|
He still breathes radioactive fire, which he has to get from somewhere.
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 01:21
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 27, 2024 20:25 |
|
|
Peacoffee posted:Having seen all the Rodan appearances over the years from my rewatching, that seems to be on point at least. Rodan’s nothing if he’s not someone’s little poo poo. Rodan in the Showa series was explicitly depicted as being just as strong as Godzilla so I'm not sure what you're getting at here.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 01:26
|
|
|
HannibalBarca posted:Rodan in the Showa series was explicitly depicted as being just as strong as Godzilla so I'm not sure what you're getting at here. He kinda just hosed around in Destroy All Monsters though, eating the odd fish. Did he have better things to do?
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 01:29
|
|
|
The Golden Gael posted:He kinda just hosed around in Destroy All Monsters though, eating the odd fish. Did he have better things to do? Most monsters "just hosed around" in DAM to be fair. I think Rodan flew over Moscow and destroyed some generic-looking Russian buildings.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 01:31
|
|
|
SuperMechagodzilla posted:That’s one character’s theory expressed in the expository dialogue, but we are never shown it. We’re constantly shown the MUTOs feeding on nuclear bombs, nuclear reactors, radioactive Godzilla corpses, and nuclear waste, but Godzilla 2014 is seemingly entirely indifferent to those things. You're ignoring it because it's inconvenient to you. We're also told the nuclear tests attracted Godzilla from the depths and the movie shows Godzilla hunting the giant, radioactive monsters. You're making poo poo up again.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 01:36
|
|
|
Is anything stopping Toho from doing a live action Godzilla x Evangelion in the future?
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 01:41
|
|
|
The Golden Gael posted:Is anything stopping Toho from doing a live action Godzilla x Evangelion in the future? Depends on the copyright laws involved there
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 01:44
|
|
|
Tezcatlipoca posted:You're ignoring it because it's inconvenient to you. We're also told the nuclear tests attracted Godzilla from the depths and the movie shows Godzilla hunting the giant, radioactive monsters. You're making poo poo up again. And the event that woke up Legendary Godzilla wasn't even nuclear tests: it was the stray radiation emissions from the USS Nautilus, the world's first nuclear powered submarine, passing through the Pacific deep. That's what woke him up, and the nuclear "tests" were attempts to kill Godzilla that either simply did nothing or just made him stronger.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 01:50
|
|
|
The Golden Gael posted:He still breathes radioactive fire, which he has to get from somewhere. Well yeah; he generates it inside of himself. He IS the reactor. The ending of 2014 is literally Godzilla force-feeding the big MUTO radiation until it dies. Tezcatlipoca posted:You're ignoring it because it's inconvenient to you. We're also told the nuclear tests attracted Godzilla from the depths and the movie shows Godzilla hunting the giant, radioactive monsters. You're making poo poo up again. You can’t just claim that I’m wrong. You have to demonstrate it. Check the script: Godzilla was not attracted by nuclear testing. We’re told that Godzilla was accidentally woken up by a nuclear submarine, then the US Government repeatedly nuked Godzilla in an effort to kill him (which seemingly just drove him back underwater). In 1999, the MUTO is accidentally woken up by... oxygen. MONARCH - who are morally ambiguous characters behind a disastrous government coverup - theorize that all MUTOs eat radiation, primarily from the Earth’s core. But what’s the basis for that? King Kong doesn’t eat radiation in his film, and lives above ground. Godzilla doesn’t eat the MUTOs. He actually expends a ton of power hunting them down and killing them, then just walks away. You yourself are now a clear-cut example of why exposition is unreliable. SuperMechagodzilla fucked around with this message at 02:03 on Jun 19, 2019 |
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 01:59
|
|
|
Weren't the mutos woken up by seismic activity and then they burrowed towards the nearest source of radiation? The monsters emitting radiation was never seemed the reason the world was healing. San Francisco didn't become an overgrown jungle because of excess radiation. The reason those places recovered had everything to do with mankind's absence, not nuclear fallout. The eco terrorists plan wasn't to let radioactive monsters irradiate human settlements, it was to let monsters tear poo poo up and keep humans away from places so that nature could recover. Radiation has never been a cure. Even when psycho mom says that Chernobyl is an example of a recovering human area, that doesn't mean that the power plant poisoning the area somehow made it healthy. The Iron Forest is dead for a reason and even though animal life is flourishing around pripyat, it isn't healthy because of radiation. The animals around pripyat have numerous birth defects and shorter life expectancies.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 02:19
|
|
|
HannibalBarca posted:Rodan in the Showa series was explicitly depicted as being just as strong as Godzilla so I'm not sure what you're getting at here. That you think there’s some deeper meaning to my Rodan comment suggests things may be getting too serious iit
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 02:31
|
|
|
Arcsquad12 posted:Weren't the mutos woken up by seismic activity and then they burrowed towards the nearest source of radiation? The male MUTO woke up due to being uncovered by uranium miners in the Philippines (they guess it was a chemical reaction to the atmosphere outside the cave). He then attacked the Janjira reactor, causing the seismic activity. The male MUTO then woke up the female with a call. Evidently, he got up first to collect food for her. So, why does Serizawa get it wrong? Why does he think all Kaijus eat radiation? Answer: he’s been studying the male and female MUTOs for around fifteen years, even performing a vivisection on the female. Serizawa knows a ton about those two*, but almost nothing about Godzilla. So his theory about Godzilla eating radiation is based mainly on his MUTO research. *Even then, Serizawa gets a lot wrong. He thought killing the male MUTO would release a massive cloud of radiation, and that the female was effectively dead. Oops.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 02:39
|
|
|
SuperMechagodzilla posted:We’re told that Godzilla was accidentally woken up by a nuclear submarine, then the US Government repeatedly nuked Godzilla in an effort to kill him (which seemingly just drove him back underwater). In 1999, the MUTO is accidentally woken up by... oxygen. He isn't driven underwater, we stopped testing nukes. The MUTO in 1999 is attracted to the nuclear power plant. quote:Godzilla doesn’t eat the MUTOs. He actually expends a ton of power hunting them down and killing them, then just walks away. Do you need a scene of Godzilla eating big chunks of plutonium? The MUTOs don't even eat it, they absorb it. One of Godzilla's distinguishing features might help with the absorption of radiation and that doesn't require ignoring the movie.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 02:54
|
|
|
SuperMechagodzilla posted:*Even then, Serizawa gets a lot wrong. He thought killing the male MUTO would release a massive cloud of radiation He wasn't wrong. The MUTO feeding on the reactor was the only real thing containing the radiation. Killing it would just leave them with a still active and now leaking nuclear reactor. You could argue they could have built proper containment for the fallout prior to killing it.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 02:57
|
|
|
Tezcatlipoca posted:He isn't driven underwater, we stopped testing nukes. “Not tests. They were trying to kill it.” There’s nothing in the film about Godzilla fighting humanity until nuclear ‘testing’ ceased in... quote:Do you need a scene of Godzilla eating big chunks of plutonium? The MUTOs don't even eat it, they absorb it. Slowly, over the course of 15 years or so.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 03:14
|
|
|
Nothing about how the Titans are meant to act in relation to one another and with the environment makes sense. If Godzilla and Ghidorah are "rival alphas", with the winner taking control of all the Titans as a pack, then nothing about how the MUTOs acted the first time around is logical. I enjoyed the movie but its not, like, good.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 03:24
|
|
|
SuperMechagodzilla posted:There’s nothing in the film about Godzilla fighting humanity Ftfy You still haven't given any reasons to ignore what was stated in the movies.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 03:25
|
|
|
Tezcatlipoca posted:You still haven't given any reasons to ignore what was stated in the movies. I did not ignore the exposition. I incorporated the exposition into a reading where Serizawa is wrong.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 03:29
|
|
|
Mantis42 posted:Nothing about how the Titans are meant to act in relation to one another and with the environment makes sense. If Godzilla and Ghidorah are "rival alphas", with the winner taking control of all the Titans as a pack, then nothing about how the MUTOs acted the first time around is logical. Like SMG said a little while ago, Godzilla: King of the Monsters acts as a subtle reboot of the Monsterverse. I would disagree only on it being subtle, the tone of the first movie is almost entirely gone. The MUTO no longer act as predators toward Godzilla, now they bow to him. Godzilla isn't an unkillable force of nature, turns out humanity can manufacture Oxygen Destroyers which would get the job done quite nicely. No longer is Godzilla a being with some mystery, the massive damage dealt by his arrival juxtaposing strangely with his interacting with the cityscape and gazing down at Ford Brody. Now he's temperamental, prone to acting as little more than an oversized wild animal trying to threaten and intimidate people whenever he notices them. I found it a little disappointing!
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 03:34
|
|
|
Dammerung posted:Like SMG said a little while ago, Godzilla: King of the Monsters acts as a subtle reboot of the Monsterverse. I would disagree only on it being subtle, the tone of the first movie is almost entirely gone. The MUTO no longer act as predators toward Godzilla, now they bow to him. Godzilla isn't an unkillable force of nature, turns out humanity can manufacture Oxygen Destroyers which would get the job done quite nicely. No longer is Godzilla a being with some mystery, the massive damage dealt by his arrival juxtaposing strangely with his interacting with the cityscape and gazing down at Ford Brody. Now he's temperamental, prone to acting as little more than an oversized wild animal trying to threaten and intimidate people whenever he notices them. Yeah it’s disappointing that it’s not a G14 sequel at all. Maybe GvK will work with some of those ideas but who knows. Skull Island is a pretty different flick from that too and it would be hard to serve as a proper sequel to both
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 03:57
|
|
|
SuperMechagodzilla posted:I did not ignore the exposition. I incorporated the exposition into a reading where Serizawa is wrong. Yeah, in 2014 it's hypothesized that all the kaiju grew so big and powerful by absorbing/feeding on radiation from the earth's core, and that Godzilla was an apex predator in the kaiju ecosystem, but Godzilla's treatment of the MUTO - specifically, just destroying but not eating them - implies that Godzilla's more of a gardener, or a sapient being with personal or ideological grudges, than a hungry predator. Serizawa might not be wrong that Godzilla feeds off or is empowered by radiation generally, but just eating other monsters clearly isn't his main objective. In KotM things are a lot more straightforward. Ferrinus fucked around with this message at 04:20 on Jun 19, 2019 |
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 04:10
|
|
|
Dammerung posted:Like SMG said a little while ago, Godzilla: King of the Monsters acts as a subtle reboot of the Monsterverse. I would disagree only on it being subtle, the tone of the first movie is almost entirely gone. The MUTO no longer act as predators toward Godzilla, now they bow to him. Godzilla isn't an unkillable force of nature, turns out humanity can manufacture Oxygen Destroyers which would get the job done quite nicely. No longer is Godzilla a being with some mystery, the massive damage dealt by his arrival juxtaposing strangely with his interacting with the cityscape and gazing down at Ford Brody. Now he's temperamental, prone to acting as little more than an oversized wild animal trying to threaten and intimidate people whenever he notices them. This isn't any different than how the Showa films went. Godzilla tried killing Mothra, was encased by two small Mothra, then bowed to her in the third act of the Godzilla and Mothra trilogy. He was even told to watch his mouth around her by her representatives. Compare that with the Godzilla of 54.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 04:12
|
|
|
The Golden Gael posted:This isn't any different than how the Showa films went. Godzilla tried killing Mothra, was encased by two small Mothra, then bowed to her in the third act of the Godzilla and Mothra trilogy. He was even told to watch his mouth around her by her representatives. Compare that with the Godzilla of 54. Continuity in the Showa era is faster and looser, and there was an enormous tonal shift after King Kong versus Godzilla. It's a bit like comparing apples and oranges, considering how many Godzilla films were made in the Showa era (15) compared to the two in the current Monsterverse. It's entirely possible that I would hypothetically come to appreciate the differences in tone between Godzilla 2014 and Godzilla: King of the Monsters with more sequels, but as is, I'm not happy with how the latter turned out.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 04:33
|
|
|
The Golden Gael posted:This isn't any different than how the Showa films went. Godzilla tried killing Mothra, was encased by two small Mothra, then bowed to her in the third act of the Godzilla and Mothra trilogy. He was even told to watch his mouth around her by her representatives. Compare that with the Godzilla of 54. That’s two different Godzillas, though. The second Godzilla is nicer from the outset, and gradually becomes way more mellow due to Mothra’s influence. But even in the 1950s, it’s sad that the first Godzilla (and a Rodan) ends up killed. (It’s really easy to skip over Raids Again because it sucks - plus, keep in mind that the Godzilla movies from 1964 and ‘65 are more like Mothra sequels featuring Godzilla.) This kinda brings thing back to the point that this Godzilla 2 has most in common with a “Millenium” film - not just the concentrated nostalgia (i.e. Final Wars) and the sudden, casual rebooting, but this insecurity over an inferior Godzilla stealing the spotlight. I don’t think it’s a stretch to say Ghidorah in this film is a stand-in for Shin Godzilla in the same way that Orga stands in for ‘Zilla 1998. SuperMechagodzilla fucked around with this message at 06:45 on Jun 19, 2019 |
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 06:19
|
|
|
Arcsquad12 posted:Weren't the mutos woken up by seismic activity and then they burrowed towards the nearest source of radiation? Your argument against the explicit text of the film is "real life doesn't work like that"?
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 06:52
|
|
|
McSpanky posted:Your argument against the explicit text of the film is "real life doesn't work like that"? Well yeah, he’s right. By ‘explicit text’, you’re referring of course to the litany of blogs and articles at the end of the film. And those thinkpieces are ultimately, credulously promoting a ‘green’ capitalism (which could have been a good pun if Godzilla wasn’t greyish). Godzilla 2 is basically aligned with Ripley in Aliens, who fights to protect the Weyland-Yutani corporation’s assets against greedy corrupters (e.g. Burke) and alien attack ‘from outside.’ Building better worlds, right? There’s a trend nowadays where, whenever a movie features bad weather, it’s like “oh wow, climate change.” This movie says almost nothing about ecology at all, outside the end credits. SuperMechagodzilla fucked around with this message at 07:39 on Jun 19, 2019 |
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 07:34
|
|
|
i have a bad habit of fitting stories into thesis/antithesis/synthesis patterns, driven by how common trilogies are, but this movie really does feel antithetical to 2014 in a few important ways, and antithetical to skull island in some other important ways (the most significant one being 'actually the monsters are gods and not just big gorillas') that could lead to godzilla vs kong being an interesting synthesis. then again man of steel / bvs / justice league could have also been a good one of these and the synthesis Got Murdered so who knows
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 07:58
|
|
|
SuperMechagodzilla posted:Godzilla 2 is basically aligned with Ripley in Aliens, who fights to protect the Weyland-Yutani corporation’s assets against greedy corrupters (e.g. Burke) and alien attack ‘from outside.’ Building better worlds, right? She's the one that comes up with the plan to blow up the entire facility and all of the precious bioweapons specimens contained within...
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 12:19
|
|
|
Dammerung posted:Continuity in the Showa era is faster and looser, and there was an enormous tonal shift after King Kong versus Godzilla. It's a bit like comparing apples and oranges, considering how many Godzilla films were made in the Showa era (15) compared to the two in the current Monsterverse. It's entirely possible that I would hypothetically come to appreciate the differences in tone between Godzilla 2014 and Godzilla: King of the Monsters with more sequels, but as is, I'm not happy with how the latter turned out. Let's not forget the Kong movie is a Monsterverse film in the same sense that Mothra or Rodan were Showa era films. I'm open to tone shifting between films because that's what shakes it up. You could never do a sequel to 2014 which has the same spirit without it feeling like more of the same to some extent - this is in part why Skull Island works in the context of this quadrology.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 13:26
|
|
|
HannibalBarca posted:She's the one that comes up with the plan to blow up the entire facility and all of the precious bioweapons specimens contained within... Ripley suggests nuking the site after it's determined that the facility has been hopelessly infested, and then she never follows through. The facility was actually (accidentally) blown up by Vasquez. The company isn't pursuing the 'xenomorphs' as bioweapons. Burke was operating on his own. Point is that Ripley never actually acts against the corporation, only against the aliens. She is heading back to Earth at the end specifically so that she can continue working for the company in a higher-level position. I bring this up both because of the ideology, and Aliens is my go-to example of a sneaky reboot. The Golden Gael posted:Let's not forget the Kong movie is a Monsterverse film in the same sense that Mothra or Rodan were Showa era films. I'm open to tone shifting between films because that's what shakes it up. You could never do a sequel to 2014 which has the same spirit without it feeling like more of the same to some extent - this is in part why Skull Island works in the context of this quadrology. The issue is that the 'spirit' of a film isn't its tone or, like, genre. Kong works great as a comedy prequel to Godzilla. The issue with Godzilla 2 is not that it has a different tone, but that it's a thematic regression. (Also the editing is terrible and Dougherty can't direct action (lol at the ambush/standoff scene in the Antarctic)).
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 15:50
|
|
|
SuperMechagodzilla posted:I did not ignore the exposition. I incorporated the exposition into a reading where Serizawa is wrong. By using an unrelated film to prove he is wrong, not what is actually in Godzilla '14. There's nothing in the movie that contradicts what he says. Your reading of the movie should be kept within the movie. Stop bringing in other movies to fill in the blanks when the text is inconvenient to your bad interpretations. Tezcatlipoca fucked around with this message at 16:14 on Jun 19, 2019 |
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 16:10
|
|
|
I want to call out one cool thing KoTM brought forward from its predecessors- during the scene where Godzilla buzzes Castle Bravo, the G-team mans three turrets, if you look as the system is powering up, the system calls them out as MASER batteries, just like the ones used in the Millennium (?) era Godzilla films. Among the other items, it's a neat bit of callback/easter egg that shows the team behind the movie did some research into the prior series.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 16:23
|
|
|
If your reading is predicated on the idea that the movie is actively lying to the viewer about its own events, your reading is bad. You are no longer reading the actual movie that exists, but rather, an imaginary movie that you have decided exists within the movie.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 16:25
|
|
|
LORD OF BOOTY posted:If your reading is predicated on the idea that the movie is actively lying to the viewer about its own events, your reading is bad. You are no longer reading the actual movie that exists, but rather, an imaginary movie that you have decided exists within the movie. No one is suggesting that the film is lying to the viewer, but that what individual characters are saying is happening and what the film is actually showing the viewer are in conflict. This is Godzilla, it ain't unexpected for the scientists and experts to be wrong on occasion. "The creature is confined to the water, if it were to leave it would be crushed by its own weight. I repeat, there is no danger that the creature will leave the water. Please, we ask you to remain calm." "Prime Minister, excuse the interruption..." Tezcatlipoca asked earlier, "Do you need a scene of Godzilla eating big chunks of plutonium?" And, if you want to argue that 2014 Godzilla definitely, absolutely eats radiation, then the answer is actually "yes." Schwarzwald fucked around with this message at 00:58 on Jun 20, 2019 |
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 17:03
|
|
|
Well one of the newsreel headlines in G14 at the end notes that the fallout from the San Francisco nuke is shockingly low, so it is implied, if not explicitly stated, that Godzilla absorbed the radiation during his nap after the fight. Not that being a radiation vacuum cleaner somehow makes what's left of the city inhabitable, mind you.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 18:05
|
|
|
SuperMechagodzilla posted:Ripley suggests nuking the site after it's determined that the facility has been hopelessly infested, and then she never follows through. By the time she gets to the Sulaco, where the nukes are, there's no point, because it's already been destroyed ahhhhhh. And the infestation is the point; by the time they know about the aliens, Burke the corporate rear end in a top hat is less concerned about saving the expensive atmosphere processor than he is about a sneaking a xenomorph specimen through quarantine.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 18:37
|
|
|
I mean, I enjoyed KotM but the 'alpha' nonsense is a pretty big clue these characters might not be correct in all their theories
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 19:21
|
|
|
You're conflating feeding and eating.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 19:40
|
|
|
Tezcatlipoca posted:You're conflating feeding and eating. I like the implication here that Godzilla evolved what looks like a mouth and jaws but it’s actually just a weapon he doesn’t eat it’s for biting and shooting laser beams. there’s no throat in there, just a Nuke Bladder
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 20:03
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 27, 2024 20:25 |
|
|
Schwarzwald posted:Tezcatlipoca asked earlier, "Do you need a scene of Godzilla eating big chunks of plutonium?" And, if you want to argue that 2014 Godzilla definitely, absolutely eats radiation, then the answer is actually "yes." Right the MUTOs are 100% shown rubbing their faces all over radioactive things, building nests on them, laying their eggs on them, etc. That all doesn’t matter, because the point is Ripley isn’t trying to blow up the company. Her goal is to blow up the aliens. She has no issue with any of the other W-Y mining colonies.
|
|
#
?
Jun 19, 2019 20:47
|
|