|
It's a really dumb system because you don't want to strip all of the armor if you can help it or you lose the +75% damage from Corrosive itself. Ideally, you'd like to strip just enough armor that they still have a sliver of Ferrite as they die. A +75% damage boost can be offset by 57% DR, which translates to just under 400 armor. For a unit with 100 base ferrite armor at level 1, the break even point is right around lvl 20-21 after which the DR from the armor will more than compensate for the +75 damage boost to ferrite. But until that level, not stripping armor means they will die quicker than if you did strip armor. But if you go in with 3x CorPro so you have 90% armor strip instead of 100%, then the break even point goes up to 4000 armor - which is well over lvl 165 for a unit that has base 100 armor (a lot of the baseline Grineer units). Even the much heavier armored Corrupted Lancers (lvl 113) and Corrupted Bombards (lvl 67) have high levels for break even. If you go in with 3x corpro and say a Sarpa to do another 90% armor strip to give an overall 99% armor strip, then you have an effective 40000 armor before you break even. That's not really practical but just emphasizes how not taking all armor off is actually beneficial - which reinforces how dumb that part of the damage system is. Armor overstripping can cost you a lot of damage unless you're certain that all armor has been stripped and you go into Grineer missions with a flesh based damage type instead of corrosive - which also shows how dumb the whole system is. The math here is a very oversimplified view since it doesn't factor in corrosive procs doing their own armor strip but also because it assumes that all you have is Corrosive's +75% to boost damage and in reality other base damage boosts will lower the overall contribution of corrosive and those break evens will to shift lower levels, but it still shows how dumb that armor calculation is and how the corpro solution to the problem is even dumber. v1ld fucked around with this message at 16:24 on Jul 26, 2019 |
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 16:22
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 11:33 |
|
|
Tulip posted:good (?) news! The other best auras are also dash polarity! Oh yeah I forgot the Speed Holster was a Dash. escape mechanism posted:They've also been handing out a lot of free universal aura formas recently, more than there are frames that can use a non-dash aura in fringe situations, so I'm not too worried about the future I actually didn't know this was a thing. I've only just come back to the game and need to get into Arbies (having left last time just as they dropped). Are they generally pubby friendly or is that just going to lead to pain?
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 16:24
|
|
|
Arbies are one of a handful of things that are truly not pub friendly.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 16:27
|
|
|
Eh, you can do a survival arby with pubs with no real problems, unless they start dying left and right in which case bail, but I wouldn't try anything that has a health bar to watch.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 16:30
|
|
|
What are arbys?
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 16:39
|
|
|
Oldstench posted:What are arbys? Arbitrations. They're a special class of level 100+ endless missions with some added mechanics to (at least theoretically) make them harder. They pay out in Endo, as well as some unique mods. You have to complete every mission on the start map to unlock them.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 16:41
|
|
|
Oldstench posted:What are arbys? Arbitrations. They're alert-ish endless missions that rotate once an hour and give each player an individual bonus to a frame and a gun. Enemies scale twice as fast and objectives require twice the completion/time per rotation; 2 excav, 10 min survival, etc. They have special drones that link to all nearby enemy mobs and make them immune to damage and abilities. Each rotation gives Vitus Essence, in addition to the normal rewards of each mode, which you can turn in to a Hexis rep in relays to buy certain cosmetics, archwing rivens and the ability to craft amber ayatan stars. Finally Vitus Essence is a required component for each built ephemera.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 16:42
|
|
|
Also pubbie easy mode for arbys is Nova in Interception, slow the whole room and force the pubbies to win.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 16:42
|
|
|
Orv posted:Eh, you can do a survival arby with pubs with no real problems, unless they start dying left and right in which case bail, but I wouldn't try anything that has a health bar to watch. that's kind of big. Plus they'll forget to bring corpro. It's basically the only thing other than the open world bosses where pubbies are a significant liability.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 16:48
|
|
|
I mean I have zero problems believing that it could be a problem but I haven't pubbed an arby yet that was any kind of complete shitshow. Anecdotal obviously and it's like playing Russian roulette with five rounds in but it's not wholly impossible.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 16:50
|
|
|
v1ld posted:It's a really dumb system because you don't want to strip all of the armor if you can help it or you lose the +75% damage from Corrosive itself. Ideally, you'd like to strip just enough armor that they still have a sliver of Ferrite as they die. Your point is correct but in addition to its 75% bonus damage vs. ferrite, corrosive damage also ignores 75% of the target's ferrite armour so your numbers are off. There is no bonus for corrosive vs. alloy armour though so for those targets stripping it all is good. Ignoring 75% of a level 120 heavy gunner's armour is about a 3.65x damage bonus on top of the 75% bonus from the damage type.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 16:50
|
|
|
Tulip posted:that's kind of big. Plus they'll forget to bring corpro. Pubbies aren't a liability in survival arbitrations. You just go in capable of soloing the mission and pubbies make more enemies spawn just by existing. More enemies means more life support drops. Eventually they die and sign off (or you can rez them if you want) but you've already benefitted from their presence by that point.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 16:57
|
|
|
Tuxedo Catfish posted:(or you can rez them if you want) I thought the point of Arbies is that you can't. Or is it that you only get one life?
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 17:01
|
|
|
I pubbed arbies today and I had a good time. I might have gotten lucky with my pubs (we had a trinity!) but I brought Gara at +300% strength and had an easy time, the only one to die was my cat (somehow) just sling splinter storms everywhere, cover every available surface in glass shards. They'll have to actively try to croak with 90% DR.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 17:06
|
|
|
Nickiepoo posted:I thought the point of Arbies is that you can't. Or is it that you only get one life? When somebody is dead in an arbitration, enemies start sometimes dropping thingies and if you collect 5 you can res them. They debuff you like index points when you carry them.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 17:06
|
|
|
Kobogartimer posted:Your point is correct but in addition to its 75% bonus damage vs. ferrite, corrosive damage also ignores 75% of the target's ferrite armour so your numbers are off. There is no bonus for corrosive vs. alloy armour though so for those targets stripping it all is good. Very good point. So there's even more advantage to not stripping all of the Ferrite with 4x CorPro. Radiation has +75% against Alloy Armor and CorPro works on it as well, so you can run 3x CorPro against Alloy. The folks doing Eidos seriously do exactly this by running only 3x CorPro to get 90% strip on joints and then hit them with Radiation for the +75% damage bonus. Eido joints have 200 base alloy armor last I looked, so doing the 90% armor strip is well worth the damage boost. E: Thumpers and Wolf have base 200 armor too. So an armor-stripping Sarpa is particularly good against them if you can't get 3x CorPro going. v1ld fucked around with this message at 17:27 on Jul 26, 2019 |
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 17:24
|
|
|
v1ld posted:Very good point. So there's even more advantage to not stripping all of the Ferrite with 4x CorPro. Yep but corpro doesn't actually work on eidolons anymore.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 17:31
|
|
|
Kobogartimer posted:Yep but corpro doesn't actually work on eidolons anymore. U wot m8
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 17:32
|
|
|
Nickiepoo posted:I thought the point of Arbies is that you can't. Or is it that you only get one life? It used to be that dead was dead, but they chickened out because the dead person would always quit and it led to more frequent host migrations.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 17:40
|
|
|
Tuxedo Catfish posted:Pubbies aren't a liability in survival arbitrations. I figure if you're at the point where you can solo all extant game content, you don't ask about pubbies at all.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 17:52
|
|
|
There's lots of content where no matter how much you've mastered it, other people can slow you down. There's lots of content where no matter how much you've mastered it, other people can help you complete it faster or get better rewards (because you can't be in two places at once.) Arbitrations, being endless missions and not subject to clear times, are almost exclusively in the latter category. Excavations are an exception, you want to do those with an organized group if at all possible so that you can keep two extractors going at once.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 17:59
|
|
|
So hard to decide between completing madurai, and not leveling void radiance which literally gets worse as you level it.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 18:01
|
|
|
Tuxedo Catfish posted:There's lots of content where no matter how much you've mastered it, other people can slow you down. let me try to be more clear: when considering audience, an audience that asks whether or not a given piece of Warframe content is pubbable is not an audience that's going to have a good time pubbing arbitration.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 18:27
|
|
|
Other than the passives and waybounds, I find very few of the focus perks to be useful (with obvious exceptions) and will probably ignore the system entirely past "which passives are best for this mission" once I get my waybounds unlocked. It's not actually as much of a challenge as I've heard people make it out to be now that tridolons spit out a couple hundred thousand worth of shards with each clear.Helter Skelter posted:Obviously it depends a bit on what you're facing, but against high level armored targets, 100% status for corrosive is a huuuuge increase to damage output. Like, 6-7 shots from a Strun Wraith to kill a L165 Corrupted Bombard instead of 14. Tulip posted:I should probably dump my aura forma on Nova for Power Donation but I'm being lazy. Goa Tse-tung posted:Also pubbie easy mode for arbys is Nova in Interception, slow the whole room and force the pubbies to win. Interception is actually the riskiest to pub because if you lose control of the map at any point (someone dies, enemies get entrenched on a point) there's very little time to catch up because the enemy score gain is massively multiplied. Arbitrations aren't that bad to pub because of the star chart clear requirement, so most people come in ready to win. Tanky frames and killframes are always nice, and CC is actually surprisingly viable since you can tell where the drones are just by which enemies are still moving after something like a giant cataclysm/stasis. The main problem is that sometimes critical enemies bug out and won't spawn (looking at you, power cell carriers and arby drones) when you need them to and it brings the mission to a screeching halt. I had three people on the ground during a survival and absolutely no drones spawned so we had to extract. Pubbies are also very easy to support if they seem to be stupid; running things like capacitance Volt, safeguard Nezha, Oberon, or Wisp dramatically increases their survival rates. You don't need them to contribute in most cases unless there are spread out objectives (interception, excavation) but you want to keep them close to herd enemies into the blender. Useful pubbies are just a bonus. Arbys are easily soloable up until enemy level ~150 or so.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 18:32
|
|
|
Just build a second Nova, I personally found it tricky to balance the polarities between regular and speedva. Plus I can just pick my Nova and know what build I have without having to gently caress around with "oh, poo poo, this is my regular Nova" which happens every time because I am dumb as
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 18:39
|
|
|
Tulip posted:let me try to be more clear: when considering audience, an audience that asks whether or not a given piece of Warframe content is pubbable is not an audience that's going to have a good time pubbing arbitration. The newer you are and the more reliant you are on pubs to be able to do something in the first place, the less reason (or justification) you have to worry about how well pubs are going to be able to perform. Generally speaking, though, if you have arbitrations unlocked in the first place you're probably at a pretty advanced stage in your Warframe career.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 18:40
|
|
|
Echophonic posted:Just build a second Nova, I personally found it tricky to balance the polarities between regular and speedva. Plus I can just pick my Nova and know what build I have without having to gently caress around with "oh, poo poo, this is my regular Nova" which happens every time because I am dumb as
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 18:59
|
|
|
devstream time
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 19:00
|
|
|
4 24-Hour Alerts after this devstream instead of 2 Fragor Tekelor (tekelu?) Skin Orokin Catalyst Orokin Reactor Aura Forma Also the drop is a lazula toroid
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 19:08
|
|
|
Nalesh posted:So hard to decide between completing madurai, and not leveling void radiance which literally gets worse as you level it. What I did to overcome my minor completionist need was to grind up enough focus and focus-pool cap to be able level and use it if I ever felt the need to make my operator overall worse at eidolons.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 19:08
|
|
|
Summer event next week? "Some way to cool off" Double credits is definitely next weekend too.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 19:10
|
|
|
I haven't played since they got rid of the no-brainer energy regen perk for zenurik. Are there any particularly good skills on any of the focus trees, or is it all just finicky / situational bullshit?
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 19:15
|
|
|
 Pre-clone grineer is a hunk.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 19:17
|
|
|
 FINALLY
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 19:19
|
|
|
Babe Magnet posted:
it's him, john grineer
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 19:22
|
|
|
     Dax Thangs
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 19:23
|
|
|
Devs say they accidentally made Hayden in the Duviri Paradox, not on purpose
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 19:24
|
|
|
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 19:24
|
|
|
GANDHITRON posted:I haven't played since they got rid of the no-brainer energy regen perk for zenurik. Are there any particularly good skills on any of the focus trees, or is it all just finicky / situational bullshit? zenurik still gives infinite energy, it's just slightly more paperwork to use (it's "energizing dash")
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 19:25
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 11:33 |
|
|
GANDHITRON posted:I haven't played since they got rid of the no-brainer energy regen perk for zenurik. Are there any particularly good skills on any of the focus trees, or is it all just finicky / situational bullshit? The no brainer energy regen is still there in Zenurik, it just doesn't work exactly like it did before War Within released but now there are two different bonus energy perks. There are lots of other good passives though. Naramon has a perk that increases affinity gain from melee kills and another that makes the combo counter decrease by 5 (or 10 i forget atm) whenever it would expire instead of just evaporating back to 0. That also has a passive massive crit chance buff. Those are crazy strong for melee focused builds. Vazarin has a perk that makes the first four or five revives one either uses or receives instant, which can be really convenient in lovely situations or when you're baby sitting bad pubs. I want to say Madurai and Unairu have some useful things as well but I forget right now, one of them has a perk that can be used to buff out base damage and that can be used to pretty good effect in eidolon fights for buffing out spoiler amps.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2019 19:25
|
|
