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punk rebel ecks posted:So, it's well known that Japan developed rapidly after WWII, but I just wonder how far they've come. Like at what level of development was Japan prior the war? I know they were more developed than China, however they weren't as wealthy as say Western Europe. japan was trying to gain a seat among the big boy nations during the age of imperialist expansion and largely succeeded. during the boxer rebellion japan was one of the eight nations that intervened to protect colonial exploitation of china. in 1905 japan defeated russia in what was then a global stunning upset, an industrial asian power defeating an industrial european power in a modern no-poo poo war. japan also straight up colonized korea. pre-ww2 my guess is that japan weighed in somewhere lower than italy but higher than spain in terms of economic power and industrial development
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Jul 25, 2019 04:37
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That feel when gawking foreign scare-reporting cites "alarming facts" about Japanese society that are literally exactly the same as the United States https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/03/world/asia/japan-single-women-marriage.html?emc=rss&partner=rss quote:Craving Freedom, Japan’s Women Opt Out of Marriage https://flowingdata.com/2017/11/01/who-is-married-by-now/ 
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Aug 4, 2019 06:24
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Wow such a wacky country where nobody has sex ever!
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Aug 4, 2019 09:15
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icantfindaname posted:That feel when gawking foreign scare-reporting cites "alarming facts" about Japanese society that are literally exactly the same as the United States That article was written by a Japanese woman though.
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Aug 4, 2019 10:23
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icantfindaname posted:That feel when gawking foreign scare-reporting cites "alarming facts" about Japanese society that are literally exactly the same as the United States I don't know how to say this without sounding weird, but you seem like you have a real persecution complex with this sort of stuff. Not every piece of reporting about Japanese society is meant as "look at these wacky orientals and their bizzare ways".
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Aug 4, 2019 11:58
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AFancyQuestionMark posted:I don't know how to say this without sounding weird, but you seem like you have a real persecution complex with this sort of stuff. Not every piece of reporting about Japanese society is meant as "look at these wacky orientals and their bizzare ways". A considerable amount of it is though. Outlandish, otherizing, polarizing poo poo gets clicks and money. Beyond good old fashioned orientalism modern media monetization absolutely incentivized such behavior. Bloodnose posted:That article was written by a Japanese woman though. A half Japanese woman who was born and raised overseas except for a few years when she was younger. So yes, but also no in some ways. She absolutely comes at things from a Western perspective; you can even see on her Facebook page public posts discussing cultural shock about some things since she moves to Japan 3 years ago. So her being part Japanese by birth is hardly a slam dunk against the idea of Western media sometimes misreporting or poorly contextualizing stories about Japan. Moreover even if someone is Japanese and comes at things from a truly Japanese eye it’s not like people don’t constantly repackage or commercialize their own culture for non-native consumption. I’m not saying it’s always bad, or it’s all intentional or some conspiracy or whatnot but you should, as with literally any media you consume about anything, come at it with a healthily critical eye.
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Aug 4, 2019 12:49
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AFancyQuestionMark posted:I don't know how to say this without sounding weird, but you seem like you have a real persecution complex with this sort of stuff. Not every piece of reporting about Japanese society is meant as "look at these wacky orientals and their bizzare ways". I’m having a really hard time understanding how you reached that conclusion.
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Aug 4, 2019 15:01
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Weatherman posted:I've been to Hong Kong twice in the past two years. Hope the HK thread is ready for my hot takes on exactly what's causing the problems their country is facing. Bonus "speaking from I think I’m one of the more frequent goon tourists visiting japan. Last night we went to a hunan restaurant owned by Li komaki , 李小牧 (li xiao mu) He’s ethnic Chinese but turned Japanese, made a living from working in Kabukicho and tried to get into politics. He refuses to hire helpers or have volunteers and burned god knows how much money on random ad buys. Anyways I rather listen to Japanese goons in person than actually give HOT TAKES Unless it’s making fun of bureaucratic OCD Japan
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Aug 4, 2019 15:45
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GLORIOUS NIPPON
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I’m really sad and angry that some crazy fucker started a fire and killed all these innocent people. If you want HOT TAKES then maybe people are just copying American mass shootings since it’s so frequent  Oh the brighter side. Lots of Chinese tourists and other fans raised money for the studio. Rest In Peace 
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Aug 4, 2019 15:47
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Pollyanna posted:I’m having a really hard time understanding how you reached that conclusion. No hate on him because I usually do agree with what he's saying and everyone has a hobby, but icantfindaname has been doing this extremely consistently for years now, the dude didn't pull that out of the air. Anyway leaving aside that whole part of it, I think it is an interesting article and the point that how patriarchal things are in those countries is a significant cause for young women not wanting to marry is something I've heard from (feminist, to be fair, so maybe not representative of everyone) female Korean friends a few times too and not something I see brought up very much whenever people are going off about birth rates there
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Aug 4, 2019 22:46
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LimburgLimbo posted:A half Japanese woman don't do this
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Aug 4, 2019 22:52
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Bloodnose posted:don't do this A Japanese-American woman who lived briefly in Japan as a child but is otherwise completely American-socialized Not that that necessarily impacts the quality of her reporting, but it's fundamentally a bad article. If she had written about the extremely low rate of birth outside wedlock and the plight of single mothers, something that is genuinely unique to Japan vis-a-vis Europe and America, then it could have been a good article, but the core thesis is "Japan's marriage rates, which are exactly the same as the USA's, are Abnormal and Weird and Alarming". The best-case interpretation of this is that she's just regurgitating lovely, irrational moral panic stories from the Japanese media without any critical reflection or context like the fact that the Japanese version of this story takes "normal" to be "1970s-era Japanese gender and family relations" while her mostly white liberal readership will take "normal" to mean "nice white European countries" or else just a projected fantasy vision of their own ideal society icantfindaname fucked around with this message at 23:48 on Aug 4, 2019 |
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Aug 4, 2019 23:37
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icantfindaname posted:The best-case interpretation of this is that she's just regurgitating lovely, irrational moral panic stories from the Japanese media mystes fucked around with this message at 00:11 on Aug 5, 2019 |
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Aug 5, 2019 00:09
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Bloodnose posted:don't do this She’s literally haafu
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Aug 5, 2019 01:13
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Those numbers have a different context in a society that tries to rely solely on in country births to maintain it's population.
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Aug 5, 2019 02:34
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7c Nickel posted:Those numbers have a different context in a society that tries to rely solely on in country births to maintain it's population. Well, yeah. But this distinction doesn’t always get sufficient focus in these sorts of articles because “Japan needs more immigration” is less sensational than “Japan needs more sex.” Edit: Actually, given current Anglosphere politics, the reverse might be true as to which is more sensational. But however you look at it, there's certainly a lot of reporting that omits important context. Silver2195 fucked around with this message at 03:42 on Aug 5, 2019 |
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Aug 5, 2019 03:30
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LimburgLimbo posted:She’s literally haafu I'm ハーフ as well, and I have now spent the majority of my time outside of Japan. Please do lecture me about what my cultural baggage is.
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Aug 5, 2019 19:34
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When people say haafu unironically I tend to mentally replace it with hanbaagu and the sentence's intent often becomes clearer.
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Aug 5, 2019 19:40
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Vagabundo posted:I'm ハーフ as well, and I have now spent the majority of my time outside of Japan. Please do lecture me about what my cultural baggage is. as an enlightened white liberal who grew up in usa and *understands things*, let me know if you want me to lecture you about your culture
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Aug 6, 2019 03:22
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Vagabundo posted:I'm ハーフ as well, and I have now spent the majority of my time outside of Japan. Please do lecture me about what my cultural baggage is. I’m not lecturing the person herself. I’m saying to someone, who wasn’t aware of the fact, that she clearly has a certain, and mostly likely primarily Western (though obviously “Western” is in itself a huge generalization), perspective on Japan considering she apparently spent about 2-3 years of elementary school living in Japan while going to an international school, and the rest in the US. Do you truly feel that you have exactly the same experience and perspectives as someone who was born and raised in Japan, never spent significant time overseas, and spent their whole life as visually indistinguishable from most ethnic Japanese? I would presume not; and in most cases I’m more interested in the opinions of those who have deep experience in both Japan and elsewhere, but when we’re *specifically* discussing how Western media commercializes, contextualizes, and commodifies Japanese culture and society then, yes an authors cultural background is a very salient point. Bloodnose’s point was “she’s Japanese [therefore inherently cannot have a Westernized perspective]” which is wrong at any rate, but in this case very demonstrably wrong given the cultural background of the specific person in question. I’m not discussing cultural baggage of minority groups in (and from) Japan in general as it’s very much a tangent. LimburgLimbo fucked around with this message at 06:05 on Aug 6, 2019 |
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Aug 6, 2019 06:01
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Imagine caring about the cultural bias of a Japanese person that much.
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Aug 6, 2019 06:25
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I mean there’s writers and anthropologists etc. who make their lives discussing cultural background of various ethnic sub-groups of Japan, so I think my literal toilet posting isn’t such a stretch.
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Aug 6, 2019 06:57
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noted cultural gatekeeper of “true” Japanese culture, *checks notes*...white guy from USA
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Aug 6, 2019 11:25
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I know you’re just doing drivebys across your usual threads because you’re bored or something, but suffice to say that my primary objection is actually the opposite of what you’re saying; I think that someone who’s got a Japanese name can absolutely have a heavily Western influenced perspective, just as someone without a Japanese name at all can have an very heavily Japanese influenced perspective. We should, I would hope obviously, look beyond surface qualities like nationality and race (for all that race can correlate highly to ethnicity in many circumstances) if you’re going to make inferences about the relative perspective of people. Edit: and there is no “true” Japanese culture LimburgLimbo fucked around with this message at 13:12 on Aug 6, 2019 |
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Aug 6, 2019 13:04
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LimburgLimbo posted:I know you’re just doing drivebys across your usual threads because you’re bored or something, but suffice to say that my primary objection is actually the opposite of what you’re saying 1) this is exactly what I was doing, lol, you know me p well 2) I know, I am just trolling and giving u poo poo
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Aug 6, 2019 13:12
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The Great Autismo! posted:1) this is exactly what I was doing, lol, you know me p well Yeah but it was as good an opportunity as any to actually elaborate more on what I was saying for the clarity of anyone interested, which is admittedly probably nobody
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Aug 6, 2019 13:14
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LimburgLimbo posted:Edit: and there is no “true” Japanese culture *wafts your face with a tank of Naruto*
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Aug 6, 2019 13:14
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LimburgLimbo posted:Yeah but it was as good an opportunity as any to actually elaborate more on what I was saying for the clarity of anyone interested, which is admittedly probably nobody In all seriousness, this is something I asked about in the thread a few years back, about books on the sociology of Japan, and I’d love to drink beers with you and actually hear you talk about it, as you have an absolute mammoth amount of experience in Japan. I just don’t think conversations like this translate well over the internet so I just drive by troll when I’m bored lol
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Aug 6, 2019 13:18
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Vagabundo posted:I'm ハーフ as well, and I have now spent the majority of my time outside of Japan. Please do lecture me about what my cultural baggage is. Assuming that some percentage of Japanese DNA makes you magically in touch with the culture of Japan is a mistake that the Japanese government has made several times w/r/t immigration particularly of blue collar workers from Brazil (I'm mixed race as well and there absolutely are a bunch of white men who know far more about my mother's culture & language than I do, and that's true of every mixed race person I know)
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Aug 6, 2019 14:38
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Y'all keep arguing when we should be celebrating Hiroshima Day. https://twitter.com/FreeBeacon/status/1158762707501441024?s=20
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Aug 6, 2019 21:20
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paperwind posted:Y'all keep arguing when we should be celebrating Hiroshima Day. https://twitter.com/FreeBeacon/status/1158762707501441024?s=20 "Celebrating"? I hope that's satire.
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Aug 6, 2019 22:55
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On the plus side, if American war crimes are holidays now, that could mean a lot more vacation time.
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Aug 6, 2019 23:01
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harperdc posted:"Celebrating"? the free beacon is a right wing rag, they 100% mean that article as a good 'LOOK HOW BRAVE WE WERE TO NUKE TWO CITIES, PRAISE US!'
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Aug 6, 2019 23:07
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harperdc posted:"Celebrating"? Yes, my words are satire. The Free Beacon absolutely is not satire.
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Aug 6, 2019 23:56
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It's a phenomenon noted by Japanese commentators that major outlets in U.S. media do like to run with articles and narratives that exoticize Japan. The book I recall was named 笑われる日本人
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Aug 17, 2019 14:42
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paperwind posted:Y'all keep arguing when we should be celebrating Hiroshima Day. https://twitter.com/FreeBeacon/status/1158762707501441024?s=20 The responses are at least heartening.There are far more people criticizing this than supporting it.
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Aug 17, 2019 22:01
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NikkolasKing posted:The responses are at least heartening.There are far more people criticizing this than supporting it. I visited Japan last month and drove to Hiroshima to do the pay my respects thing. The way the peace museum approaches the horror of it all is humbling. No denial of Japan's actions and a complete want to never let nuclear weapons be used again. When you see how integrated the history of the bomb is in education, from primary school level up and you listen to the multiple stories of children with their skin melting off them, at no point does the experience attempt blame on the US. It is all about it never loving happening again. One of the many things I love and respect about Japan. Also, battery vending machines. 
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Aug 18, 2019 20:20
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I keep seeing in Japanese media about how the "bubble" period of the 1980s had the average Japanese person live substantially better than they do today. Is that true, or has Japan mostly just stagnated since the '90s rather than decline?
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Aug 18, 2019 20:39
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BobbyThompson posted:I visited Japan last month and drove to Hiroshima to do the pay my respects thing. I've never been lucky or rich enough to travel to Japan but I distinctly remember reading Sadako and the Thousand Paper Cranes when I was little. Obviously my arguments against nuclear weapons are vaguely more sophisticated now but that book was where it all began and I'll never forget it or her. And one thing I've always found interesting about Japan is the varieties of tea they have. To me, tea i an old person drink and playing Japanese games where the teen kids talk about what tea they want to drink is so strange. But in Japan tea is more like soda and you can get it from vending machines like soda.That's really neat and I'd like to try some someday.
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Aug 18, 2019 20:50
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BobbyThompson posted:I visited Japan last month and drove to Hiroshima to do the pay my respects thing. Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
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Aug 18, 2019 20:59
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