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NewFatMike
Jun 11, 2015

Atomizer posted:

Mechanical wireless for $20.

Mechanical backlit, wired, for $17.

There are of course many clones of the above, but those should do the trick, and as I said, I still can't find mechanical/backlit/wireless altogether. In any case, either of the above for no more than $20 should no doubt be worth sacrificing a built-in numpad to get a better laptop overall.

Thank you! You're a gent.

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wolrah
May 8, 2006
what?

Tunahead posted:

Yeah sorry, I should have specified. Occasionally, I need to run an OS off a USB stick, and I strongly feel that anyone who does this through some kind of ghastly dongle is no better than an animal.
Every major flash drive vendor offers dual-mode drives that have an A connector on one end and a C connector on the other. They're also great with cell phones.

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

Mu Zeta posted:

Is it safe in general to run a PC laptop in closed lid mode while connected to an external display? I know Macs are designed for this

I've never ever heard of this being a problem but it's also not super common

It's going to be better to just leave the lid open, but better by how much I dunno. We're no longer in the screen melting Pentium 4 era so heat dissipation isn't a major factor like it once was. The average laptop CPU puts out less than 20 watts these days at wide open throttle which is a far cry from 60-100 watts of yesteryear

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

N/m

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness

Hadlock posted:

I've never ever heard of this being a problem but it's also not super common

It's not going to kill your laptop from doing it now and then, but there are laptops that are designed (poorly) with air intakes exclusively from the top, which then get blocked when the lid is closed and can slowly cook it if you leave it running that way all day every day.

In general I wouldn't worry about it, though.

Shrimp or Shrimps
Feb 14, 2012


How would heat affect the screen? I know on my Aero 15 it can get quite hot at the space above the keyboard - hot enough be uncomfortable to touch, and I'd be paranoid about running it closed and that heat affecting the screen.

Sheep
Jul 24, 2003
FYI New Dell XPS 13 today is base ~$140 off, and you can bring that up to $300 off with coupon code SAVE10AFF.

Edit: works on XPS 15 too, welp my wallet.

Sheep fucked around with this message at 01:34 on May 11, 2019

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

Shrimp or Shrimps posted:

How would heat affect the screen? I know on my Aero 15 it can get quite hot at the space above the keyboard - hot enough be uncomfortable to touch, and I'd be paranoid about running it closed and that heat affecting the screen.

Honestly with a 20w cpu you might be heating the screen more by sitting on it

Probably the reason that part of the case gets hot is because there's a heat pipe mounted to the underside of it. Your screen probably gets hotter than that locked in the trunk of a black car at 3pm in a black car parked on a black asphalt parking lot in Phoenix in August

If heat dissipation is a major concern consider a Thinkpad. Mine is still working.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Shrimp or Shrimps posted:

How would heat affect the screen? I know on my Aero 15 it can get quite hot at the space above the keyboard - hot enough be uncomfortable to touch, and I'd be paranoid about running it closed and that heat affecting the screen.

The display, like any component, will have a range of operating temperatures, although I don't think you'd be heating it enough to damage it. Just run it on a cooling pad like I recommended.

Ceros_X
Aug 6, 2006

U.S. Marine
All of my daily drivers at work (5+ years) have operated screen closed, outfitted to a dual monitor with no issues. Corporate Dells but whatever

bull3964
Nov 18, 2000

DO YOU HEAR THAT? THAT'S THE SOUND OF ME PATTING MYSELF ON THE BACK.


My work T480 just bit the dust after only 4 months with a slew of memory related BSODs. I know it's only one data point, but it wasn't a great intro to Lenovo for me. Hopefully the replacement lasts longer.

oliveoil
Apr 22, 2016
Also posted this in IYG tablet thread:

Not sure if a tablet is appropriate or if I might like a laptop better. Initially, I think of some kind of windows or chrome laptop/tablet hybrid but maybe there something else?

I'd like something I can physically write notes on so I can reference them later.

When taking classes, I write virtually everything my professor says and all the examples. When I work through a textbook, I take notes on key concepts and work through examples.

Except I do it all on paper. I have tons and tons of college-ruled, 70-page notebooks that get damaged, dirty, lost, etc.

Each notebook is for one subject, and every time I start taking notes, I put in the date, so I can keep a rough idea of when they were taken.

Is there a good digital equivalent? I want to be able to take notes and find them later with minimal fussing and organizing. I'm tired of paper.

Ideally would be some kind of electronic surface with an electronic pen. Are any good and worth using nowadays?

It would be super cool if I could actually use it as a laptop to do some coding, too.

Also, I don't mind spending like $600-1500. I would need to be talked into anything more expensive than that if it's really worth it.

NewFatMike
Jun 11, 2015

oliveoil posted:

Also posted this in IYG tablet thread:

Not sure if a tablet is appropriate or if I might like a laptop better. Initially, I think of some kind of windows or chrome laptop/tablet hybrid but maybe there something else?

I'd like something I can physically write notes on so I can reference them later.

When taking classes, I write virtually everything my professor says and all the examples. When I work through a textbook, I take notes on key concepts and work through examples.

Except I do it all on paper. I have tons and tons of college-ruled, 70-page notebooks that get damaged, dirty, lost, etc.

Each notebook is for one subject, and every time I start taking notes, I put in the date, so I can keep a rough idea of when they were taken.

Is there a good digital equivalent? I want to be able to take notes and find them later with minimal fussing and organizing. I'm tired of paper.

Ideally would be some kind of electronic surface with an electronic pen. Are any good and worth using nowadays?

It would be super cool if I could actually use it as a laptop to do some coding, too.

Also, I don't mind spending like $600-1500. I would need to be talked into anything more expensive than that if it's really worth it.

Samsung Chromebook Plus or Pro might be the best options for you, and there's a whole universe of note taking applications for Android, Linux and web based ones that will work on there. My personal experience is a little hit or miss on electronic interfaces for notes, but there's a ton of folks for whom it works.

Re: tablets, I had the old iPad Pro 12.9" and that was great (until I had to sell it for extra cash) but the current iPad Air sets that have Apple Pencil support are great. I would recommend a Brydge keyboard for the iPad family.

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness
You can do what you're looking for with any of the pen-enabled tablets (like the newer iPads w/Pencil support), or 2-in-1 laptop/tablets that support stylus/pens, such as MS's Surface Book or Samsung's Notebook 9 Pro. Prices will flex depending on storage and such, but should be within your range. If that's all you want from them, there's no need to worry about bumping up model ranges to get impressive specs, as even the baseline models will be sufficient (other than maybe space). All of them have pen support that should be more than sufficient for note-taking. The iPad, for example, is now actively marketing itself as something like an art tablet that's good for drawing "professionally," if that gives you an idea.

Something not-an-iPad will be much better for coding on, if and when you want to do so. Chromebooks are iffy for coding, but usable unless you need a Windows specific IDE, or are developing for Windows, since obviously Chromebooks aren't gonna help you there.

There's also a range of purpose-made devices (reviews here: https://www.2kreviews.com/best-digital-notepad/) that I've never had any personal experience with, and thus can't comment on, but they're interesting concepts at least.

Cozmosis
Feb 16, 2003

2006... YEAR OF THE BURNITZ, BITCHES
Is the 6th gen X1 Carbon on sale at Costco for $1300 a good deal? It’s the 16/512 model, 1080p.

Futaba Anzu
May 6, 2011

GROSS BOY

going to need a good portable option with good graphical and cpu requirements for uni, i know this is marketed as a gaming laptop but is there anything better right now that i could also consider other than this one at about this price point or lower?
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07MNWT1KQ/?coliid=I3FN30ZUVGFGJY

Mu Zeta
Oct 17, 2002

Me crush ass to dust

Cozmosis posted:

Is the 6th gen X1 Carbon on sale at Costco for $1300 a good deal? It’s the 16/512 model, 1080p.

Seems about normal. It often sells for that on the Barnes and Noble link in the OP.

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

bull3964 posted:

My work T480 just bit the dust after only 4 months with a slew of memory related BSODs. I know it's only one data point, but it wasn't a great intro to Lenovo for me. Hopefully the replacement lasts longer.

Sounds like an intermittent problem with a voltage regulator somewhere

Most devices that fail, fail in the first 30 days, sounds like yours started to fail in that time period but was able to just hang on to 120 days

Worf
Sep 12, 2017

If only Seth would love me like I love him!

What is the best place to grab refurb t480s? In USA

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



oliveoil posted:

Not sure if a tablet is appropriate or if I might like a laptop better. Initially, I think of some kind of windows or chrome laptop/tablet hybrid but maybe there something else?

I'd like something I can physically write notes on so I can reference them later.

When taking classes, I write virtually everything my professor says and all the examples. When I work through a textbook, I take notes on key concepts and work through examples.

Except I do it all on paper. I have tons and tons of college-ruled, 70-page notebooks that get damaged, dirty, lost, etc.

Each notebook is for one subject, and every time I start taking notes, I put in the date, so I can keep a rough idea of when they were taken.

Is there a good digital equivalent? I want to be able to take notes and find them later with minimal fussing and organizing. I'm tired of paper.

Ideally would be some kind of electronic surface with an electronic pen. Are any good and worth using nowadays?

It would be super cool if I could actually use it as a laptop to do some coding, too.

Also, I don't mind spending like $600-1500. I would need to be talked into anything more expensive than that if it's really worth it.

I'm thinking one of the convertible devices with dedicated stylus would do everything you want. The thing is:
- first of all, you really should hand-write your notes (on a tablet or in notepads just like you're doing now) instead of typing them, plus you shouldn't record everything said or displayed on slides; I don't have a link to any articles on the subject at the moment, but part of the learning process includes listening, processing the information, and jotting down the important parts. Typing everything just forces you to try to keep up with the professor instead of actually thinking about the subject.
- you could actually get whatever device works for you, but continue to use the notebooks. Then, you use your phone's camera to take a photo of each page so that you have a digital record; you can discard the paper as soon as convenient. There's actually a product called Rocketbook that is part erasable notebook, part app; you use the Pilot Frixion erasable pens (which also work on normal paper) and your camera to record notes. Each page has a QR code to keep things organized.

AgentCow007
May 20, 2004
TITLE TEXT

oliveoil posted:

Also posted this in IYG tablet thread:

Not sure if a tablet is appropriate or if I might like a laptop better. Initially, I think of some kind of windows or chrome laptop/tablet hybrid but maybe there something else?

I'd like something I can physically write notes on so I can reference them later.

When taking classes, I write virtually everything my professor says and all the examples. When I work through a textbook, I take notes on key concepts and work through examples.

Except I do it all on paper. I have tons and tons of college-ruled, 70-page notebooks that get damaged, dirty, lost, etc.

Each notebook is for one subject, and every time I start taking notes, I put in the date, so I can keep a rough idea of when they were taken.

Is there a good digital equivalent? I want to be able to take notes and find them later with minimal fussing and organizing. I'm tired of paper.

Ideally would be some kind of electronic surface with an electronic pen. Are any good and worth using nowadays?

It would be super cool if I could actually use it as a laptop to do some coding, too.

Also, I don't mind spending like $600-1500. I would need to be talked into anything more expensive than that if it's really worth it.

The Surface Pro 6 with OneNote is purpose-built for taking notes. Be sure to try one out at Best Buy or something. The screen is top notch, and that dinky keyboard cover is actually one of the best keyboards made right now.

Sri.Theo
Apr 16, 2008
Are there any recommendations for laptops in the £300 to £500 range right now? It’s for my mum so not looking for anything to demanding but something with a decent amount of ram and SSD size that’s not too heavy would be great. Right now I’m looking at this https://www.pcworld.co.uk/gbuk/computing/laptops/laptops/dell-inspiron-15-3000-15-6-amd-ryzen-5-laptop-256-gb-ssd-silver-10190038-pdt.html

- AMD Ryzen 5 2500U Processor
- Quad-core
- 2.00 GHz / 3.60 GHz
- 4 MB cache
RAM 8 GB DDR4 (2666 MHz)
Storage 256 GB SSD

But I have no idea about CPUs since i7 better than i5 better than i3.

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

I would pick up a refurbished i5 laptop with 8gb ram and at least a 128gb SSD

If you are on a budget I would not buy a new laptop, you won't find anything you like at that price point. There are lots of excellent refurbished business class laptops on eBay. See the OP.

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness

Futaba Anzu posted:

going to need a good portable option with good graphical and cpu requirements for uni, i know this is marketed as a gaming laptop but is there anything better right now that i could also consider other than this one at about this price point or lower?
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07MNWT1KQ/?coliid=I3FN30ZUVGFGJY

There's nothing particularly wrong with it, other than the hilarious 128GB SSD that you should immediately replace with a larger one for ~$75. At least it's got a decent screen, unlike the 42% NTSC ones the 1060 versions tend to come paired with.

I would note that, unless you have an actual need for the tensor cores in the 2060, you might want to consider waiting a few more weeks for general availability and reviews on the new batch of laptops with 1660Ti's, as early testing indicates that they'll be about the same performance in most games, but the 1660Ti will be cheaper and use a bit less power, meaning longer battery life, cooler laptops, and probably less thermal throttling (which will be real interesting to see, since it's possible with less thermal throttling the 1660Ti might be even closer in actual performance to the 2060 than on the desktop). Many of the newer gen laptops will also be paired with 9-series CPUs, which will be slightly faster and more efficient than the 8-series. Incremental gains and all that.

Honestly, even if you end up deciding this is the laptop you want, waiting a few more weeks for the next gen laptops to really show up will only help push prices on ones like this down.

Sri.Theo
Apr 16, 2008

Hadlock posted:

I would pick up a refurbished i5 laptop with 8gb ram and at least a 128gb SSD

If you are on a budget I would not buy a new laptop, you won't find anything you like at that price point. There are lots of excellent refurbished business class laptops on eBay. See the OP.

Is the Ryzen 5 in the one I linked that much worse then a older i5? I’d heard good things about them.

I’m not keen on buying something second hand as I won’t be around to troubleshoot it and the warranty would be nice.

It seems really strange that there are so many cheap but good phones but not laptops.

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness
Considering that not too long ago, any laptop that wasn't going to fall apart within 6 months cost over $1000, I think we're actually in a pretty solid place regarding cheap-but-good-laptops. At least in the US; the UK has some pretty strange electronics pricing at times.

The Ryzen 5 2500U is roughly equivalent to an i5-8250U. So not a high end processor by any means, but it'll certainly get the job done for most people doing most things.

Dell, at least, (maybe Lenovo, too? Unsure) has a UK/Euro refurbished outlet website that you should look through. Refurbs straight from Dell are generally indistinguishable from new, and normally carry the same warranty as a new laptop. Just for a chunk less money. Really, refurbs are a great value proposition.

Worf
Sep 12, 2017

If only Seth would love me like I love him!

I would feel more comfortable buying a refurbed Dell (business or xps class) than a new unit of most other mfgs

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

Statutory Ape posted:

I would feel more comfortable buying a refurbed Dell (business or xps class) than a new unit of most other mfgs

This, honestly

Buying a refurbished business class laptop is like buying a BMW or Mercedes with 20,000 miles on the clock. Solid buy. No depreciation. Will last you forever.

Buying a new, non-business class laptop is like buying a Yugo or Russian Lada, maaaybe a Toyota Corolla

Sri.Theo
Apr 16, 2008

Hadlock posted:

This, honestly

Buying a refurbished business class laptop is like buying a BMW or Mercedes with 20,000 miles on the clock. Solid buy. No depreciation. Will last you forever.

Buying a new, non-business class laptop is like buying a Yugo or Russian Lada, maaaybe a Toyota Corolla

Hmm the only refurbished laptops in the price range look pretty similar.

Processor: Intel® Core™ i5-7200U (Dual Core,3M Cache, up to 3.10 GHz,15W)
Windows 10 Pro (64bit)
8GB (1x8GB) 2400MHz DDR4 Non-ECC
256GB 2.5 inch SATA Class 20 Solid State Drive

https://m.dell.com/h5/m/r/outlet.eu...gvr1VCLTJ%2fklP

Slow News Day
Jul 4, 2007

Hi thread,

I work remotely and try to bike everywhere. I carry my laptop in my backpack, which I'm trying to keep as light as possible.

I'm looking for a 13-14" laptop with the following specs:

- Around 2.5 lbs (lighter = better)
- More than 12 hours of battery life under moderate load (e.g. programming work plus having youtube music channels run in the background)
- 4k display (brighter = better, I want to be able to see the screen even when under direct sunlight, e.g. when sitting outside)
- 16 GB RAM
- 4 or more CPU cores
- No discrete GPU

Basically, I'm looking for something I can put in my backpack and take with me in the morning, without its charger (I don't want the extra weight), and have its battery last the entire workday without me feeling battery anxiety.

I've looked at MBAs/MBPs (hate the keyboards), as well as Lenovo X1 Carbons (seems a bit pricy after customizing to the specs I want). Haven't found anything too compelling, though.

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness

enraged_camel posted:

Hi thread,

I work remotely and try to bike everywhere. I carry my laptop in my backpack, which I'm trying to keep as light as possible.

Dell XPS 13. Next question.

Worf
Sep 12, 2017

If only Seth would love me like I love him!

12 hours 4k res on bright outside i dont think happens at 2.5 lb

especially if you are unwilling to carry an external battery.

why do you actually need 4k?E: i dont think my 4k display is inherently easier to read because of the resolution

Worf fucked around with this message at 00:27 on May 14, 2019

Spring Heeled Jack
Feb 25, 2007

If you can read this you can read
Just grabbed an i5 XPS 9360 for a hair under $500 on eBay, let’s hope it’s everything I (realistically) dreamed of.

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness

Statutory Ape posted:

12 hours 4k res on bright outside i dont think happens at 2.5 lb

No, it doesn't. The best you get is the XPS 13, which clocks in around 8 hours if you keep the brightness down a bit. That said, 8+ straight hours (let alone 12+, what sort of work day do you have?) of use without any charging is a little on the silly side, especially when the charger is only ~250g, and it'll go from 0-80% in an hour. It does USB-C charging, too, so you can plug it in to just about anything and get some juice. Hell, plunk a 30W cell phone charger in your bag with you and that'll keep you going, at absolutely minimal weight.

The 1080p models get 12+ hours straight up, so there's that to consider, too.

If you really really need 4k and 12+ hours for some reason (and at 13" for programming you simply don't), you're going to have to give up on the <3lbs weight and spring for something like the T580 w/larger battery. Simple physics and power tech right now dictates that you need a ~4.5-5lbs laptop to have a big enough battery to power a 4k screen for 10+ hours.

fwiw, the MBP/MBA's fail one or more of your requirements, too, regardless of the keyboards.

Really, you should just get the XPS 13 either in the 1080p model (that'll have the battery life you want), or the 4k model and see if 8hrs is enough, and if not, plug the thing in for a few minutes here and there throughout the day.

e; The Surface Book 2 also gets close. It's about 3.5lbs, but has a ~4k screen and should get somewhere between 10-12hrs. It is, of course, also rather expensive ($2500 if you need 16GB RAM. A much more reasonable $1500 if you can suffer with 8GB and an i5 CPU), and is completely unserviceable if anything goes wrong with it, so absolutely buy it on a CitiBank card to get the extra 2 years of warranty.

DrDork fucked around with this message at 02:38 on May 14, 2019

space marine todd
Nov 7, 2014



https://www.notebookcheck.net/Lenovo-ThinkPad-X1-Extreme-is-about-to-get-even-more-extreme-with-the-2019-Gen-2-refresh.420457.0.html

quote:

Last year's ThinkPad X1 Extreme continues to be one of our highest-rated business laptops because of its stable chassis design, excellent CPU performance, 4K UHD panel with no flickering, and ease of serviceability. Lenovo will be upping the ante this year with the ThinkPad X1 Extreme Gen 2 by including Intel 9th gen Core i9 H-Series CPUs and a GTX 1650 Max-Q GPU to supplant the 8th gen H-series CPUs and GTX 1050 Ti Max-Q GPU of the 2018 model.

Other new features include a brighter 4K OLED touchscreen and an even higher 4 TB storage option. The OLED panel will likely be the same panel as found on the upcoming OLED IdeaPad C730 and OLED Razer Blade 15.

Welp, July can't come fast enough.

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness

space marine todd posted:

Welp, July can't come fast enough.

I will be very interested to see how much being a Max-Q part hurts it. The drop from 50W to 35W is pretty significant, to the point where I wonder if it'll be meaningfully faster than the Gen1's 1050 Ti, albeit at a lower power profile. Also real interested to see what exactly the $1500 configuration actually includes (I'd assume 1080p non-HDR, 8GB RAM, 256GB SSD, i5-9(3|4)00U).

FISHMANPET
Mar 3, 2007

Sweet 'N Sour
Can't
Melt
Steel Beams
Is there going to be any appreciable difference between an i5-8350u and i5-8365u? Looking at replacing my work laptop and deciding between the Latitude 7390/7490 and 7300/7400, they're both 8th gen CPUs and the price is even pretty equivalent, but comparing the specs of the two chips even on Intel's site they look basically identical.

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness
The i5-8365U is a re-spin of the i5-8350U, having launched about 2 years later. It does clock nominally higher (4.1Ghz vs 3.6Ghz), but you're unlikely to ever notice the difference, especially since those laptops are not exactly speed demons to begin with.

As far as I can tell, the 7300/7400 update didn't really bring a whole lot to the table compared to the 7390/7490. Most likely slightly better battery life and...that's about it. Do get the 1080p option, though--the 768p screens are abysmal. If you haven't been looking at them already, these are prime candidates for picking up refurbished off the Dell outlet for solid savings.

Shrimp or Shrimps
Feb 14, 2012


1050ti Max-Q --> 1650 Max-Q seems like it'll perform basically the same GPU-wise.

And then the 9750s are basically identical to the 8750s...

i9 means 9980H 8c/16t (wonder if the HK will be an option) which seems unlikely to maintain stock all-core boost speeds at least without an undervolt and a good repaste.

Now... OLED. Yum.

Shrimp or Shrimps fucked around with this message at 05:30 on May 14, 2019

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space marine todd
Nov 7, 2014



DrDork posted:

I will be very interested to see how much being a Max-Q part hurts it. The drop from 50W to 35W is pretty significant, to the point where I wonder if it'll be meaningfully faster than the Gen1's 1050 Ti, albeit at a lower power profile. Also real interested to see what exactly the $1500 configuration actually includes (I'd assume 1080p non-HDR, 8GB RAM, 256GB SSD, i5-9(3|4)00U).

For me, the use case is 75% productivity-on-the-go and 25% indie gaming, so I am definitely okay with more of the same GPU if it means a lower power profile. Still, I'll be interested in benchmarks when they are available.

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