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Davros1 posted:... the gently caress? God I hope this is in the 2020 series. Also, an old friend of mine retweeted this thread on the issues in the finale. I thought it articulately put a few things into my mind I hadn't thought of before, so I thought I'd share. Don't know who the author is but his profile says he's a script-writer/editor, which is good although he does live in Basingstoke. https://www.twitter.com/ellardent/status/1072087053054214144
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Dec 12, 2018 20:02
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Davros1 posted:... the gently caress? Shouldn't it be wearing a fedora? EDIT: Stabbatical posted:Also, an old friend of mine retweeted this thread on the issues in the finale. I thought it articulately put a few things into my mind I hadn't thought of before, so I thought I'd share. Don't know who the author is but his profile says he's a script-writer/editor, which is good although he does live in Basingstoke. Some good points, but he's making the mistake of thinking that Chibnall gives a drat about the plot or story. For him, they're just potential vehicles to get across character beats, so asking what difference it would make to the story if Graham killed Tim Shaw is asking a question that wouldn't make much sense. "Of course it doesn't change the plot. Why would it? The point is that it would change Graham." (Possibly followed by a further explanation of the Graham thing because maybe we missed the point.) His point about the Ux is spot on, though. I'm confused by his comment about how Tim Shaw was wearing a mask so there could be a surprise reveal. Did he forget that Tim Shaw wore a mask the first time out, too? Narsham fucked around with this message at 20:41 on Dec 12, 2018 |
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Dec 12, 2018 20:35
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Does the Dalek say "swag is for boys, men have class"?
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Dec 12, 2018 20:37
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Vinylshadow posted:Can we talk about those hands though? JAZZ-HANDS
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Dec 12, 2018 20:46
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Edward Mass posted:Overall, this series was what I had feared: bland and unmemorable. Couldn't disagree with you more. I'll always remember the episodes: The Woman Who Fell to Earth, Rosa, Demons of Punjab, It Takes You Away. I'll remember the awesomeness of the companions, especially Graham. I'll remember Tim Shaw, the Ptang, the ridiculous King James, and the Solitract Frog. The series being bland is your opinion though, of course.
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Dec 12, 2018 21:37
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AndyElusive posted:The series being bland is your opinion though, of course. Hey now, don't put that on him! Put that on me!
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Dec 12, 2018 21:42
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Narsham posted:Some good points, but he's making the mistake of thinking that Chibnall gives a drat about the plot or story. For him, they're just potential vehicles to get across character beats, so asking what difference it would make to the story if Graham killed Tim Shaw is asking a question that wouldn't make much sense. I would like to think you could develop your characters while telling a compelling story rather than instead of. I know it's pretty clear that Chibnall's priority is developing characters while waving some moral lessons around in the most obvious way possible, but there really is more to the job than that and it's such a shame that he's approaching it like this. I love the characters in this series in theory but drat it I'm really struggling to care about what happens to them
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Dec 12, 2018 22:16
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Chalks posted:I would like to think you could develop your characters while telling a compelling story rather than instead of. I know it's pretty clear that Chibnall's priority is developing characters while waving some moral lessons around in the most obvious way possible, but there really is more to the job than that and it's such a shame that he's approaching it like this. You speak as if this clown has a clue. He's arguably the very worst writer in Who history, and now going for the title as worst ever showrunner as well. My current theory: Chibnal and Whittaker are out to destroy Dr. Who. After the next season, it will be cancelled due to the tanking ratings, and will never, ever come back. And Mr. Chibs and missy will clap their hands at a "job well done".
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Dec 12, 2018 22:45
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Chalks posted:I would like to think you could develop your characters while telling a compelling story rather than instead of. I know it's pretty clear that Chibnall's priority is developing characters while waving some moral lessons around in the most obvious way possible, but there really is more to the job than that and it's such a shame that he's approaching it like this. I've heard the character argument a couple of times, and while that's fine in theory, what are any of these characters? What are their traits? What are their personalities? How do they change throughout the season? Could you replace one of them with one of those tennis balls they use to mark where CGI characters stand and nothing would change? It Takes You Away actually bothers to have a story involving the characters in some way, but no other episode is interested in doing this. The only character who comes across as anything more than wallpaper is Graham, and I suspect that that's mostly because Bradley Walsh is an experienced enough actor that he's able to rise above the wet fart of a script he's been given. And even then, the fact that this suddenly milquetoast, politically-neutered, hand-wringing series is most interested in the only white male character makes me resent him. None of the showrunner's scripts rise above the competence of an episode called *checks notes* Dinosaurs on a Spaceship from six years ago. There's maybe two episodes this season that know what they're about and what they mean. And even those are grading on a curve. I don't know why anybody would pick watching any of the other episodes this season over an episode of loving Supernatural or whatever.
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Dec 12, 2018 23:13
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Oh I know you didn't just imply that Dinosaurs on a Spaceship was anything but the platonic ideal of Doctor Who.
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Dec 12, 2018 23:25
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docbeard posted:Oh I know you didn't just imply that Dinosaurs on a Spaceship was anything but the platonic ideal of Doctor Who. I actually quite like Dinosaurs on a Spaceship. It's not saying much, but it's my favorite Chibnall script by a country mile. I was initially kind of bearish on Chibnall thinking if he could pull off scripts on that level of quality I'd basically be happy.
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Dec 12, 2018 23:42
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Cojawfee posted:Does the Dalek say "swag is for boys, men have class"? "What are you feelings on women?" "WOMEN ARE INFERIOR!" "So you're one of those Men's Right Activi-" "MEN ARE ALSO INFERIOR! EVERYTHING IS INFERIOR TO THE DALEKS! DALEKS ARE SUPERIOR!" "What about Davros?" "..... THAT IS A PRIVATE FAMILY MATTER PLEASE DO NOT INTRUDE."
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Dec 12, 2018 23:58
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Jerusalem posted:"What are you feelings on women?" "Are you an Imperial Dalek or a Renegade?" "ARE YOU SAYING THAT ALL DALEKS LOOK THE SAME TO YOU!"
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Dec 13, 2018 00:41
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I think the scripts for this season almost all had an early draft feel to them- like they’re fine but they’d really sing with some tightening. The Battle of.... etc has good bones but you can’t help but think “what if they trimmed down trying to restore the guy’s memory, and devoted that time to play up Graham’s conflict or the Doctor facing the ramifications of letting this guy get away and now look what he’s done, adding more emotional stakes” etc. There’s always a sense that yeah, you’ve got something, let’s go further with that, let’s develop it. Maybe they’ll have more time next season and that will be good, I dunno. RTD’s first series was technically quite crude but had the emotional energy, Moffat’s was actually pretty assured which is why what came after seemed like a bit of a step down, this is feeling like they still have a lot of kinks to work out.
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Dec 13, 2018 01:29
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God I can't get over what a terrible title that is. "The Battle of Ranskoor Av Kolos". It sounds like the name of the Doctor Who parody show Peter Griffin would be watching.
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Dec 13, 2018 01:58
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It sounds like Inspector Spacetime. This whole season has.
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Dec 13, 2018 07:29
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As good as RTD and Moffat were, maybe the reins should have been handed over to someone who doesn't care about Doctor Who. Mark Gatiss will die of heartbreak, but it seems like inertia was a big factor in Chibnall getting the job.
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Dec 13, 2018 07:39
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Why couldn’t they give it to Gatiss? Hmm, maybe Jeremy Dyson?
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Dec 13, 2018 11:33
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sunnyboy posted:You speak as if this clown has a clue. He's arguably the very worst writer in Who history, and now going for the title as worst ever showrunner as well. Get a load of this guy!
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Dec 13, 2018 14:13
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Bicyclops posted:Get a load of this guy! Who knew Ian Levine had an account?
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Dec 13, 2018 14:17
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The_Doctor posted:Why couldn’t they give it to Gatiss? Too closely linked to Moffat perhaps? It's kind of weird since he's been a showrunner before, has written a lot of stuff that has won acclaim as well as proved to be pretty popular, and the quality of his particular Who episodes tended to be higher on average (in my opinion) than Chibnall's. Then again, maybe he simply didn't want the job? He did post a Latin quotation when Moffat announced he was stepping down that essentially translated to,"A slave freed at last" so maybe the last thing he wanted to do - much as he clearly loves Doctor Who - was to be in charge of running it. Plus of course, Chibnall did have Broadchurch's success going for him, while Gatiss' most (massively) popular work was co-produced with Moffat and he was already committed to working on their adaptation of Dracula.
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Dec 13, 2018 14:31
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sunnyboy posted:You speak as if this clown has a clue. He's arguably the very worst writer in Who history, and now going for the title as worst ever showrunner as well. hahahahahahaha 
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Dec 13, 2018 14:55
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Yeah, Gatiss is probably close enough to Moffat that he had no desire to inherit what looked and sounded like a miserable death march. Iirc Moffat only stayed on past Husbands Of River Song because they couldn't find anyone else to do the job
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Dec 13, 2018 15:18
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I do wonder if the BBC will take a rest from Who should Chibnall step down.
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Dec 13, 2018 15:20
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I sort of feel like Gatiss as a showrunner would have felt mostly like "Moffat, but without a lot of better things about Moffat's strongest writing," and I definitely don't think Who should ever switch to "watered down version of the same" when doing major shakeups.
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Dec 13, 2018 15:21
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Hinchcliffe is still alive, huh.
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Dec 13, 2018 15:23
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Also, “tanking ratings”. Didn’t all of the episodes this season outperform all of series 9 and 10? e: “It Takes You Away” didn’t outperform “The Magician’s Apprentice” or “The Pilot”, but that’s understandable given it was directly up against the X-Factor Final. TinTower fucked around with this message at 15:37 on Dec 13, 2018 |
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Dec 13, 2018 15:32
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Every season is the worst all the show runners are bad this doctor stinks bring back my [insert doctor name here]
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Dec 13, 2018 15:37
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Doctor Who was ruined when it went from a police procedural to some weird show about a teenage school girl and a weirdo in a box
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Dec 13, 2018 15:42
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The sad thing is that if Chibnall really was the very worst writer in Who history, at least his episodes would be a lot more interesting. I genuinely don't have any major issues with Season 11 except for Chibnall being a painfully average writer, but I was sort of expecting that anyway based on his previous Who scripts. It's just a shame that either BBC convention or his own ego dictates that he has to write 5 or 6 episodes per season, so it's a problem we've had to confront almost every week. If somebody else was writing the NY special, I would be a lot more excited for it than I currently am.
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Dec 13, 2018 15:50
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Give the showrunner job to Rob Schrab
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Dec 13, 2018 16:07
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Maxwell Lord posted:I think the scripts for this season almost all had an early draft feel to them- like they’re fine but they’d really sing with some tightening. The Battle of.... etc has good bones but you can’t help but think “what if they trimmed down trying to restore the guy’s memory, and devoted that time to play up Graham’s conflict or the Doctor facing the ramifications of letting this guy get away and now look what he’s done, adding more emotional stakes” etc. There’s always a sense that yeah, you’ve got something, let’s go further with that, let’s develop it. Some episodes definitely needed some more polish (the finale and Arachnids stand out there in my mind), although there's nothing near as egregiously first-drafty as, say, Kill The Moon was. It really felt like all of them, probably every episode this year, had to be cut a bit for time, though. Like most of the issues with most of the episodes would have gone away if they'd had time to fit an extra scene or two in.
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Dec 13, 2018 16:33
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I'll be show runner. Sign me up.
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Dec 13, 2018 17:18
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Same. Hope you're ready for some Lawrence Miles episodes.
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Dec 13, 2018 17:27
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docbeard posted:Some episodes definitely needed some more polish (the finale and Arachnids stand out there in my mind), although there's nothing near as egregiously first-drafty as, say, Kill The Moon was. I'd dread to think how bad the stuff they cut would have to be to justify some of the stuff they left in. Like what did they cut so we could spend 20 mins watching a pregnant bloke for no reason at all in that medical ship episode?
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Dec 13, 2018 17:36
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CommonShore posted:I'll be show runner. Sign me up. I'm already show runner.
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Dec 13, 2018 17:39
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Cojawfee posted:I'm already show runner. Maybe I'll be the producer.
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Dec 13, 2018 17:44
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I am not interested in being the showrunner, but I'll write an episode or star as a one off companion, Kevin McCallister.
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Dec 13, 2018 23:23
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CommonShore posted:I'll be show runner. Sign me up. Oh we're posting quotes from Tom Baker circa 1980 now?
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Dec 13, 2018 23:28
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Season 11 reads like I write, you guys don't want me to be showrunner.
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Dec 13, 2018 23:28
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