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Catfishenfuego posted:The correct answer to this is 'gently caress off or stop doing this'. Yeah, easy fix. If your players won't buy in at all to your game you need either new players or a new game.
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Jun 26, 2019 04:35
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Naoto Shirogane posted:There's a guy in my group who made a Lasombra who never shapeshifts and is always shaking like he has Parkinson's or something? He doesn't do anything at all, and put all of his points on his character sheet into guns despite not owning a gun. In the middle of our session he screams "WELCOME!" in a nasally voice while his character points a camcorder to his face (despite being invisible in the lens due to Lasombra) and drinking special edition sodas and eating Lunchables even though vampires don't eat or drink? Unless he throws it up somehow afterwards, but he never elaborates. In fact, whenever he needs blood he pours it from oda cans(???) He cracks the drink open, breathes heavily into his microphone and splashes what I assume is Coke Zero all over his own microphone and glass/table. I...appreciate his dedication to the character, but to be completely honest with you all I don't think he truly appreciates the serious tone the World of Darkness universe brings to the proverbial table and it makes any interaction with him an absolute chore. Absolutely useless character, and he doesn't die. His rolls are just too good and I suspect he's using some sort of weighted dice to make sure he plagues our existence with either himself or a gruff sounded alter ego he created last week named "Darnation Rob". Darnation isn't even a word.  Or, tell him his character sucks and it doesn't fit the game at all and if he wants to play he should make a new one that isn't an excuse to pour soda all over himself.
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Jun 26, 2019 08:36
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its a good idea to tell them to tone it down but honestly im vaguely curious what theyre trying to do
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Jun 26, 2019 08:46
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the mad lasombra i mean gently caress to weird transmisic poo poo
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Jun 26, 2019 08:47
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Tollymain posted:its a good idea to tell them to tone it down but honestly im vaguely curious what theyre trying to do Sounds like he might have some issues, is trolling the group, or is doing some sort of weird performance art. Maybe a bit of the latter two. Either way, sever if he won't respect the rest of the group. On the other hand, if you've done something to piss him off or provoke him into trolling then please put off severing in favor of telling us why you've provoked some rando into trolling the poo poo out of your game with his seemingly unkillable character. Because given that character description there's gotta be a story there.  Oberst posted:Wait why did he make a homophobic vampire in the first place? Projection much? I'm trying to imagine a situation where saying "Okay, drop the bigotry as a character concept and go with something that doesn't involve beating the poo poo out of and/or eating LGBT people." wouldn't just be easier for everyone in the long run instead of trying to mage-chat your way into figuring out what qualifies as an acceptable meal to the aforementioned bigoted vampire. Archonex fucked around with this message at 10:50 on Jun 26, 2019 |
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Jun 26, 2019 10:40
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Regardless of the context (which is teetering on transphobic/homophobic) there are plenty of other examples of “how do I treat a prey exclusion in cases where the feeding vampire doesn’t know whether or not prey qualifies”. If your blonde prey dyes their hair red, and you only feed on redheads, guess what that meal is coming right back up. Ignoring the differentiation between sex and gender, if I was the ST I would probably say anybody with a Y chromosome is on the menu. If you want to then make calls on whether a character is intersex or anything else youre at least working with distinct rules and not debating the social construct of gender through a pair of plastic vampire fangs GNU Order fucked around with this message at 15:34 on Jun 26, 2019 |
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Jun 26, 2019 15:29
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To me the equally unnerving part of that situation is the “no kids” rule which I can imagine you’ll run into like a brick wall in an similarly suspicious context. Feeding on a kid should be carte blanche humanity stain imo. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and wants to reinforce traditional gender roles like a duck, then it’s a duck
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Jun 26, 2019 15:31
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there a lot of afab women who have y chromosomes like, that's loving stupid as a criteria and the entire thing should be, no, pick a different restriction, the end.
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Jun 26, 2019 15:52
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I feel like a lot of posters are equating “playing a homophobic character” with being a homophobe/transphobe as though people haven’t been using tabletops to role play EVIL characters since they were invented. The nerd in me immediately read the situation, however clumsily explained, as “if the victim was genetically male at birth would it trigger a penalty” and the correct response was the above poster going “Vampires are magic, not sciencey, so genetics don’t matter.” If the victim identifies as a woman and lives as a woman, then she’s a woman and the penalty won’t trigger. This could lead to situations where the only available victim is a trans woman and the character could then roleplay through their homo/transphobia. It’s clunky sure but do not even close to the most problematic or hosed up or even that offensive of an idea for someone to bring up. The Lasombra guy spilling Coke everywhere sounds way more lovely to play with TBQH But for clarity, transwomen aren’t “men dressed up as ladies” that’s something else (I just like spaghetti straps and loose fitting skirts because I have a lot of tattoos and don’t like jeans. The lipstick and nails... we’ll just blame Depeche Mode), and if that’s the assumption you group is under then you’re probably not mature enough to explore these themes in game and end up somewhere good. Bust Rodd fucked around with this message at 16:16 on Jun 26, 2019 |
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Jun 26, 2019 16:11
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MollyMetroid posted:there a lot of afab women who have y chromosomes It is possibly the dumbest criterion. It's a blood curse, not science.
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Jun 26, 2019 16:13
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Bust Rodd posted:It’s clunky sure but do not even close to the most problematic or hosed up or even that offensive of an idea for someone to bring up. No, it's pretty problematic and hosed up. It's extremely offensive. Trans people are literally being murdered for their perceived gender. It's literally not a fiction, it's our goddamn reality. Edit: not to mention the sheer dipshittery of comparing being trans to dyeing your hair color what the gently caress people MollyMetroid fucked around with this message at 16:18 on Jun 26, 2019 |
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Jun 26, 2019 16:15
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there is a pretty large difference between playing evil ("bwahahahaha behold my doom machine!") or even playing evil ("okay I'm going to eat this defenseless person because I need some blood right now") and going 'and for this one, I'm going to say slurs and be hugely transphobic but it's fine because it's just ~my character~' Like, yes, a real person being a supervillain or a murderous vampire would be hella evil? but it's kind of a qualitative difference a huge one
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Jun 26, 2019 16:24
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But there isn’t anything in the post about using slurs.
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Jun 26, 2019 16:53
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You know, at this point, Mage Chat would be an upgrade.Nessus posted:Yeah, "it was secretly all another layer of control by the unfuckable super-conspirators" is like the most boring answer possible. This is the chain of logic that ends in the last season of GoT. The point is not the twist, the point is so how well constructed it is, how it builds themes and ideas presented in the text. The Unlife Aquatic fucked around with this message at 17:08 on Jun 26, 2019 |
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Jun 26, 2019 17:03
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Bust Rodd posted:But there isn’t anything in the post about using slurs. gently caress off.
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Jun 26, 2019 17:13
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Hey folks. w.r.t. the transphobic vampire: I don't think this conversation is going to go anywhere good, especially the part about chromosomes (tl;dr: there are actually a lot of possible chromosomal arrangements, even if you're cis you can't be 100% certain which ones you have unless you get tested, and "If you have a Y you're a guy" is a thing transphobes say so that's a whole other can of worms). I think "it's probably a bad idea to say a vampire isn't breaking their clause if they don't perceive it that way" pretty much covers it, so let's move on.
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Jun 26, 2019 17:19
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So, how about those Traditions, huh? What would Ascension have to do to make them function as protagonists in 2019?
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Jun 26, 2019 17:20
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Rand Brittain posted:So, how about those Traditions, huh? Scrap them and start over with something not based on 90s club cultures?
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Jun 26, 2019 17:24
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Bust Rodd posted:I feel like a lot of posters are equating “playing a homophobic character” with being a homophobe/transphobe as though people haven’t been using tabletops to role play EVIL characters since they were invented. The world is a vampire....
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Jun 26, 2019 17:26
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GNU Order posted:If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and wants to reinforce traditional gender roles like a duck, then it’s a Camarilla
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Jun 26, 2019 17:28
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I will take this lovely topic as a jumping off point to say that Promethean is a wonderful game and feels built to be played by trans people. 2 of my 3 players (and i also as the gm) are trans and i feel like the game would have a harder time functioning if we weren’t so in touch with the concept of finding/building an identity.
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Jun 26, 2019 17:40
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Dave Brookshaw posted:Scrap them and start over with something not based on 90s club cultures? Not make their enemies anti-Semitic conspiracy theories?
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Jun 26, 2019 17:42
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Is the v5 thinblood alchemy trans spell triggering/problematic? It seems pretty inclusive but I'd never play a thinblood (disgusting so I cant tell
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Jun 26, 2019 17:48
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Dave Brookshaw posted:Scrap them and start over with something not based on 90s club cultures? I definitely agree that the Hollow Ones are not worth saving.
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Jun 26, 2019 18:13
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Naoto Shirogane posted:There's a guy in my group who made a Lasombra who never shapeshifts and is always shaking like he has Parkinson's or something? He doesn't do anything at all, and put all of his points on his character sheet into guns despite not owning a gun. In the middle of our session he screams "WELCOME!" in a nasally voice while his character points a camcorder to his face (despite being invisible in the lens due to Lasombra) and drinking special edition sodas and eating Lunchables even though vampires don't eat or drink? Unless he throws it up somehow afterwards, but he never elaborates. In fact, whenever he needs blood he pours it from oda cans(???) He cracks the drink open, breathes heavily into his microphone and splashes what I assume is Coke Zero all over his own microphone and glass/table. I...appreciate his dedication to the character, but to be completely honest with you all I don't think he truly appreciates the serious tone the World of Darkness universe brings to the proverbial table and it makes any interaction with him an absolute chore. Absolutely useless character, and he doesn't die. His rolls are just too good and I suspect he's using some sort of weighted dice to make sure he plagues our existence with either himself or a gruff sounded alter ego he created last week named "Darnation Rob". Darnation isn't even a word. If you have a DM worth their salt they should be able to have things set up to kind of push back on those kinds of things (without necessarily punishing people or restricting player agency.) If done correctly they can introduce something in the story that has meaning to the character with subtle undertones meant to speak to the player as well. Talk things out with other players to make sure they are okay with something like this, especially if the DM decides to do something drastic such as introducing a Ventrue that wishes to (once again) discontinue Coke Zero. Yes that's invalidating his character quite a bit and might upset the player, but these harsh truths are what make WoD so good.
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Jun 26, 2019 18:34
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Xinder posted:I will take this lovely topic as a jumping off point to say that Promethean is a wonderful game and feels built to be played by trans people. 2 of my 3 players (and i also as the gm) are trans and i feel like the game would have a harder time functioning if we weren’t so in touch with the concept of finding/building an identity. This is also how I feel about Demon. It's a great game when you have an LGBT group because the complex relationship with identity means people more quickly grasp the intricacies of the Cover system and how to play a character with a mutable sense of self.
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Jun 26, 2019 18:43
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The Unlife Aquatic posted:This is also how I feel about Demon. It's a great game when you have an LGBT group because the complex relationship with identity means people more quickly grasp the intricacies of the Cover system and how to play a character with a mutable sense of self. One of these days I really ought to do Demon. I just get so worried I’m not smart enough to run it.
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Jun 26, 2019 19:36
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Rand Brittain posted:So, how about those Traditions, huh? You could make them front groups for the Pentacle as originally intended for Awakening, but they're fine as-is. Like I've posted before, a lot of people fail the basic "will you support the traditionalists or the technocrats" ideological test - just as you'd expect they would in the present era - but that doesn't mean it isn't an interesting test.
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Jun 26, 2019 19:39
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Xinder posted:One of these days I really ought to do Demon. I just get so worried I’m not smart enough to run it. I've run multiple Demon games, feel free to PM me to talk shop.
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Jun 26, 2019 19:49
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Another question about Changeling: The Lost, is it possible to combine multiple personal Hollows into a shared Freehold? A few players have Hollows and the game is going to encourage cooperation so it's something I envision them encountering in the future. I think I'll encourage them to make an oath-forged token to create a kind of "foundation" to join the hollows together, and just have a handful of Hedgespinning roles to finagle moving these things through non-euclidean space.
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Jun 26, 2019 20:58
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Rand Brittain posted:So, how about those Traditions, huh? It was very clear to me that they were all kind of cast in a mold in relation to the Order of Hermes. The Order of Hermes is "fine" in the sense that it is coherent, makes sense, and has an obvious magical flavor. I would reduce the number of Traditions to, say, five total and I would cast each of them as a society analogous to the Order of Hermes, with a thumbnail sketch of a backstory and an ideal and a clear broad magical "style." This would probably involve threading some cultural needles in a way that is beyond my easy encompassing, but you could also do some fun stuff. For instance, you could make the Celestial Chorus organizationally/rhetorically Islamic (even if in fact it encompasses all fundamentally monotheistic magical/occult practices -- possibly including, for instance, vodou). You then have a sixth "Tradition ex Miscellanea" which would cover "all things that don't fit elsewhere," including schismatic Technocrats who have remained clumped together. Long term defecting Technocrats tend to actually join other groups, and I would personally drop the ~stemlord~ angle entirely -- doing a lot of gizmo crap tends to come naturally if you use a lot of Matter or Forces. The Technocracy probably does not need a lot of interior modification, although you might somewhat reconsider the flavoring of the NWO and the Void Engineers probably make more sense as a sub-category of other groups. If you want to cast them as having interior tensions it would seem pretty easy to say that Iteration X and the Progenitors have a lot of people who want to release cyber-implants and genome-drugs and instead keep getting put to work on blockchain and boner pills for ageing Sleepers. e: You should also use the Awakening sphere systems and don't feel like you're being cute by marrying a tradition to a particular sphere.
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Jun 26, 2019 21:30
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:Another question about Changeling: The Lost, is it possible to combine multiple personal Hollows into a shared Freehold? A few players have Hollows and the game is going to encourage cooperation so it's something I envision them encountering in the future. I think I'll encourage them to make an oath-forged token to create a kind of "foundation" to join the hollows together, and just have a handful of Hedgespinning roles to finagle moving these things through non-euclidean space.
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Jun 26, 2019 21:42
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There's even a merit for linikng trods to their hallows
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Jun 26, 2019 23:19
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Chernobyl Peace Prize posted:You could also have a session or two set around cleaning out the equivalent of a lovely Hedge single-story motel, and then the tokens let them turn the doors into portals back to their Hollows. Just the saddest god drat stopover in miserytown. Why would they need to go to New Jers- Oh! Yeah, that's a brilliant idea. Thanks!
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Jun 27, 2019 04:56
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alright yall i confronted him i think it went well
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Jun 28, 2019 05:01
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Dave Brookshaw posted:Scrap them and start over with something not based on 90s club cultures? It always bugged me that 1E Mage did that. 1E Vampire didn't give you the option of playing a vampire who aesthetically speaking has nothing in common with pop cultural or folkloric vampires, 1E werewolf didn't let you opt out of having shapeshifting powers and kinship with wolves. If 1E Mage had gone to press without the Hollow Ones, Sons of Ether or Virtual Adepts, nobody would be saying "Hang on, this game is woefully incomplete because it's missing out entire iconic archetypes of what we consider wizards to be!" because of the lack of goths, steampunk scientists, and Neuromancer-style hackers. (They might be saying it on account of the lack of other magical traditions, but the splats in question do nothing to fill those conceptual gaps.)
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Jun 28, 2019 14:30
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I feel like having "wizards" who aren't obviously "magic users" is important, though. I mean, if the Technocracy are going to still exist, why wouldn't the Traditions have technomages? I can agree with getting rid of the Hollow Ones and Verbena because they were never good ever, or the Dreamspeakers so they can be replaced with something way less problematic, but crossing out Akashics and Etherites means junking two of the best books in the entire line.
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Jun 28, 2019 15:13
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Rand Brittain posted:I feel like having "wizards" who aren't obviously "magic users" is important, though. I mean, if the Technocracy are going to still exist, why wouldn't the Traditions have technomages? - If the Technocracy is going to exist, they are the technomages already, by definition a "technomage" is propagating the exact thing the Traditions are opposing. - If you're doing a radical update of Ascension anyway, do you need the Technocracy? Does it make sense for them to be the antagonist faction when the major IRL antagonists out there include Moon Landing deniers, anti-vaxxers and Flat Earthers among their number? quote:I can agree with getting rid of the Hollow Ones and Verbena because they were never good ever, or the Dreamspeakers so they can be replaced with something way less problematic, but crossing out Akashics and Etherites means junking two of the best books in the entire line. Etherites, though? I'm not seeing what benefit there is to having them in a specifically Mage game when you could take the same effort and make a better and more interesting book when you don't weigh it down with the necessity of connecting to the rest of the Mage setting. A game about steampunk advocates of unfashionable cosmologies rebelling against modern science sounds fun to me! It also doesn't suggest "wizards". Warthur fucked around with this message at 16:15 on Jun 28, 2019 |
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Jun 28, 2019 16:05
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Periodic reminder The Technocracy were right, screw The Traditions. (Said light heartedly with best intentions)
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Jun 28, 2019 16:12
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Shockeh posted:Periodic reminder The Technocracy were right, screw The Traditions.
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Jun 28, 2019 16:14
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