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I still don’t understand the component complaints. If you’re talking graphic design, sure that may be valid even though I can appreciate both lavish and spartan designs. But the wooden pieces and cardboard? They’re standard thickness and materials. Most euros have even flimsier boxes and really thin cards. If you’re saying they should be dual layered boards for the price, sure that’s possible, but then again, look at manufacturing methods. Hollandspiele is close in business model. 18xx can be some guy in a garage making things over the weekend. Hollandspiele costs $50 for a paper map and a handful of tokens. Zero wood. More of the money probably goes towards art production. But I would expect a similar price point if they were to make something like TGZ, if not more.
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Jul 9, 2019 18:30
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Mayveena posted:I'm not posting this to Trade Games, I didn't even know it was going there.
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Jul 9, 2019 18:30
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Is there a recommendation for babby's first heavy Euro trading game? It's a genre I don't play much and would like to dive in to more.
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Jul 9, 2019 18:38
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"What Splotter should do as obvious smart and correct business practice" posts always end up looking a lot like personal wish lists in an overcoat and fake beard.
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Jul 9, 2019 18:45
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Funzo posted:Is there a recommendation for babby's first heavy Euro trading game? It's a genre I don't play much and would like to dive in to more. Do you mean resource conversion games? Or real time trading? For real time, sidereal confluence just got reprinted. For resource conversion, a feast for Odin or Gaia project.
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Jul 9, 2019 18:54
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1830 op
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Jul 9, 2019 19:06
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Chill la Chill posted:I still don’t understand the component complaints. If you’re talking graphic design, sure that may be valid even though I can appreciate both lavish and spartan designs. But the wooden pieces and cardboard? They’re standard thickness and materials. Most euros have even flimsier boxes and really thin cards. If you’re saying they should be dual layered boards for the price, sure that’s possible, but then again, look at manufacturing methods. Hollandspiele is close in business model. 18xx can be some guy in a garage making things over the weekend. Hollandspiele costs $50 for a paper map and a handful of tokens. Zero wood. More of the money probably goes towards art production. But I would expect a similar price point if they were to make something like TGZ, if not more. I just went to my FLGS website to check prices and indeed the two Splotter games I checked (Indonesia, FCM) cost approximately twice as much as the two COIN games I checked (Cuba Libre, Falling Sky). Am I very much off base, or aren't the number and types of components pretty comparable for those games? Some wood, some cardboard, some cards, a board. FCM seems to have a bit less wood, but whatever. I'm not comparing to something big like Root or Gloomhaven with all their economies of scale. Just other niche game publishers.
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Jul 9, 2019 19:07
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Funzo posted:Is there a recommendation for babby's first heavy Euro trading game? It's a genre I don't play much and would like to dive in to more. Like the the trading mechanic specifically? There aren't really many heavier trading Euro games as the mechanic is generally better implemented with little overhead. The best meatier one is Sidereal Confluence. Bohnanza and Chinatown are great but on the lighter side. A lot of people like Genoa which is mediumish.
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Jul 9, 2019 19:08
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Kerro posted:Also played the first ever 'game' with my two year old daughter, Loopin Louie. She couldn't quite grasp the game part of needing to protect the chickens (when I told her that this was the aim, she took them all out of the coops and kept them in a pile in front of her so they couldn't get knocked down), but she quickly got the hang of using the lever arm to knock the plane around and was laughing her head off. Looking forward to being able to introduce more games as she gets a little older as she's only recently turned two. I recommend Animal Upon Animal as a good next game if you don't have it yet. It's fun enough to stack up the animals without bothering with the rules (or just make up your own) and it'll hold up to years of punishment. On that same subject, I picked up My First Castle Panic and it's actually quite good as an intro to co-op games. They boiled the rules down to a handful of concepts and it plays tightly and quickly. Other than the player aids and rule sheet, there's no text on the game components, just symbols. My 5 year old had no problem understanding how everything works and I think he would have been fine playing it a year ago. I think it works well as a bridge to more complex coop games likes Ghost Fightin Treasure Hunters. Over the weekend we tried Potion Explosion for the first time and he was able to grasp the rules for that pretty quickly as well. The marble dispenser in that game is really clever (just needed some superglue to hold it together) and I like that I can play it with my kids, take it to game night to play with my friends, or take it back home to play with my family who aren't as big on games. It's got a universal appeal and is easy to learn and teach.
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Jul 9, 2019 19:12
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I don't care what Splotter does re: business practices or whatever, when it comes to printing small runs and stuff that's their business choice to make. But as a consumer of their product, I react to their visual design the same way I do to, say, anything that's done by the person who does the art for Munchkin. Except Munchkin costs, what, 20 bucks? It's not even just opinion about aesthetics - Antiquity's blurry-rear end resources make it hard to know what's going on at a glance. My friend purchased colored tiles with pictures on them for his copy, and I can't imagine playing without those and having to squint at individual pieces of monotone-colored cardboard on my board to figure out what was what. And oh god having to pick up six or seven of them up at a time would be a nightmare, picking up think cardboard resources off of thin cardboard pollution tiles off of thin cardboard deforested tiles off of a cardboard map. Incidentally, after playing something like half a dozen games of it last weekend, I wouldn't mind if Spirit Island replaced their explorer tokens with something new as well. The chunky towns and cities are nice, but the explorers are spindly as hell and I feel like I'm going to break something on them every time I reach for a few.
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Jul 9, 2019 19:12
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Jimbozig posted:I just went to my FLGS website to check prices and indeed the two Splotter games I checked (Indonesia, FCM) cost approximately twice as much as the two COIN games I checked (Cuba Libre, Falling Sky). Am I very much off base, or aren't the number and types of components pretty comparable for those games? Some wood, some cardboard, some cards, a board. FCM seems to have a bit less wood, but whatever. GMT isn’t that niche. Look at MMP, Compass, or Hollandspiele if you want a similar niche. GMT also doesn’t produce things locally. Otherwise, those splotter titles will have a ton more wood than most GMT games. GMT is mostly counters and cards. I’m with CD, though. I’ll dunk on Indonesia's decisions even though their fix is fine. I like the map more than most, though. It’s but for usability and probably thematically but I like it aesthetically. Chill la Chill fucked around with this message at 19:45 on Jul 9, 2019 |
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Jul 9, 2019 19:13
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Morpheus posted:It's not even just opinion about aesthetics - Antiquity's blurry-rear end resources make it hard to know what's going on at a glance. My friend purchased colored tiles with pictures on them for his copy, and I can't imagine playing without those and having to squint at individual pieces of monotone-colored cardboard on my board to figure out what was what. And oh god having to pick up six or seven of them up at a time would be a nightmare, picking up think cardboard resources off of thin cardboard pollution tiles off of thin cardboard deforested tiles off of a cardboard map. I bought those tiles too, and honestly when after shipping and duty and stuff I realized I had easily spent the cost of a new game (like 60-70 CAD) just on those tiles I felt sort of... drained. Those tiles are 38 USD, not including shipping. Welcome to a specialty item of a niche of a niche, I guess.
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Jul 9, 2019 19:28
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Morpheus posted:Incidentally, after playing something like half a dozen games of it last weekend, I wouldn't mind if Spirit Island replaced their explorer tokens with something new as well. The chunky towns and cities are nice, but the explorers are spindly as hell and I feel like I'm going to break something on them every time I reach for a few. I hate them too but I think they're purposefully annoying for themeatic reasons The Eyes Have It posted:I bought those tiles too, and honestly when after shipping and duty and stuff I realized I had easily spent the cost of a new game (like 60-70 CAD) just on those tiles I felt sort of... drained. I just got them two weeks ago and feel the opposite, they made a game I really love much better looking and easier to play and that's worth it twice over to me. But I'm in the phase of trying to keep a relatively lean collection and really make them as nice as possible (just got the same kind of tiles for Keyflower tools and wheat meeples for that too). Same with the wooden money chips I just got for FCM (I hate the look of poker chips tbh). Bottom Liner fucked around with this message at 19:31 on Jul 9, 2019 |
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Jul 9, 2019 19:28
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Does anyone have tips for being good at concordia? Girlfriend kicked my rear end, but we both really enjoyed the game (we played 2p on ionium without salt or forum tiles) It was both of our first times playing, and think I undervalued how good specialists can be, so I got eaten by monster turns where she had like 50 gold while most of my money was coming from market actions to sell a couple wine or a couple silk. Any big picture or little picture tips would be appreciated. Also, if we are agonizing over all our decisions, how much will the addition of salt and forum tiles add to that?
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Jul 9, 2019 19:33
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I used to use tweezers for antiquity. Truth be told I’ll miss them since I got the plastic tiles but I can use my tweezers for OCS games now.
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Jul 9, 2019 19:36
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Funzo posted:Is there a recommendation for babby's first heavy Euro trading game? It's a genre I don't play much and would like to dive in to more. Archipelago.
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Jul 9, 2019 19:43
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horrible accident! posted:Does anyone have tips for being good at concordia? Girlfriend kicked my rear end, but we both really enjoyed the game (we played 2p on ionium without salt or forum tiles) It was both of our first times playing, and think I undervalued how good specialists can be, so I got eaten by monster turns where she had like 50 gold while most of my money was coming from market actions to sell a couple wine or a couple silk. Any big picture or little picture tips would be appreciated. Also, if we are agonizing over all our decisions, how much will the addition of salt and forum tiles add to that? Doing a lot of stuff on the board is meaningless if you don't get the cards to multiply the score. Late game should almost always devolve into a card rush so you should try to build up throughout. It will make you more efficient and put you ahead in that race.
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Jul 9, 2019 19:46
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homullus posted:Archipelago. Archipelago is one of those games that I friggin love, except that the exploration action absolutely sucks balls. Being told that you have a chance of straight-up losing a turn is terrible, and I'm always looking for house rules to make it better.
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Jul 9, 2019 19:50
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Chill la Chill posted:I still don’t understand the component complaints. If you’re talking graphic design, sure that may be valid even though I can appreciate both lavish and spartan designs. But the wooden pieces and cardboard? They’re standard thickness and materials. Most euros have even flimsier boxes and really thin cards. If you’re saying they should be dual layered boards for the price, sure that’s possible, but then again, look at manufacturing methods. Hollandspiele is close in business model. 18xx can be some guy in a garage making things over the weekend. Hollandspiele costs $50 for a paper map and a handful of tokens. Zero wood. More of the money probably goes towards art production. But I would expect a similar price point if they were to make something like TGZ, if not more. It's all about scale. Hollandspiele games rarely have more than a single counter sheet. Splotter games have more components than the average Euro so even if they're technically "average" from a quality standpoint, asking me to place thin tokens on a crowded map to symbolize shipping payment (which I'm only doing as an abstract representation because there's no better way of handling it) and do this ten more times in the game is asking a lot. Something I think Cole Wehrle and Phil Eklund learned immediately after PaxPam is the limitations of using components to abstractly represent certain board states. It's probably why PaxRen streamlined the map and uses distinct pieces for its units. You can compare Splotter to the average non-GMT wargame but no way in hell am I going to tell you a paper map with a thousand chits stacked is acceptable for anything even close to mainstream.
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Jul 9, 2019 19:50
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More people should play OCS, actually 
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Jul 9, 2019 19:58
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Morpheus posted:Archipelago is one of those games that I friggin love, except that the exploration action absolutely sucks balls. Being told that you have a chance of straight-up losing a turn is terrible, and I'm always looking for house rules to make it better. I am not an expert on the game, but my experience is that you shouldn't explore more than one or two tiles in the beginning, and should consider it later when you have more actions. Exploration has the promise of free resources and nice exploration tokens, but you're better off piggybacking on the exploration of others and building up the tiles that are out.
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Jul 9, 2019 20:15
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Mr. Squishy posted:Have those Cthulhu figs been given a wash or am I just losing my mind. They look different from the copy I've played. Yeah as someone else mentioned it's just an ink wash over zenithal priming. I'm way too lazy to do serious painting on that many minis. Shadow225 posted:I'll be a voice of dissent and say that it fell a bit flat for me. Game end condition is either player elimination, or place the highest piece like 5 times once a specific card comes out. It is surprisingly difficult to build vertically in the game due to the rules for placement and the lack of ways to build diagonally. If you look at all of the pitures posted here, you either have flat structures, or flat structures with a piece propped up on a crane. The end result is waiting until every other player makes mistakes, which makes the game drag much longer than it should. Yeah, the 'place a highest piece' goal is often just completely unachievable - if the highest piece is currently a worker and you're placing a girder, it's likely impossible to place that girder on top of the worker, or somewhere else on the structure that is higher. Our games did all come down to last person standing - however, we still got through a game in about 20 minutes (and came close to running out of pieces so it wasn't just that we were knocking things over a lot) so I never felt that the game dragged because of it. There's also a more 'gamey' variant that I'd probably play with if you wanted to make the alternate win condition more viable which is where you are able to keep a number of cards at the start of the game and use them instead of the card you drew on your turn, giving you greater flexibility about what you are placing. I've never played any stacking/dexterity games like this since pick-up-sticks as a child so have literally zero basis for comparison, but we had a lot of fun with Men at Work Chubbs posted:I recommend Animal Upon Animal as a good next game if you don't have it yet. It's fun enough to stack up the animals without bothering with the rules (or just make up your own) and it'll hold up to years of punishment. I was considering getting the toddler version of Animal Upon Animal but it's damned expensive for an ultra-basic kids game so I might hold off until she's old enough to play the original version. She already enjoys stacking things, so I don't think it'll be long before she has the co-ordination for the smaller pieces. When we were playing Loopin Louie after she got bored with the plane, she spent some time stacking her small plastic dinosaurs and spiders on the plane or on the catapult and then flinging them into the air. Morpheus posted:Archipelago is one of those games that I friggin love, except that the exploration action absolutely sucks balls. Being told that you have a chance of straight-up losing a turn is terrible, and I'm always looking for house rules to make it better. Yeah we played a lot of Archipelago but in the end with experienced players we found the swinginess of the exploration action combined with the swinginess of how important first player becomes made it feel really chaotic and uncontrollable at times. The first player was honestly the bigger culprit for us - depending on the crisis that came out it could make the difference between having a completely unimpeded turn or being able to do next to nothing, depending on the number of goods in the market, behind player screens and how much each good was worth in terms of re-activating workers. Yes, there are lots of mitigating factors and ways to prevent not being able to use your workers, and of course if it's important you can prioritise becoming first player, but we ended up with too many games where a player who was already in a weaker position due to failing an explore early on then ended up screwed by the crisis due to not having the resources to activate their workers or the money to bid for order (due in part to the failed explore) that led to some pretty unfun situations. It's a shame because I really like pretty much everything else about the game, but even with trying out various kinds of tweaks and houserules we just couldn't find a satisfactory way to get around those issues.
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Jul 9, 2019 20:52
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By the way, is Pictomania 2nd ed worth getting if I just wanted more cards for the base game, or is there a lot of overlap of words between the versions? We've played so many times that certain words have started developing a meta around how people draw them.
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Jul 9, 2019 20:53
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One thing I just remembered: the food chain magnate expansion is at full price. You can get roads and boats with expansion for the same price when they’re both released this year. Wtf Oh wait never mind, the price it’s preordering for is the same price I’ve seen for antiquity and Indonesia from the same online sites. So R&B is still a bit more but it’s the same price as other base splotter games. Chill la Chill fucked around with this message at 22:05 on Jul 9, 2019 |
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Jul 9, 2019 22:00
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It sounds like Ketchup Mechanism is practically a whole game's worth of new features though so I can overlook it. Certainly not as egregious as 1817 having to intentionally restrict itself by rules because getting the full components practically doubles the cost of the game. Speaking of 1817 I had a wild run on that one. I think the game gets a bit too silly in the end because if the 5s are out at the end of OR2 but haven't been bought yet then the next stock round is guaranteed every company gets shorted into the dirt. Everybody made the mistake of shorting my newly merged 10 share company with 3 loans on it because they thought I would use my cash on hand to close two shorts that had already cost me almost twice what I received for them. But then they made the mistake of shorting that company which would result in its turn order falling all the way to the back. So I said "gently caress it", took out 7 loans on my 10 share to drop its value, bought back all the outstanding shares, opened a new 5 share company at 200, and dumped my last 200 into it. The new 5 share company operates before the 5-trains are bought so I "buy" all the soon-to-rust 3s from the 10 share for $549. It gets to the 10-share's turn, it runs a 4 train costing everyone ~26 bucks a short but they're all sitting on 3-4 shorts. Instead of buying a 6-train I close out every single loan (after paying $500 in interest, too!) which causes my share value to quadruple. The merger phase lasts literally 45 minutes as everyone maths out how to save themselves because they know the inevitable: I'm going to buy my once-failing 10-share company with my new fake shell company (let's call it Chump Enterprises) which will immediately get a liquid cash injection of $2,100 which as the only shareholder is somewhere in the line of $900 into my pocket and $185 a short from everyone else. I bankrupted 2 people. We decided to call it conceding that I probably would've lost in the long run without a 6 train going into OR2 and fewer positive shares overall, but that moment was Top 5 board game highlights.
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Jul 9, 2019 23:11
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horrible accident! posted:Does anyone have tips for being good at concordia? Consuls are godlike. Time your Diplomat wisely.
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Jul 9, 2019 23:21
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"al-azad" posted:Certainly not as egregious as 1817 having to intentionally restrict itself by rules because getting the full components practically doubles the cost of the game. What?
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Jul 9, 2019 23:36
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Decided to make my own wood transfer based TGZ and redoing all the cards from scratch. Pretty happy so far
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Jul 9, 2019 23:54
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Papes posted:What? Ignore that comment, I got it confused with 18USA which is a $65 game that requires components from 1817 or you could pay $165 for 18USA "expanded" (still requires 1817 components) but you get thematic companies for the entirety of America instead of Northeast exclusive ones so... yay. So in 1817 (a $228 game I should mention) you can short companies value except the base game only comes with 5 short sale certificates per company which means 10-share companies can only be shorted 50% of their value. For $20 you can get the extra 5 shorts and the rules reflect this by including 10 shorts as a "variant." The "variant" is widely accepted as the normal rules because otherwise there's practically no risk in shorting a 10 share company. I don't know why they just don't roll the extra shorts into the base game. 18USA "expanded" includes all 10 shorts for each company and it's not like people are going to thumbs up $230 but run for the hills at $250. I can only imagine it's out of respect for the original ruleset.
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Jul 10, 2019 00:04
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heres the first specialist. I'll post a full gallery when I'm done and hopefully get some transfer paper and wood this weekend to start the print transfers also while finding various art resources and photos it seems splotter took some authorial licensing with regards to many of the gods and what they represent to various cultures, does anyone know if they have any info on the background of the game posted anywhere? Bottom Liner fucked around with this message at 00:51 on Jul 10, 2019 |
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Jul 10, 2019 00:45
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Chubbs posted:I recommend Animal Upon Animal as a good next game if you don't have it yet. It's fun enough to stack up the animals without bothering with the rules (or just make up your own) and it'll hold up to years of punishment.
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Jul 10, 2019 00:58
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sonatinas posted:Just make sure you get the “first games” edition since it’s made for toddlers and don’t have to worry about choking hazards I was looking at that but it's like $40 shipped to NZ for a game that she'll probably outgrow in 6 months, so it just seems a bit too pricy for what it is. I reckon I might just hold off and get the full game.
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Jul 10, 2019 01:09
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You could also get Animal Upon Animal: Small Yet Great which is much cheaper, lighter and easier to choke on. Tile-laying games are great for toddlers and pre-schoolers who like jigsaws. Got a lot of mileage out of Carcassonne and Kingdomino with mine.
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Jul 10, 2019 01:11
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Doctor Spaceman posted:You could also get Animal Upon Animal: Small Yet Great which is much cheaper, lighter and easier to choke on. Thankfully she's past the stage of randomly putting objects in her mouth so I'm not too worried about choking risks, so that could be a good option. We've already got Queendomino and enjoy it so might have to pick up Kingdomino as well as I can see that working well too once she's a bit older. At the moment though she seems more able to grasp physical concepts (stacking, whacking) than more conceptual ones like connecting dominos, but I'm sure we'll get there 
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Jul 10, 2019 01:15
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The pieces for that small version are tinyKerro posted:Thankfully she's past the stage of randomly putting objects in her mouth so I'm not too worried about choking risks, so that could be a good option. We've already got Queendomino and enjoy it so might have to pick up Kingdomino as well as I can see that working well too once she's a bit older. At the moment though she seems more able to grasp physical concepts (stacking, whacking) than more conceptual ones like connecting dominos, but I'm sure we'll get there My daughter loves jigsaws so at about 2 1/2 we started playing a game with Carcassonne where we take turns adding a tile to the map (generally from a face up pile), with the only restriction being that the features have to match appropriately. With Kingdomino (which we started when she was about 3) I got her to read the number on the back of the tile and if she got that correct she could add it to the map as long as there was one feature match. I made sure the first few tiles got enough stuff out so there was never a problem. There are a few other games I use to try and teach her things (eg Ticket to Ride has lots of pretty coloured cards) and even just a pile of cubes or glass beads is neat for patterns and counting.
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Jul 10, 2019 01:34
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Doctor Spaceman posted:The pieces for that small version are tiny Yep, making up games out of 'big kids' games are things my 4yo loves to do. We play a similar hacky version of Carc, and she can manage Kingdomino as long as I don't impose the 5x5 size restriction, which is hard for a preschooler to visualize. She can legit play Catan Jr on her own, with just me running through the checklist of "Can you buy X? Oh, you're missing a barrel? Does the market have a barrel you can trade for?" She loves figuring things out, holding the big chunky resources and making forts and boats across the island chain. She also loves Animal Upon Animal, and we've gotten my 2yo to play with us as well. Luckily my 4yo laughs off the collapse of animals when the 2yo hamfists the whole thing down. We also have Indigo, which is a hex tile with routes printed on them game, with gems sliding along the paths created. You try to direct the pieces to your sides of the board to get the gems. Advanced planning isn't really possible at their age, but rotating the pieces so that the gems slide towards her side is fun enough. She also likes a version of KittyPaw, which is just a bunch of cat tiles and pictures of patterns to make with them, where she just takes a card, and lines up all the pieces to match the picture. I act as the judge, and let her know how many errors there are, and she figures out how to correct it. Then there's Ice Cool, the weeblewobble penguin game of flicking them around the board to go through doors. We just play that like a race usually, who can make a lap around the board first, with her getting a few extra moves to balance things out. Ticket to Ride is just her placing trains on the board to connect cities I point out. "Make a route from X to Y". Then we count up the trains and move the score marker along the numberline. Basically, just take the components of any game, and turn it into a counting or pattern recognition game, and you're doing good.
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Jul 10, 2019 02:43
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Mayveena posted:This is what got me into the discussion in the first place Sorry to revive a conversation that everyone wants to die, but if you're going to quote me in the future, please don't erase my name. Maybe that was accidental. All I will add is that it is perfectly legitimate to call out a company for lovely business practices. Did Splotter commit Foxconn level human rights abuses? Of course not. But releasing that most recent version of Indonesia in a barely playable state, with known manufacturing errors, at full price, with no replacement parts offered--that is a bad business practice. I didn't buy Indonesia. I won't ever buy it unless I can get it used. I posted my reasons. It was such a botched job, that I'm unlikely to pay for Ketchup Mechanism until people confirm it doesn't have similar issues.
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Jul 10, 2019 04:21
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Didn't realize the pret-a-porter kickstarter was live. What are people's thoughts on it? I know Rahdo loves it but Ignacy has a... questionable design history... and I don't want to back something if it's another mess.
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Jul 10, 2019 14:47
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Played 1st ed ages ago and it was... fine. Unless I've misremembered something, it was a fairly standard, fairly heavy worker placement game with a fairly unusual theme. It had a whole lot of cards with various boni to collect and combo off each other and the victory boiled down to set collection. It was a solid entry in the genre, but didn't really do anything unique.
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Jul 10, 2019 15:53
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This KS is for the 3rd edition and it looks like they're reworking big chunks of the game to improve and streamline it overall... which is always a good thing when we're talkin Ignacy. The theme is almost non-present in board gaming, other than trivia games and bad marketing tie-ins. A heavy euro seems like a natural fit for the industry. I like how they've gotten several guest artists in on it as well, seems like there's a lot of fondness for the game among designers. Chubbs fucked around with this message at 16:16 on Jul 10, 2019 |
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Jul 10, 2019 16:13
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