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https://twitter.com/JZarif/status/1142436757801197568 lol
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Jun 22, 2019 19:52
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Willie Tomg posted:there's a line of internal monologue from one of the rangers in that book along the lines of "its like someone declared Kill Americans Day in mogadishu!" and It's an interesting example because it was one of the few moments where the birth-to-death american exceptionalism propaganda veil was pulled aside for actual americans. It reveals a really weird attitude, too, where American forces routinely fail to expect their opponents to meaningfully resist them, much less actively adapt to their tactics. In Mogadishu Aidid's forces stockpiled RPGs for months thinking that if they had enough they could probably take down a helicopter by sheer volume of fire. Similarly the f-117 shootdown in Yugoslavia was because an anti-air battallion commander realized that American jets weren't varying their approaches but were literally flying over the same mountain every day on bombing raids so he just set up a sam site on the mountain and downed the first stealth fighter ever. IIRC the serbian shootdown of an f16 was done the same way. This weird hubristic perception of invincibility is almost inseparable from how the US military works, like the indoctrination is actually too effective. Similarly, it's notable that both of these huge fuckups ended up with major hollywood productions essentially intended to rewrite the official story into something lionizing the dumbshit actions. It's this weird devil's bargain where there's a promise that even if you fail and suck at what you're doing, as long as you're doing it for the US we'll make a movie about you and we'll make you look like a hero. Hell, maybe we'll even make you a senator in Arizona
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Jun 22, 2019 20:09
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so basically the navy danced in the zone between iranian airspace and iranian waters and when that didnt provoke a response they just went straight across the line and got blasted immediately
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Jun 22, 2019 20:11
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aidid was also treated as some "warlord" and not as a sophisticated political and military operator who graduated from the frunze military academy in the soviet union. he went on to serve as somalia's president.
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Jun 22, 2019 20:18
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Some canadian reporter found out soldiers raped and beat a teen to death during the operation and after an inquiry into the military revealed a bunch of neonazis everywhere in the CAF. It got gutted but every country involved in the UN operation did the same thing (and imploded the country for years to come until they ousted the moderate Islamic courts too when they semi-stabilized the country leading to al-Shabaab rising out of the triple burned ashes of Somalia) Once the African Union gets sick of trying to husband Somalia it’ll slide right back into the al-quada safe haven hellhole that both the warlords and Islamic courts tried avoiding since the early 00’s (and ironically were put into the transitional governments after years of UN and US opposition) There’s a lot of other stuff too like how Kenya and Ethiopia had to be taken off most of the AIMSOM mission because of past histories between them and Somalia (and them helping various warlords for their own expansionist reasons in the 90’s), which gave al-shabaab a good foot in the door after Ethiopian tanks rolled into Mogadishu and made the Somali national conscious really mad All the elders were right all along and communist Somalia was the best it’ll ever be and every Somali worldwide deserves a hot cup of tea and a Somali cookie when bill clinton passes on to hell.
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Jun 22, 2019 20:19
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The best non-Somali source I’ve seen in the past few years is a Somali professor who went on the war nerds podcast on their al-shabaab episode (which i really recommend) and I think he plugged his book on the radio too. A few good Somali and Kenyan books in English on Amazon but it seems more on the broad strokes on the failed state
drjuggalo has issued a correction as of 20:28 on Jun 22, 2019 |
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Jun 22, 2019 20:25
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drjuggalo posted:The best non-Somali source I’ve seen in the past few years is a Somali professor who went on the war nerds podcast on their al-shabaab episode (which i really recommend) and I think he plugged his book on the radio too. ????????
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Jun 22, 2019 20:28
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As in he’s speaking in English and not Somali
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Jun 22, 2019 20:29
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lol that owns. Watching America get owned loving owns. God bless
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Jun 22, 2019 20:39
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drjuggalo posted:The best non-Somali source I’ve seen in the past few years is a Somali professor who went on the war nerds podcast on their al-shabaab episode (which i really recommend) and I think he plugged his book on the radio too. A few good Somali and Kenyan books in English on Amazon but it seems more on the broad strokes on the failed state Thanks for this, it's crazy how hard the US has memory holed everything in English related to Somalia. It's like the one thing you can google search that gets 5 results that are all us military publications
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Jun 22, 2019 20:54
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drjuggalo posted:Some canadian reporter found out soldiers raped and beat a teen to death during the operation and after an inquiry into the military revealed a bunch of neonazis everywhere in the CAF. It got gutted but every country involved in the UN operation did the same thing (and imploded the country for years to come until they ousted the moderate Islamic courts too when they semi-stabilized the country leading to al-Shabaab rising out of the triple burned ashes of Somalia) nothing got gutted. they just rebranded the para's into jtf2 then gave'em more money.
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Jun 22, 2019 21:42
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Herstory Begins Now posted:Thanks for this, it's crazy how hard the US has memory holed everything in English related to Somalia. It's like the one thing you can google search that gets 5 results that are all us military publications Another American tradition proudly stolen from the British Empire. It's kind of amazing how many brutal massacres and dirty wars the British conducted that are passed over with almost total silence in English language history.
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Jun 22, 2019 21:47
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Helsing posted:Another American tradition proudly stolen from the British Empire. It's kind of amazing how many brutal massacres and dirty wars the British conducted that are passed over with almost total silence in English language history. Yeah well we can't exactly dump all the documentation into the sea anymore. Kindest Forums User posted:lol that owns. Watching America get owned loving owns. God bless Seems clear that Trump lied about deciding not to strike against Iran, and that they never intended any kind of retaliation because they knew that we violated their airspace.
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Jun 22, 2019 22:06
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:Seems clear that Trump lied about deciding not to strike against Iran, and that they never intended any kind of retaliation because they knew that we violated their airspace. this is my thinkin' as well
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Jun 22, 2019 22:41
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Goon Danton posted:What's MSNBC doing on this? Are they howling for Iranian blood like the rest of the #resistance, or did they just close up shop for good after Mueller failed to oust Trump for them? Maddow literally said that we should feel bad for John Bolton as a human being. I’m not kidding. She said this, with her mouth: quote:”Hey John Bolton, hey, Mike Pompeo, are you guys enjoying your jobs right now?” Maddow asked. “You each thought your job this week was to name and shame and threaten and counter Russian government involvement in Venezuela while sabre-rattling about how everyone better get out of the way because the US is really mad about it. Guys, turns out your actual job is figuring out why you work for a president who says whatever Vladimir Putin tells him. I mean, just to be clear here, how do you come to work anymore if you’re John Bolton?”
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Jun 22, 2019 22:52
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im incapable of seeing john bolton as a human being. he's a sentient mustache intent on using the american military to enforce american hegemony at the cost of life and resources.
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Jun 23, 2019 00:00
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Darkman Fanpage posted:im incapable of seeing john bolton as a human being. he's a sentient mustache intent on using the american military to enforce american hegemony at the cost of life and resources. mmm nice try VLADMIR
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Jun 23, 2019 00:04
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Herstory Begins Now posted:This weird hubristic perception of invincibility is almost inseparable from how the US military works, like the indoctrination is actually too effective. it's wishful thinking, plus imperial mentality for at least a century, Western military planners have dreamed of being able to overwhelmingly win wars against minor powers without significant troop commitment, just rolling in and one-sidedly steamrolling everything with advanced technology and highly-trained elite squads, without having to send in a full ground invasion and without taking significant casualties. because the idea is so attractive, Western militaries have jumped at it at every opportunity. for example, right before the Korean War, Truman was making big cuts to the Army and Navy because his advisors had convinced him that ships and infantry were obsolete and that all future wars would be nuclear wars fought exclusively by Air Force strategic bombers and part of the reason Western militaries are so casualty-averse is because they're usually operating on colonial or imperial missions far from home. and because they're largely doing imperial or colonial work, they tend to hold disdain for or disinterest in their victims' capabilities, just like every other empire throughout history. moreso in the wake of the Cold War, where the force that had been built to oppose the Soviet Menace and the Red Army Hordes definitely did not think there was anything left on the planet that could possibly threaten them
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Jun 23, 2019 05:37
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dK5V2XLnjE re bolton
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Jun 23, 2019 06:02
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When I was a teenager, I thought it was stupid and unrealistic how constantly owned the Empire is in Star Wars. As an adult, I now realize that we are the Empire. 
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Jun 23, 2019 06:07
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note that what little I've heard from NPR while driving characterizes iran as an aggressor
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Jun 23, 2019 06:12
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https://twitter.com/Marko24893950/status/1142548578751193090
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Jun 23, 2019 06:14
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYhvOgN707k
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Jun 23, 2019 08:33
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What is the general opinion here on Jimmy Doore? I like him but I'm ready to have my view shattered into a million pieces
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Jun 23, 2019 08:52
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he's sometimes kind of an unsympathetic dirtbag rear end in a top hat, he fell for the imperialist coup in brazil, and his reflex is sometimes to be alex jones-like on events like the las vegas shooting or 9/11 fundamentally his outlook tends to be more reformist liberal but he's slowly getting more and more towards the 'workers should own the means of production' line of thought he's still better than basically the entire mainstream news media, he's reflexively anti-imperialist, and is an ally
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Jun 23, 2019 08:55
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i think some people dont like him because he kind of has a dirtbag blue collar persona with the way he talks, but that's also the reason some people like him lol the other reasons would be he questioned mother or he is extremely critical and skeptical of the absurd russiagate narrative like matt taibbi or glenn greenwald which some people can't seem to let go of
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Jun 23, 2019 09:01
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like the only criticisms I've heard of him here was his cheerleading of Lava Jato and maybe his platforming of Tulsi Gabbard which, really, fair enough on both counts He's still more right than wrong on just about everything else he's commented on
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Jun 23, 2019 09:05
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if people applied the same rigors generally that they do for Jimmy Dore then all goons would be cancelled
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Jun 23, 2019 09:24
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:if people applied the same rigors generally that they do for Jimmy Dore then all goons would be cancelled not exactly seeing the downsides here
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Jun 23, 2019 09:55
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I will be honest and admit I am more surprised he managed not to rant live on TV about how the US army should cover Iran's sky with Raytheon's Tomahawk missiles.
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Jun 23, 2019 10:33
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gradenko_2000 posted:like the only criticisms I've heard of him here was his cheerleading of Lava Jato and maybe his platforming of Tulsi Gabbard he's got an unfortunate tendency to buy in to dumbass conspiracy theories, which has led him into occasionally pushing far right bullshit. i don't think it's malicious when he does it, unlike alex jones and the right wing media machine, but i do think it's counterproductive. his heart is definitely in the right place though, which is far better than most folks with a platform as big as his.
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Jun 23, 2019 12:43
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We talking about jimmy? Love Jimmy. Great way to get your boomer and xer relatives into good thought territory I think shoutman style television is engaging because I started school under ronald Reagan when the US was strong. Democracy now has been more consistently and frustratingly wrong about poo poo over the last couple years and beyond than jimmy dore
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Jun 23, 2019 12:49
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There isn't enough sincere anger at the political establishment, even in left wing media.
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Jun 23, 2019 13:55
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Herstory Begins Now posted:poo poo, just reread black hawk down and just read between the lines to start? Like yeah they were fighting militia, but also every city on the planet has some militia types that they'd break out if a loving hostile army comes roaring through their markets and residential areas guns blazing. Tbh it's more reflective probably of general American media portrayal of Arabs and the muslim world and you need to break down that really loving weird lens first. Yeah its funny how the book, while being generally pro US, gives a much more nuanced depiction than the movie; but of course no one read the book. poo poo the US had leveled a meeting of tribal leaders killing dozens of respected politicians on thr off chance the Bad Guy might be there (he wasn't)
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Jun 23, 2019 14:40
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Jimmy Dore is an idiot, but less so than any MSM journo, and he seems to be stumbling towards correct opinions more often than not, so in summary Dore is a land of contrasts.
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Jun 23, 2019 15:54
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comedyblissoption posted:note that what little I've heard from NPR while driving characterizes iran as an aggressor I turned it on on the way home and their special guest to talk about the "called-off strike" was that former natsec dude who's now with a think tank that exists solely to jerk off over wargames (I think it was CNAC but I thought they were defunct?) and wrote the "we need to hit Iran" article. they suck so loving much
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Jun 23, 2019 18:16
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And Erdogan's Party, the AKP, just lost Istanbul mayoral election rerun he forced after losing the first time. No one is surprised.
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Jun 23, 2019 20:41
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Trumps Baby Hands posted:Maddow literally said that we should feel bad for John Bolton as a human being. its incredible how much she broke her brain on the russia poo poo
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Jun 23, 2019 21:08
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im convinced she's always had a broken brain
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Jun 23, 2019 21:10
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I think it's more of a collective brain breaking with trump in the social circles she runs in, just like conservatives went nuts after obama got elected
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Jun 23, 2019 21:30
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