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https://twitter.com/thickyrubio/status/1074688443198910464
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Dec 17, 2018 17:20
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Sir, this isn’t the Trump lol thread. I like my unnerving reality at arms length through both time and physical distance, not live and all up ins my poo poo.
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Dec 17, 2018 20:41
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Pvt.Scott posted:Sir, this isn’t the Trump lol thread. I like my unnerving reality at arms length through both time and physical distance, not live and all up ins my poo poo. It's unnerving that Cory Booker is on record as wanting to make support for BDS, crininal which is what that idiotic oath is about.
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Dec 17, 2018 20:49
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Pvt.Scott posted:Sir, this isn’t the Trump lol thread. I like my unnerving reality at arms length through both time and physical distance, not live and all up ins my poo poo. Sorry, felt it hit the right note of being "what the gently caress" and unnerving to go here without being too close to the White Nationalist House. Let's talk about something that still freaks me out repeatedly whenever I think of it: Drinking the Kool-Aid. You've heard this phrase everywhere, right? It's common and seems kind of benign, a wacky way of saying that someone bought into some freaky stuff. It was only a few years ago that I learned that uhhh, it came from this: quote:The phrase derives from the November 1978 Jonestown deaths[1] in which over 900 members of the Peoples Temple died by drinking a powdered drink mix laced with cyanide. Most voluntarily committed suicide while the rest were killed by forced ingestion of the poison.[2] The powdered drink mix used might not have been Kool-Aid but could have been the competing brand Flavor Aid. However this is disputed as the commune had both among their supplies. [3] 
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Dec 17, 2018 21:03
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There’s audio of the event available online. Not reccommended especially if you have kids.
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Dec 17, 2018 21:05
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It has always baffled me that people want to argue about the particular brand of drink mix used to kill hundreds of people.
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Dec 17, 2018 21:06
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fizzymercy posted:It has always baffled me that people want to argue about the particular brand of drink mix used to kill hundreds of people. Would you want your brand used as a slogan about a cult death squad?
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Dec 17, 2018 21:08
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fizzymercy posted:It has always baffled me that people want to argue about the particular brand of drink mix used to kill hundreds of people. quote:In February 2012, "Drinking the Kool-Aid" won first place in an online poll by Forbes Magazine as "the single most annoying example of business jargon."[20] People are weird
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Dec 17, 2018 21:08
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quote:
I'll take it over "Eat our own dog food."
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Dec 17, 2018 21:09
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Cat Army
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xtal posted:Would you want your brand used as a slogan about a cult death squad? I think it speaks to the tastiness and refreshing satisfaction that not even poison would be enough to keep people from drinking it. In the right marketing hands they are sitting on a gold mine. A gold mine, I say!
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Dec 17, 2018 21:10
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xtal posted:Would you want your brand used as a slogan about a cult death squad? No, but I don't hear this poo poo from Kool-Aide executives. I do hear it from every internet Well Actually, though. StrixNebulosa posted:People are weird
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Dec 17, 2018 21:12
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What’s scary to me about Jonestown (well extra scary) is that they had had so many “suicide drills” where they went through the motions of drinking only to be told afterwards that there was no poison added that many of them didn’t believe this time would be real until the first kids started keeling over. And as more people started to die, especially adults who wouldn’t “cry about the taste” as they were told the kids were, people realized that not only would they die, but that it would be painful and not the “just falling asleep” that was promised.
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Dec 17, 2018 21:22
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:What’s scary to me about Jonestown (well extra scary) is that they had had so many “suicide drills” where they went through the motions of drinking only to be told afterwards that there was no poison added that many of them didn’t believe this time would be real until the first kids started keeling over. And as more people started to die, especially adults who wouldn’t “cry about the taste” as they were told the kids were, people realized that not only would they die, but that it would be painful and not the “just falling asleep” that was promised.  Here's a website with more info about it. quote:Presentation of Peoples Temple and its members in their own words: through articles, tapes, letters, photographs and other items. These materials let readers make their own judgments about the group and its end.
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Dec 17, 2018 21:24
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Jonestown was some raw poo poo, but the whole story from tiny church with a charismatic preacher to religious splinter colony in the wilderness of Guyana is damned fascinating. I’m surprised the Pilgrims didn’t go out in a similar manner shortly after colonizing America as well.
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Dec 17, 2018 21:40
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Pvt.Scott posted:Jonestown was some raw poo poo, but the whole story from tiny church with a charismatic preacher to religious splinter colony in the wilderness of Guyana is damned fascinating. I’m surprised the Pilgrims didn’t go out in a similar manner shortly after colonizing America as well. Well, Kool-Aid and Flavor-Aid hadn't been invented yet.
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Dec 17, 2018 21:59
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Pvt.Scott posted:Jonestown was some raw poo poo, but the whole story from tiny church with a charismatic preacher to religious splinter colony in the wilderness of Guyana is damned fascinating. I’m surprised the Pilgrims didn’t go out in a similar manner shortly after colonizing America as well. If whoever led the pilgrims had been given access to sufficient food and unlimited quantities of amphetamines, it probably would have. That said, I think that for all the talk about the rough conditions at Jonestown and how lovely the land was, comparing it to a place where this happened runs the risk of misunderstanding what happened at Jonestown. Jones was, when Leo Ryan arrived, almost certainly facing the collapse of Jonestown from people wanting to leave, but no one was starving or facing death from the elements. What happened went down because Jones decided that everyone dying was preferable to him facing failure and public ridicule when some percentage of them went back to the US and told everyone what a shithole it was and how Jones was a literal psycho.
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Dec 17, 2018 23:12
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MightyJoe36 posted:I'll take it over "Eat our own dog food." oh no we might work for the same company
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Dec 17, 2018 23:14
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Pvt.Scott posted:Jonestown was some raw poo poo, but the whole story from tiny church with a charismatic preacher to religious splinter colony in the wilderness of Guyana is damned fascinating. I’m surprised the Pilgrims didn’t go out in a similar manner shortly after colonizing America as well. I know it's divisive, but the Last Podcast on the Left Jonestown series is loving excellent.
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Dec 17, 2018 23:20
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Not Very Metal posted:oh no we might work for the same company We're gonna bikeshed this to death if we're not careful.
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Dec 17, 2018 23:20
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Azathoth posted:If whoever led the pilgrims had been given access to sufficient food and unlimited quantities of amphetamines, it probably would have. That said, I think that for all the talk about the rough conditions at Jonestown and how lovely the land was, comparing it to a place where this happened runs the risk of misunderstanding what happened at Jonestown. I love that the arrival of Congressional Action Man was the trigger for the mass suicide. Showed up looking to save the day and then got shot for his trouble.
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Dec 17, 2018 23:24
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IIRC there’s still a few of them around who were left behind to maintain the website
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Dec 18, 2018 00:05
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christmas boots posted:IIRC there’s still a few of them around who were left behind to maintain the website You're thinking of Heaven's Gate. Jonestown happened in 1978.
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Dec 18, 2018 00:10
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Pvt.Scott posted:I love that the arrival of Congressional Action Man was the trigger for the mass suicide. Showed up looking to save the day and then got shot for his trouble. He was probably gonna buy their act too and go home without any proof of what was going on until some desperate people slipped him notes asking for help.
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Dec 18, 2018 00:17
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ponzicar posted:You're thinking of Heaven's Gate. Jonestown happened in 1978. You’re right, wrong death cult
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Dec 18, 2018 01:08
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christmas boots posted:You’re right, wrong death cult Mods, new thread title
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Dec 18, 2018 01:12
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christmas boots posted:IIRC there’s still a few of them around who were left behind to maintain the website There are Jonestown survivors and people who escaped the camp before the suicide. Jim Jones' son is still alive. None of them are still members of the cult (iirc).
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Dec 18, 2018 01:12
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xtal posted:Mods, new thread title I'm fine with it. Not the death cult, I mean.
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Dec 18, 2018 01:14
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Necrothatcher posted:I know it's divisive, but the Last Podcast on the Left Jonestown series is loving excellent. Their most recent series on the Order of the Solar Temple is fascinating too, in general I'd say that LPotL's cult stuff is easy to recommend. Order of the Solar Temple is crazy and unnerving too. It's not quite on the scale of Jonestown, but the creepy aspect was that a bunch of members were just living normal lives. And there's a lot of doubt over exactly how many knew that they were really going to die. For awhile it was just a cool secret club where you took drugs and watched a man in robes wave a sword around during a laser light show, then suddenly there's a mass murder/suicide. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_the_Solar_Temple quote:15 inner circle members committed suicide with poison, 30 were killed by bullets or smothering, and 8 others were killed by other causes. In Switzerland, many of the victims were found in a secret underground chapel lined with mirrors and other items of Templar symbolism. The bodies were dressed in the order's ceremonial robes and were in a circle, feet together, heads outward, most with plastic bags tied over their heads; they had each been shot in the head.
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Dec 18, 2018 01:23
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fizzymercy posted:It has always baffled me that people want to argue about the particular brand of drink mix used to kill hundreds of people. This probably isn't the right thread to pretend you don't understand people being fascinated with the minutiae of a tragedy.
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Dec 18, 2018 01:42
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Pvt.Scott posted:I love that the arrival of Congressional Action Man was the trigger for the mass suicide. Showed up looking to save the day and then got shot for his trouble. The overall timeline of People's Temple is pretty nuts. They'd been chugging along for more than 20 years before the mass exodus to Jonestown, but then it only took a year and a half to go from building a utopian commune to mass murder once they got there. And while Ryan's visit was obviously the trigger, I have a hard time attaching any real blame to him. Jones put that community on the road to mass murder at a minimum from the moment they all arrived and likely before. Jones was gonna kill whoever eventually came around to investigate, whether it would be reporters, politicians, US law enforcement, the Guyanese government, whoever. I legit think that, if left to their own devices, they would even have done it in the absence of external pressure, it just might not have been till a little later. It's an absolutely heartbreaking situation.
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Dec 18, 2018 01:48
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Have there ever been any serial killers as effective/prolific as Jones, then? Killing 900 people is, jesus christ.
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Dec 18, 2018 01:56
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Azathoth posted:The overall timeline of People's Temple is pretty nuts. They'd been chugging along for more than 20 years before the mass exodus to Jonestown, but then it only took a year and a half to go from building a utopian commune to mass murder once they got there. Yeah, Ryan was from a time when congressman (mostly) went on fact-finding missions to find actual facts. IIRC, the whole impetus for the trip were his constituents complaining to him in concern for their family and rumors of abuse. And yeah, his visit was the flashpoint. And he did bring a news-crew with him (the compound was newsworthy and politicians gotta politic), but I do think he went down largely for the right reasons.
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Dec 18, 2018 02:01
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christmas boots posted:You’re right, wrong death cult Speaking of which, it is still up. http://www.heavensgate.com/ It even has an "Our Position against Suicide" section! http://www.heavensgate.com/misc/letter.htm
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Dec 18, 2018 02:07
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StrixNebulosa posted:Have there ever been any serial killers as effective/prolific as Jones, then? Killing 900 people is, jesus christ. Depends, individual serial killers he'd be well in the lead based on the ones we know or have confirmed. But if we technically call it a genocide since it was targeting specifically the followers of his religion, and hold to to the standards of other community leaders then he barely shows up on the radar.
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Dec 18, 2018 02:07
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Yeah I was thinking if you wanted to compare mass murder, there’s a Hitler-Bundy spectrum with dudes like Jim Jones somewhere in the middle.
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Dec 18, 2018 02:11
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aphid_licker posted:Is there a place somewhere that links them all or something? I'd like to read more. Not that I know of - anyone?? Cefte's stories should be preserved
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Dec 18, 2018 02:12
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:Yeah I was thinking if you wanted to compare mass murder, there’s a Hitler-Bundy spectrum with dudes like Jim Jones somewhere in the middle. I think it’d be Stalin-Bundy spectrum, but I feel state actors like Stalin, Hitler and Pol Pot are kind of in their own category.
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Dec 18, 2018 02:17
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StrixNebulosa posted:Have there ever been any serial killers as effective/prolific as Jones, then? Killing 900 people is, jesus christ. Highly unlikely. Serial killers usually spread the kills out over a period of time. They're a very different beast from a cult leader engineering a mass suicide. If a serial killer killed 3 people a month every month it would take them 25 years to get to 900. The ones that get away with more than a few are the slow, methodical, and sneaky ones. Makes it pretty unlikely they'd manage to pull off 3 a month; that's almost one a week. Good luck hiding that.
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Dec 18, 2018 02:24
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The Thugee cult might have come close.
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Dec 18, 2018 02:25
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Solice Kirsk posted:The Thugee cult might have come close. I don't think it's widely accepted that they were ever actually a real thing. Even if they were, you'd compare them to organized criminal gangs. They wouldn't go on a "most prolific serial killers" list.
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Dec 18, 2018 02:28
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