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He's not fat in the slightest.
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Dec 30, 2018 05:34
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You can't even tell he's got that supposed fat when the he's got the suit on.
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Dec 30, 2018 05:37
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he's merely "out of shape" when you compare to a template of "spider-man"
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Dec 30, 2018 05:40
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If you want to be charitable maybe it was so the joke was more about him aging and letting himself go in his post-divorce depression + him losing his self confidence rather than straight up bodyshaming him? Him doing his hero work in sweatpants very much gave me the same vibe of the perfectly fine kid who swims with his shirt on and gets way more poo poo for it than anything else. Spider-Man is very much an acrobat and as someone who grew up with family that was pretty deep in the world of upper-level gymnastics and ballet a person who is supposed to be operating at peak flexibility and manueverability while wearing form fitting costumes getting a bit of a spare tire like Peter B is a really big deal in how it affects your performance compared to the average overweight office worker fluctuating twenty or thirty pounds over the year between swimsuit seasons or as part of a bulking and cutting cycle.
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Dec 30, 2018 05:42
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when you are as stupidly strong as most spider-people you can probably put on a whole bunch of weight without it really affecting your ability to do acrobatics much. i mean, it'll affect it more than just picking up a fifty lbs bag of cement because you're carrying that weight all the time, but jesus these are people that can generally treat hardened steel the way normal people treat play-doh
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Dec 30, 2018 05:49
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  "I prefer the real piggy Spider-Man."   "I said, the real piggy Spider-man"   "Perfection."
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Dec 30, 2018 05:52
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how much pizza exactly do you think someone with that sort of metabolism would have to eat to get the gut he had this isn't a serious question don't answer it
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Dec 30, 2018 05:53
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One thing sorely missing from this film:
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Dec 30, 2018 05:54
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I Before E posted:One thing sorely missing from this film: I honestly wouldn't be surprised if that was one of the many, many goofs they had in the big crowd scenes during the animated credits sequence. I was too focused on the big ones at the foreground like all the Spider-Hams roasting a Spider-man on a spit over a fire or recreating exponentially bigger and more populated versions of that one 60s Spider-man meme to look over the others. Even as far back as Cloudy With A Chance of Meatballs Lord and Miller have been incredibly good at packing their movies full of, to borrow the term from the people who made The Simpsons, VCR Gags so I'm really looking forward to getting to watch it from the comfort of my own home with a pause button handy. Even the small clips and stills they released as promos had a bunch of stuff I missed, like the different universes having ads for the Yugo and a big EA Sports water polo game.
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Dec 30, 2018 06:08
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nerdman42 posted:You can't even tell he's got that supposed fat when the he's got the suit on. You can tell he's got a little more around the middle than the average Spiderman for sure, though. And you know he's definitely sucking in the gut when he puts on the costume, too. it probably helps shape him like superhero spanx. Real Spiderman in his prime doesn't have to suck in, you can tell he's just got a lean hard six pack under there, the kind of compact taut muscles that make you feel warm and safe when they pull you tight against his chest, and then you squeeze his bicep and it's so tough you just can't make it budge in the slightest. And then he turns you around in his arms and you and look into his spider eyes and
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Dec 30, 2018 06:19
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Spider-Man: Spider-Man:  Spider-Man??? 
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Dec 30, 2018 06:51
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Anyone can be a spiderman, from a twink to a particularly twinky otter
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Dec 30, 2018 06:56
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I think the sexy part just comes along with all the other superpowers when you get bitten, like with vampires. All the film version, at least, appear to have a scene where Peter goes to bed a nebish skinny boy but then wakes up a complete hunk.
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Dec 30, 2018 07:01
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Guy Mann posted:I honestly wouldn't be surprised if that was one of the many, many goofs they had in the big crowd scenes during the animated credits sequence. I was too focused on the big ones at the foreground like all the Spider-Hams roasting a Spider-man on a spit over a fire or recreating exponentially bigger and more populated versions of that one 60s Spider-man meme to look over the others. I was looking forever through those big crowd scenes for the "two Spider-Man (Men?) pointing at each other" bit and never found it.  Turns out that that's the '60s Spider-Man gag that I never caught because I left the theater early Guy Mann posted:Even as far back as Cloudy With A Chance of Meatballs Lord and Miller have been incredibly good at packing their movies full of, to borrow the term from the people who made The Simpsons, VCR Gags so I'm really looking forward to getting to watch it from the comfort of my own home with a pause button handy. Even the small clips and stills they released as promos had a bunch of stuff I missed, like the different universes having ads for the Yugo and a big EA Sports water polo game. I still love that the Times Square introduction of Gwen and Peter B. have so many tidbits like the movie posters for From Dusk To Shaun and Hold Your Horses starring Seth Rogen.
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Dec 30, 2018 07:06
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In keeping with the staff of the movie being Very Online, Phil Lord has been posting raw assets from the movie on request. https://twitter.com/philiplord/status/1079254573594828800 I Before E posted:Anyone can be a spiderman, from a twink to a particularly twinky otter if a radioactive spider bit a bear would he look like this  or like this 
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Dec 30, 2018 07:09
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That Aaron Davis is Prowler because he chose to do so is a more insightful observation than it seems. The story of Spider-Man is that Peter Parker loses his uncle because he chose not to stop a criminal. Miles Morales on the other hand loses his uncle because the latter chose to be a criminal. The idea is that Miles Morales no longer has great responsibility, and the tragic aspect of Spider-Man is removed. BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 12:40 on Dec 30, 2018 |
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Dec 30, 2018 09:41
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There’s a thin line between bravery and stupidity.
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Dec 30, 2018 11:09
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Peni Parker didn't loose a family member due to choosing to let a criminal go. Her dad died while piloting the mech and she took up his role after his death at the urging of her Uncle. Spider Gwen killed her friend Peter Parker after he turned himself into a lizard man in a bungled attempt to become a super hero, wherein he started attacking people in the city. Not really her fault either. The common tie is a loss of a close relative or friend, not necessarily that they personally hosed up and cause the death of that relative.
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Dec 30, 2018 14:32
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I love that rhis movie got me to appreciate and even enjoy some of the more bizarre and ridiculous characters, such as spider-ham and Post Malone.
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Dec 30, 2018 15:22
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Guy Mann posted:In keeping with the staff of the movie being Very Online, Phil Lord has been posting raw assets from the movie on request. I love how the crew has been so open about how they made the movie so rad. https://twitter.com/DANIELPEMBERTON/status/1079380689844346880?s=19
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Dec 30, 2018 16:24
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I'm really hoping that there's like, three or four commentaries on the Blu-ray. One from the directors, one from the animators, one from the composer, and one from the actors (because those are generally pretty fun).
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Dec 30, 2018 16:26
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Nitrousoxide posted:The common tie is a loss of a close relative or friend, not necessarily that they personally hosed up and cause the death of that relative. Yes. The point is to sanitize the core story of Spider-Man, because that is now apparently too tragic.
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Dec 30, 2018 16:39
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Ah yes, because it is not tragic at all to be held by the throat by your beloved uncle, begging for your life, and just as said uncle starts to realize what’s happening, said uncle gets shot, so you flee with his dying, bleeding body to a filthy back alley where he finally dies in your arms, and then your father appears and blames you That’s the height of comedy right there.
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Dec 30, 2018 16:46
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Tragedy, in fiction, means disaster brought upon one's own ill-advised choices. Peter Parker allowing for a criminal to escape, only for that criminal to kill his uncle is tragic. Kingpin alienating his own family is tragic. What happens to Miles Morales is merely unfortunate, not tragic.
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Dec 30, 2018 16:54
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:Tragedy, in fiction, means disaster brought upon one's own ill-advised choices. Miles is effectively told to give up and go home as he is a danger to himself and the team due to his inexperience. Instead, he retreats to his uncle's apartment to try and steel his courage and collect his nerves. Then, when he discovers his uncle is the Prowler, instead of going home he heads back to the Spider-Lair, leading the Prowler and the Kingpin's men directly to the rest of the Spider-People. Finally, when confronted with the possibility of death, Miles chooses to unmask himself in a desperate attempt to save his own life, leading Aaron to hesitate and lose his life instead. Even by your own overly strict definition it is clearly a tragic result brought on by the protagonist's own choices. Was he entirely in control of the circumstances of his tragedy? No, but neither was Oedipus, and trying to argue otherwise is digging yourself into a hole of your own pedantry.
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Dec 30, 2018 17:44
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"Digging a hole to pedantry" sounds like Lamps' personal motto.
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Dec 30, 2018 17:53
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Pick posted:loving you dumb kindsa fuckers are why we keep getting origin stories and prequels. jesus christ you guys gently caress stories right in the mouth with the cocks of your stupidity. lol looks like we're getting a crossover of our own: into the bad postingverse
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Dec 30, 2018 18:11
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Acebuckeye13 posted:Miles is effectively told to give up and go home as he is a danger to himself and the team due to his inexperience. Instead, he retreats to his uncle's apartment to try and steel his courage and collect his nerves. Then, when he discovers his uncle is the Prowler, instead of going home he heads back to the Spider-Lair, leading the Prowler and the Kingpin's men directly to the rest of the Spider-People. Finally, when confronted with the possibility of death, Miles chooses to unmask himself in a desperate attempt to save his own life, leading Aaron to hesitate and lose his life instead. As I already said, what makes tragedy a tragedy is that it is brought upon oneself. It's a form of cruel, destructive justice. Peter Parker decided that the rest of the world be damned as long as he and his family are happy, and because of that he loses part of his family. Miles Morales doesn't do anything wrong, and doesn't bring anything on himself, so his character isn't tragic. The actual character undergoing a tragedy is the guy who dies as a consequence of his ill-advised choices. BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 18:30 on Dec 30, 2018 |
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Dec 30, 2018 18:27
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:As I already said, what makes tragedy a tragedy is that it is brought upon oneself. It's a form of cruel, destructive justice. Peter Parker decided that the rest of the world be damned as long as he and his family are happy, and because of that he loses part of his family. See, this is what I don't like about you as a poster. You are clearly well-read and educated, and yet instead of using that education for anything productive, you choose to spend your time telling people on the internet that the things they like are actually bad, while completely misrepresenting the subjects of your education. Miles isn't a tragic figure because he doesn't do anything wrong? Both within the text and outside of it, this isn't true at all. Many of the greatest tragedies feature protagonists who are entirely well-meaning and make what in their mind are the right decisions, but what makes them tragic figures is that they fail in spite of that. Oedipus wanted to avoid the horrific fate that had been forseen of him, and took what in his mind were prudent measures to avoid it—his mistake and hubris, of course, being that he could avoid fate. Othello was an intelligent and competent human being whose greatest mistake was placing his trust in the wrong lieutenant, and allowing himself to be manipulated into committing a horrific and unforgivable action. Miles made several poor decisions as a result of his inexperience and hubris. He wanted to be a member of the team to destroy the supercollider, and left dejected instead of heeding the advice of those with more wisdom and experience (See, this is where the Greeks would be pointing and nodding that, yes, this kid is about to get what's coming to him). Then, as a result of his inexperience, proving the rest of the team correct, he leads the Kingpin's men directly to the rest of the Spider-people, and in the ensuing standoff he gets his uncle, one of his closest relatives and friends, killed as a direct result of trying to save his own life (Ignoring, again, the words of multiple Peter Parkers that you don't remove the mask). If anything, Miles contributes far more to his own tragic fate than Peter, whose mistake was a single moment of inaction amidst his hubris. In short, please stop because you clearly know better and are deliberately misrepresenting that which you claim to hold in high esteem.
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Dec 30, 2018 19:22
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You can argue how important it is for a Spider-man narrative for Spider-man to share blame for the death of a family member, but it seems pretty clear that Miles was certainly much less to blame than Peter was. The idea that Miles showed hubris because he ought to have given up seems especially like one hell of a reach.
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Dec 30, 2018 19:57
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Given that Uncle Aaron is responsible for his own death, isn't it still a tragedy, just Uncle Aaron's own tragedy as opposed to Miles'?
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Dec 30, 2018 20:04
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Schwarzwald posted:The idea that Miles showed hubris because he ought to have given up seems especially like one hell of a reach. That would specifically mean that Miles Morales is guilty of excessive pride that insults the gods, because he wants to fight alongside the other Spider-People even though they don't think he has what it takes. Acebuckeye is specifically claiming that the Spider-People are gods, and going against them is defying divine order. e: And we've already established that Miles Morales has been chosen by Spider-God, so it's the other way around. 21 Muns posted:Given that Uncle Aaron is responsible for his own death, isn't it still a tragedy, just Uncle Aaron's own tragedy as opposed to Miles'? Yes. BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 20:22 on Dec 30, 2018 |
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Dec 30, 2018 20:17
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Loved the move. I watched the latest Avengers with my family over the Christmas holidays and I kept thinking about how much that movie sucked compared to this. The discussion that Miles's dad and uncle don't have terribly different jobs is interesting, with the main difference being that Aaron is less moralistic about it. Miles's dad coming to a sort of realization that being an authoritarian figure, albeit a well-meaning one, on both societal and family levels have hosed up his relationship with his family was a story line I felt paid off well emotionally. Most of the emotional beats in the movie hit for me to be honest though. Jefferson Davis being the only cop in New York was sort of funny, but made sense for what the movie was trying to do. The makers of the film seemed to be trying to avoid the Marvel cliche of the villains being basically justified in their actions. Miles's two main villains seemed pretty secure and happy about the current societal status quo. Liv is a famous scientist, with her videos shown to teenagers at elite schools, and Kingpin followed the portrayal of the character as a part of New York's elite political class. Spider-Man going after them made sense, because the cops certainly weren't going to. The criticism of Spider-Man only going after bank robbers doesn't apply in this case, because he's actually fighting a person that owns banks in the movie. Black Panther was a similar movie with regards to being inclusive of an oppressed group in the US, but casting the villain as an anti-colonial Black radical and making a CIA agent the good guys made its politics sort of at odds with part of its target audience. "Killmonger was right," became a meme for a few months, and while part of that was people thinking Michael B. Jordan was really hot, a good amount was a sincere agreement with the broad political agenda of the character. Spider-Verse of course isn't revolutionary, or even that progressive, but it wisely avoided that potential political friction with its audience by minimizing the focus on the societal role of police, and by making it's villains firmly entrenched as part of the elite in current society. BravestOfTheLamps posted:Spider-Verse in fact ends with a rather sinister lesson, because the road to growing up means losing one's individuality by being assimilated into the cross-dimensional Spider-Franchise. Super-hero films are already filled with the lesson that individual acts of courage are enough to save the world, which is actually a pretty hosed up moral when the only way to confront major ecological and political problems ethically today is through historically unprecedented collective action. Sony is obviously not going to actually save us from climate hell world, but attacking a super-hero product from them for not promoting individualism enough is hilariously reactionary. I like contrarian readings, but please don't make me defend Sony. Also really hosed up that no one on here has pointed out that Chance instead released 4 in Miles's universe. It took me far to long to catch that change.
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Dec 30, 2018 20:29
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21 Muns posted:Given that Uncle Aaron is responsible for his own death, isn't it still a tragedy, just Uncle Aaron's own tragedy as opposed to Miles'? I think this argument is getting a bit confused, so let's clarify things up a bit: Bravest argued that Miles' story isn't tragic, because it doesn't meet the (His excessively specific) qualifications for a tragedy. I disagreed—I would argue that even if you accept Bravest's limited definition, it would still qualify as the negative events of Miles' story are still the results of his own actions, however well intentioned or meaning, as if Miles had given up at that point, or had he been more competent in evading pursuit, then Aaron would still be alive. This doesn't mean that he should have given up, of course, but merely that the events that result are absolutely tragic by any definition.
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Dec 30, 2018 20:29
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I have determined the spider man who would need to be in a sequel Hold the Dark Spider Man
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Dec 30, 2018 20:40
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Acebuckeye13 posted:Bravest argued that Miles' story isn't tragic, because it doesn't meet the (His excessively specific) qualifications for a tragedy. I disagreed—I would argue that even if you accept Bravest's limited definition, it would still qualify as the negative events of Miles' story are still the results of his own actions The problem here is that you've come up with this bizarro definition that tragedy is "negative events [that] are results of one's own actions". I've been pretty clear what tragedy is. It means that someone is undone cruelly, but justly, by their own mistakes. Tragedy is a terrible retribution for a terrible error. Thus you're claiming the character of Miles Morales is culpable for what happens to him and on some level deserves his punishment. But he really, really isn't. He's a victim, not a wrongdoer. You want Into the Spider-Verse to be a classical tragedy, so you're victim-blaming a fictional teenager.
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Dec 30, 2018 20:43
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:The problem here is that you've come up with this bizarro definition that tragedy is "negative events [that] are results of one's own actions". Except 'terrible retribution for a terrible error' is a subset of tragedy, not the entire genre. Again, what 'terrible error' did Oedipus make that he could have reasonably avoided? e: actually gently caress it, I'm making a terrible error right now by engaging in your bad-faith posting
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Dec 30, 2018 20:48
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Acebuckeye13 posted:Again, what 'terrible error' did Oedipus make that he could have reasonably avoided? He murdered a man in a petty argument that escalated into violence.
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Dec 30, 2018 20:53
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Acebuckeye13 posted:See, this is what I don't like about you as a poster. You are clearly well-read and educated, and yet instead of using that education for anything productive, you choose to spend your time telling people on the internet that the things they like are actually bad, while completely misrepresenting the subjects of your education. Othello believes his wife is going to cuckold him from act one, when her father tells him that if she was willing to “betray” him by marrying without his blessing she will also “betray” her new husband/owner. Iago just tells him what he’s ready to hear. His pride, self loathing, and paranoia make him all too ready for murder. Oedipus depends on what version you’re talking about.
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Dec 30, 2018 21:29
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DeimosRising posted:Othello believes his wife is going to cuckold him from act one, when her father tells him that if she was willing to “betray” him by marrying without his blessing she will also “betray” her new husband/owner. Iago just tells him what he’s ready to hear. His pride, self loathing, and paranoia make him all too ready for murder. I'll concede on that specific example, I haven't read Othello since high school so I may be misremembering.
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Dec 30, 2018 21:46
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