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Hamelekim posted:rift-s apparently almost completely gets rid of god rays, plus the higher pixel fill. other than fitting more securely to your face and the ipd slider it seems like a better headset.
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May 2, 2019 18:37
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Cicero posted:My understanding is that the tracking still isn't quite as good. I already get frustrated with Rift tracking occasionally while playing Beat Saber. It doesn't happen terribly often, but even with a 3 sensor setup every once in a while tracking will be lost. Tracking would be lost if you go behind your back. I'm not sure about beat saber but they have 5 cameras on the headset including above your head. So it covers anything in front of you.
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May 2, 2019 18:48
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I heard a rumour about the index god rays being bad. They don't bother me too much on the rift but has anyone confirmed this? I would obviously prefer them not to be there.
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May 2, 2019 18:55
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Hamelekim posted:Tracking would be lost if you go behind your back. I'm not sure about beat saber but they have 5 cameras on the headset including above your head. So it covers anything in front of you. I've heard it's considerably better than the WMR headsets, but yeah, still has problems with behind the head or very close to the eyes. Probably a reasonable tradeoff for the lack of external cameras, but it does mean some people will prefer external tracking and others the self contained. Claes Oldenburger posted:I heard a rumour about the index god rays being bad. They don't bother me too much on the rift but has anyone confirmed this? I would obviously prefer them not to be there. One of the reviews (RoadtoVR) mentioned they thought they got increased god rays, though none of the others did, so how much so is kind of still up in the air. For what it's worth Norm from tested got asked about that in his AMA and IIRC he said he didn't notice them. It is worth noting that while reviewers got sent demo units of the Quest and Rift S, so far I believe all the reviewers of the Index just got invited to Valve to try it for a bit, so their reviews are based on what they noticed during that demo rather than being able to do direct comparisons. Hopefully the review units of the Index will be out soon and we'll be able to get more rigorous reviews. Bremen fucked around with this message at 19:00 on May 2, 2019 |
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May 2, 2019 18:56
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what's a god ray
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May 2, 2019 19:02
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Awesome, thanks for the response!
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May 2, 2019 19:02
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you're welcome
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May 2, 2019 19:06
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Gort posted:what's a god ray Sun rays that you see going through clouds. Beams of light in the atmosphere. They are caused by the ridges on the lenses. You can see them in the headset especially in space flight games.
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May 2, 2019 19:06
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yeah they're the light streaks that show up in high contrast situations. fresnel makes them pretty apparent.
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May 2, 2019 19:09
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Hamelekim posted:rift-s apparently almost completely gets rid of god rays, plus the higher pixel fill. other than fitting more securely to your face and the ipd slider it seems like a better headset. At least it's better for a cluttered space when the sensors would be blocked by furniture. Yeah I think in general it definitely is better. The only really issue is that it does make compromises, like excluding the audio which was really nice on the rift, the edge case natural limitations of inside out tracking of controllers, and if you have a really wide or really narrow IPD. The Halo design seems either a plus or a minus move depending on peoples personal tastes. Still I think people have been overreacting way too harsh on it. Heck, it should have a higher angular resolution than the Index even, due to the former's wider fov and circular rendering profile. It might even be better about god rays as well (a road to VR preview mentioned glare between the 2 lenses in high contrast scenes they described as "While Valve’s dual-element optics might be focused on a wide field of view and large sweet spot, it seems to have come at the cost of an increase in internal reflections (god rays). Moderately high contrast scenes cause significant glare which unfortunately detracts from the other benefits in clarity."). Minuses aside, outside of spending a grand on the index, I think it looks like the best VR headset you can get. Even more so when you factor in how good all the system software is for oculus, and not needing to bother with revive.
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May 2, 2019 19:09
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Hamelekim posted:Sun rays that you see going through clouds. Beams of light in the atmosphere. They are caused by the ridges on the lenses. You can see them in the headset especially in space flight games. Smudges on the lenses can greatly increase god rays.
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May 2, 2019 19:10
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Hamelekim posted:Sun rays that you see going through clouds. Beams of light in the atmosphere. They are caused by the ridges on the lenses. You can see them in the headset especially in space flight games. To clarify, there are "rendered" god rays in games which are intentional, and there's "optical" god rays caused by Fresnel lenses of VR headsets (much more noticeable when you have bright graphics against a dark background). Rendered in Fallout 4:  Optical on Rift CV1: 
Zero VGS fucked around with this message at 19:15 on May 2, 2019 |
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May 2, 2019 19:13
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I’m amazed that Oculus still goes with the white-on-black logo, which produces the Godliest God Rays you can find.
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May 2, 2019 19:15
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Also worth noting, in that second picture you can see that the edges on the left of the letters are blue, and the edges on the right are orange. That is another optical artifact called "chromatic aberration", and like god rays, games will often render the effect intentionally (underwater scenes is a common use), but it is undesirable when caused by VR headset optics. VR graphics engines like UE4 can actually add their own chromatic aberration in order to cancel-out or at least minimize the aberration you see in real life, but it is not perfect.
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May 2, 2019 19:21
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It was actually pretty bad early on but the software tricks they do to make it less apparent in VR is pretty darn good. Elite had this problem bigtime with the DK2 and CV1 that they ironed out pretty well. Though God Rays can be pretty bad when you have a scene you are waiting for something to happen in, overall when you get into a game and start playing and moving/looking around, usually the rays aren't nearly as apparent unless you are really looking for them. I would be surprised if the Index is worse than the CV1, but the CV1 really hasn't been that big of an issue since launch has it?
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May 2, 2019 19:29
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EdEddnEddy posted:It was actually pretty bad early on but the software tricks they do to make it less apparent in VR is pretty darn good. Elite needs to change the control scheme for the galaxy map. It should be drag to zoom with your wands. I stopped playing it because I could never setup navigation properly. Otherwise it is a ton of fun to fly by stars and through canyons on planets.
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May 2, 2019 19:32
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EdEddnEddy posted:It was actually pretty bad early on but the software tricks they do to make it less apparent in VR is pretty darn good. The worst part of Elite VR is going through the black and white menu. It makes my eyes tear up.
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May 2, 2019 19:33
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Hamelekim posted:Elite needs to change the control scheme for the galaxy map. It should be drag to zoom with your wands. I stopped playing it because I could never setup navigation properly. Otherwise it is a ton of fun to fly by stars and through canyons on planets. It works pretty good with a HOTAS setup actually. It used to be a lot worse and of course, could be better, but overall it's not that big of a hassle as long as you have the right Joystick setup. What I reallllly do look forward too, is No Mans Sky VR. So far the people that have played it say it's pretty good, so we shall see. Mike the TV posted:The worst part of Elite VR is going through the black and white menu. It makes my eyes tear up. You can change the UI/Font colors to whatever you want with a small tweak if you want.
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May 2, 2019 19:35
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Hamelekim posted:rift-s apparently almost completely gets rid of god rays, plus the higher pixel fill. other than fitting more securely to your face and the ipd slider it seems like a better headset. At least it's better for a cluttered space when the sensors would be blocked by furniture. Index's higher fov is mostly the eye distance slider apparently so it might not end up better than the Vive. Cooling on it rapidly at this point, especially at that price. I wonder how close you can get to the Rift Ses lenses? Mind you the software IPD there might make things awkward.
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May 2, 2019 19:36
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Surprise Giraffe posted:Index's higher fov is mostly the eye distance slider apparently so it might not end up better than the Vive. Cooling on it rapidly at this point, especially at that price. I wonder how close you can get to the Rift Ses lenses? Mind you the software IPD there might make things awkward. Just pointing out, the Vive also has variable eye distance, and FOV is customarily measured with it up close. So just because the Index's FOV is measured with it in doesn't mean it isn't much better than the Vive.
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May 2, 2019 20:03
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Apparently I picked a really awkward time to decide to want a VR headset? Index doesn't look like it'll be available up here in Canada for a while and it looked to be a good s jumping in point, albeit expensive, especially if what my friends have said about controllers is true. Should I look into getting a Vive or a Rift now, or wait it out for index to potentially show up here/a new wave of headsets/whatever? I'm not super familiar with the market and how fast things change wrt VR, but it's almost looking like it's on par with the console market with pacing from my short look at it.
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May 2, 2019 20:12
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After an hour of loving around trying to change my camera setup, getting a ton of errors, and eventually tracking down a faulty extension cable and having to recalibrate back to my original setup... I can once again see the appeal of stand-alone inside-out tracking.
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May 2, 2019 20:23
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Tyty posted:Apparently I picked a really awkward time to decide to want a VR headset? Index doesn't look like it'll be available up here in Canada for a while and it looked to be a good s jumping in point, albeit expensive, especially if what my friends have said about controllers is true. If you want PC go with the rift-s. If you want to stick with the oculus store, and wireless, go with the quest. Index isn't going to hit Canada for at least a year. They have preorders all the way to September. No way it is going to be available until the main rush is over, if ever. I am going from rift to rift-s as it will have better resolution and pixel fill. I also want inside out tracking. I don't like the external sensors for the rift.
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May 2, 2019 20:24
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Rift-s uses the same screen and lenses as the Oculus Go. See the image below for a comparison of the screens. Seems pretty good to me. 
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May 2, 2019 20:27
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Tyty posted:Apparently I picked a really awkward time to decide to want a VR headset? Index doesn't look like it'll be available up here in Canada for a while and it looked to be a good s jumping in point, albeit expensive, especially if what my friends have said about controllers is true. If you want something now, or cost is a big concern, you could look at picking up a used Rift or Vive right now for cheap (as enthusiasts sell theirs and order the new ones). If you don't mind waiting a few months for the cutting edge, you might want to order a Quest (self contained console equivalent), Rift S (Lower cost tethered to PC version), or Index (Higher cost tethered to PC version). But yeah. It's a bad time to buy VR right now, but on the positive side you can either get the last gen for cheap or wait and enjoy the newer gen that's better than you would have gotten two months ago.
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May 2, 2019 20:28
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I'm gonna wait for reviews, but I'm pondering either a Rift S or a higher end WMR headset (Reverb maybe). Having inside out tracking is essential to me because I'm gonna be moving it around my house, but knowing I have the option to upgrade from the WMR controllers in one location is good to know. The reduced god rays in the S do sound nice. I think I'm particularly sensitive to them because they drive me nuts. I clean my lenses way too often hoping to reduce them even a bit.
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May 2, 2019 20:29
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Bremen posted:If you want something now, or cost is a big concern, you could look at picking up a used Rift or Vive right now for cheap (as enthusiasts sell theirs and order the new ones). If you don't mind waiting a few months for the cutting edge, you might want to order a Quest (self contained console equivalent), Rift S (Lower cost tethered to PC version), or Index (Higher cost tethered to PC version). The Vive is the better go than the Oculus if you buy secondhand. Cuts some of the cost later if you are looking at the Index. Otherwise the Rift S would probably do if your IPD's not out in the low 60's or into the 70's.
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May 2, 2019 21:01
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Neddy Seagoon posted:The Vive is the better go than the Oculus if you buy secondhand. Cuts some of the cost later if you are looking at the Index. Otherwise the Rift S would probably do if your IPD's not out in the low 60's or into the 70's. There is an ipd app you can download on your phone to get your ipd. It seems to work pretty well.
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May 2, 2019 21:13
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EdEddnEddy posted:Dash is great, however HelloV does have a redesign coming that should make resizing, pinning, multiple windows, etc all work across all headsets and with even less performance penalty then HelloV currently has. I'm really excited to see this! It may tip the scales for me in getting an Index.
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May 2, 2019 21:14
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Just out of curiosity, do people think the wait for the Index is likely to be accurate? I just reserved and it says Aug 31st, and yikes that's far
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May 2, 2019 21:23
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Tyty posted:Apparently I picked a really awkward time to decide to want a VR headset? Index doesn't look like it'll be available up here in Canada for a while and it looked to be a good s jumping in point, albeit expensive, especially if what my friends have said about controllers is true. Get a Quest
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May 2, 2019 21:24
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Hamelekim posted:There is an ipd app you can download on your phone to get your ipd. It seems to work pretty well. I tried it, it’s... weird. Changes figures constantly and isn’t accurate
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May 2, 2019 21:45
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unbutthurtable posted:Just out of curiosity, do people think the wait for the Index is likely to be accurate? I just reserved and it says Aug 31st, and yikes that's far Impossible to say, honestly. We just don't know enough details about the assembly process, and since they're using special made low latency screens from a manufacturer that could easily become a limiting factor. OTOH, since they were deliberately going for an enthusiast market they may have underestimated demand and be able to scale things up. So could be sooner, could be Aug 31, could even (possibly) be later if they run into a supply line issue like Oculus did.
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May 2, 2019 21:46
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rage-saq posted:I tried it, it’s... weird. Changes figures constantly and isn’t accurate
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May 2, 2019 21:46
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Tyty posted:Apparently I picked a really awkward time to decide to want a VR headset? Index doesn't look like it'll be available up here in Canada for a while and it looked to be a good s jumping in point, albeit expensive, especially if what my friends have said about controllers is true. Index by valves own admission is being produced and released with limited stock, hence why its backed up so far, with no word when it will be available outside of the US and western Europe. The "new wave" is basically upon us already in the form of the Quest, index, rift-s, and the new WMR ones like the reverb. The only one we really haven't heard more about is HTC's mysterious cosmos but... ehhh its going to need some good specs and price to recommend another HTC device to a friend with all the tech support issues they've had, but it might be good. So yeah, I don't really think its a bad time to jump in. I'd have to recommend the rift-s though right now, 600 cheaper than the index, not backed up atm, and as nice as I'm sure the screens are on the reverb I think WMR's 2 front cameras for tracking is too limiting compared to rift-s, and also the controllers for WMR are a lot worse and haven't been updated for the new headsets. The rift also currently has the best system software for in VR menus, pinning stuff, running desktop stuff, frame mitigation techniques, etc. If you decide to get an index down the road, you can always sell the rift, or keep it around for any of the oculus exclusive games. Being inside out now means its a lot easier to have a couple headsets, or put it away when not using it, since theres nothing external to setup for it.
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May 2, 2019 21:48
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Hamelekim posted:There is an ipd app you can download on your phone to get your ipd. It seems to work pretty well. I had a perfectly nice time going into an eyeglasses store and asking for a measurement. They don't like to do it if they think you're just getting your IPD so you can shop for glasses online, but I made it clear it was for VR which resulted in some fun conversation, and the handheld tool they have gives a reading in 5 seconds so it's no big deal. YMMV but worth a shot. AndrewP posted:Get a Quest I feel like anyone in this thread who can get a Quest from somewhere that they can easily return it (i.e. Amazon, Best Buy) owes it to themselves to at least try it out. It's one of those products like the Nintendo Switch that could make a lot of hardcore types realize that accessibility/portability/affordability can outweigh graphical prowess. I was skeptical of how anemic the Switch looked but now PC and Switch are the only two systems I play.
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May 2, 2019 21:48
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Zero VGS posted:I feel like anyone in this thread who can get a Quest from somewhere that they can easily return it (i.e. Amazon, Best Buy) owes it to themselves to at least try it out. It's one of those products like the Nintendo Switch that could make a lot of hardcore types realize that accessibility/portability/affordability can outweigh graphical prowess. I was skeptical of how anemic the Switch looked but now PC and Switch are the only two systems I play. Yeah its all going to rest on the devs if it sinks or swims. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vhh_GeBPOhs Theres little you couldn't do on the quest with time and money behind it. No reason for games to be simple or not have meat there. Metroid Prime ran on a 500mhz cpu, with 24mb of ram on a console nearly 20 years old, but its still a fun game and theres 0 reason why you couldn't have that same kind of thing on the Quest. Why you couldn't have a Zelda Wind Waker or whatever adventure, A GTA game, an elder scrolls game, heck port doom 3 to it. Anything, as long as you accept graphical turn downs. All of those would still be killer and fun and would wow people. It just needs enough life for developers to come on board and make a Zelda sized game or whatever, and that money and will is the only real limitation.
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May 2, 2019 22:04
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 Uhhhh guys https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U45KPDpAuHE edit: It may be fake.
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May 2, 2019 22:15
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So someone brought up a while ago that the WMR headsets can't improve their tracking because they need Hololens parity. Hololens 2 has a rather familiar camera count and relatively similar config. That should potentially make the WMR companies happy at least. Now they just need to design some better controllers.Zero VGS posted:I feel like anyone in this thread who can get a Quest from somewhere that they can easily return it (i.e. Amazon, Best Buy) owes it to themselves to at least try it out. It's one of those products like the Nintendo Switch that could make a lot of hardcore types realize that accessibility/portability/affordability can outweigh graphical prowess. I was skeptical of how anemic the Switch looked but now PC and Switch are the only two systems I play. The only reason I'm not getting a Quest is I can play the games I want with a Vive. If you don't have VR headset, or a PC able to run one, it's certainly well worth considering getting a Quest.
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May 2, 2019 22:17
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Agreed. Quest does have the benefit of being on reasonable good hardware and fully self contained. Considering they could get near or better than PS3 graphics on the Vita with it's hardware, getting near PS4 graphics on the Quest's hardware isn't that far of a stretch. Textures and some other things need to be tuned down a bit, but the core content of games just has to be really good. OrbusVR seems to be gaining some traction as a really good VR MMO so that's promising, and being it is Android, $10 says a good chunk of people will be hacking ways to either stream VR from a PC to the headset, making side loadable games that aren't locked to the Oculus Store, Modding Beat Saber because that just has to happen for how much better the game is with them, etc. It won't replace the Index for things like Sims and True PC powered graphics, but it might get more people to really give VR a try and see what all the Tethered people have been talking about all this time.
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May 2, 2019 22:18
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