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Logicblade posted:Rean still plays the lead, it's just the other new Class VII members play secondary leads depending on the chapter. To the point where I'd consider Altina the heroine of the third game, and Juna the fourth... >_> Yeah fair. That's kinda true of the first two games too, with Alisa being the heroine of the first game and Celine of the second.
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Jan 20, 2019 15:24
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theblackw0lf posted:So for those that haven’t played the crossbill arc. Are you going to still play CS 3 when it comes out? Definitely take the time to play Crossbell while you wait if you haven't. The duology is such a lovely experience that it'll be worth a second or third playthrough for Geofront/Official localization anyway. Everyone's different and I dunno anything about CS3 or CS4, but by the looks of things, knowing the characters and events of Crossbell will make CS3/4 a real treat. The Zero beta translation is super wonky but understandable. Ao is much better and the story and characters shine in spite of the wonkiness. I did see that Geofront expect to have their translations available by summer.
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Jan 21, 2019 03:35
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MythosDragon posted:All Falcom Protags with dialogue are good and valid. Talking Adol is how we get Ys III. Not Felghana, the original Ys III. Do you want Ys III again?
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Jan 21, 2019 05:18
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SouljaBoyVEVO posted:Definitely take the time to play Crossbell while you wait if you haven't. The duology is such a lovely experience that it'll be worth a second or third playthrough for Geofront/Official localization anyway. Everyone's different and I dunno anything about CS3 or CS4, but by the looks of things, knowing the characters and events of Crossbell will make CS3/4 a real treat. If those translations are out by summer that would be awesome. Are they releasing them for the PSP and PC versions? I saw there are Vita remakes but are those as shunned as the Sora remakes?
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Jan 21, 2019 14:06
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Pegnose Pete posted:If those translations are out by summer that would be awesome. I think I remember that they were grabbing the voice acting (... extra voice acting, I suppose, since the originals still have combat voices) for the translation, so it's not completely terrible I guess.
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Jan 21, 2019 14:51
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https://twitter.com/supremezerker/status/1087690930126245890
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Jan 22, 2019 14:29
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Pegnose Pete posted:If those translations are out by summer that would be awesome. The Zero and Azure Evolution remakes weren't that bad. From what I remember, it mostly added a few new cutscenes and remade the entire soundtrack with different instruments. Some of the remade tracks were kinda bad, but not to the point where it wasn't unrecognizable. Just compare the normal battle theme here and here. That said... yeah, I hope Geofront finishes the translation for Zero before I wrap up the LP for it. The beta translation for Zero has... issues. I'll excuse it on the basis that Zero/Ao's scripts are the length of a novel. And correct me if I'm wrong since I don't remember where I read it before, but I think the translator isn't a native English speaker, so there's that too. I'd say wait for the Geofront patch. Pyre of Word Salsa fucked around with this message at 16:10 on Jan 22, 2019 |
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Jan 22, 2019 16:05
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Pyre of Word Salsa posted:Just compare the normal battle theme here and here.
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Jan 23, 2019 01:42
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Nah, that was just an example of the differences between both soundtracks. If you want a track that got badly remade, you want this and this. That's what I'd deem to be bad. Honestly, my opinion of Zero Evolution's soundtrack kinda varies. On the one hand, we have stuff like that remix of Get Over the Barrier! that sounds new and refreshing. And on the other hand, we get songs that feel a little off, like some of the boss themes. Everything else about Zero Evolution is honestly solid, though. Full voice acting for the main plot! Pyre of Word Salsa fucked around with this message at 03:32 on Jan 23, 2019 |
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Jan 23, 2019 03:27
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Something about that "Demonic Drive" song sound familiar, but I can't quite place what it reminds me of. I haven't listened to a comprehensive list of "Evolution" tracks, most of what I've heard I've disliked. But the Evolution version of "Genuine Devil" from Sky the Third is one I actually like better than the original, as it sounds richer, more orchestral. The Evolution version of Sky SC's "Fight with Assailant" is different from the original, but not in a bad way.
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Jan 23, 2019 05:30
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It was so good. Sen 4 was so good guys. (It was so good)
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Jan 25, 2019 12:34
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Satisfying ending?
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Jan 25, 2019 16:42
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They stopped doing bullshit cliffhangers, yes.
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Jan 25, 2019 17:34
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I am completely satisfied. It's a very good send off not just for the Erebonia crew, but the Liberl and Crossbell teams as well. It also did a good job setting the stage for future mysteries in the games to come.
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Jan 26, 2019 00:16
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It will probably be like 10 years until I play Sen 4 but good to know it's a satisfying ending.
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Jan 26, 2019 01:46
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Here's something you guys probably know but I've been curious about since I've played the game and am now watching one of our fellow goons do an LP on it - why in some scenes does everybody around Rean have voice acting but he doesn't even when he's supposed to be speaking?
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Jan 26, 2019 02:01
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That's what falcom does (Same thing happens in tokyo xanadu ex)
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Jan 26, 2019 02:15
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Dawgstar posted:Here's something you guys probably know but I've been curious about since I've played the game and am now watching one of our fellow goons do an LP on it - why in some scenes does everybody around Rean have voice acting but he doesn't even when he's supposed to be speaking? rean’s Japanese voice actor is famous and thus expensive the pc release of CS 1 and 2 actually adds voice acting back in there
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Jan 26, 2019 02:16
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Rean is ostensibly meant to be a player self-insert. It's a dumb choice since he's such a defined character and after CS2 they pivoted hard to aiming at a female demographic, but that is the logic. His voice actor being expensive is a factor, too.
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Jan 26, 2019 02:17
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Dawgstar posted:Here's something you guys probably know but I've been curious about since I've played the game and am now watching one of our fellow goons do an LP on it - why in some scenes does everybody around Rean have voice acting but he doesn't even when he's supposed to be speaking? Oddly Silent Rean is because his voice actor was too popular, expensive and busy. XSeed fixed that in the PC release.
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Jan 26, 2019 02:17
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Tae posted:That's what falcom does (Same thing happens in tokyo xanadu ex) Maybe I'm misremembering but I feel like xanadu is way more inconsistent about it in terms of who is or isn't voiced and when.
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Jan 26, 2019 02:33
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Also Rean in particular feels like a budget thing levered into an attempted effect, kinda? The divide is usually between school scenes and field studies in CS1 for example, which makes a kind of sense in terms of projecting onto a character but not really given the inconsistency.
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Jan 26, 2019 02:38
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Re: Rean discussion, Rean improves significantly in CS3 and then becomes kinda lame against in CS4*. While being very general and avoiding spoilers, CS3 gave me a lot of false hope that the series was going to improve many of the things I didn't like about CS1/CS2, and then betrayed it in CS4 (there's one particular thing that I really hated, to the point that it retroactively soured me on parts of CS3). It's still a really good game, though; it's just that I feel like it could have been much better. Lloyd is way better than Rean (though Estelle is better than both), and the person who said Lloyd is worse is crazy and dumb. Rean is far more of a cliche "anime/manga harem protagonist" type character, and a lot of his character design and circumstances are clearly aimed at making him seem cool in a kind of lame way (clothes, katana, mech, white hair/red eye mode, etc). I like Lloyd because he's pretty goofy and his dynamic with the rest of the party is far better than Rean's. He has his (relatively modest, compared with Rean - there are only really two serious members) harem, but people give him poo poo about it and turn it into a joke, as opposed to the CS games that play Rean's harem almost completely straight. Lloyd's chemistry with the supporting cast is also much better, compared with Rean's which is pretty much just "everyone likes and looks up to Rean." All in all, the Trails arc that had the best overall impression on me was Zero/Ao. It had the best combination of good characters/chemistry and good setting. There are certain aspects to the Sky games that I liked more, so it's kind of close between them and Zero/Ao, but the latter just come out a bit better in my estimation (largely due to having better party chemistry and a neater setting). The Cold Steel games were still entertaining, but something about them felt a lot less inspired and it felt like a lot of stuff was thrown in as fan service. * just decided to add a spoiler here just in case
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Jan 26, 2019 03:11
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Gonna have to agree that Lloyd overall is better than Rean. To me, Rean is just kinda bland and, much like Tokyo Xanadu's main protagonist, was kind of a walking bag of cliches. Not that cliches are bad, as Star Wars or the Belgariad proves. I just... kind of expected something other than a high school setting, but I suppose that was something that Falcom hadn't done at that point (barring yet again, Tokyo Xanadu). Lloyd, on the other hand, is a loving serious idiot to the point where it wraps around to being awkward and I kind of love it. Definitely agree that Estelle is the best protagonist out of the three of them, though. Not that it's surprising since everyone (*cough*in Japan*cough*) loved Christina from the Gagharv Trilogy.
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Jan 26, 2019 03:24
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everything about rean's design works at making him extremely attractive to female fans, so i can buy girls being into him in game as well
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Jan 26, 2019 03:31
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Yeah the Rean Harlem stuff gets really annoying especially when women who don’t really interact with him all that much in story start falling for him. Granted Sky sort of had that problem but it was at least balanced by having two characters to get the affection so it wasn’t that silly and annoying Though it did get a bit of that.
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Jan 26, 2019 03:38
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At least in Sky, the girls crushing on Joshua were the same age as him. Captain Claire and Sara are both in their mid 20s, so it's a little weirder that they both have a thing for Rean.
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Jan 26, 2019 07:40
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Yeah I definitely agree with Ytlaya in that 3 is great but kinda gets damaged a bit by association to 4 which while still good, has some story and gameplay design choices I question. A lot. Rean being one of them. He's much more of an actual character in 3 that he doesn't feel as much of a self-insert and being a teacher feels like a much more natural fit for his character than the first two games where he was a student but more or less being a teacher of sorts anyway. He was much more than a generic harem protagonist which is the main criticism I see against him and then 4 kiiinda doubles down on stuff like that as well as other things I didn't like about the Erebonia arc which 3 mostly did away with. I actually sometimes wonder if 4 was changed in response to initial kneejerk reactions to the reveals in 3. Around the Japanese launch of 3 there was a lot of people including myself who didn't like the reveals in 3 but slowly came around to really liking them a lot and appreciating the darker direction 3 takes and became curious to see what would happen in 4. Then 4 came out and I kinda felt underwhelmed by comparison and kinda disagree that it was satisfying. I mean, it was satisfying at concluding the Erebonia arc but the reveals in 4 also dampened my enthusiasm for future arcs at the same time, like I could predict where the overall story of the series will go. It's hard to be more specific than that without spoiling everything though.
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Jan 26, 2019 10:07
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Personally, CS 2 did a lot of things that made me leery of future games in the entire series. It badly, badly overused the heroes win a battle, but oh no the enemy has reinforcements or was holding back their true strength, wait some NPC is coming in at JUST THE RIGHT TIME to save the day, hooray trope. I think it does that the majority of the time, in fact. I also really disliked how all of Class VII was just reduced to Rean's echo chamber. No one could disagree with Rean, no one could have a difference of opinion with Rean. Even the alleged adults just smiled and nodded, even if Rean was merely spewing anime speeches which said... nothing. Rean getting TWO different extraordinary Chosen One powers was pretty ridiculous, and no it doesn't really make a difference whether or not having one lead to getting the other. The entire "Divine Knight" thing fell flat for me. It never really seemed necessary for the story at all, and the climax of it being Oroborus summoning an eldritch castle from a lost dimension just for the sole purpose of going "let's you and him fight" as the entire point just felt goofy. The regular DK story battles also suffered from being way too easy thanks to infinite free healing. I also in general, didn't care for the bonding point system locking relationship growth behind optional events instead of integrating it into the main story, and the whole "pick the one you want at the end" harem system hampers not only Rean's relationships, but those of other classmates as well. The fact that your choices in CS 2 do not carry over and thus do not have even the slightest effect on CS 3 is bad, especially if you chose endings with the strongest statements of feelings. Some Numbers posted:At least in Sky, the girls crushing on Joshua were the same age as him. Yeah, the age difference is enough for me to automatically disqualify those two as relationship interests for Rean, no matter how funny Sara is. And even discounting that, it just plain doesn't make any sense from the mandatory dialogue alone - at least through the first two games. Rean's attitude towards Sara is largely "I cannot believe she got a job as in instructor", and he agrees with the sentiment "there's not a person in Erebonia who would be suited to woo that alcoholic typhoon". Claire has little screen-time and doesn't even have a chance to talk to Rean outside of RMP business until Chapter 6 of CS 1. In the first two games, even though I used NG+ "max bonding points carryover" to see all bonding events, I tried to get around the "harem" part by picking one person for basically all optional "pick one and only one person" events. It actually helped that for that particular person Rean seems to be written as less oblivious towards them.
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Jan 26, 2019 16:44
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I will never understand Claire as a viable option. Sara, at the very least, is a cliche. Van Halen didn't make that song out of thin air, yknow. Claire on the other hand seems forced no matter how ya try to spin it. Maybe there's more info about her in 3 and 4, but I beat 2 thinking "why are you even here?" A lot of that group of characters could have been trimmed down, imo.
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Jan 26, 2019 17:18
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The odd and even numbered CS games feel a bit like they have two entirely different writing teams at times. The best decision 3 made was toning down the harem stuff a bit, but I guess people complained a bunch since it came back with a vengeance in 4 and did some serious damage to certain characters in the process. The Sky and Crossbell teams mostly avoid falling into the Rean-hole at least, and I do think 4 is far better than 2, which is my pick for weakest Kiseki.
The Doomhammer fucked around with this message at 17:23 on Jan 26, 2019 |
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Jan 26, 2019 17:18
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What certain characters do you mean? I don't mind spoilers about that, though ofc put them in tags for people who do.
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Jan 26, 2019 17:59
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You know if they went all in and had the crossbell and Sky teams fall for Rean making him a parody of boring harem protagonists that would have been funny. The Trails games are a little to sincere for that tho.
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Jan 26, 2019 18:09
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Endorph posted:What certain characters do you mean? I don't mind spoilers about that, though ofc put them in tags for people who do. Cold Steel 2 had some character bloat, which....is a weird thing for me to complain about in this franchise, but Claire worked fine as a rep for the Railway Police, and her big reveal as more than that fell flat because it really changes nothing about her. It really just gets used as a dramatic device in the Rean/Claire dynamic which felt pretty forced anyway. Admittedly, I don't know what role he will eventually play in 3 & 4, but I felt like Lechter was more of a glorified cameo than anything else. That leaves Rufus, Millium and Altina, and while I'm interested in all three it's a bit harder to sell a trio as "Osbourne's secret elite team!" It could very well be that the Ironbloods reveal comes so late in the game that I was more annoyed than surprised, but I just have never cared for Claire beyond the brief interactions in CS1. If it comes across as just me complaining about harem stuff, so be it. Too many dang waifus/husbandos in the friggin game. Where's the Mishy route, Falcom???
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Jan 26, 2019 18:25
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Shinjobi posted:Cold Steel 2 had some character bloat, which....is a weird thing for me to complain about in this franchise, but Claire worked fine as a rep for the Railway Police, and her big reveal as more than that fell flat because it really changes nothing about her. It really just gets used as a dramatic device in the Rean/Claire dynamic which felt pretty forced anyway. Admittedly, I don't know what role he will eventually play in 3 & 4, but I felt like Lechter was more of a glorified cameo than anything else. That leaves Rufus, Millium and Altina, and while I'm interested in all three it's a bit harder to sell a trio as "Osbourne's secret elite team!" It could very well be that the Ironbloods reveal comes so late in the game that I was more annoyed than surprised, but I just have never cared for Claire beyond the brief interactions in CS1.
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Jan 26, 2019 18:28
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Endorph posted:What certain characters do you mean? I don't mind spoilers about that, though ofc put them in tags for people who do. I feel Juna gets the worst of it, feels wrong to see her fawning over Rean the way she does in 4, and Rean seems far too receptive to the advances of his female students for my comfort (they don't seem to do anything stupid with Altina, at least.) On the whole, many of the female bonds are a lot more aggressively romantic in ways that makes it harder to ignore than ever that Rean is a harem anime protagonist (i.e. Laura making out with him in a cave and telling him that he knows Alisa and Emma have feelings for him, but she also has feelings for him etc. that's like their first event by the way)It just all had me rolling my eyes a bit. Also, Towa and Rean's relationship goes from extremely platonic to romantic and that's just sacrilege I say! I'll also just mention for accuracy's sake that I don't speak Japanese so there's a chance I misread the context on certain things that happen in bonding events.
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Jan 26, 2019 18:34
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ahh, yeah, if there's no like, clear non romance path vs romance path for bond events thats a bit of a shame
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Jan 26, 2019 19:13
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It's also literally all the same confession, sometimes word for word. A lot of your bonding event options are girls, and they're practically all romantic in some manner, the only ones who aren't are *spoilers*. I'd agree that the girls bonding events were the worst part of the game easy, but a lot of the guys bonding events were actually... pretty drat good? But like, I had pot committed on a girl well before that point and you can deny everyone who isn't the new class 7 girls from being an option for the final event if you so choose, and accepted that Rean basically has an overwhelming harem aura that no one can escape. It completely plays him like a two timer though which sucks. The canon we came up with in streaming is that this was all the effect of the curse going around the empire and the entire purpose of the Great Twilight was to get Rean laid. It's just his dad doing him one big solid.
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Jan 26, 2019 21:17
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I should be able to date Claire, but Rean shouldn't, that is the game option we need.
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Jan 26, 2019 21:21
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Logicblade posted:It's also literally all the same confession, sometimes word for word. A lot of your bonding event options are girls, and they're practically all romantic in some manner, the only ones who aren't are *spoilers*. I'd agree that the girls bonding events were the worst part of the game easy, but a lot of the guys bonding events were actually... pretty drat good? But like, I had pot committed on a girl well before that point and you can deny everyone who isn't the new class 7 girls from being an option for the final event if you so choose, and accepted that Rean basically has an overwhelming harem aura that no one can escape. It completely plays him like a two timer though which sucks. Osborne: I want grandkids, damnit.
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Jan 26, 2019 21:35
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