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MustachioNut posted:So I'm working my way through the backhalf of Heavensward, got a tank, healer, caster and ranged dps to ~60 and I reckon I need a melee dps to round things out. Ninja.
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Jul 16, 2019 19:55
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Mordiceius posted:The story is barely even there. All together it is less than 20 minutes of cutscenes, and that's if you're taking it slowly. They introduce a new character, who you don't even get to meet. They're trying to establish a mystery but they're not even giving us enough to get invested in the mystery. Every character is a complete void of charisma in the story. The dialog is them mostly just pointing out the obvious. drat...Can't believe the plot that's intentionally split up into 3 parts isn't super amazing and fufilling in the first section. Have you done any raid content at all in this game when its current? This is like saying Coil is garbage trash because first coil's story was boring.
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Jul 16, 2019 19:55
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MustachioNut posted:So I'm working my way through the backhalf of Heavensward, got a tank, healer, caster and ranged dps to ~60 and I reckon I need a melee dps to round things out. Definitely Ninja, it's probably the most complicated of all the melee classes by a fair margin.
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Jul 16, 2019 19:58
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Ibram Gaunt posted:drat...Can't believe the plot that's intentionally split up into 3 parts isn't super amazing and fufilling in the first section. Have you done any raid content at all in this game when its current? This is like saying Coil is garbage trash because first coil's story was boring. Like I said people say it about every raid tier because almost always the majority of the story and cut scenes is the finale.
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Jul 16, 2019 19:58
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Ibram Gaunt posted:drat...Can't believe the plot that's intentionally split up into 3 parts isn't super amazing and fufilling in the first section. Have you done any raid content at all in this game when its current? This is like saying Coil is garbage trash because first coil's story was boring. I have literally been around for every raid at every tier when it is current. The setup for both Alexander and Omega were far better than this. poo poo actually happened in those expansions. They introduced new characters and we actually got to meet them. Instead we get someone in power armor that we don't get to meet and then Ryne introduces a dude in the end and they go off to talk secrets. I didn't look at the first tier story for Omega and Alexander and think "Wow this story is terrible" because there was actually story there. Certainly a helluva lot more than we get for Eden. Omega had a loving hour of cutscenes and story. Eden has about 20 minutes.
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Jul 16, 2019 19:59
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When a server shifts from preferred to standard, does the leveling bonus go away after a period of time or do I get to keep that "Road to 60" buff?
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Jul 16, 2019 19:59
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People totally called alexander bad when it started, and they say its bad still now.
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Jul 16, 2019 19:59
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Mordiceius posted:I have literally been around for every raid at every tier when it is current. The setup for both Alexander and Omega were far better than this. poo poo actually happened in those expansions. They introduced new characters and we actually got to meet them. Instead we get someone in power armor that we don't get to meet and then Ryne introduces a dude in the end and they go off to talk secrets. You could say the same about O1 though and while A1 introduced new characters not much was done with them. They were both pretty universally panned. What did people think of T1-T5? There is some story there but the only good stuff is the cutscenes between T11 and T13.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:01
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People were ready to give up on omega too especially by the 2nd part, it always happens and then the finale comes out and its good again suddenly.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:01
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The story for the first tier of Eden is pretty meh.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:02
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Sharkopath posted:People were ready to give up on omega too especially by the 2nd part, it always happens and then the finale comes out and its good again suddenly. I look forward to hopefully the story becoming better. But currently, I think out of the first tiers of all three, Eden has the worst story and the best bosses. Tier 1 stories: Omega > Alexander > Eden. There is barely anything for me to hook onto. It is just kind of there, and happens. It's not that interesting and not that involved. Literally the only problem I have with Eden is the story. The visuals are fantastic. The music is amazing. The fights are some of my favorite ever. The story is just so loving bad compared to how good everything else is. Mordiceius fucked around with this message at 20:05 on Jul 16, 2019 |
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Jul 16, 2019 20:02
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People were talking about quitting this game before shadowbringers came out because the story wasn't going in the direction they wanted too now that I think about it.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:02
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hobbesmaster posted:You could say the same about O1 though and while A1 introduced new characters not much was done with them. They were both pretty universally panned. People were doomsaying that the raid content will be a total bust when first coil came out cuz it was so meh.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:03
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Sharkopath posted:People totally called alexander bad when it started, and they say its bad still now. Alexander was bad because it followed Coil. Coil is still the only decent raid story they've had so far. Omega had potential but they squandered it for the sake of fanservice.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:06
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Speaking of Alexander, does anyone have a link to the concert where Yoshi -P, Soken, and Uematsu come out during the time stop bit?
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Jul 16, 2019 20:08
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I'd rather have 20 minutes of nothing story then 60 minutes of nothing story and none but Coil have honestly had a killer story so I'm cool with this.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:10
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LunarEmerald posted:Alexander was bad because it followed Coil. Coil is still the only decent raid story they've had so far. Omega had potential but they squandered it for the sake of fanservice. Theyre all good.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:10
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it's a recurring trend in this game that plots that are still being built up are seen as being bad for not immediately jumping into the twists and turns and instead establishing a status quo that can later be taken to its conclusions or challenged
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Jul 16, 2019 20:10
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Aside from crunch potentially eating up the story budget, Eden's story is flatter and less involved because they necessarily have to save any major character development for the MSQ. The advantage of going with side characters for the past raids has been that you can tell a relatively full story (within reason), since these characters have been specifically sidelined from the MSQ to give the writers freedom. Tying their hands by making your raid companions MSQ companions - and it'd be very weird if none of them showed up again in further MSQ content - means that you'll get a blander story in return. There's still the possibility of part 2/3 being bangers, but having only one new character introduced - and having everything be so tightly tied to Ryne - makes me think that the same issue will crop up in the other releases.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:12
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I wish the egis had some specific utility that helped you out instead of just being busywork. Like Ifrit boosting your damage, Garuda giving you some regen and Titan shielding you or reducing incoming damage. I thought they'd have something like this with the change to insta-summon, but instead they've gutted Garuda. There's no point to pulling out anything other than Ifrit during fights unless you're duing a duty, then Titan's shield helps with survivability. In my mind, SMN was always this weird DPS-Support mix that could be a tank or a healer for a few seconds when the need arises. Instead, they made one step forward and two steps back. Still, plate-spinning isn't all that bad because the big fights are challenging and the SMN rotation occurs in stages, so figuring out when to start turbo-spinning and keeping it up is plenty rewarding.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:13
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I’m trying to catch up on stuff I missed by not being subbed during Stormblood. Is Eureka going to be a ghost town if I try to spend time working on the relic weapon?
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Jul 16, 2019 20:16
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Blattdorf posted:In my mind, SMN was always this weird DPS-Support mix that could be a tank or a healer for a few seconds when the need arises. It's never really been that at all. If the tank ate poo poo back in the day, even in a 4 man, the probability of you getting out Titan-Egi and having it establish enough enmity in time to prevent a wipe was vanishingly small, and Physick's heal barely contributed any real HPS at 50, even back in ARR. The only thing that set them apart utility-wise was having access to Resurrection, something that's been maintained through every expansion. Macdeo Lurjtux posted:I’m trying to catch up on stuff I missed by not being subbed during Stormblood. Is Eureka going to be a ghost town if I try to spend time working on the relic weapon? Probably. I assume they're going to eventually make it easier to progress a SB relic, given Eureka's unique status, but you're probably better off doing something else for the moment.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:18
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Macdeo Lurjtux posted:I’m trying to catch up on stuff I missed by not being subbed during Stormblood. Is Eureka going to be a ghost town if I try to spend time working on the relic weapon? For now at least, there's too much new stuff that I can't see many people hanging around there. I think it'll def get some population in the next couple weeks though.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:18
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Anyways the people need more faith and if you haven't even built a modest shrine to Soken in your family home you're part of the problem.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:19
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Blattdorf posted:I wish the egis had some specific utility that helped you out instead of just being busywork. Like Ifrit boosting your damage, Garuda giving you some regen and Titan shielding you or reducing incoming damage. I thought they'd have something like this with the change to insta-summon, but instead they've gutted Garuda. There's no point to pulling out anything other than Ifrit during fights unless you're duing a duty, then Titan's shield helps with survivability. garuda's identity is the AoE summon now, it contributes pretty well in big dungeon pulls and the tankable/stackable add phases on bosses. you should absolutely be pulling it out in these situations.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:19
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Blattdorf posted:In my mind, SMN was always this weird DPS-Support mix that could be a tank or a healer for a few seconds when the need arises. What? When?
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Jul 16, 2019 20:20
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Blattdorf posted:I wish the egis had some specific utility that helped you out instead of just being busywork. Like Ifrit boosting your damage, Garuda giving you some regen and Titan shielding you or reducing incoming damage. I thought they'd have something like this with the change to insta-summon, but instead they've gutted Garuda. There's no point to pulling out anything other than Ifrit during fights unless you're duing a duty, then Titan's shield helps with survivability. Garuda is worth it in the adds phase of some fights. Titan's egi-assault gives you a shield so hes good for solo'ing only just like he used to be. The only times Titan has been useful in raids have been to exploit bugs. That said, egi assaults don't feel all that great, its just push this button ogcd to be able to push another button without a cast time so you can push more ogcd buttons. yay?
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Jul 16, 2019 20:21
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Vermain posted:Aside from crunch potentially eating up the story budget, Eden's story is flatter and less involved because they necessarily have to save any major character development for the MSQ. The advantage of going with side characters for the past raids has been that you can tell a relatively full story (within reason), since these characters have been specifically sidelined from the MSQ to give the writers freedom. Tying their hands by making your raid companions MSQ companions - and it'd be very weird if none of them showed up again in further MSQ content - means that you'll get a blander story in return. Agreed with all of this. I feel like the Eden story has pretty much zero personality currently. I'm just going to spoiler the rest of this so I don't have to selectively spoiler it. Eden, as a character itself, has zero personality compared to Alexander and Omega. Alexander, we had a lot of personality through the goblins and their hijinks. Omega, we get personality via meeting Alpha and the interactions with Omega itself. We got to experience some of this in the first tier of each raid. Eden, we get nothing to go from. Eden, itself, has zero interaction with us. Ryne mentions her struggle fighting the will of Eden, but it's one line and we experience none of that, so it might as well not even exist. As mentioned above, we can't have any major character revelations for the Scions because that would be kept for MSQ so they're just kinda "there," but could basically be swapped out for any character and the story wouldn't change a bit. We get introduced to two main characters but don't get to interact with either of them. There is the "Oracle of Darkness" in the power armor that is basically just asleep the whole time. Then we have this guy that Ryne introduces us to at the end and again, we don't know why or have any reason to care because they contribute nothing to the story. The main thrust of the story of "give life back to the wasteland" is fine but that needs to be embodied through interesting characters. Any potentially interesting characters have been held for later tiers, so we have nothing to latch on to for this tier. No matter what you thought of Mide or Alpha, we got introduced to them early so that we got to go on a journey with them. We got to see the start of their arc. We didn't get to start the arcs of any characters here, all we have is an abstract concept.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:24
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Being able to switch on the fly is nice though admittedly. I still view Titan as a crutch for solo-ing though, both the old and new version. Since there's just a point where it's faster to dps everything rather than relying on Titan to protect you (I say as I die in Eureka after getting overconfident about chaining with 4.0 Garuda).
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Jul 16, 2019 20:26
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<Lighter Than Air>
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Jul 16, 2019 20:30
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FactsAreUseless posted:<Lighter Than Air> Weirdest kinsect I've ever seen.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:40
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lol
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Jul 16, 2019 20:41
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There's big chunks of the rotation that would have not much going on if the egi assaults were taken out, so I'm glad they're there. They're not hard to do and building Ruin IV stacks and using them optimally to minimise Ruin II casts feels good.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:47
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Saint Freak posted:Weirdest kinsect I've ever seen.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:48
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Mordiceius posted:Agreed with all of this. I feel like the Eden story has pretty much zero personality currently. I'm just going to spoiler the rest of this so I don't have to selectively spoiler it. oh, woe, the day I agree with a mordiceius post pretty much in its entirety! woe!! it's just that the whole thing reeks of - and I cede that I'm biased because I deeply dislike the dude - nomura's usual nonsensical style of "dream logic but less coherent." there's a thing! whoa, it's the first sin eater!! whoa, ryne can control it!!! whoa, there's another goddamn character whose primary trait is "doesn't know what's going on before falling into an interminable coma"!!!! even kairi in kingdom hearts had more presence and she's basically the platonic ideal of a blank slate. I mean, does that mean that it definitely cannot be compelling come the second or third parts? no, it could be. but even gordias had gobbiespeak and fun to be had mocking mide, and during deltascape omega at least managed to be vaguely menacing, despite being a cliche. there could be meat on the bone here, but we didn't even get a sniff of any so far. that said, the fights and music are rad and that's what I care about, so I ain't perturbed.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:49
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What if the final fight of E12 is Ultima Weapon, based on the VIII version? Since Eden is drawn from it in that game, after all. Savage could be Omega Weapon.
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Jul 16, 2019 20:50
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I will forgive everything if one of the tiers is "We need to bring monsters and animals back to this part of the world! SUMMON THE LUNATIC PANDORA!"
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Jul 16, 2019 20:55
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Mordiceius posted:I will forgive everything if one of the tiers is "We need to bring monsters and animals back to this part of the world! SUMMON THE LUNATIC PANDORA!" Had we not gotten Yoko Taro's wild ride for the 24 man this expansion, I would have unironically loved to have Lunatic Pandora for the 24 man.
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Jul 16, 2019 21:06
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I did the whole of Eden this morning with PUGs, 3 wipes on E1, 1 on E2 and E3, and2 or 3 on E4, i don't recall. What I do know is that E4 was nightmarish for me as a monk between dodging AoEs and Knockbacks, I couldn't keep my stacks up when I wasn't dead. E1 isn't so bad, the massive AoE spam right before the DPS check is a bit rude. E2 is doable once you figure out the timing gimmick. E3 was a lot of fun overall.
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Jul 16, 2019 21:26
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Nomura didn't write Eden He's doing the character and boss designs that's it
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Jul 16, 2019 21:28
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