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one guy accused hussie of being a homophobe because the only gay man* became the main villain * but far from the only man attracted to other men, lol e: snipe ruined my combo, drat
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Apr 21, 2019 05:23
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For those of you who are considering not reading the Candy side of things, it gets just as dark and weird, and the Muse of Space explains a lot more towards the end, so why not read it? Just take a breather, you came this far, might as well see it through.
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Apr 21, 2019 05:26
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You know it's good because Reddit hates it.
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Apr 21, 2019 05:27
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One thing people have yet to mention: What the gently caress is up with Jane becoming Basically Hitler in BOTH stories? Like with Dirk there’s plenty of room in his character for it, but Jane? is it supposed to be a satire of when a fanfic author really hates a character that puts their preferred ship in jeopardy? Like “jake/dirk forever and I’m gonna write about how much of an evil poo poo Jane is!!!”
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Apr 21, 2019 05:29
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Pants Donkey posted:One thing people have yet to mention: What the gently caress is up with Jane becoming Basically Hitler in BOTH stories? Like with Dirk there’s plenty of room in his character for it, but Jane? is it supposed to be a satire of when a fanfic author really hates a character that puts their preferred ship in jeopardy? Like “jake/dirk forever and I’m gonna write about how much of an evil poo poo Jane is!!!” The dictatorial Crocker apple doesn't fall far from the tree.
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Apr 21, 2019 05:31
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Elephant Parade posted:lmao homestuck superfans are getting insanely mad about dirk and jane turning evil Which was pretty much the crux of my post in the Super Gay Life Experience Dirk Is An Abuser spiel. It was in response to someone saying Dirk is not a garbage abuser because they're typically outside the gay community looking in rather than having experience or perspective.
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Apr 21, 2019 05:31
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I ended up doing a weird rear end thing (kinda like what MonsieurChoc did) where I read a section of Meat (until the page that starts with "EPILOGUE [insert number here]", then read the corresponding section of Candy. While I def see the reason why a lot of people would prefer doing Candy first then Meat, there is one important argument for reading Meat first: The Obama stuff at the end of Candy gains an extra dimension of humor when it's brick joke set up at the start of Meat
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Apr 21, 2019 05:34
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The Obama stuff was loving terrible tbh
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Apr 21, 2019 05:37
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rereading all the spoiler blocks from before, drat, as little i think of my own insightfulness, everyone pretty much covered every single topic i mentioned, in a much more concise manner. gently caress. Also, as I haven't read candy yet, I don't know if Meenah uses the ring of life, but all this dancing around john's resurrection at the end of meat, will it eventually end up on his corpse? that'd be a nice circular travel for the ring. Pants Donkey posted:One thing people have yet to mention: What the gently caress is up with Jane becoming Basically Hitler in BOTH stories? Like with Dirk there’s plenty of room in his character for it, but Jane? is it supposed to be a satire of when a fanfic author really hates a character that puts their preferred ship in jeopardy? Like “jake/dirk forever and I’m gonna write about how much of an evil poo poo Jane is!!!” it IS kinda weird to me, felt a bit forced, but I assume it involves Dirk manipulating her to meet his needs, cockblocking both jake and jane, and her deep resentment of the condesce making her hate trolls. It does come kind of out of nowhere. Digamma-F-Wau posted:there is one important argument for reading Meat first: The Obama stuff at the end of Candy gains an extra dimension of humor when it's brick joke set up at the start of Meat Mobius Double Reach-Around
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Apr 21, 2019 05:45
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Clawtopsy posted:Which was pretty much the crux of my post in the Super Gay Life Experience Dirk Is An Abuser spiel. It was in response to someone saying Dirk is not a garbage abuser because they're typically outside the gay community looking in rather than having experience or perspective. Can we read that post again?
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Apr 21, 2019 05:46
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Lol @ people getting mad that Dirk's "suddenly" a giant shitbag Took the whole day for me to read it, but the epilogues were alright, if a little uncomfortable at parts. Vaah fucked around with this message at 05:57 on Apr 21, 2019 |
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Apr 21, 2019 05:54
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Elephant Parade posted:lmao homestuck superfans are getting insanely mad about dirk and jane turning evil I am not on the Dirk-is-awesome boat, but I respect people's having been invested in "you can be better than who you were." Jane, meh. Jane had a personality!?!??!
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Apr 21, 2019 05:56
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MonsieurChoc posted:Can we read that post again? i went looking for it and found this": 
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Apr 21, 2019 05:56
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For those that even remember the weird guy, I don’t think Bladekindeyewear is going to survive the epilogue.
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Apr 21, 2019 05:57
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Arsenic Lupin posted:Back in pre-Epilogue Homestuck, Dirk had a redemption arc (TM). Like, he was a manipulative rear end in a top hat, he realized he had been a manipulative rear end in a top hat, he tried to do better. As narrative, that's satisfying. People can grow and change and like that. When you change that narrative to Dirk was a manipulative rear end in a top hat, he thought he was changing, but actually he was a super manipulative super rear end in a top hat, it's disappointing. I kind of read it as one Dirk had a redemption arc (TM) but then he achieved his Ultimate Self, and unfortunately (and the comic backs this up with AR/Bro/Brain Dirk) Dirk has more lovely selves than redeemed selves, so it shook out that the sum of his metanarrative parts was more lovely than Redeemed. Sadly, Ultimate Dirk is a manipulative shitbag.
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Apr 21, 2019 06:03
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Arsenic Lupin posted:Back in pre-Epilogue Homestuck, Dirk had a redemption arc (TM). Like, he was a manipulative rear end in a top hat, he realized he had been a manipulative rear end in a top hat, he tried to do better. As narrative, that's satisfying. People can grow and change and like that. When you change that narrative to Dirk was a manipulative rear end in a top hat, he thought he was changing, but actually he was a super manipulative super rear end in a top hat, it's disappointing.
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Apr 21, 2019 06:05
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I half-expected Dirk’s Ultimate Self being able to just manifest copies in other people. I mean his hijacking of the narrative and characters is basically inserting himself everywhere. I half-expected characters to start talking in orange text.
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Apr 21, 2019 06:05
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his powers will never let him be anything than an overly cerebral hyper aware omniscient presence, so he likely doesnt give a poo poo about the events taking place, as they do not matter in the grand grand graaaaand cosmic scheme of things. kinda mirrors dave's nihilistic self doubts in the actual comic when thinking about all the alternate selves, doomed timelines, davesprite, and the pile of dead daves, only instead of moping about it, dirk probably thinks its all insignificant. i kinda dont agree with myself here because he keeps babbling on about how this is all in everyone's best interest, so, yeah, wonder what his grand plans entail
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Apr 21, 2019 06:06
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MonsieurChoc posted:Can we read that post again? https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3444640&pagenumber=1977&perpage=40#post466497932 here it is, and the discussion goes on for a few pages after
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Apr 21, 2019 06:10
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also did Dirk pretty much just become Dr. Manhattan lol
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Apr 21, 2019 06:10
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Dirk is like Dave in that he has a cool guy front but, unlike Dave, Dirk just tries to justify lovely behavior. Even when he identifies that he is the villain, he buries it in a bunch of narrative excuses. And remember that AR also assured Dirk that it was in everyone’s best interest when they manipulated Jake into a relationship.
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Apr 21, 2019 06:12
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really id say Dirk is more like Rose without any sort of moral compass
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Apr 21, 2019 06:13
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Clawtopsy posted:https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3444640&pagenumber=1977&perpage=40#post466497932
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Apr 21, 2019 06:17
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Clawtopsy posted:also did Dirk pretty much just become Dr. Manhattan lol Oooh, nice.
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Apr 21, 2019 06:17
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Clawtopsy posted:also did Dirk pretty much just become Dr. Manhattan lol oh hey, thats an apt comparison. I dont think manhattan truly interfered in any way though. not until the end at least, i guess
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Apr 21, 2019 06:18
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also, I hate to say it but Obama is probably just a Dirk rusequote:DAVE: mr president quote:DAVE: i guess what im trying to say is quote:OBAMA: Did he, now? someone's likely already brought this idea up, but I'm not willing to do more than skim the thread. also, Dirk likely narrated Meat 43 starting from Calliope's departure, suggesting that he had an opportunity to gently caress with Davebot and Aradia: quote:He holds out his hand. She looks around, and assumes he means for her to take it, so she does. She didn’t know someone could fly this fast. He nearly yanks her arm out of its socket. She considers reminding him that maybe this isn’t necessary, since she can fly too. But she doesn’t want to risk saying more embarrassing stuff around this outrageously cool dude. Besides, they’re through the wormhole before she can even finish the thought. It vanishes the moment they’ve crossed.
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Apr 21, 2019 06:20
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Elephant Parade posted:also, I hate to say it but Obama is probably just a Dirk ruse
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Apr 21, 2019 06:23
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Arsenic Lupin posted:Niiice insight. All those quotes you cited are in Dirk language.
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Apr 21, 2019 06:25
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Also the characters that aren’t omniscient sitting around discussing poo poo like canon as if it ain’t no thing is super obnoxious and bad. “Homestuck is about discussing metanarrative” is still one if the more egregious sins of Act 6.
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Apr 21, 2019 06:25
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also the ultimate self robot like the one Dirk made for Rose. and, y'know, the fact that SBURB Player Obama doesn't really make any sense still desperately want it to be canon tho Pants Donkey posted:Also the characters that aren’t omniscient sitting around discussing poo poo like canon as if it ain’t no thing is super obnoxious and bad.
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Apr 21, 2019 06:26
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Elephant Parade posted:also, I hate to say it but Obama is probably just a Dirk ruse I got that exact impression while reading it, yeah.
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Apr 21, 2019 06:28
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Yeah, the brain Obama was absolutely Dirk; nobody else would have encouraged Dave to leave his wife forever so that he would seem to just randomly disappear. Also, drat, the "bimboification" content warning was not loving around.
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Apr 21, 2019 06:29
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Arsenic Lupin posted:Niiice insight. All those quotes you cited are in Dirk language. Oh gently caress he’s right. It’s a part of what he did to help his own demise. Because there’s a part of him that could have been non-lovely that wants to stop himself.
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Apr 21, 2019 06:34
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yeah that whole thing seemed really apparent the second the obama winked coyly at the camera and went "I'm sure Dirk is proud of you"
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Apr 21, 2019 06:40
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Clawtopsy posted:yeah that whole thing seemed really apparent the second the obama winked coyly at the camera and went "I'm sure Dirk is proud of you" Also, Dirk is not the kind of person you want to be proud of you. If you're doing something that would make Dirk proud you should probably stop doing whatever that thing is immediately.
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Apr 21, 2019 07:00
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It’s very telling after he endlessly goads Dave and Karkat together, he instantly bristles and looks away once they start just straight up having sex, and “Looks away”, then projects onto the audience for being the perverts (though he might not 100% wrong there.)
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Apr 21, 2019 07:33
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Pants Donkey posted:For those that even remember the weird guy, I dont think Bladekindeyewear is going to survive the epilogue. 
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Apr 21, 2019 08:14
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Elephant Parade posted:also, I hate to say it but Obama is probably just a Dirk ruse it's hilarious that the context of homestuck is such that "obama had a secret sburb session after turning the white house over to juggalos" could potentially be a legitimate thing but yes, even in homestuck land that plus "Obama secretly met Dirk and likes him a lot" plus "Obama, a Page of Hope, knew the future enough to premptively leave an Obama AI and a Dave-specific bot in the white house" is a lot less likely than Dirk just stole a pair of Jake's jammies and threw them up on the wall along with an Obama hologram and a Davebot custom-made to sucker Dave into it.
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Apr 21, 2019 08:43
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Digamma-F-Wau posted:I ended up doing a weird rear end thing (kinda like what MonsieurChoc did) where I read a section of Meat (until the page that starts with "EPILOGUE [insert number here]", then read the corresponding section of Candy. While I def see the reason why a lot of people would prefer doing Candy first then Meat, there is one important argument for reading Meat first: The Obama stuff at the end of Candy gains an extra dimension of humor when it's brick joke set up at the start of Meat I'm pretty sure the "intended" way is reading Meat up until the one section where it literally says "go see what could have happened if we went the other way", read through Candy, and then jump back, which very much puts you in the same mindset of John the entire way through of "yeah this really isn't what's supposed to be happening", makes everything going on with troll ghosts falling out of the sky suddenly make a lot more sense, and pre-sets you up for Calliope jumping into the Meat narration.
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Apr 21, 2019 08:49
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Posthumous congratulations to Davepeta^2sprite, indubitably the best Dave.
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Apr 21, 2019 08:54
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