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It's less a trap and more it does what it says on the tin, it also doesn't protect machinery spaces and hits there can really be bad news. However it has different uses for different types of ships. If you're using it for BB's you should be armoring enough that the halved protection everywhere else is equal to what you were going to stick on them anyway (i.e. 2x your planned armor so the normal space have decent protection.) This way it's really an *increase* in tonnage in exchange for making your magazines basically invincible (no more random explosive deaths). For other things like CL/CLAA etc it's a way to skimp on armor if you don't expect them to face a lot of direct fire. http://nws-online.proboards.com/thread/3027/magazine-box-aon quote:Okay so I just lost a 70000 Ton Battleship with magazine box to a single 5" hit that caused such extreme flooding that the whole boat sank. I'm not doing this anymore on anything that cost me money. 
Saros fucked around with this message at 13:51 on Jul 2, 2019 |
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Jul 2, 2019 12:59
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Historically, box protection was only used in situations where armor wasn’t a priority. I wouldn’t use it on a BB unless I felt like I really had to.
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Jul 2, 2019 14:17
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Any advice for playing the Soviets in 1920? Looks like I start with some comically lovely pre-dreads accounting for the majority of my tonnage which I'm probably going to mothball or scrap almost immediately, particularly since I have a bunch of BBs already under construction. Everybody except the Germans seems to outgun me massively, although they also all have much more territory to cover. I'm running an enormous deficit from turn 1 so that's fun.
Mister Bates fucked around with this message at 04:50 on Jul 3, 2019 |
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Jul 3, 2019 04:47
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Obfuscation posted:How much of a trap is box protection on BBs or other ships where armor actually matters? It cuts a lot of weight, and I'm worried that it makes you that much more vulnerable to random flotation hits. I've never used it on straight up BBs, but I used it on some small BCs and it wasn't bad. Instead of armoring them normally and then checking magazine box to save weight the way I would on light cruisers, I spent about the same weight on armor as I would have without magazine box. My logic was that magazine box lets you get immunity zones on ships that otherwise wouldn't have them at the cost of less armor outside the magazine box, but without the weight savings I wouldn't have been able to meaningfully armor those parts of the ship anyway (and I had 4"+ deck and belt so they were at least splinter proof).
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Jul 3, 2019 06:33
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Mister Bates posted:Any advice for playing the Soviets in 1920? Looks like I start with some comically lovely pre-dreads accounting for the majority of my tonnage which I'm probably going to mothball or scrap almost immediately, particularly since I have a bunch of BBs already under construction. Everybody except the Germans seems to outgun me massively, although they also all have much more territory to cover. I'm running an enormous deficit from turn 1 so that's fun. Mothball and reserve everything.
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Jul 3, 2019 07:15
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Feels like late game the AI spends so much on planes they can't afford any boats.
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Jul 3, 2019 21:42
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OddObserver posted:Feels like late game the AI spends so much on planes they can't afford any boats. Yeah but then the game spawns any battle where you don't have a carrier and if you don't immediately turn around and run for the nearest port you get sunk by three hundred land-based torpedo bombers.
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Jul 3, 2019 23:03
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Is there any way to tell my ships to stop pumping torpedoes into the burning, immobile heavy cruiser that hasn't fired a shot in like ten minutes?
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Jul 4, 2019 16:01
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Mister Bates posted:Is there any way to tell my ships to stop pumping torpedoes into the burning, immobile heavy cruiser that hasn't fired a shot in like ten minutes? right click on the offending divisions flag on the map - one of the buttons on the right of the div info window should be a torpedo hold fire toggle on an unrelated matter: late 40s and onwards mass carrier battles are insane! two back to back battles with Germany as the USSR and 2/3 of Germany's capital ships are sunk almost entirely by dive and torpedo bombers with hundreds of air losses on each side. 1600lb AP bombs are no joke - I've detonated more than one BC/CV from magazine penetrations. TehKeen fucked around with this message at 18:09 on Jul 4, 2019 |
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Jul 4, 2019 18:03
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how far away should you be before re-enabling torpedos though
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Jul 4, 2019 18:05
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There's nothing quite like the feeling you get when the war's nearly won, you've sunk almost the entire German navy, and all they're able to field in what will be one of the last engagements of the war is a light cruiser and a destroyer...which proceed to blitz into the middle of your formation and put three torpedoes into your prize battleship, sinking her immediately.
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Jul 4, 2019 22:54
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Nothing like the feeling when you're up by 40,000 VP and the US or UK enters the war against you.
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Jul 4, 2019 23:01
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Arglebargle III posted:Nothing like the feeling when you're up by 40,000 VP as the US and Japan and the UK enter the war as your allies. Fixed for my last run (Russia got desperate with their subs and sank one too many liners)
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Jul 5, 2019 01:04
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Are CLs supposed to be expendable deathtraps or am I doing something wrong with them? The game's battle gen really likes to throw my light cruisers alone into heavy fleet engagements with enemy BBs and BCs, and the CL's torps can theoretically wreck poo poo, but their survivability against those heavy hitters is extremely low without any CA or BC support. How do I keep them from exploding by the dozen in every battle?
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Jul 5, 2019 01:42
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Mister Bates posted:Are CLs supposed to be expendable deathtraps or am I doing something wrong with them? The game's battle gen really likes to throw my light cruisers alone into heavy fleet engagements with enemy BBs and BCs, and the CL's torps can theoretically wreck poo poo, but their survivability against those heavy hitters is extremely low without any CA or BC support. I mean...don't engage capital ships with light ships, is a good general plan. Always try to make sure your CLs are fast enough to escape anything they don't clearly outgun, and use them only as screens or independent in big battles. They aren't meant to be hit by heavy caliber shell fire. I was about halfway through writing this before I remembered I'd already written it. This is my approach with CLs: bewbies posted:CLs:
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Jul 5, 2019 01:45
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Don't be afraid to keep going beyond 30 knots. 33 knots isn't a bad speed for a late game light cruiser. They really need to be able to run away from late game fast ships. Fun fact, the Royal Navy's first 35 knot heavy cruiser class suffered bow collapses at top speed and had to be rebuilt to withstand the force of their own movement through the water.
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Jul 5, 2019 02:16
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lmao From undamaged to dead in one turn. This particular BC design has been wrecking poo poo against the Germans, but there's really not much you can do when the destroyers get lucky. Got ambushed at night in the loving fog. Mister Bates fucked around with this message at 02:46 on Jul 5, 2019 |
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Jul 5, 2019 02:38
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Finally got my key a few days ago and so far this game has been fun. Hoping someone can roll out an Ottoman Empire mod at some point, playing them and slapping Austria and Italy for paltry gains in the Med is always a fun fight.
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Jul 6, 2019 21:44
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Ottoman aircraft carriers would be great and I hope somebody does that sooner rather than later. I'd also love to see some Southern Hemisphere powers, even if we have to get pretty alt-hist about it, like a resurgent Empire of Brazil or a Zulu empire that successfully booted the British out of South Africa. Independent India immediately after a successful nationalist revolt would be pretty rad too.
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Jul 7, 2019 03:30
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1920 Japan Game has been fun. Have to feel sorry for the Soviets after the 3rd surprise attack on Vladivostok to start the next war. Though in the 3rd and last one one of my brand new destroyers torpedoed TWO of my brand new shiny heavy cruisers at point blank range and sank them both 
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Jul 7, 2019 12:46
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if broadsides were good enough for 1702 they're good enough for 1902
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Jul 7, 2019 22:06
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Mister Bates posted:if broadsides were good enough for 1702 they're good enough for 1902 Does this... work?
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Jul 7, 2019 22:23
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Gort posted:Does this... work? It works in the sense that it's a valid design that the game allows me to build. It also technically enormously outguns anything else any other navy is building, and has enough armor to at least hold its own against other pre-dreads. It's one knot faster than any pre-dread any of the other navies are building, too. Remains to be seen how it actually stacks up in a real fight, though. I figure at knife-fight range its powerful broadside will allow it to knock enemy Bs and CAs out quickly, and its large tertiary armament will help deter DDs, but at range it will probably suffer to ships with better primary armament. It will also be obsolete almost immediately.
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Jul 7, 2019 22:38
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And plenty of ammo for the 12" guns. Let's have a trip report when one of those gets into a fight.
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Jul 7, 2019 23:02
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Some early French aircraft pics for you: Very early biplane indeed.  Your engineers were so busy asking whether or not they could, they didn't stop to ask if they should.  Mais pour quoi François?  Where we're going, we won't need eyes to land...  This one is a low cantilevered-wing monocoque monoplane that was wildly ahead of its time in 1911. Unfortunately it could not achieve flight.  This was an attempt to solve the Allied deficiency in machine gun timing gear in WW I. You may want to look closely to discern its drawbacks.  Modern fighter entered development in 1935, was delayed by problems for so long that the lone production plane manufactured never made it to French service.  Nothing wrong with this heavy fighter, it was just scheduled to enter service in 1941.  Ditto for this fighter. Arglebargle III fucked around with this message at 02:27 on Jul 8, 2019 |
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Jul 8, 2019 02:19
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Mister Bates posted:It works in the sense that it's a valid design that the game allows me to build. It also technically enormously outguns anything else any other navy is building, and has enough armor to at least hold its own against other pre-dreads. It's one knot faster than any pre-dread any of the other navies are building, too. 4 inch armor on 11 inch turrets sounds exciting.
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Jul 8, 2019 02:42
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 An actual cool French design for a naval fighter from the 1940s.
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Jul 8, 2019 03:17
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Mister Bates posted:if broadsides were good enough for 1702 they're good enough for 1902 At this point why not casemate secondaries?
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Jul 8, 2019 03:50
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Great blurb:  hush-kit posted:Blackburn ‘Twin Blackburn’ or ‘TB'  hush-kit posted:Blackburn Firebrand "stability issues in all axes" is not a phrase you want to see Arglebargle III fucked around with this message at 04:04 on Jul 8, 2019 |
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Jul 8, 2019 03:55
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Arglebargle III posted:
Is that an intake there behind the cockpit? Is this one of those bizarro mixed power designs?
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Jul 8, 2019 04:11
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Early German medium bomber: hush-kit posted:Siemens-Schuckert Forssman "Großernutzloser Ladenhüter"  hush-kit posted:Siemens-Schuckert, who were nothing if not persistent, mended the wings of the aircraft and fitted another new nose. Now desperate to get something – anything – for their hopeless machine, Dr Reichel the technical director of Siemens-Schuckert persuaded the Army to lower the specification the aircraft was required to achieve before they would buy it in return for a reduction in the purchase price. The new specification required the aircraft to reach 2000 meters in 30 minutes carrying a useful load of 1000 kg and enough fuel for 4 hours. Meanwhile he offered Bruno Steffen, himself a successful aircraft designer, 10% of the sale price if he could make the acceptance flight which was scheduled for October. Despite warnings from friends regarding the structural safety of the aircraft, Bruno decided after inspecting factory drawings and the aircraft itself that it was strong enough. However he was concerned that he would lack the strength necessary to operate the massive tail surfaces. On the day of the flight Steffen invited five passengers to accompany him, including members of the Army acceptance commission but all politely declined.
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Jul 8, 2019 04:20
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Mister Bates posted:if broadsides were good enough for 1702 they're good enough for 1902 That thing is going to blow up the second anything hit those 4 inches of secondary turret armor. I bet the explosion will be gigantic though.
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Jul 8, 2019 07:49
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That ship is for players who feel that the early game does not have enough decisive battles. Win or lose, some boats will not be making it back to port. I would bet this is an amazing ship to have when you outnumber them, but then I wonder if it becomes a liability in every other scenario. No secondary director means those guns won't actually be hitting often, even by pre-dreadnought standards, so you now have a big expensive ship that could potentially be lost immediately up against a smaller cruiser.
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Jul 8, 2019 16:30
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I'm about to throw it into a battleship engagement, so we'll see how it goes! Even if it blows up, it should be funny.Pirate Radar posted:At this point why not casemate secondaries? Can't believe I didn't think of that! If I try this again I'm going to put them in casemates and use the weight saving to add more secondary armor. Can you put primary armament in casemates? Mister Bates fucked around with this message at 03:42 on Jul 9, 2019 |
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Jul 9, 2019 03:39
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You can, I saw someone do it in one of these threads. I can't remember the trick to it though
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Jul 9, 2019 09:25
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You can. Only works for some turret positions; you just set the number of guns/turret to 0.
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Jul 9, 2019 09:26
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I was hoping to be able to post a trip report but unfortunately the Austro-Hungarians are utterly unwilling to actually engage - even in the battles they're not declining they just immediately turn tail and run for port.
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Jul 10, 2019 02:45
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This was an easy choice
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Jul 10, 2019 03:07
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Just got this and am having to s of fun but could use some explanation of the absolute basics. -What is worth including in a real refit of your older ships? I’ve figured out that upgrading firing control is worth it but other then that what’s worth it? -is there an online guide to historical ship designs that I can use as a guide? Right now I’m just clicking the auto design function and messing around with what the game gives me. Plus any other tips for a complete novice to the series would be appreciated!
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Jul 11, 2019 19:58
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AA guns are super worth it when they become available. Once CVs start showing up, any ship bigger than a DD needs AA or you may as well scrap it. It's cheap and quick to add. Ships become obsolete after 10 years, but rebuilding resets this timer. Even if you don't add anything, the rebuild will still upgrade things that are not represented on the design screen (I think? The manual could use some work). Obsolete ships cost more in maintenance and probably have other issues that aren't documented anywhere. In some cases it might be worth it to upgrade your gun quality. There is a significant difference between -1 and +1 quality, the most obvious being the maximum range. Once high angle guns become available, it's "free" to apply to older ships, and in doing so it greatly increases your range and hits deck armor much more effectively. That also means your older ships with 1.5" deck armor are going to have a really hard time. You can think about clicking that "add more deck armor" button. IMO that's not worth it, it's a mothball or a scrap for me, but there are probably some situations it's a good idea. Usually my ships can't take the extra weight without a machinery upgrade, and that is extremely expensive by itself, so I've never done it. For inspiration, I use Wikipedia (most of the relevant stats are on there!) and I lurk on the official discord. There's a ship design channel on there that gets a decent amount of activity so you can at least see what other people are doing. I've only been playing a few weeks but the game has hooked me, too. The main thing I wish this game had that it currently doesn't would be simulations of other wars happening between other countries and maybe some indication about what is happening on land other than those random messages sometimes about front lines moving.
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Jul 11, 2019 23:25
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