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Goffer posted:Aren’t all three of those character traits from top gun Tom cruise? He's a wisecracking smartass with the talent to back that up. Literally the embodiment of his callsign. I don't remember him ever being a stoic hardass. Been a while since I've watched Top Gun though so 
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Mar 17, 2019 23:55
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teagone posted:He's a wisecracking smartass with the talent to back that up. Literally the embodiment of his callsign. I don't remember him ever being a stoic hardass. Been a while since I've watched Top Gun though so People are like onions, see? Some people have a protective layer of wisecracking which hides their core stoic nature, some people a protective stoic layer which hides a whimsical nature underneath. Tom cruise is no. 1, idk about cap marvel as I haven’t seen it
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Mar 18, 2019 00:08
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For the record I thought she was a free spirited and incredibly determined person who had been trained and brainwashed into being a stoic condescending hardass. The movie is kind of about her true nature asserting itself.
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Mar 18, 2019 00:09
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I mean she is a military pilot turned space cop and the times she acts hardass are the times I'd expect either of those groups to act hardass. Nobody is quippy 24/7 not even Marvel characters except Tony Stark.
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Mar 18, 2019 00:14
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Goffer posted:People are like onions, see? Some people have a protective layer of wisecracking which hides their core stoic nature, some people a protective stoic layer which hides a whimsical nature underneath. Top Gun is a movie I don't care to explore, but I've never thought of Tom Cruise's character as "stoic" in that film. He's a headstrong renegade to the core. Either way, Carol was portrayed as sassy and confident, with a tinge of volatility. Larson's performance doesn't particularly communicate those traits in compelling fashion, but I got what they were doing with the character. I liked Larson in Room, and think she's a solid actress, so I blame the writers/directors for Carol's personality coming across as  for me.
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Mar 18, 2019 00:20
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Lurdiak posted:For the record I thought she was a free spirited and incredibly determined person who had been trained and brainwashed into being a stoic condescending hardass. The movie is kind of about her true nature asserting itself. I'd also call her willfully contrarian. Steve Rogers gets up every time he's knocked down because it's the right thing to do. Carol Danvers, at least in this depiction, gets up every time she's knocked down because gently caress you if you think she's beaten. I think a lot of her personality comes across in her smirks and body language, more than when she's actually talking.
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Mar 18, 2019 00:34
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Cythereal posted:I'd also call her willfully contrarian. Steve Rogers gets up every time he's knocked down because it's the right thing to do. Carol Danvers, at least in this depiction, gets up every time she's knocked down because gently caress you if you think she's beaten. I also felt like they glossed over a lot of her ‘past life’ too quickly and that takes away from her development a bit as a character
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Mar 18, 2019 01:21
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Cythereal posted:Carol Danvers, at least in this depiction, gets up every time she's knocked down because gently caress you if you think she's beaten. Spitefully heroic might be the best role model we need right now, so I approve.
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Mar 18, 2019 01:22
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Lurdiak posted:For the record I thought she was a free spirited and incredibly determined person who had been trained and brainwashed into being a stoic condescending hardass. The movie is kind of about her true nature asserting itself. Samuringa posted:Spitefully heroic might be the best role model we need right now, so I approve. Yeah this was my takeaway as well. I mean I probably wouldn't say "spitefully" but I definitely got the impression of someone who gets up when she's knocked down not because she's taking the weight of the world on her shoulders but because she simply refuses to let herself be beaten by anybody. And Lurdiak's point goes back to the very first bits of the movie where Jude Law keeps telling her "you have to control your emotions, you're too emotional, you'll never beat me if you let your emotions get the better of you" except it turns out that's all horseshit and she beats him at the end by being herself and doing things her way (by shooting him into a mountainside with space lasers).
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Mar 18, 2019 01:26
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Kai Tave posted:Yeah this was my takeaway as well. I mean I probably wouldn't say "spitefully" but I definitely got the impression of someone who gets up when she's knocked down not because she's taking the weight of the world on her shoulders but because she simply refuses to let herself be beaten by anybody. And Lurdiak's point goes back to the very first bits of the movie where Jude Law keeps telling her "you have to control your emotions, you're too emotional, you'll never beat me if you let your emotions get the better of you" except it turns out that's all horseshit and she beats him at the end by being herself and doing things her way (by shooting him into a mountainside with space lasers). And just by reading your post I realize that plays into the whole 'women are have emotions' complaint Certain People have and that they use it as a negative.
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Mar 18, 2019 01:30
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Keep in mind too that both in the finale and that original spar, she beats him both times with her power aka “being emotional”. It’s not subtle
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Mar 18, 2019 01:36
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And that Carol's entire life has been men telling her she's too emotional, she needs to smile more, she's not good enough to do what men do, and every time she's pressed on regardless. I'm ambivalent but supportive of the gay subtext between Carol and Maria in this movie, but what stuck out for me about their relationship is that Maria, Monica, and Mar-Vell are the only people in her entire life who have never been anything but supportive of her (Fury and Talos come around). These women are her family, especially as the movie notes that Carol is estranged from her parents. I also noted in CineD that one of the things that most stuck out about this movie for me was how much plain old fun Carol is having. She's snarking and grinning and laughing for most of the movie, and when her powers unlock in the climax you can hear her whooping and yelling and having a great old time as she saves the planet. I credit a lot of that to Brie Larson, and the sheer attitude Carol has in the movie, and it's for me very refreshing in a superhero movie. Carol Danvers is one of the very few supers of the modern superhero movie era who seems to love having superpowers, love using them, and what angst she has is completely unconnected to the fact that she can body slam battleships in orbit.
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Mar 18, 2019 02:04
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FlamingLiberal posted:I like the idea of her character but I think due to the writing it didn’t come across as well as it could have. It's the most comic-faithful adaptation of a Marvel character yet! 
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Mar 18, 2019 02:38
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I think it was too dark when she killed an entire ship full of people. I mean imagine if Superman killed somebody in one of his movies people would lose their mind
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Mar 18, 2019 02:42
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AlBorlantern Corps posted:I think it was too dark when she killed an entire ship full of people. I mean imagine if Superman killed somebody in one of his movies people would lose their mind She stole that man's motorcycle she is a menace! 
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Mar 18, 2019 02:47
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Aliens don't count as people in movies. You can just kill them and it's fine. Like nazis, PMCs, and anyone who gets into hand to hand combat wearing a suit and tie.
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Mar 18, 2019 02:51
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They had just launched a bunch of planet killer bombs at earth, what did we think she was gonna do, give em a stern talking to
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Mar 18, 2019 02:55
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Aphrodite posted:Aliens* don't count as people in movies. *also people from the middle East or disabled US veterans Oh wait if aliens don't count then Superman didn't kill anyone
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Mar 18, 2019 02:56
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I actually enjoyed Captain Marvel more as the movie got on. I really enjoyed the Earth-based stuff as it developed/revealed more about Carol. Good chemistry with Fury and Monica. I really hope to see Monica prominently featured in the sequel.
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Mar 18, 2019 02:57
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Really though, those ships don't seem to have a crew in Guardians. So she killed a few Accusers maybe.site posted:They had just launched a bunch of planet killer bombs at earth, what did we think she was gonna do, give em a stern talking to I mean, she does do that right after.
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Mar 18, 2019 03:02
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I will admit I haven't read a ton of Ms./Captain Marvel comics, but I guess I missed the part where not killing people is a key element of her character.
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Mar 18, 2019 03:02
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Those were planet killers? When he fired them I thought they were but then when she threw them into each other the result was no more impressive than the bomb Tony showed off from the beginning of Iron Man 1
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Mar 18, 2019 03:06
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Their goal was to exterminate the Skrulls on the planet, so maybe they wouldn't destroy the planet, but there probably wouldn't be much in the way of life left after they all hit.
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Mar 18, 2019 03:08
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They were at least the first volley, and would have presumably spread out closer to the surface. I never gave it much thought, because it felt more like a fun nod towards Missile Command than a serious plot beat. We got Galaga (Avengers), Space Invaders {Guardians of the Galaxy), and Missile Command (Captain Marvel) so far.
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Mar 18, 2019 03:18
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They need to move on to non space shooters like Donkey Kong
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Mar 18, 2019 03:25
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I thought people were less bothered about Zod and more about Supes not seeming to give much of a drat about the civilians in the buildings he was punching Zod through. Or am I baited into talking about some bad movie? Anyway pretty much all of the MCU heroes kill bad guys, kinda a limitation of the power set if your main ability is blowing stuff up. Maybe all the Kree ships were autonomous and everyone made it to a lifepod idk.
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Mar 18, 2019 03:38
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AlBorlantern Corps posted:They need to move on to non space shooters like Donkey Kong Thor scaling a skyscraper to get to a rampaging Hulk, smashing barrels with his hammer.
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Mar 18, 2019 03:45
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I think the problem is, as Rich Evans once said, if you're gonna have Superman kill somebody, you should probably establish that he doesn't like doing that earlier in the film, and not have him screaming in rage while he does it. Then again I wouldn't have Batman shooting guns either so maybe I just don't get film-making like Fired Legend Zack Snyder.
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Mar 18, 2019 03:46
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Open Marriage Night posted:They were at least the first volley, and would have presumably spread out closer to the surface. I never gave it much thought, because it felt more like a fun nod towards Missile Command than a serious plot beat. Let's introduce Black Knight so we can get Joust.
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Mar 18, 2019 03:51
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Jesus christ, thread, Borland got you discussing MoS! Pull up!
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Mar 18, 2019 03:54
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Lurdiak posted:I think the problem is, as Rich Evans once said, if you're gonna have Superman kill somebody, you should probably establish that he doesn't like doing that earlier in the film, and not have him screaming in rage while he does it. That's incredibly dumb. "Screaming in rage" lol. Rich is more smoothbrained than I recalled.
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Mar 18, 2019 03:56
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Endless Mike posted:Their goal was to exterminate the Skrulls on the planet, so maybe they wouldn't destroy the planet, but there probably wouldn't be much in the way of life left after they all hit. Yeah. The Accusers' preferred method of exterminating Skrulls seemed to be 'rigorous carpet bombing.'
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Mar 18, 2019 04:29
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That's more or less brought up explicitly in the movie. "Tell us where she is-" "So you can loving Exterminatus the planet like every other time you find a Skrull?" Paraphrased, obviously.
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Mar 18, 2019 04:30
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Aphrodite posted:I mean, she does do that right after. Lol okay fair but telling the kree to gently caress off plays a lot better after you've demonstrated that you can easily obliterate a fleet
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Mar 18, 2019 04:30
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AlBorlantern Corps posted:That's incredibly dumb. "Screaming in rage" lol. Rich is more smoothbrained than I recalled. I contend that it is your brain that is smooth.
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Mar 18, 2019 04:55
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Lurdiak posted:I contend that it is your brain that is smooth. He's clearly screaming in grief due to having to do it. It's not even subtext. It's text. He also literally breaks down crying after he does it.
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Mar 18, 2019 05:26
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Guess I'll need to rew-ahahahahaha.
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Mar 18, 2019 05:34
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Lurdiak posted:Guess I'll need to rew-ahahahahaha. The movie has enough issues all by itself without having to make up some that actually just make you look like you don't understand what emotions are or how to tell them apart.
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Mar 18, 2019 06:18
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Remember how some dude in CineD was dreaming up his idea for a Superman movie and it included Superman snapping Bizarro's neck while crying, and everyone gave him poo poo for that really dumb idea, and then Man of Steel came out and included Superman snapping Zod's neck while crying?
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Mar 18, 2019 06:23
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Here's a series of video essays that takes a critical but levelheaded look at the MCU and its more popular issues that's worth a watch imo. They do a pretty good job informing those popular issues in a way that isn't fanboy-ish or vitriolic; they're well presented and put together, mimicking the style/feel of Every Frame a Painting's essays pretty well. I personally agree with a lot of what the guy has to say and have echo'd similar sentiments elsewhere for some time, but he thinks Whedon is some kind of visionary filmmaker and that's a hard disagree on my end lol. But otherwise, so far the videos were a good watch. It's a three part series I believe. Here are the first two https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6Bq_jK0Z1Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzIJ4HzLiIE
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Mar 18, 2019 06:28
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