team. But I get that it doesn’t work to have people queue for 6 minutes when they want to play an assassin. Not sure what to do about it though because i really don’t want to go back to the old system.
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Dec 10, 2018 21:29
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Yukari posted:If a non-dps player queues as a non-dps, they won't be thrown into a 5 dps vs 5 dps game. It might be a 1 support 4 dps vs 1 support 4 dps, but it won't be 5 dps. At least that's what I'd like to say if the matchmaker actually mirror matches properly. Yes, of course. However, again, there is a reason 4 dps 1 healer isn't a thing. And it isn't exactly the most fun to be getting blown up every team fight because the other team has multiple burst dives and you have no means of getting peeled on your team. So the healer in this situation has the privilege of just trying to get out any usefulness before being gangbanged by multiple attackers. I mean, I am not going to say I have never had fun as a healer in QM, but it was the main reason I didn't play healers. I've had a much better time playing healers in brawls where we can see picks before it launches. And I have had a great time playing tanks in draft modes. I've played some tank games in new QM and I can't complain too much about the MM. In old QM I didn't like playing tank too much because it meant pretty much never having heals, which makes some tanks less fun. I basically stopped playing QM all together. Also not having heals or tanks reduces talent options in a lot of situations. I would have loved to really learn Aba in QM but back in old QM, queuing Aba meant I would be solo support almost guaranteed it felt like. I've played more QM since the change than I have probably played in the past 6 months, and I have generally had way higher quality games in general. Still get some awful games though. ToastyPotato fucked around with this message at 21:37 on Dec 10, 2018 |
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Dec 10, 2018 21:35
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5 assassin games always sucked on a melee assassin for me. Like playing maeiv vs 5 ranged or something. I'd rather wait longer and have a chance of living for more than 2 seconds since I'd have a tank and healer. On the other hand 5 assassin games are fun on some characters and I liked getting wonky comps sometimes in qm because it varied the game up more. Idk there are good and bad aspects of the changes, no need to be lovely to each other about it.
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Dec 10, 2018 21:55
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Star posted:Being a tank main, the QM changes have been great. Almost instant queue pops and always a healer in my team. But I get that it doesn’t work to have people queue for 6 minutes when they want to play an assassin. Not sure what to do about it though because i really don’t want to go back to the old system. Its the same issue MMOs have where tanks/healers have near instant queues but DPS players have 30 minute queue times. There isn't really a good solution because at the end of the day most assassin/dps players just want to slam pick a damage role and have no interest in anything else
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Dec 10, 2018 21:56
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PantsBandit posted:That kind of stuff always blows my mind. Like, it must be someone's responsibility to handle that, right? There must be some chain of command that is supposed to ensure stuff like that doesn't just get...forgotten? It's just hard to fathom a massive company collectively missing a deadline with zero messaging to customers whatsoever. My intuition about this sort of thing makes me think they are internally discussing what their official statement will be, and analyzing whether another season is financially allowable. Saying nothing gives them time to reach a consensus on what their next action is going to be. Saying there will be a next season and then saying "well we talked about it and now you're all fired" looks a lot worse. E: that said, you know for a fact as soon as they say there isn't an HGC any more this game is branded in big bold letters DEAD (sc2 or diablo 3 style dead) Polio Vax Scene fucked around with this message at 23:49 on Dec 10, 2018 |
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Dec 10, 2018 23:42
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Blactivision stock is down 43% in the past 3 months ($83 September 28th to $47 today) so there may be some corporate pressure involved in cost-cutting. (lots of bideo game stocks are down but i assume similar things are happening at those companies)
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Dec 10, 2018 23:45
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I think you are wrong about the QM times. Anytime I click ready on a Support or Warrior (ie anyone who has the bonus XP flag at the time) I get an instant pop, at worst 30 seconds. This is in EU at any time of the day. So the problem is that yes, too many people want to play Assassin/Specialist and hence the MM is taking forever while waiting for a Warrior+Support for both teams. Ironically, it is so bad that after 8+ mins, the MM "relaxes" and you end up in wonky games anyway. Just roll the changes back IMO. I like Unranked draft, I play it quite a bit when I want to play someone like Tychus who has a niche role but if the composition for him isn't working out I can switch to eg Valla. Kith posted:hey guys i wrote an absolutely enormous list of changes that would make valla not poopy I still like Valla a lot and recently hit 20 with her. When I say like, I mean playing for fun - I can see that if you were depending on her in any sort of competitive ie Ranked game, she could be very frustrating due to being too glassy. Someone like Raynor is a better hero but Valla feels so much better to play.
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Dec 11, 2018 11:12
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Game blocked me from queuing as a specialist the other day, had to spam it to even get into queue as Naz.  Ended up with 4 specialists and a brightwing, still somehow won despite loosing every team fight.
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Dec 11, 2018 11:35
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kaesarsosei posted:I think you are wrong about the QM times. Anytime I click ready on a Support or Warrior (ie anyone who has the bonus XP flag at the time) I get an instant pop, at worst 30 seconds. This is in EU at any time of the day. So the problem is that yes, too many people want to play Assassin/Specialist and hence the MM is taking forever while waiting for a Warrior+Support for both teams. Ironically, it is so bad that after 8+ mins, the MM "relaxes" and you end up in wonky games anyway. I've not always had 30 second pops on healer or tank, but I haven't had the 5-10 minute queues some are reporting either. My only really long queues have been when I insisted on playing a character flagged as ranged dps. This is on NA. The MM seems to expand its search after 40 seconds now as of a few days ago, which is worrisome.
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Dec 11, 2018 16:49
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This wasn't what anyone wanted (outside of the sort of people who want to dictate how others play the game). What was expected is there would be some algorithm that would track what people were queueing as and put tanks/healers in standard compositions and put dps/specialists in standard compositions or not. This isn't actually difficult to implement at all.
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Dec 11, 2018 16:54
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Well, HOTS just updated. Eagerly awaiting those patch notes to see if game ded.
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Dec 11, 2018 16:56
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No Wave posted:This wasn't what anyone wanted (outside of the sort of people who want to dictate how others play the game). Blizzard's announcement at Blizzcon was pretty clear that every game would have a tank and a healer and a ranged dps. You sure you aren't projecting your own expectations here? I am willing to concede that I am wrong if there is some official quote I missed. And I don't see how before hand, anyone wanting better matchmaking was honestly expecting essentially 2 different queues. Also wanting QM to be like it was is dictating how others play as well, hth. 
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Dec 11, 2018 17:01
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People were saying for a pretty long time that they wished QM just did a better job of putting together "normal" teams Now that it does people are realizing that if the majority of the players all want to play one roll its going to make for really long queues for them
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Dec 11, 2018 17:12
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