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Pener Kropoopkin posted:Games studios shouldn't have to try and make all the money in gaming. Treating difficulty as an "accessibility" issue sounds like you're comparing hard games to a building that's not wheelchair accessible. Oh I'm not treating it as an accessibility issue, and they're of course free to do whatever they like and some doubtless will keep making them harder and harder as the base desires. People need to accept that some studios are gonna open them up to more casual players though because it's easy money and already the industry standard.
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Apr 8, 2019 18:22
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i think an easy mode would be bad if it made the games worse, and good if it made them better
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Apr 8, 2019 18:22
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:The Souls series is already one of the most popular franchises in gaming, so they really don't. Dark Souls did kind of have an easy mode by letting you summon NPCs or other players to help with boss fights though, but Sekiro removed that mechanic and didn't add anything else to compensate. The series got more gatekeepy with this iteration.
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Apr 8, 2019 18:23
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I bet this guy's really smart and a good socialist.
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Apr 8, 2019 18:23
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You, a leftist: Video games should have an easy mode so that everyone can beat them Me, an intellectual: Get gud scrub
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Apr 8, 2019 18:28
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a Loving Dog posted:I bet this guy's really smart and a good socialist. Lol you like Dark Souls lacfo lmob
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Apr 8, 2019 18:29
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Groovelord Neato posted:yeah they do. drat can't believe the guy whose entire career is based on nepotism and dark money funding to astroturf himself is legitimately blowing up this time for real this time, definitely, absolutely not fake for real
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Apr 8, 2019 18:29
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repiv posted:Dark Souls did kind of have an easy mode by letting you summon NPCs or other players to help with boss fights though, but Sekiro removed that mechanic and didn't add anything else to compensate. Well, Sekiro is built around making you do the hardest thing in every souls-like game, which is parrying. It's going for a particular experience. Epic High Five posted:Oh I'm not treating it as an accessibility issue, and they're of course free to do whatever they like and some doubtless will keep making them harder and harder as the base desires. People need to accept that some studios are gonna open them up to more casual players though because it's easy money and already the industry standard. Ok, but the issue at hand is that From Soft is not opening the Souls games up to more casual players. It's ok to have games that aren't meant to be casual relaxed experiences. What makes Souls games so compelling in the first place is their ability to generate tension through risk. If you don't want an intense experience you don't have to play the game. If you had a Souls game that had an "easy" difficulty, then you're not getting the same experience. It's not making the experience more accessible. It's sort of like, if you insisted on having a cut of Come and See where you took out the barn burning scene just to make it easier to watch for people who are too sensitive.
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Apr 8, 2019 18:29
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If you're not 100% anticlerical and 100% antidarksoulslikers you're right-wing and literally literally responsible for Lowtax's 90 000 spine debt.
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Apr 8, 2019 18:30
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bring back cheat codes to solve this problem imo. and big head mode while you're at it you fuckers
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Apr 8, 2019 18:31
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Jerry Cotton posted:Lol you like Dark Souls lacfo lmob every loving time lol https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3390024&pagenumber=23&perpage=40#post392117471
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Apr 8, 2019 18:31
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:Ok, but the issue at hand is that From Soft is not opening the Souls games up to more casual players. It's ok to have games that aren't meant to be casual relaxed experiences. What makes Souls games so compelling in the first place is their ability to generate tension through risk. If you don't want an intense experience you don't have to play the game. If you had a Souls game that had an "easy" difficulty, then you're not getting the same experience. It's not making the experience more accessible. lol
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Apr 8, 2019 18:31
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Baba is You and the proletariat rewriting the fickle and transitory rules imposed on them to reject orthodoxy and define their own winning conditions
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Apr 8, 2019 18:33
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imo play Metal Gear Solid: REVEANGEANCE where parrying is fun and good and you can wear a problematic giant sombrero and poncho
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Apr 8, 2019 18:34
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but I mean let's be real folks, it's all been downhill since Mutant League stopped making sports games
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Apr 8, 2019 18:35
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rewatching this for the first time in years and lmao totally forgot the ETERNAL VIRGIN part
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Apr 8, 2019 18:35
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Intel&Sebastian posted:imo play Metal Gear Solid: REVEANGEANCE where parrying is fun and good and you can wear a problematic giant sombrero and poncho When you want "war as a business" to end "war as a business." 
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Apr 8, 2019 18:36
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Intel&Sebastian posted:imo play Metal Gear Solid: REVEANGEANCE where parrying is fun and good and you can wear a problematic giant sombrero and poncho it's fun and good in sekiro too though. only problematic aspect is the one gaijin is a giant monster guy.
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Apr 8, 2019 18:38
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:Ok, but the issue at hand is that From Soft is not opening the Souls games up to more casual players. It's ok to have games that aren't meant to be casual relaxed experiences. What makes Souls games so compelling in the first place is their ability to generate tension through risk. If you don't want an intense experience you don't have to play the game. If you had a Souls game that had an "easy" difficulty, then you're not getting the same experience. It's not making the experience more accessible. That said, I know jack and poo poo about game design but I know difficulty isn't just a linear slider. It would probably take quite a bit of effort to pull it off well and if that's not what the studio wants to invest in, that's fine.
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Apr 8, 2019 18:39
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Every game has an easy mode these days, the kids call it a Let's Play.
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Apr 8, 2019 18:42
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Games are an interactive medium, and difficulty is an intrinsic part of that. Dark Souls and similar games would be worse for having an easy mode, their combat systems and difficulty are their primary focus Accessibility in terms of adjustable control options, color blind modes, speech to text, and the like should be expected from any major project, but the difficulty of winning a game or engaging with its systems is a design decision, not an accessibility one. I actually never beat Dark Souls, I got bored and quit when I hit an infamously stupid boss fight, but I consider going back from time to time and trying the game again, something I wouldn't give a poo poo about if it had an easy mode because the unforgiving nature of the gameplay is the point; it supports the game's aesthetic, narrative, story, and the general weighty feel of the combat mechanics, and making it easy would dilute the overall experience. If you don't get it that's cool, but crying about how games you aren't even interested in should be modified to meet your ideals is like crying about how rappers should stop swearing so much and be more accessible to people outside their intended audience. You're just being a punk bitch
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Apr 8, 2019 18:43
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edit: Weird, thought this was the gamer thread. For some reason.
D1Sergo has issued a correction as of 18:46 on Apr 8, 2019 |
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Apr 8, 2019 18:44
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yeah the only people who get up in arms about there being an easy mode in Sekiro are gamers who derive all their self esteem from beating something they deem hard. the true gamers don’t ask fir an easy mode they melt the gently caress down because someone isn’t playing the game the way they have arbitrarily decided is correct ironically this discussion is bringing those very people out of the woodwork
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Apr 8, 2019 18:45
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yeah, i caught a lot of the halfcoordinated discussion as well, and, yeah, i do think providing as many assistances as are needed is cool and good. i don't think people who claim this lessens the game are making much sense. it seems fine to not offer the option up front, and gather this sort of thing under an accessibility heading, if one wishede to clearly define what the baseline is
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Apr 8, 2019 18:47
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at the end of the day it's From's game and they can make it how they want. a bunch of gamer americans (mostly non gamers and the media class of gaming, as far as i can see both itt and elsewhere) telling the japanese how to do their work is stupid.
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Apr 8, 2019 18:49
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the only good videogames are ones about conveyer belt routing
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Apr 8, 2019 18:49
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like I beat Sekiro myself and guess what? I don’t give a gently caress if you include an easy mode because who cares it doesn’t effect me at all
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Apr 8, 2019 18:50
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CharlestheHammer posted:like I beat Sekiro myself and guess what? I don’t give a gently caress if you include an easy mode because who cares it doesn’t effect me at all Okay.
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Apr 8, 2019 18:50
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a Loving Dog posted:at the end of the day it's From's game and they can make it how they want. a bunch of gamer americans (mostly non gamers and the media class of gaming, as far as i can see both itt and elsewhere) telling the japanese how to do their work is stupid. oh my god the hot takes are coming from inside the thread gamers loving suck
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Apr 8, 2019 18:50
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Intel&Sebastian posted:imo play Metal Gear Solid: REVEANGEANCE where parrying is fun and good and you can wear a problematic giant sombrero and poncho it's metal gear rising
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Apr 8, 2019 18:51
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CharlestheHammer posted:oh my god the hot takes are coming from inside the thread can you engage with what i said instead of doing this stupid smug poo poo
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Apr 8, 2019 18:51
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a Loving Dog posted:can you engage with what i said instead of doing this stupid smug poo poo why the gently caress would I you said nothing of substance except getting mad at non gamers for not playing the game in some arbitrary way. You are the gamer we are making fun of
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Apr 8, 2019 18:52
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CharlestheHammer posted:why the gently caress would I you said nothing of substance except getting mad at non gamers for not playing the game in some arbitrary way. Are you incapable of reading or do you just pick a position and anyone challenging it is coming from an angle you made up in your head? Would you be okay with a movement to have, say, David Lynch make his work more accessible for people who "don't get it?" Telling a group of people working on a project with a specific vision that they should actually make it another way to please more people is dumb as hell.
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Apr 8, 2019 18:54
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CharlestheHammer posted:like I beat Sekiro myself and guess what? I don’t give a gently caress if you include an easy mode because who cares it doesn’t effect me at all sekiro would be designed differently and it would effect you is the argument
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Apr 8, 2019 18:54
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good discussion here, just a minor quibble: technically, it’s called “ephebophilia”
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Apr 8, 2019 18:55
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Caring a lot about the Souls games' honor and getting mad about it online means 1) You have a lot of time to play videogames 2) When you aren't playing videogames you get mad at strangers online for not playing them right 3) You are a very garbage person
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Apr 8, 2019 18:55
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drat, another circular firing squad on the left
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Apr 8, 2019 18:56
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Intel&Sebastian posted:Caring a lot about the Souls games' honor and getting mad about it online means anyone who has dozens of thousands of posts on the something awful forums making this argument has little to no self awareness, my guy
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Apr 8, 2019 18:56
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once more every thread is the same in C-SPAM trupm
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Apr 8, 2019 18:58
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a Loving Dog posted:can you engage with what i said instead of doing this stupid smug poo poo engage with you calling the opposing viewpoint stupid based on what i can, with a lot of reading between the lines, only interpret as an idea of free speech being a *stronger* right across borders? gently caress off.
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Apr 8, 2019 18:58
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