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I would laugh so hard if they had to reban mystic because of the hammer.
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Aug 2, 2019 07:10
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Stoneforge Mystic isn't even good with Hammer though, when you aren't saving mana on the casting cost and Steelshaper's Gift is just cheaper.  tbh if Mystic got unbanned it would not affect the metagame at all because Modern is broken as gently caress right now.
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Aug 2, 2019 07:32
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The Shortest Path posted:Stoneforge Mystic isn't even good with Hammer though, when you aren't saving mana on the casting cost and Steelshaper's Gift is just cheaper. Turn 1 tron land, turn 2 tron land prophetic prism, turn 3 tron land, stoneforge, hammer, turn 4 equip. It's almost too good.
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Aug 2, 2019 09:21
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I always though SFM was considered too good because of Batterskull. That's effectively bringing it in already equipped with more dangerous abilities than just how big it is. Colossus Hammer still needs Sigarda's Aid or Magnetic Theft to be most effective, both of which are technically faster than SFM.
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Aug 2, 2019 14:07
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suicidesteve posted:Turn 1 tron land, turn 2 tron land prophetic prism, turn 3 tron land, stoneforge, hammer, turn 4 equip. It's almost too good. drat that’s nuts I wonder what other powerful stuff tron can do on (checks notes) Turn 4
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Aug 2, 2019 15:23
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Y'all are treating my post very seriously. I doubt it'd happen, but I'd die laughing if it did. The chance it does comes from the possibility of nearly all white decks playing the package, nearly all midrange/control being white, and Hammer being a too consistent T2/T3 deck with some resilience.The Shortest Path posted:Stoneforge Mystic isn't even good with Hammer though, when you aren't saving mana on the casting cost and Steelshaper's Gift is just cheaper. You'd play both. The deck absolutely wants equipment tutors that are also creatures, and it lets you play Batterskull. InterrupterJones posted:I always though SFM was considered too good because of Batterskull. That's effectively bringing it in already equipped with more dangerous abilities than just how big it is. Colossus Hammer still needs Sigarda's Aid or Magnetic Theft to be most effective, both of which are technically faster than SFM. SFM doesn't attach.
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Aug 2, 2019 16:51
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Tom Clancy is Dead posted:SFM doesn't attach.
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Aug 2, 2019 17:32
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Yawgmoth posted:Batterskull comes in with a 0/0 attached to it. No poo poo? InterrupterJones posted:Colossus Hammer still needs Sigarda's Aid or Magnetic Theft to be most effective, both of which are technically faster than SFM. ...
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Aug 2, 2019 17:35
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https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/2125100#paper I almost have this deck built. I don't currently own Surgical Extraction and I know I'll need to get them eventually. I'm not planning on winning a GP with this or anything. . I doubt there is a cheaper replacement, which cards should I add more of? Is Surgical currently in the main due to Hogaak or has it always been in the main because its a free spell?
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Aug 2, 2019 17:46
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Kjermzs posted:https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/2125100#paper It's been maindeckable for a while due to factors like: 1) Izzet Phoenix used to be like 20% of the metagame; 2) It's a free spell; 3) it's a free spell that can just be cast even if there are no targets of value. With Hogaak it's still useful for sure, but you often don't get priority to even use it so it's not like it's amazing. You can run gut shots, Crackling Drakes (to get around the presence of graveyard hate), and Lava Darts as you see fit.
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Aug 2, 2019 17:59
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Kjermzs posted:https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/2125100#paper Surgical was maindecked before Hogaak was printed. I’d probably just run more cantrips like sleight of hand if you don’t have them. If you know your local meta, you can figure out if that means you need more graveyard hate in the board or if you can get away without it. I don’t play Phoenix though so someone else might have better advice.
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Aug 2, 2019 17:59
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Kjermzs posted:https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/2125100#paper Surgicals were off and on in the main before Hogaak, but are incredibly necessary now. If you want to try to play without, I'd probably go with something like an extra Opt and a pair of Gut Shots, and hope people are on Humans after it had a good showing against Hogaak.
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Aug 2, 2019 18:01
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Kjermzs posted:https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/2125100#paper Won't pretend to know all the uses, but it's seemed to be helpful in the mirror in addition to graveyard strategies like Hogaak (the slot previously held by dredge).
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Aug 2, 2019 18:02
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Kjermzs posted:https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/2125100#paper more cantrips and/or removal. gut shot, opt, lava dart, flame slash all seem fine. maybe 1-2 crackling drakes. make sure to compensate by adding more graveyard hate to your sideboard Kjermzs posted:Is Surgical currently in the main due to Hogaak or has it always been in the main because its a free spell? both are obviously important. the deck was running gut shot back when the meta was less solved, but even before hogaak most people had switched to surgical
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Aug 2, 2019 18:02
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Tom Clancy is Dead posted:Surgicals were off and on in the main before Hogaak, but are incredibly necessary now. If you want to try to play without, I'd probably go with something like an extra Opt and a pair of Gut Shots, and hope people are on Humans after it had a good showing against Hogaak. For LGS play this is not really true, IMO. By and large people don't pivot to the best tournament deck. The pivot to Jund and UW Control because they want to pretend they have agency in modern.
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Aug 2, 2019 18:03
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Vapor snag and/or set adrift are incredibly good maindeck at the moment and would be fine To replace surgical #1
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Aug 2, 2019 18:05
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ShaneB posted:For LGS play this is not really true, IMO. By and large people don't pivot to the best tournament deck. The pivot to Jund and UW Control because they want to pretend they have agency in modern. True, I guess I'm thinking about online where there has been a lot of Gaak.
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Aug 2, 2019 18:06
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Tom Clancy is Dead posted:True, I guess I'm thinking about online where there has been a lot of Gaak. I was prepared to come into the thread and have you hard disagree with me in a very Magic Player way then I was reminded that man there still can be some kind of reasonable discussion about magic from time to time. Speaking of Jund, episode 33 of my pod The Dive Down is a deck dive into it. It's somehow 1h40m and not quite as deep as I would have liked to have been, but that's Jund for you. https://thedivedown.fireside.fm/33 should have links to non-browser-based playing on that page.
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Aug 2, 2019 18:09
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Kjermzs posted:https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/2125100#paper Surgical main was originally tech for the mirror / the dredge matchup in addition to it also being a free spell. Prior to Surgical it was gut shot was the free spell since Humans was quite popular at the time. Maybe try something like this list without surgicals in the main? https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/2137240#paper I do feel that you need to be packing some heavy duty graveyard hate still - so if your local meta is a lot of those decks you might have some major issues
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Aug 2, 2019 18:10
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Dehtraen posted:Surgical main was originally tech for the mirror / the dredge matchup in addition to it also being a free spell. Prior to Surgical it was gut shot was the free spell since Humans was quite popular at the time. FYI I’m 90% certain this list has a typo- it’s supposed to be magmatic sinkhole not insight.
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Aug 2, 2019 18:12
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ShaneB posted:For LGS play this is not really true, IMO. By and large people don't pivot to the best tournament deck. The pivot to Jund and UW Control because they want to pretend they have agency in modern. Feeling called out by this post so I'll play bant soulherder instead of UW tonight
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Aug 2, 2019 18:58
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Skyl3lazer posted:Feeling called out by this post so I'll play bant soulherder instead of UW tonight My man
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Aug 2, 2019 19:03
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C-Euro posted:My man Going infinite via Time Warp, eternal witness, and ephemerate
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Aug 2, 2019 19:07
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Time posted:FYI I’m 90% certain this list has a typo- it’s supposed to be magmatic sinkhole not insight. I would assume the same thing - to be honest I just looked for a placing Phoenix list without main deck surgicals and that was the first one I could find. Most are running 2-3 surgicals main.
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Aug 2, 2019 19:11
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ShaneB posted:For LGS play this is not really true, IMO. By and large people don't pivot to the best tournament deck. The pivot to Jund and UW Control because they want to pretend they have agency in modern. Yup. There were 30+ players last modern night at my LGS. I think one person played hoogak.
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Aug 2, 2019 20:05
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Buffis posted:Yup. 10 of 30 players at a Chicago LGS were on Jund the other night, say my co-hosts.
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Aug 2, 2019 20:11
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ShaneB posted:For LGS play this is not really true, IMO. By and large people don't pivot to the best tournament deck. The pivot to Jund and UW Control because they want to pretend they have agency in modern. Ouch, just because I wear a Jund shaped bullseye doesn't mean you have to pull the trigger. Your latest podcast was sweet, listened to it today at work.
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Aug 2, 2019 20:22
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I look at the SFM unbanning problem as a litmus test for Modern's health as a format. If SFM appears safe to unban, as it does now, that's because modern is really unhealthy and too fast, and poo poo needs to be banned until it's slowed back down enough where SFM is no longer a safe unban.
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Aug 2, 2019 20:51
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I'm playing Bant Vannifer on arena and it's going pretty decently
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Aug 2, 2019 20:53
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The Shortest Path posted:I look at the SFM unbanning problem as a litmus test for Modern's health as a format. If SFM appears safe to unban, as it does now, that's because modern is really unhealthy and too fast, and poo poo needs to be banned until it's slowed back down enough where SFM is no longer a safe unban. Yikes. No, slow the format down and SFM is mediocre at best without Jitte. Swords and/or batterskull is not taking over a format. A 4/4 lifelinker coming down on turn 3 hasn't been great in modern, maybe ever.
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Aug 2, 2019 21:12
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Thanks for so much feed back! I have no idea what the local meta looks like yet. I'll just jam a couple got shots and a vapor snag for now and take note of what I end of playing against.
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Aug 2, 2019 21:37
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The Shortest Path posted:I look at the SFM unbanning problem as a litmus test for Modern's health as a format. If SFM appears safe to unban, as it does now, that's because modern is really unhealthy and too fast, and poo poo needs to be banned until it's slowed back down enough where SFM is no longer a safe unban. I literally can't imagine how Modern could be in a place where SFM is too powerful. SFM without Jitte is a good but not exceptional swiss army knife. The best part about SFM is that it's probably very good against Phoenix but like Phoenix is already super good so who cares.
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Aug 2, 2019 21:51
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K'rrick, Son of Yawgmoth 4 PhiBPhiBPhiB https://twitter.com/jay13x/status/1157392275204390914?s=19
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Aug 2, 2019 21:55
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Karn went back in time and stopped Kerrick from killing Jhoria and exploded the island in time bullshit, which is what gave Jhoria and Teferi immortality. Kerrick and some phrexians got stuck in a fast time zone and built an army, which is what looks like that card represents.
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Aug 2, 2019 21:58
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Kurtofan posted:K'rrick, Son of Yawgmoth 4 PhiBPhiBPhiB Neat! He turns Ad Nauseam into a 3-drop spell. 
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Aug 2, 2019 22:03
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What the hell is a fast time zone Is this like the hyperbolic time chamber from dragom ball ?
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Aug 2, 2019 22:03
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Kurtofan posted:K'rrick, Son of Yawgmoth 4 PhiBPhiBPhiB They must have heard me thinking, because last night I was tweaking my "mono-black" Oloro deck (every spell can be cast with only black mana and it uses Cabal Coffers and other mono-black ramp) and wishing I could play Treasonous Ogre to pay life for mana.
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Aug 2, 2019 22:04
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Kurtofan posted:What the hell is a fast time zone Pretty much, yeah. Not sure if this guy is any good but his design owns really hard.
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Aug 2, 2019 22:08
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I'm sure that this card will absolutely not end up being broken and banned
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Aug 2, 2019 22:09
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Kurtofan posted:What the hell is a fast time zone So Urza made a time machine, but he couldn't send anything living through it or they would die, so he built Karn out of pure silver which was the only way to send something back. This was also super dangerous but he hoped to go back and smash Yawgmoth when he was still a man or something. Anyway Kerrick invades and most of the school dies so they send Karn back. But because this is a massive paradox it blows up the time machine. Throughout the island there are some zones where time ended up moving really fast, like you'd enter and die of old age. Kerrick and the phrexians were in a spot where like every one of their weeks took a day outside. Teferi was stuck in a super slow zone where years took less than a second. Jhoria survived but drank water from a slow time zone. This made them both age incredibly slowly. This is different from how Jonah drank water from a magic well and ages even slower.
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Aug 2, 2019 22:10
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