|
Yeah nobody wants cool battles with crazy animations and insane poo poo to zoom in on, and everyone hates this new complex building slot management instead of good ol’ “build everything, massacre your people as necessary”, and CA loves agents and loads of armies *warhammer 2 with dino on dragon animations and simplistic buildings with slots and massive penalties to building more than a few armies blows sales charts, ToB removes agents* Edgar Allen Ho fucked around with this message at 23:57 on Mar 30, 2019 |
#
?
Mar 30, 2019 23:53
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 07:38 |
|
|
Edgar Allen Ho posted:Yeah nobody wants cool battles with crazy animations and insane poo poo to zoom in on, and everyone hates this new complex building slot management instead of good ol’ “build everything, massacre your people as necessary”, and CA loves agents and loads of armies Yeah this is probably CA's target audience, folks that find the pretty animations and colored lights compelling for a campaign play-through while feeling super badass for wrecking the busted AI on normal and dutifully buy the next game while pointing to sales charts as signs that they must be doing something right  These things aren't mutually exclusive, you can have good gameplay and fun production values. To me it seems they keep focusing on production values and not on gameplay, that was what I was saying. I'm glad you like it bro, I had fun with Med 1 / Shogun 2 even though they were far more simplistic visually. I even enjoyed Empire and Napoleon battles other than the horrid rear end campaign map. Ham Sandwiches fucked around with this message at 00:16 on Mar 31, 2019 |
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2019 00:14
|
|
|
i don't think there's a pronounced tendency in either direction. with warhammer: the strategic level is simplified but the tactical level is a lot more sophisticated with the addition of large and hero units. with three kingdoms: what seems most prominent are the huge innovations to strategic level gameplay. the focus on graphics might have been a relevant criticism for the original r:tw. but subsequent improvements to graphical scale and fidelity don't seem to inform these gameplay innovations at all.
Zane fucked around with this message at 00:49 on Mar 31, 2019 |
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2019 00:43
|
|
|
Ham Sandwiches doesn’t seem to care at all about the extremely good Warhammer battles besides hating on graphics, so I didn’t mention them But yeah, Warhammer battles are super loving good, Warhammer MP is great, and I hope we can combine Warhammer and Shogun 2 avatar going forward *blinks at flashing lights*
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2019 00:47
|
|
|
Ham Sandwiches posted:Yeah this is probably CA's target audience, folks that find the pretty animations and colored lights compelling for a campaign play-through while feeling super badass for wrecking the busted AI on normal and dutifully buy the next game while pointing to sales charts as signs that they must be doing something right literally me e: did i ever tell you guys about that time i lined up a spartan hoplite phalanx on a bridge against like 20000 peasants? man it was badass
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2019 01:08
|
|
|
I’d like a game that had spectacular battles and a great campaign, but if I can only choose one I’m going to take dinosaurs riding dinosaurs most of the time. Still there day 1 for 3K if it seems decent though.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2019 01:11
|
|
|
Warham 1 and to some extent 2 are the best vanilla games CA has made in ages. Maybe FotS comes close. That's why Throb disappointed me so much, not only did they build it as a 32bit fork of the worst engine they ever made it was a big ol mess at launch and is still trying to find the fun. I was hoping for them taking everything they'd improved on with Warhams over Rome 2 and attila to make a historical title. When that wasn't the case I was hopeful for 3k but that looks uh... Not as good as Warhams by a long way. I think the problem is CA has enough trouble making a single game with a unified vision and level of quality let alone 3 at once.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2019 02:12
|
|
|
Half the time I use ambush stance it's to get armies out of settlements.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2019 02:02
|
|
|
Plan Z posted:Half the time I use ambush stance it's to get armies out of settlements. Yea same and I think their metrics were only counting the times you actually engaged in an ambush battle which yeah was very rare compared to the number of times I used the stance itself to lure ai armies into attack range which is basically something I do multiple times every campaign
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2019 02:15
|
|
|
Maybe they should just change the AI so it fights more battles! I understand the "make the AI try and win the game approach" but they could limit that to legendary or something and let the AI actually attack you on other difficulties, even if its at a slight disadvantage. I just want to actually fight field battles, without sitting in ambush and hoping the AI has decided that army is going to attack me and not defend the city. Oh wait an agent from an entirely different faction has spotted me, it's not happening.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2019 13:06
|
|
|
yeah the whole thing of the ai just chilling with a 20 stack in a city with a second 20 just outside is a bit lameo. its so easy to counter too, atleast in games with night battles. in rome 2 is there any reason to not spec your generals into cuning up to night battles, then zeal to the -30% enemy morale buff?
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2019 13:43
|
|
|
also the ai very very rarely makes use of ambush (except via skaven and beastmen shenanigans) so their metric was stupid on that front, too
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2019 14:01
|
|
|
Here's CA's take on today! Oh, and I don't know the source for this but it's an interesting description of how Gongsun Zan's faction mechanic of 'no administrators, but rather commanding generals' works.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2019 16:11
|
|
|
Kind of looking forward to seeing how 3K's weird segmented army system plays out. I kind of like the idea of de-metafying building 20 stacks all the time. I actually really enjoy the Mongol invasion in Med 2 because they'd sometimes just hurl these weird random stacks out to your lesser territories which leads to a lot of fun defenses or small-army battles in the late game.
Plan Z fucked around with this message at 22:18 on Apr 2, 2019 |
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2019 22:15
|
|
|
Theswarms posted:Maybe they should just change the AI so it fights more battles! This is my big frustration with TW campaigns. It's like, everybody knows that the most interesting fights are when you have two roughly evenly matched forces on open ground (maybe with some interesting terrain features to take advantage of, but not like, a siege battle), and yet the campaign seems to be designed to prevent that from happening. 90% of the battles I have in campaigns are either auto-resolves or a boring city attack where the majority of the fighting happens in blobs on the walls where there's not really any maneuvering or anything you can do other than just slowly press in.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2019 23:36
|
|
|
tbh i get field battles all the time so the whole line of conversation mystifies me a little bit
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2019 23:52
|
|
|
If you show the least big of aggression the AI holes up in a city with two or three reinforcing armies camped out front. If you try to draw them out they attack with overwhelming odds. If you're in range to attack an isolated stack they conveniently have enough movement range left to retreat away and leave you unable to pursue, after which they hit you with the aforementioned overwhelming odds.
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2019 23:55
|
|
|
Which is why my entire army is together for every attack always
|
|
#
?
Apr 2, 2019 23:57
|
|
|
The recruitment bonuses that the AI gets on higher difficulty are worse than their cheating economies. Killing one stack for another one to immediately spawn in a low tier settlement packing elite troops just so they can hit your undefended rear whole yours prosecuting your conquest is bullshit.
|
|
#
?
Apr 3, 2019 00:02
|
|
|
Tiler Kiwi posted:tbh i get field battles all the time so the whole line of conversation mystifies me a little bit I think if you're powergaming it then it's super hard to avoid them, e.g. in Shogun 2 how no matter how far the odds are in your favor the castle will always be damaged (and so stopping you from recruiting and making public order worse etc) after an autoresolve, but yeah for a more normal style of play I totally agree, my experience does not match what seems to be a lot of people's on this one. You can turn literally every siege assault into a field battle by waiting for them to sortie (which the AI seems to do after a few turns 100% of the time, even if they have no chance) as long as you're willing to wait, and if you're aggressive then you don't actually get many siege defenses. Like, honestly I find myself wishing for more siege defenses sometimes. I guess if you manually play it out for every single settlement you capture then it's a different story but I dunno why anyone would inflict that on themselves. Like, 100% agreed on the bullshit movement, but the AI holing up does not match my experience: Arcsquad12 posted:If you show the least big of aggression the AI holes up in a city with two or three reinforcing armies camped out front. If you try to draw them out they attack with overwhelming odds. If you're in range to attack an isolated stack they conveniently have enough movement range left to retreat away and leave you unable to pursue, after which they hit you with the aforementioned overwhelming odds. gently caress, thinking about it I feel like I barely even get the actually cool siege assaults? It's always against just a handful of dudes after having wiped out their armies in field battles. The huge throwdowns behind walls are actually some of the most fun I've had in Total War too.
|
|
#
?
Apr 3, 2019 00:34
|
|
|
I've been playing a ton of Rome 2 lately while waiting for the next Warhams DLC and the open town battles are great to break the monotony of laying siege to walled settlements over and over. Fighting through sidestreets to isolate and destroy enemy units is pretty cool. Also multi-front siege fights are something Warhammer just doesn't have. That the settlement towers aren't machine gun nests like in Attila is another plus.
|
|
#
?
Apr 3, 2019 02:42
|
|
|
Depends which game youre playing. Shogun 2 ai is eager to fight in the field, almost suicidally so. Its a good thing. It's particularly bad in warhammer, the ai will even put you under seige then just not attack to starve you out instead. So you don't even get to play siege defences yourself.
|
|
#
?
Apr 3, 2019 04:48
|
|
|
Hentai Jihadist posted:Depends which game youre playing. Shogun 2 ai is eager to fight in the field, almost suicidally so. Its a good thing. Unless it has an overwhelmingly superior force, like the time my Dark Elf elite stack did a Thermopylae against 6000 Skaven. Man that was the greatest battle I ever lost.
|
|
#
?
Apr 3, 2019 07:35
|
|
|
I wish starting a siege would give you a prompt to attack right away. Sometimes I’d rather not waste a turn of building stuff just because some rear end in a top hat took his 200 friends to siege my huge city with 1000 garrison, and maybe additional 2000 dudes army inside.
|
|
#
?
Apr 3, 2019 12:00
|
|
|
So are Liu Biao or Kong Rong going to be able to progress down the reforms path faster than others? It seems like they're the tech savvy factions of this game.
|
|
#
?
Apr 3, 2019 15:02
|
|
|
Looks like CA "fixed" the unit cards in 3K.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2019 08:11
|
|
|
Arbite posted:So are Liu Biao or Kong Rong going to be able to progress down the reforms path faster than others? It seems like they're the tech savvy factions of this game. The "Alternate unit cards" checkbox in game settings results in 'soldier's 3D model' portraits, so here's Kong Rong's army of four Fury of Beihai crossbowmen units, two trebuchet units, six units of Ji Militia, four units of Sabre Militia, and two units of Mounted Sabre Militia:  You can move your capital once every two years (more specifically "Once moved it takes 10 seasons to be able to relocate again") at the cost of 10000 funds; this may break some or even all of your trade routes, but if you control Emperor Xian he will be relocated along with your capital.  The character relation screen in question is a tab in the faction court screen, joining the Court and Family Tree tabs, which also serves as a way to browse through characters that you've met (e.g. search for any "Liu" clansmen), e.g. to find where a character who left your faction ended up, and the columns can be sorted by character rank, faction, name, age, and the five attributes (expertise, resolve, cunning, instinct, authority):   The gold border/generic->Legendary bit wasn't shown correctly because the Kong Rong campaign's on a carried-over save, but the attributes' colored bars are scaled to reflect values up to 100, with the cap being 200; a normal character who gets an attribute above 100 gets a gold border around the elemental icon/the attribute name in gold text and the character becomes Legendary -- complete with resilience -- for as long at least one attribute stays above 100 (if it's dependent on their ancillaries, then if you take away those ancillaries they lose their Legendary status at the end of the turn):   Hilariously, this playthrough's rank 5 Liu Bei is a 'double Legendary' in that respect, with 159/200 authority (+10 satisfaction factionwide if prime minister/heir/faction leader and +18 unit morale for his own retinue) but then also 106/200 resolve (+43% general's health and +6K population growth for administered commandery):  Kong Rong's gained a five-stage faction mechanic/unique resource/'meter' called trade monopoly, accrued via the faction-exclusive Extort Through Trade diplomatic option, with the fifth stage doubling his trade influence... but every army Kong Rong has reduces his faction-wide trade influence by -35%:  Also, Wheels claimed (48:50 in Twitch stream) that a Unique-quality ancillary really is unique -- only one copy of that given ancillary (e.g. the Bastion of Fire armor) in the game, the graphics options include post effects choices of "Romance" and "Records" which despite the names are independent of campaign mode with the latter being more Attilla-like (think 'gritty graphics filter for my legendary lords'), and the mouseover tooltip for the pre-battle GUI's 'Fight night battle' checkbox showed that if one army has 'night battle' enabled and the other does not then the latter's army will not receive reinforcements, their spotting ability will be diminished, and their army will have a -15 morale penalty. Finally, if a unit reaches rank 10 you can rename it.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2019 10:09
|
|
|
Not a fan of the generic UI Looks like GW2 concept art or endless legend, not a Chinese themed game
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2019 11:36
|
|
|
The character relations screen is straight out of one of the Koei Romance games.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2019 16:12
|
|
|
Lui bei is kind and fraternal? Would they say he's b e n e v e l e n t
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2019 05:09
|
|
|
Are those smiles faceapp swaps
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2019 09:06
|
|
|
I'd like records mode to have the characters behave according to their historical personas. Just for the confusion in forums. "Why does Liu Bei keep betraying me?"
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2019 10:00
|
|
|
"Why isn't Zhuge Liang an omnipotent deity?"
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2019 11:49
|
|
|
Tiler Kiwi posted:I'd like records mode to have the characters behave according to their historical personas. Just for the confusion in forums. Oh, and did anyone else notice that during the battles against Zhang Yan's faction that Kong Rong's rank 4 champion Zheng Yan was offered a permanent +25% hit points for winning a duel, be it against a weaker opponent or one deemed of similar strength? When a commander of his was deemed overmatched against a sentinel he was offered 'survive-and-then-disengage to get these buffs' which didn't include extra hit points.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2019 16:04
|
|
|
Chortles posted:(Interesting rundown) Thank you, for that. Speaking of the livestream, they showed it was possible to marry Zheng Jiang and merge factions with her. I wonder if her faction could choose to do that to the emperor if he fell under her control.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2019 18:11
|
|
|
Oh cool, I was wandering if it was possible to merge bandit factions like that from pretty much the moment Zheng Jiang was announced. E: I don't think the Emperor can "win", he automatically abdicates after a certain point, and Zheng marries matrilineally iirc so that strategy probably would just automatically trigger the abdication event. Mantis42 fucked around with this message at 18:33 on Apr 5, 2019 |
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2019 18:29
|
|
|
Mantis42 posted:E: I don't think the Emperor can "win", he automatically abdicates after a certain point, and Zheng marries matrilineally iirc so that strategy probably would just automatically trigger the abdication event.
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2019 04:31
|
|
|
Vichan posted:"Why isn't Zhuge Liang an omnipotent deity?" This would be a real bug though.
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2019 04:54
|
|
|
Arcsquad12 posted:Please, the only thing that will make the TWC assholes satisfied is a Spanish Reconquista game where the Muslims are an unplayable faction and they're all modeled like brown skinned goblins from Warhammer dying in droves to holy Christian reclaimers. Extremely belated but are the TWC guys angry at Three Kingdoms being the next game? I know it's full of racists and the same kind of people who populate the Paradox forums, but having posted a whole lot on there back when I was a teenager (I was/am a giant history nerd and I had some minor involvement with the Broken Crescent mod for Medieval 2) I remember Three Kingdoms Romance consistently being one of the most request settings whnever there was talk of a potential new TW game. Did that change? They probably would have taken that Reconquista game as well back then though. With the exception that the Muslims would only functionally be goblins, not visually, because of ~~historical accuracy~~ (is unaware that Moorish/Andalucian armies were extremely similar in terms of equipment to Christian Spanish ones, and is fine with hordes of unarmored light cavalry and infantry rabble) e: On a related but different note, a Three Kingdoms style character-focused historical game set in the Crusades would be extremely my poo poo. Particularly if it starts in the 1160s before Saladin seizes power in Egypt. There's a whole bunch of politicking and struggles that took part at that time, particularly on the Islamic side, which is generally ignored in nearly all media that portrays the Crusades, even lots of historical works just glosses over how Saladin had suddenly established himself as the head of a Sunni state in Egypt that was previously home to a Shiite Caliphate. Randarkman fucked around with this message at 09:49 on Apr 7, 2019 |
|
#
?
Apr 7, 2019 09:36
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 07:38 |
|
|
Mantis42 posted:The character relations screen is straight out of one of the Koei Romance games. No poo poo, it’s a good rip.
|
|
#
?
Apr 7, 2019 11:25
|
|
