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Helith posted:I've played a lot of Civ V and now that the steam sale is here I'm thinking about getting Civ VI, but I'm a bit conflicted. Just buy the whole thing and start playing. If you're that worried about it, the Gathering Storm stuff doesn't require you to learn/unlearn much, so it wouldn't mess you up to get it later.
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Jun 27, 2019 13:53
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Ragnar34 posted:I suggest clustering your cities as closely as you possibly can even if you plan to stop at five cities or whatever. The district adjacency bonuses alone make it worth the loss of space, which honestly isn't that important anyway. That said, some civs really want to go wide, and in that case I'd either settle lots of mediocre cities or just declare war and resign myself to shuffling troops around for hours. I suspect there's a space for Euro game like mechanics in video games. But no one credible is exploring it. They should, a Terra Mystica style game would sell a ton to this demographic in my opinion.
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Jun 27, 2019 14:00
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One of my big problems (among many) that keep me from high level play is trying to break the habit of expanding as physically wide as possible. I'm playing an emperor game now where I've shoved six cities in the space where I'd normally only have three and I'm doing so much better. Defending is easier and loyalty is easier to hold when I take the AIs cities since I have more cities closer to the targets. In older civs my cities would grow huge and I needed to shake the mindset of "what if I need to work every single tile with this city" because now cities don't generally grow that large.
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Jun 27, 2019 14:19
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That is my exact same problem
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Jun 27, 2019 17:21
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Agency bonus stacking also helps so much for stuff, so cities closer helps even more. Power plants too
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Jun 27, 2019 19:05
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Fhqwhgads posted:One of my big problems (among many) that keep me from high level play is trying to break the habit of expanding as physically wide as possible. I'm playing an emperor game now where I've shoved six cities in the space where I'd normally only have three and I'm doing so much better. Defending is easier and loyalty is easier to hold when I take the AIs cities since I have more cities closer to the targets. I'm considering getting the two big expansions and getting back into Civ6. However, my favourite style of play is the opposite of what you've described- I love having a weird empire of far-flung colonies set up on the best possible bit of land on each continent. Would it still be possible to play that way with a bit of investment, or would the new mechanics render it impossible?
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Jun 28, 2019 02:30
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Tree Bucket posted:I'm considering getting the two big expansions and getting back into Civ6. However, my favourite style of play is the opposite of what you've described- I love having a weird empire of far-flung colonies set up on the best possible bit of land on each continent. Would it still be possible to play that way with a bit of investment, or would the new mechanics render it impossible? It takes a lot of investment to hang on to an isolated city surrounded by enemy territory. It's technically doable but it's going to be difficult to do more than 1-2 at a time. It gets easier if you're willing to put up satellite cities, or prioritize grabbing remote islands/peninsulas even if the terrain is so-so.
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Jun 28, 2019 03:25
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Maybe give it a go with the Maori, as you can start settling across the ocean much earlier than other nations and get a better foothold all over the place.
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Jun 28, 2019 08:06
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Start up a huge TSL Earth map as the Maori with the Americas uninhabited for a huge empire and an easy win.
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Jun 28, 2019 10:02
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It can be a pain, but it's not as hard as the game makes it seem. If you have enough surplus amenities to push your smaller cities into the ecstatic range, that gives you +6 loyalty, and a governor gives +8. If you've founded a religion, converting a city is another +3. If you put down a monument and have a policy card that boosts loyalty, you can put a city literally anywhere, since that gives you +20 loyalty per turn and the maximum penalty from being near other cities is -20. This is a small investment beyond tying up a governor, and you can play some logistical hopscotch to keep several cities in the -20 ring with no loss of loyalty, as Amani and Victor can both give bonus loyalty to cities in range. Though when I am expanding cheekily, I try to settle near some marsh/food resources, harvest them to push the population to 4 or 5, which makes the city big enough to stay loyal when I need my floating governor for the next expansion.
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Jun 28, 2019 11:31
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Carthage can get 100% loyalty for coastal cities on one continent
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Jun 29, 2019 00:07
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hi civ friends I'm 6000 posts behind and still playing vanilla 6 but the steam sale is upon us and I want to upgrade. It won't let me buy the gold pack except as a gift though? What should I buy? I don't care about scenarios but I do want some expansions.
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Jun 29, 2019 15:28
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Care that Gold edition doesn't include the second big expansion,
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Jun 29, 2019 15:51
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Defenestration posted:hi civ friends I'm 6000 posts behind and still playing vanilla 6 but the steam sale is upon us and I want to upgrade. It won't let me buy the gold pack except as a gift though? I DO NOT OWN EITHER EXPANSION, so take this with a grain of salt, but my understanding is that it works like this: If you buy Rise & Fall, you'll get its mechanics, plus about ten civs. If you buy Gathering Storm, you'll get its mechanics plus all the R&F mechanics (but not the civs or scenarios from R&F). All the civ packs are according to individual choice. They all came out between the initial release and R&F, and they all use the base game's mechanics. And yeah, the Gold Pack is everything except for Gathering Storm, the latest part.
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Jun 29, 2019 16:00
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Gathering Storm gives you all the gameplay upgrades, but not the stuff from the other DLCs. Gold version gives you everything except Gathering Storm, which does contain 15 civs, 1 leader, 4 wonders, 6 city states and a bunch of natural wonders and scenarios you'd otherwise miss out on.
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Jun 29, 2019 16:05
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Are any of the civs or other things in Rise and Fall 'must-have'? E: Wow, that sucks, the Temple of Artemis, Statue of Liberty and St. Basil's are in it. Byzantine fucked around with this message at 16:26 on Jun 29, 2019 |
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Jun 29, 2019 16:24
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I've never seen a statue of liberty built I want to say there's really good civs in Rise? But might be thinking of dlc pack ones
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Jun 29, 2019 17:53
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I forgot that y'all had already posted about GS having the R&F mechanics built in and bought Rise and Fall last week when the sale started. Honestly it's fine and should be enough to keep me entertained for a while. I'll probably pick up GS in a later sale, hopefully it will be available at a better discount by then anyways. Re: R&F civs, I haven't played enough to really know them bit I know Mongolia is fuckin baller. It's like a better Scythia with all the bonuses to early cavalry.
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Jun 29, 2019 18:41
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If you like the base game then R&F and GS are both improvements over it, GS much more so. But for those wondering the R&F leader / civs are: Poundmaker / Cree - a fun civ, focuses on alliances and culture, probably the most fun of the RnF civs imo for friendly play Wilhemina / Dutch - if you really like making polders sure, otherwise skippable - they also get bonuses to building dams and flood barriers in GS Tamar / Georgia - widely regarded as the worst civ in the game Chandragupta / India - for if you really wanna roll people with elephants, but otherwise meh Seondeok / Korea - for triggering incels, but also a super powerful turtle/science civ if you're into that. One of the better AI opponents since they get big science no matter how bad their districts are. Lautrao / Mapuche - I've never played these guys, they have an anti-golden age mechanic? They are one of the more difficult AI opponents for that reason. Genghis Khan / Mongolia - The man. Has a cool mechanic for getting extra visiblity and therefore combat strength with trade routes leading to a "trade first, invade next" style that is fun to play. Robert the Bruce / Scotland - has a bonuses for happiness mechanic that makes him very powerful to go science/tall with if that's your thing. Shaka / Zulu - early corps and armies and free upgrades to them, an insane snowbally military civ, although they really hit their stride in medieval as opposed to early so play a bit different than your old school zulus. So yeah if any of that sounds worth the price of admission, get R&F.
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Jun 29, 2019 18:58
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Once you have R&F, shaka/zulus also get a loyalty bonus for having a unit garrisoned in a city, and an even greater one for having a corps/army garrisoned. They're insanely good, as you can use this for better forward settling early on.
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Jun 29, 2019 19:34
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After the June Update my game is crashing like crazy. It's really fuckin' frustrating  .
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Jun 30, 2019 04:31
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I think that post undersells Cree somewhat, they're arguably the best Civ from that set, or at least the one that's generally good at everything you need to succeed in Civ 6. Their UU is a super scout that doesn't die to a stiff breeze and starts with a free promotion so exploring your entire continent is completely trivial. They have one of, if not THE best unique improvement in the game in that it comes extremely early, provides production, gold, and, most importantly, +1 housing (upgraded to +2 absurdly early) and can be freely spammed throughout your empire since their build restrictions are hilariously generous. They get a trade route AND Trader for free within the first 10 turns of the game for no reason at all, save a ton of gold by claiming tiles for free with trade routes, and just for kicks trade routes will inevitably provide a ton of free food and gold because camp and pasture resources are everywhere. It's like every single bonus for Cree was designed to easily overcome every common bottleneck you would run into in this specific game with any other Civ.
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Jun 30, 2019 08:19
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Defenestration posted:hi civ friends I'm 6000 posts behind and still playing vanilla 6 but the steam sale is upon us and I want to upgrade. It won't let me buy the gold pack except as a gift though? Definitely get Gathering Storm, it's the best Civ VI you can get. Then wait for the Gold Edition to come on sale somewhere else than Steam, a Steam key for the Gold Edition will still work even if Steam won't let you buy it. Here's a handy link to keep check on the Gold Edition: https://isthereanydeal.com/search/?q=Sid+Meier%E2%80%99s+Civilization+VI%3A+Gold+Edition BTW, Mac and Win keys are interchangeable. It's all Steam, baby!
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Jun 30, 2019 13:11
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I'd like to come to Georgia's defense a bit, with the June Update, Tamar is actually pretty drat good at getting a diplomatic victory. Get a set of beliefs that will make you either good at theological combat or not care much about losses, and you can hang onto every city state in the world, even if you miss some things like the Apandana. If you make sure you get through the civic tree and get the Statue of Liberty, and with clever voting in the World Congress, you can pile up a good stock early and rush to the end a lot earlier than you used to. The ease of Diplomatic victories now can't be understated, even the AI can sneak one if you're not paying attention.
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Jul 1, 2019 09:00
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Georgia’s UAs of “infinits Golden Ages” and “twice as many envoys as standard civs if you invest in religion” have been there since the start and I’ve never quite got why they’re universally considered bottom tier.
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Jul 1, 2019 09:28
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Zulily Zoetrope posted:Georgia’s UAs of “infinits Golden Ages” and “twice as many envoys as standard civs if you invest in religion” have been there since the start and I’ve never quite got why they’re universally considered bottom tier. At higher difficulties most players see investing in religion as being for suckers, and alternating dark/heroic ages (which Georgia is bad at) is arguably better than chaining golden ages.
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Jul 1, 2019 13:37
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I'm incredulous of any city state strategy because there might be none near you. Let alone good ones. Korea is maybe the strongest civ. Mapuche are extremely dangerous in online games.
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Jul 1, 2019 13:43
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Super Jay Mann posted:I think that post undersells Cree somewhat, they're arguably the best Civ from that set, or at least the one that's generally good at everything you need to succeed in Civ 6. Their UU is a super scout that doesn't die to a stiff breeze and starts with a free promotion so exploring your entire continent is completely trivial. They have one of, if not THE best unique improvement in the game in that it comes extremely early, provides production, gold, and, most importantly, +1 housing (upgraded to +2 absurdly early) and can be freely spammed throughout your empire since their build restrictions are hilariously generous. They get a trade route AND Trader for free within the first 10 turns of the game for no reason at all, save a ton of gold by claiming tiles for free with trade routes, and just for kicks trade routes will inevitably provide a ton of free food and gold because camp and pasture resources are everywhere. Eh....Cree are mediocre. I will concede they are super fun, but they have no real bonuses that Directly help with a Science, Culture, Religion or Diplomacy victory and their generalist abilities aren't super buff compared to someone like the Inca especially. Yes they have a great unique improvement, but I would argue is worse than Terrace Farms except on very particular map setups, and the Cree's other abilities are mediocre and their UU isn't really super helpful in combat. Contrast the Cree with the Inca, who are similarly a generalist Civ, but the Terrace Farms+Ability to Work Mountains+Aqueduct adjacency can allow for truly massive hyper productive cities. Further, I find it incredibly hard to argue that Cree are anywhere close to the best in their expansion when both Korea and the Zulu exist. Korea's science is unparalleled, a Saewon in a city with a governor with mines/farms around it is absolutely ludicrous. Hell recently a streamer did a single city challenge on deity with Korea and won a science victory.......in Civ VI. Similarly, Shaka can be a late bloomer, but his military game is ferocious, You haven't lived until you've seen the sheer devastation an Impi wave can cause on a map. edit-link to the Single City Challenge Playlist with a Korean Science Victory here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLr_5Byhx_s8-NYAaeUqa2kBbY7xoEGh2m Madmarker fucked around with this message at 14:29 on Jul 1, 2019 |
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Jul 1, 2019 14:22
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I just finished a Korea Emperor game where once I got hwacha the game was effectively over. I was consistently ages ahead of everyone else but conquest is such a slog I just turtled my way to science.
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Jul 1, 2019 14:23
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What's the story behind seondeok triggering incels?
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Jul 1, 2019 16:25
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I don't know the specifics, but if I had to guess, it's a combination of South Korea's intense patriarchy and the fact a woman is leading Korea in this iteration.
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Jul 1, 2019 16:30
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Just tried 6 again with the mod that makes it look more like 5. I was having fun until once again a civ I'd been friendly with declared a war of expansion against me. I go hard with musketman armies and capture a couple of their cities before we declare peace. About ten turns after that every other civ in the game declares I'm a warmonger and keeps it up for the rest of the game even after I'm trading with them again etc. 
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Jul 1, 2019 17:00
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jojoinnit posted:Just tried 6 again with the mod that makes it look more like 5. I was having fun until once again a civ I'd been friendly with declared a war of expansion against me. I go hard with musketman armies and capture a couple of their cities before we declare peace. About ten turns after that every other civ in the game declares I'm a warmonger and keeps it up for the rest of the game even after I'm trading with them again etc. I really do love the look of V over VI. I think things are easier to see and more visually distinct, which is ironic because that's what the change in artstyle was supposed to alleviate. Biggest issue for me with VI is that the fog of war is just a different shade of tan than the actual map itself, making it a bit harder to discern if I'm looking at the past or present. I also really liked Civ V's interface, not sure how others felt about it though. I felt like it had everything I needed to see and I didn't have to question where it might be hidden. I'd love a game that carries all or most of Civ VI's gameplay systems, the look and feel of Civ V, and the military makeup and AI capabilities of Civ IV. At the very least design a system the AI can play reasonably well, instead of designing a system and then trying to make the AI competent with it after the fact.
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Jul 1, 2019 17:05
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Straight White Shark posted:At higher difficulties most players see investing in religion as being for suckers, and alternating dark/heroic ages (which Georgia is bad at) is arguably better than chaining golden ages. Not to mention that on Deity there simply won't be more than a few city states for her bonuses to work on by the time you have them up and running, and they probably won't last. Even the worst civ is one you can win with and have fun if they suit your playstyle, worst in the game doesn't mean unplayably bad, just not as good as the rest. Madmarker posted:Eh....Cree are mediocre. Yup, generalists in Civ6 tend not to shine. It's better to be really good at one thing and crap at the rest than generally pretty good at everything - if you approach the game from a numbers and winning perspective. If you just like roleplaying/simcivving it however, Cree are great, that's why I call them fun, not necessarily good. And now I want to go play as them. Soylent Pudding posted:What's the story behind seondeok triggering incels? Why it bothered them so much I can't really say beyond the fact that she's a woman, but a ton of them got super triggered when she was announced as the Korea leader. jojoinnit posted:Just tried 6 again with the mod that makes it look more like 5. I was having fun until once again a civ I'd been friendly with declared a war of expansion against me. I go hard with musketman armies and capture a couple of their cities before we declare peace. About ten turns after that every other civ in the game declares I'm a warmonger and keeps it up for the rest of the game even after I'm trading with them again etc. Was this vanilla? The grievances system has thankfully toned this down quite a lot. You'll still get a few cycles of being denounced if you take out another civ but it goes away much faster now.
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Jul 1, 2019 18:25
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SlothBear posted:
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Jul 1, 2019 18:32
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SlothBear posted:Yup, generalists in Civ6 tend not to shine. It's better to be really good at one thing and crap at the rest than generally pretty good at everything - if you approach the game from a numbers and winning perspective. If you just like roleplaying/simcivving it however, Cree are great, that's why I call them fun, not necessarily good. And now I want to go play as them. Oh I did concede at the beginning of my post that the Cree are fun for a reason. It is really satisfying to see traders snatching new tiles early into your cities, and lining up the trader to grab like 4 tiles since it is going between 2 of your cities is super nifty. I like the Cree, I am glad they exist in the game............I just wish they were good as well.
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Jul 1, 2019 18:57
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It's interesting that generalists aren't great in 6 because one of my big beefs with the system is that no resource can make up for another. Meaning that specializing in culture or faith can be really underwhelming when it's science and production that keeps you alive.
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Jul 1, 2019 19:03
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DTaeKim posted:I don't know the specifics, but if I had to guess, it's a combination of South Korea's intense patriarchy and the fact a woman is leading Korea in this iteration. It's this. Grogs rage at just about every female leader, but South Korea is even worse than normal because at least in modern times Korean culture is extremely sexist. You know how glowingly Civ5 talks about Korea's leader in that game and how it was a golden age for Korea? It was a supremely terrible time to be a Korean woman. As for 6 in general... I dunno. It didn't click with me like 5 or Beyond Earth did, and none of the features added in any of the expansions or DLC sound compelling to me. I beat the game twice, once a science victory with France and once a military victory with Egypt, then uninstalled and never played again.
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Jul 1, 2019 19:19
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SHY NUDIST GRRL posted:It's interesting that generalists aren't great in 6 because one of my big beefs with the system is that no resource can make up for another. Meaning that specializing in culture or faith can be really underwhelming when it's science and production that keeps you alive. Underwhelming in the sense of bad or unfun? Against humans.....yeah it is not the best way to win However, if against the AI (at Deity), I contest that going for culture is just as easy if not easier than even science. Honestly if you are good at handling the AI diplomacy screen, its pretty easy to handle most opponents. Just keep them happy, trade with them, send trade routes, Declare and keep friendships as long as possible, make alliances and don't declare war. 9/10 times the AI will just passively sit there and let you dominate them culturally. Besides, even if the AI is going to war with you, if you are doing a culture victory you should have the highest level walls in all of your cities, making it incredibly hard for the AI to do anything but kill themselves on your defenses.
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Jul 1, 2019 20:09
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SlothBear posted:Why it bothered them so much I can't really say beyond the fact that she's a woman, but a ton of them got super triggered when she was announced as the Korea leader. A large part of this was also Seondeok's original model, which resembled a gneeric Asian woman and not a K-pop idol
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Jul 1, 2019 20:10
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