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Mors Rattus
Oct 25, 2007

FATAL & Friends
Walls of Text
#1 Builder
2014-2018

ulmont posted:

In the original Hunters Hunted, which is consistent with Project Twilight, this is what the FBI SAD knows:


This is the Vampire (and, for Project Twilight, Werewolf, although the FBI SAD knows less about Garou)-specific view, which is somewhat different from the Hunter-specific view of VASCU.
It's also for an entirely different universe and set of gamelines.

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ulmont
Sep 15, 2010

IF I EVER MISS VOTING IN AN ELECTION (EVEN AMERICAN IDOL) ,OR HAVE UNPAID PARKING TICKETS, PLEASE TAKE AWAY MY FRANCHISE

Mors Rattus posted:

It's also for an entirely different universe and set of gamelines.

Ah, right, confused The Vigil and The Reckoning.

Nessus
Dec 22, 2003

After a Speaker vote, you may be entitled to a valuable coupon or voucher!



What does VASCU feed vampire prisoners awaiting trial? Expired medical blood? The less popular goats from the herd?

Mors Rattus
Oct 25, 2007

FATAL & Friends
Walls of Text
#1 Builder
2014-2018

Nessus posted:

What does VASCU feed vampire prisoners awaiting trial? Expired medical blood? The less popular goats from the herd?

I would imagine some form of animal, myself.

Pocky In My Pocket
Jan 27, 2005

Giant robots shouldn't fight!






Nessus posted:

I imagine direct sun exposure in space would be just as bad for a vampire as it was on Earth, if not worse. A vampire would have a number of other advantages in space of course, they wouldn't need a pressurized suit for instance. The dark side of the moon would not permanently protect them, but there are those places in the polar craters that NEVER get sunlight... that'd be a good place for Neo Carthage.

This assumes your game is cool enough to have Space Vampires, of course.

Also, in a pure vampire game I'd rule "natural" UV rays could do lethal damage to vampires but they would get the benefit of soak. So a UV cannon or a grow light would be a method of attack but would not be an ultimate trump card.

e: Better question: Would vampires still be hurt by the Sun on other planets? What about the central stars of other solar systems?

In my current firefly/OWoD/other things crossover game I'm playing the GM has said that only Sol-light hurts vampires, however only people born on earth-that-was can be embraced

We found an assamite with a complex gyroscopic prayermat so he can always pray to mecca it was dope

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

quote:

Raphael spoke, saying
Caine, son of Adam, son of Eve,
your brother Abel forgives you your sin
will you not repent, and accept the mercy of the Almighty?"

And I said to Raphael:
"Not by Abel`s forgiveness, but mine own,
will I be forgiven."

Raphael cursed me, saying
"Then, for as long as you walk this earth,
you and your children will fear the dawn,
and the sun's rays will seek to burn you like fire,
wherever you hide, always.
Hide now, for the Sun rises to take its wrath on you."


I mean it depends on which vampire-containing universe you're talking about but in V:tM the injury sunlight does to vampires is because an angel of God Almighty decreed it. I don't see any reason why UV light would do anything- it's the really curse that burns, not anything so brute and material as the electromagnetic spectrum.

Mister Olympus
Oct 31, 2011

Buzzard, Who Steals From Dead Bodies

Pope Guilty posted:

I mean it depends on which vampire-containing universe you're talking about but in V:tM the injury sunlight does to vampires is because an angel of God Almighty decreed it. I don't see any reason why UV light would do anything- it's the really curse that burns, not anything so brute and material as the electromagnetic spectrum.

Some games I've seen interpreted it such that "Caine was cursed to walk the Earth," so vampires fall into torpor as soon as they leave orbit

PHIZ KALIFA
Dec 21, 2011

#mood
This is a conditional statement:

quote:

"Then, for as long as you walk this earth,
you and your children will fear the dawn,
and the sun's rays will seek to burn you like fire,

So, if you do NOT walk the earth, you do NOT fear the dawn and the rays will NOT burn you like fire. Since this is the same Talmudic "Oven of Akhnai" diety we can assume they will be bound by the most literal interpretations of their decrees.

In conclusion, cogito ergo sum, SPACE VAAAAAAAAAAAAMPS!

Zereth
Jul 9, 2003



Nessus posted:

What does VASCU feed vampire prisoners awaiting trial? Expired medical blood? The less popular goats from the herd?
Doesn't blood lose its Vampire Nutrition within a couple minutes of leaving the body in Requiem? Even fresh medical blood wouldn't work, unless the donor was giving it just outside the cell.

Relevant Tangent
Nov 18, 2016

Tangentially Relevant

jakodee posted:

The Vanguard Serial Crimes Unit doesn't actually uphold or really have some special insight into the SECRET VEIL separating monsters from normies. They are an openly operating division of the FBI who get by by just... being vague about what exactly their "special techniques" are (they can see the future, distant places, your thoughts, etc.). They certainly know more about the supernatural than your average cop, but their primary interest is in making sure people (including supernatural people) get prosecuted for violating federal US law.

They also have Jason Voorhees trapped in a concrete block in their headquarters just radiating hatred 24/7/365. They have no real idea how to deal with him. Sooner or later that concrete block will break and he'll get loose again. VASCU owns but they are entirely constrained by the law.

Rubix Squid
Apr 17, 2014
To get vitae from a corpse or blood bag it's 1 Vitae per Blood Potency * 2 pints. So it can work for low BP vampires but gets super impractical quickly.

Over at spessvampires, i've actually got a chart based on lux that says how hard a star screws vampires over. For, you know, just in case mages are being rude or when I finally get around to running a game in my Revealed setting way in the space future. For Sol, being 10 AU out is enough to waive the damage even if its super uncomfortable. They have to go out to 31 AU to find it harmless.

UrbicaMortis
Feb 16, 2012

Hmm, how shall I post today?

Mors Rattus posted:

I mean, they do still use normal judges, just ones that know that vampires are a thing. (Which explicitly includes the entire supreme court, which is kind of funny.)

VASCU and TF:V are not exactly agencies that like each other, though, is part of it. VASCU actually does care about due process and kind of prides themselves on that, even if their methods for it are not always...great. It's part of why I really like them.

I also really like that, as near as I can tell, their opinion on supernatural that aren't in fact serial killers is 'I guess a werewolf is a citizen? please don't kill people or I'll have to try and arrest you.'

Yeah, I get that VASCU and Valkyrie don't like each other and it is an important difference that VASCU only goes after criminals rather than supernaturals generally.

My point was more that I'm dubious how much due process you'd actually get in a secret trial for a monster. Is any judge really going to say 'yes, the accused is a terrible denizen of the night but the evidence presented does not prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he drained the blood of the victims, so let him go'?

Considering how dodgy the criminal justice system operates in real life, I don't think the people arrested by VASCU are likely to get treated very fairly.

It shows what a good addition they are to Hunter, since most of the other groups are more about various degrees of vigilante violence, whereas VASCU provides a very different vibe.

Mors Rattus
Oct 25, 2007

FATAL & Friends
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#1 Builder
2014-2018

UrbicaMortis posted:

Yeah, I get that VASCU and Valkyrie don't like each other and it is an important difference that VASCU only goes after criminals rather than supernaturals generally.

My point was more that I'm dubious how much due process you'd actually get in a secret trial for a monster. Is any judge really going to say 'yes, the accused is a terrible denizen of the night but the evidence presented does not prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he drained the blood of the victims, so let him go'?

Considering how dodgy the criminal justice system operates in real life, I don't think the people arrested by VASCU are likely to get treated very fairly.

It shows what a good addition they are to Hunter, since most of the other groups are more about various degrees of vigilante violence, whereas VASCU provides a very different vibe.

That's fair! The original Slashers book does seem to suggest that sometimes, the monsters do not actually get convicted, but I would imagine the rate of conviction is higher than average.

e: also, they still get lawyers, which suggests that there is an entire subdivision of the public defender system that is aware monsters exist.

UrbicaMortis
Feb 16, 2012

Hmm, how shall I post today?

Mors Rattus posted:

That's fair! The original Slashers book does seem to suggest that sometimes, the monsters do not actually get convicted, but I would imagine the rate of conviction is higher than average.

e: also, they still get lawyers, which suggests that there is an entire subdivision of the public defender system that is aware monsters exist.

drat, now I really want to run a legal drama game following the defense lawyers for monsters.

Mors Rattus
Oct 25, 2007

FATAL & Friends
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#1 Builder
2014-2018

UrbicaMortis posted:

drat, now I really want to run a legal drama game following the defense lawyers for monsters.

fuckin' do it, LAW FIRM OF WEREWOLVES, let me play

jakodee
Mar 4, 2019

Mors Rattus posted:

fuckin' do it, LAW FIRM OF WEREWOLVES, let me play

That’s just The Wire.

Mors Rattus
Oct 25, 2007

FATAL & Friends
Walls of Text
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2014-2018

And?

jakodee
Mar 4, 2019

Play it.

nofather
Aug 15, 2014
Looks like Mark Rein-Hagen went off about an article for the V5 production on Facebook.

Another writer apparently had a stroke while on the job.

https://www.reddit.com/r/WhiteWolfRPG/comments/bslwtp/wod_creator_mark_reinhagen_calls_vampire_5_launch/

Mors Rattus
Oct 25, 2007

FATAL & Friends
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#1 Builder
2014-2018

nofather posted:

Looks like Mark Rein-Hagen went off about an article for the V5 production on Facebook.

Another writer apparently had a stroke while on the job.

https://www.reddit.com/r/WhiteWolfRPG/comments/bslwtp/wod_creator_mark_reinhagen_calls_vampire_5_launch/

Assuming he's not lying, because at this point he seems to say whatever puts him in...what he thinks the best light is, he's not very good at it.

That Old Tree
Jun 24, 2012

nah


Mors Rattus posted:

Assuming he's not lying, because at this point he seems to say whatever puts him in...what he thinks the best light is, he's not very good at it.

For someone who was trying to stop all this behind the scenes, he sure offered his full-throated defense in public at the time.

That Old Tree fucked around with this message at 22:13 on May 24, 2019

ZiegeDame
Aug 21, 2005

YUKIMURAAAA!

UrbicaMortis posted:

drat, now I really want to run a legal drama game following the defense lawyers for monsters.

This is where the Adamantine Arrow Lawyer works.

Kurieg
Jul 19, 2012

RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20
:blizz::gamefreak:

That Old Tree posted:

For someone who was trying to stop all this behind the scenes, he sure offered his full-throated defense in public at the time.

And also claimed that anyone who wished to oppose facism should be willing to lay their life on the line to do so.

Aoi
Sep 12, 2017

Perpetually a Pain.

ZiegeDame posted:

This is where the Adamantine Arrow Lawyer works.

This is also where Adamantine Arrow Prosecutor works.

Loomer
Dec 19, 2007

A Very Special Hell

Kurieg posted:

And also claimed that anyone who wished to oppose facism should be willing to lay their life on the line to do so.

But only by letting the fascists kill them without a fuss. We can't leave that bit out because otherwise, sure, I can get behind 'if you want to stop fascism, you must be willing to die fighting against it.' 'Let them murder you until they feel bad!!' not so much.

Nessus
Dec 22, 2003

After a Speaker vote, you may be entitled to a valuable coupon or voucher!



Loomer posted:

But only by letting the fascists kill them without a fuss. We can't leave that bit out because otherwise, sure, I can get behind 'if you want to stop fascism, you must be willing to die fighting against it.' 'Let them murder you until they feel bad!!' not so much.
I think Gandhi proposed something like this, but I think in the same paragraph he also observed that the reason he'd had such success in India was that the British could be shamed, and that this would likely not work against people who did not feel shame.

Kurieg
Jul 19, 2012

RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20
:blizz::gamefreak:

Loomer posted:

But only by letting the fascists kill them without a fuss. We can't leave that bit out because otherwise, sure, I can get behind 'if you want to stop fascism, you must be willing to die fighting against it.' 'Let them murder you until they feel bad!!' not so much.

While true, I wanted to focus mostly on the juxtaposition of "We must be willing to die for our principles" and "Whoever this brave person was, it wasn't me, because I want to live and would not write such a thing."

e: Cause once you bring up the "Letting facists kill them without a fuss" thing the core of his argument at that point was 'the only reason we won WW2 was because enough Jews were willing to let themselves be heroically murdered.' Which is... sure one hell of a take about WW2.

Kurieg fucked around with this message at 04:07 on May 25, 2019

Oberst
May 24, 2010

Fertilizing threads since 2010
Cults of the Blood Gods when

Octavo
Feb 11, 2019





The assistant line developer for Modiphius just retweeted a tweet slamming Onyx Path for screwing their freelancers. I would guess they're referring to pay on pub and the 3¢ per word payrates among other things.

Unless I misremember, exempting the previously licensed content for the V5 kickstarter and 20th anniversary products, Modiphius is the steward of world of darkness ttrpgs going forward.


https://twitter.com/FSohns?s=09

https://twitter.com/ReverendMalcus/status/1132342116988809217?s=19

Joe Slowboat
Nov 9, 2016

Higgledy-Piggledy Whale Statements



I assume they're also referring to Holden Shearer's claims about/crusade against OPP? Since the same account also retweeted Holden's backhanded defense of NuWW for not criticizing Zak S or saying anything about him being awful even now that it's common knowledge.

Octavo
Feb 11, 2019





Joe Slowboat posted:

I assume they're also referring to Holden Shearer's claims about/crusade against OPP? Since the same account also retweeted Holden's backhanded defense of NuWW for not criticizing Zak S or saying anything about him being awful even now that it's common knowledge.

I wouldn't trust the hamster at all, but machineiv made a lot of similar claims about pay on pub causing her to have a 5 year lag on compensation and not getting compensated for work on changeling.

Mendrian
Jan 6, 2013

Octavo posted:

I wouldn't trust the hamster at all, but machineiv made a lot of similar claims about pay on pub causing her to have a 5 year lag on compensation and not getting compensated for work on changeling.

This is true. They typically pay half on draft, half on pub, though line leaders may be paid entirely on pub, I'm not sure.

Desiden
Mar 13, 2016

Mindless self indulgence is SRS BIZNS

Nessus posted:

I think Gandhi proposed something like this, but I think in the same paragraph he also observed that the reason he'd had such success in India was that the British could be shamed, and that this would likely not work against people who did not feel shame.

Gandhi of course was also willing to stand up himself and take the retribution.

Whereas Rein*Hagen talked a big game about how other people should get killed, and claimed to be a big serious fighter for freedom...right until there was the slightest potential of blowback, at which point he freaked out and started disavowing the whole thing. And is now trying to claim he was against it from the start.

I'm guessing in another 6 months to a year, he'll be back to pretending he's a hardcore activist on the front lines.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.
Gandhi's peaceful resistance was also taking place in an India where there was an ongoing and incredibly violent insurgency fighting the British. Gandhi allowed the Brits an avenue to exit without openly surrendering to that insurgency.

(Diversity of tactics works, is what I'm saying.)

Tollymain
Jul 9, 2010

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
you gotta have some scary dudes to call yourself the alternative to otherwise you just get beaten into the dirt yeah

SuperKlaus
Oct 20, 2005


Fun Shoe
I forgot that the UV thing is shown in VtM Bloodlines. That guy who runs experiments on vampires bathes your character in UV light and asks if it burns while you just stand there and wait for the next room.

Dawgstar
Jul 15, 2017

SuperKlaus posted:

I forgot that the UV thing is shown in VtM Bloodlines. That guy who runs experiments on vampires bathes your character in UV light and asks if it burns while you just stand there and wait for the next room.

I also like that they try a cross, which the PC treats as not unlike a flying gnat (and it's a callback to Jack in the tutorial telling you about vampire weaknesses). Sadly the poor man had no True Faith.

SuperKlaus
Oct 20, 2005


Fun Shoe
Yeah and that's kind of funny too when two dungeons later you're trying to land clean hits on Bach and he keeps blinding you with unfiltered Jesus. I kinda wish he could have been spared somehow. I was running my Gangrel as vampire Goku / shonen protagonist. All he wanted to do was Protean War Form transform and fight the strongest opponents around, to see if he could.

I even went full swagger and battled the Gargoyle toe-to-toe. "Why do you want to help kill hengeyokai?" the hunter girl asked. "My Clan Saiyan...uh...Gangrel blood calls me to battle!" So I would have liked to let Bach go somehow like Goku letting Vegeta go.

Gangrel can have monkey tails right?

Dave Brookshaw
Jun 27, 2012

No Regrets
The pay rate isn’t 3c. It’s still low compared to writing, say, “what your surname means” articles for genealogical magazines, but it’s better than 3. The smart money used to be in porn, but it’s not so good an income stream any more.

The last I looked at OPP, some writing people get full on delivery. Everyone else is half and half. Developers are when the job is done, which nowadays means after the errata thread, etc.

The difficulty when improving things is that you have to decide whether to alter existing contracts as well - OPP hasn’t, so it has books still in process on much worse terms than it’s newer projects. They are not alone in this regard - another publisher is now one of the best places to be a freelance developer or writer, but they still kept me waiting five years after delivery before the book came out, because six years ago they were entirely pay on pub.

Really, if you’re worried about knowing when your pay will arrive (as a full time freelancer should be) you should only work for pay on delivery firms or go into business for yourself. Or learn to draw or edit, as the artist’s and editor’s lives are much more certain.

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Sion
Oct 16, 2004

"I'm the boss of space. That's plenty."

Dave Brookshaw posted:

The pay rate isn’t 3c. It’s still low compared to writing, say, “what your surname means” articles for genealogical magazines, but it’s better than 3. The smart money used to be in porn, but it’s not so good an income stream any more.

The last I looked at OPP, some writing people get full on delivery. Everyone else is half and half. Developers are when the job is done, which nowadays means after the errata thread, etc.

Really, if you’re worried about knowing when your pay will arrive (as a full time freelancer should be) you should only work for pay on delivery firms or go into business for yourself. Or learn to draw or edit, as the artist’s and editor’s lives are much more certain.

Holy poo poo you get paid half of your money when OP finish their errata process? So you only ever get paid half of what you're owed?

Also, cool to see a 'learn to code' unironically in the wild.

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