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I'm sure you've all seen the Factorio trailer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DR01YdFtWFI I love this video. It shows different parts of the factory, set to a sort of zany music that is extremely fitting. Are there other videos like this? I'd love to explore other people's factories, but instead of being set to narration, set to something like the Powerhouse theme made famous by Looney Tunes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DR01YdFtWFI Does anyone know of anything like this?
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Aug 9, 2019 23:45
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Travic posted:Captain Planet doesn't stand a chance. We did it, folks.
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Aug 10, 2019 00:00
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So, after a bunch of you was talking about Rain i though id check him out. His systems are amazing, specially the outpostingsystem. Even i managed to understand that stuff. What i can't wrap my head around though is the settings he set up at his dropoffpoints. In his words quote:The way it works is that it calculates how many payloads that the unloader buffers can support before being full, then it divides that by the number of trains that deliver that resource. This gives the % of trains that each outpost should send. You do have to multiply the payload by 100 to get a number between 1 and 100. And i just can't wrap my head around how he did that..
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Aug 10, 2019 01:34
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I don't know what that quote is in context of, so I can only guess at how it's constructed, but I figure the way you'd do that is you'd have, for each unit of storage, a constant combinator outputting how many items it wants. Similarly, each delivery train station has a constant combinator outputting what it delivers. At the outpost, these two signals are compared, and then different train stations are activated depending on the result
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Aug 10, 2019 14:52
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I'm still catching up through the vods and am on episode 13 which is incidentally the episode where he debuted that logic. Even after he did it off screen in creative mode and dropped it in he had to debug for 90 minutes heh. But it's basically that. How full the droppoff points are, divided by stack size, along with count are sent to a central spot that turns it in to an averaged percentage. Then it's compared with outpost count and if more than one train per outpost has room to drop off, the first train from each outpost is dispatched. Meanwhile at the receiving stations only ones with value less than the average fill turning on do so. All this was devised to get around an issue with stackers where trains would prefer to refuse to enter rather than go to a very far away slot, so he was trying to find a way for full trains to stay at the outposts until necessary.
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Aug 10, 2019 17:04
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lol AAI Industry Also, as much as I like the dumb extension of the burner phase I always feel these mods are never playtested all that much. The biggest issue as that when I run any of the AAI mods I get massive amounts of stuttering when any of the buildings are present and operating, also the weird balances for recipes that kind of do not make sense such as; by the time you can get a self sustained electricity producer that runs on coal you can already get steam engines and replacing the water pump with one that requires electricity seems kind of moot. I would love to see them go full fuckin' hog and make everything require electricity including belts with a whole dedicated line of burner belts and burner stack inserters!  I enjoy the AAI mods that I have played but man the bud that makes them should really take a look at their code and see if they are doing something like 300 if statements every tick or something. Also it seems Krastorio does not properly override the default recipe changes from AAI industry so I get 2 recipes for a bunch of poo poo but that is on the Krastorio devs, I am getting oblivion flashbacks from incorrect mod load ordering  .
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Aug 11, 2019 04:57
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As regards AAI Industry stuttering...that's strange, I've never noticed it, and have quite a bit of time using it. Earendel is the guy that does AAI and Space Exploration...and he has definite opinionstm about how the game should work. Luckily, most of those non-opt-out opinions end up being shoved in his big fancy mod Space Exploration. So some of the most interesting mod-available bells and whistles from him also come with required annoyances, for example the Robot attrition mod. Please never mention the following within earshot of the guy quote:I would love to see them go full fuckin' hog and make everything require electricity including belts with a whole dedicated line of burner belts and burner stack inserters! Because he might be just the type of person to do that and then make it a required dependency of Space Exploration. Anything that extends the hand-feeding stage is a definite "no thanks" from me.
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Aug 11, 2019 09:32
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Fuzzy Mammal posted:I'm still catching up through the vods and am on episode 13 which is incidentally the episode where he debuted that logic. Even after he did it off screen in creative mode and dropped it in he had to debug for 90 minutes heh. But it's basically that. How full the droppoff points are, divided by stack size, along with count are sent to a central spot that turns it in to an averaged percentage. Well, he redid it yesterday again, and was nice enough to give me a blueprint of it so i could try to understand what he did. https://pastebin.com/pM3q0mTm He added another station to stop trains from going to the same offloader. It works like magic.
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Aug 11, 2019 13:24
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Half-wit posted:Luckily, most of those non-opt-out opinions end up being shoved in his big fancy mod Space Exploration. So some of the most interesting mod-available bells and whistles from him also come with required annoyances, for example the Robot attrition mod. Christ, I remember trying Space Exploration (not to be confused with Space Extension, which is fine) in the middle of my Krastorio save since Krastorio has some special adjustments for Space Exploration. Then I found my main factory being annihilated by meteorites (which cannot be turned off) and basic recipes were inexplicably changed to require different buildings or, in the case of electric furnaces, require a significantly more expensive intermediate instead of steel that also takes 10x as long to craft, so in order to get production science online I needed to build like 120 assemblers making these stupid heat-resistant platings or something. Plus it gates things like radars behind research for no reason whatsoever. Plus the aforementioned Robot Attrition, which is the dumbest thing ever. Tossed that stupid poo poo out right away.
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Aug 11, 2019 13:34
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In Space Exploration & Krastorio, you used to need the 2nd-stage Steel Furnaces, plus 5 Adv. Circuits plus 15 Heat Shielding, to make an Electric Furnace. It made sense because you took the older, inferior furnace, and kitted it out for new use. But then the recipe changed so you no longer need the Steel Furnace. You just slap some red cards and heat shielding together and BAM a furnace! 
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Aug 11, 2019 15:10
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You guys are missing out on the latest ridiculousness of Space Exploration. Apparently people were cranking up the resource patch amounts at game start using the built-in game sliders so that they'd have tons of resources on Nauvis...and this didn't fit with Earendel's vision of Space Exploration. He thought people needed a reason to expand past Nauvis that was resource-based. So now he has it so that Space Exploration reverts (basically) any extra resources by the sliders above 100% down to ~100%. This affected existing saves too, so suddenly people that had 5M copper patches feeding their bases now had 200k patches.
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Aug 11, 2019 17:01
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Oh my, that's just begging to become another GateGate situation. This guy doesn't go by Arthmoor anywhere else, does he?
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Aug 11, 2019 21:50
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Oh, FlowerChild makes mods for Factorio now?
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Aug 11, 2019 22:52
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Half-wit posted:200k patches. I don’t use RSO because I can’t find a way to set the starting area to not have minuscule patches that can only fit 4 miners and have 100k each. Do people like tiny patches of resources? It’s just super obnoxious to me.
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Aug 11, 2019 23:48
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No idea who Arthmoor is. As to the resource patches...no, I don't think a lot of people do enjoy having small patches; because having to creating more outposts just ends up being more busy work. That's actually one of the things that was really nice about Seablock (despite all the things that weren't nice)...the resources were effectively infinite; so once you got a setup up and running, it would stay up and running without having to continually find new resource patches to feed it.
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Aug 11, 2019 23:57
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Half-wit posted:No idea who Arthmoor is. Arthmoor was the mod author behind Gategate(stupid name, I know). The linked post really sums it up neatly, but if you want a tl;dr, Arthmoor is an admittedly good modder who has very strong opinions about his mods(and the resultant feature creep) and causes drama to follow in his wake everywhere with his stubbornness.
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Aug 12, 2019 00:34
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Wow, nice read. Yeah, Earendel isn't that bad yet. Let's place him in the proto-Arthmoor stages of "increasingly controlling modders" for now. I don't think there are any alternate mods aimed specifically at Space Exploration that undo some of his 'vision', but it might be interesting to see how he reacts if anyone does create any mods like that. Here, have a screenshot from a pinned post in his discord:  Nothing concerning there at all. Nope. Not trying to poison anyone against Space Exploration, it really is an interesting alternate end-game mod-set which has had something like 2 years worth of work put into it. I guess I just didn't feel comfortable talking about my concerns about the author on his discord...which is...uh...maybe an indicator.
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Aug 12, 2019 01:41
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Here, let me try to put some more positive vibes into the thread. Since we're talking Space Exploration, let's go through a few quick screenshots of what it adds at end-game. So, to start, the end of vanilla Factorio is launching a satellite.  Space Exploration takes that satellite, calls it a 'navigation satellite' and uses it to unlock new 'celestial bodies' in a navigation menu...which can be any of the following a 'star', an 'asteroid field', a 'planet', or a 'moon' (and its associated 'orbit'). Planets and moons end up being new ground surfaces like Nauvis with slightly different resource distributions (usually heavily favoring one particular resource). Stars, orbits, and asteroid fields are 'space' surfaces (which can sometimes have resources as well). Space is the only place where 'space science' can be done. So, initially, to get from Nauvis to one of these orbits, you'll have to build a cargo rocket.  A cargo rocket takes a not-insubstantial investment of resources in the form of rocket cargo sections, an escape capsule, and rocket fuel, and let you move your character and some cargo from one 'celestial body' to another. Rocket fuel is used completely (and is a variable amount dependent on which orbit you're launching to), escape capsules and rocket cargo sections can be partially re-covered and re-used. I've put something stupid like 120 hours into a Space Exploration map, and so I have a decently sized space platform in the orbit of Nauvis itself.  Here we see the counter to those annoying meteors...the great 'Meteor defense installation' (if you can't read it, the red bar says "placeholder art"...heck yeah buddy). Yes. This mod introduces an annoyance in the form of meteors and then gives you a tool to counteract the annoyance. There's actually meteor point defense buildings as well, but, they're usually not resource efficient to cover an entire planet/orbit.  Here is a picture of some space science labs, and some cargo pads that receive resupply rockets from Nauvis. Everything you see here had to be shipped on cargo rockets from Nauvis to Nauvis Orbit, as Nauvis Orbit (at least in my save) didn't have any resources natively present to mine/exploit. The two green buildings in the upper left are 'Signal Transmitter/Receivers' to send circuit network signals between Nauvis and Nauvis Orbit...this let me automate some of the rocket launching so certain resources can be ferried up automatically. So why go to space at all? Space science which can only be done in space, of course.  Here we see some space fluid handling buildings. In general, most of the space fluids aren't fully consumed by whatever process uses them, they're just slightly degraded. Example: thermofluid needs to be cooled, and you lose a little thermofluid in that process. The cooled thermofluid is fed to...  Supercomputers that do the heavy data processing of space science. These use cooled thermofluid, but return 'normal temperature' thermofluid...which then has to be recycled back to the start of the fluid handling stuff to be re-used. Initially there's 4 types of space science:  Energy Science (uh...applying electricity to things. Hot things. Cold things. Biological things. Rocks. Y'know, whatever.)  Astronomic Science (using telescopes to stare at the stars for fun and profit...but mainly for profit)  Material Science (I guess this is like banging rocks together...except in spaaaaaace)  Bio Science (grow space monsters in a dome, harvest space monsters from the dome, put space monsters in a tube and feed space monsters to other space monsters in another dome in a bio-feedback loop to generate biosludge to fuel your space bio science) There's four 'tiers' of these space sciences as well, that take increasingly complex setups and more resources with each. What you see above is only working 'tier 2' space sciences. Apparently there's even more past this, as there's a 'deep space' science pack, and I haven't even gotten to/touched the techs that let you build re-usable space-ships that can fly from one planet/orbit to another. I ran into some logistical issues on Nauvis about the time the resource patch changes were pushed by Earendel, and I just never got the...chutzpah? Gumption?...to go fix the logistical nightmare on the ground (as the todo list item featured in those screenshots is kind of indicating).
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Aug 12, 2019 02:39
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Given that Earendel added a license file, but misspelled it licence twice, and wrote his own "license" instead of using one that actual lawyers wrote, i'm fairly sure the dude is simply a teenager, if not biologically then mentally.
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Aug 12, 2019 02:48
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Mithaldu posted:Given that Earendel added a license file, but misspelled it licence twice, and wrote his own "license" instead of using one that actual lawyers wrote, i'm fairly sure the dude is simply a teenager, if not biologically then mentally. Or he's in the UK, where "licence" isn't a misspelling?
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Aug 12, 2019 07:38
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Huh, thanks. I'm wrong on that part then.
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Aug 12, 2019 10:58
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Earendel has some ok mod ideas and loads of time/energy but he also likes to add penalties to his mods like your meteors which end up being nothing but time consuming make work. He will never budge on them either and won't add options to switch them off (I remember the aggro from a while back when he added breakdowns for robots? Something like that anyway).
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Aug 12, 2019 16:27
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The meteors should have clued me in earlier. When your proposal for base attrition is somehow worse than vanilla biters, ya hosed up.
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Aug 12, 2019 16:47
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Ratzap posted:Earendel has some ok mod ideas and loads of time/energy but he also likes to add penalties to his mods like your meteors which end up being nothing but time consuming make work. He will never budge on them either and won't add options to switch them off (I remember the aggro from a while back when he added breakdowns for robots? Something like that anyway). The robot attrition is a separate mod at least so you can just not install but yeah, just busywork with no benefit.
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Aug 12, 2019 19:20
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I just launched my first satellite, capping off a 31 hour game, biters set to passive. It was fun to finally see this dang factory through to the end. I never got my nuclear plants going, because I spent too much time waiting for Kovarex processing to spin up. I got more comfortable with trains and designing factories for the logistics network, but I didn't venture into anything like scheduling trains or working with combinators. Mostly, I just threw another train of raw minerals at my smelters if the main bus thinned out. Oddly, I'm interested in starting all over again! I want to play with the biters as a threat, but I've got no idea how to fend them off early on. What do y'all do? Wall off everything and expand the wall perimeter as the factory grows? Set up turret posts around the edges of the factory? It sounds like a tremendous amount of work to keep the guns fed.
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Aug 12, 2019 23:39
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Really early keep turrets at the edges near high pollution emitters. Aggressively clear bases in your pollution cloud, turret creep can ease harder bases until you get a tank. If there are clear choke points then wall those off with some turrets. If you want to wall the whole perimeter running a belt of ammo around can be expensive to set up but is cheap to continue operating. It does make expanding out a bit more difficult if you didn't leave enough space, and it's not really necessary early on. I save the wall for when I have a tank, clear bases far from my cloud, and then wall from there. Use a train to transport ammo to the wall. Make AP rounds ASAP. They do a lot more damage than regular ammo.
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Aug 12, 2019 23:47
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Also beware of rocks. I've died so many times when my truck hits a rock I didn't see, and the biters that I aggroed by shooting up their base eats me in 2 seconds as I desperately try to reverse away from the rock.
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Aug 12, 2019 23:56
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Power Walrus posted:I just launched my first satellite, capping off a 31 hour game, biters set to passive. It was fun to finally see this dang factory through to the end. I never got my nuclear plants going, because I spent too much time waiting for Kovarex processing to spin up. I got more comfortable with trains and designing factories for the logistics network, but I didn't venture into anything like scheduling trains or working with combinators. Mostly, I just threw another train of raw minerals at my smelters if the main bus thinned out. Generally speaking, two turrets with half a stack of ammo each, and walls around them is enough to defend most areas. Sometimes I will double-wall a particularly intense chokepoint and put up a bunch of turrets. Place them so there are no or insignificant gaps in coverage. Take advantage of cliffs and trees where you can, if only a few biters at a time can get into range of your turrets they will be very effective. The first attack is the worst one, so beeline turrets and get a bit of ammo production going and you'll be fine. Personally I just hand-feed my guns for the most part, belting ammo around is extremely time consuming both to set up and revise. Late game you can use logistics bots to feed ammo to your turrets. Aggressively clear biter nests out of your pollution cloud. The amount of biters that will come at you if you let them absorb a lot of pollution is insane. Early game you do this by walking turrets into range of worms and repairing them to tank the damage. Once you get the car, you can chuck grenades out of it to kill things. Good news on nuclear : it takes forever to accumulate enough U-235 for Kovarex, but you can use all the U-238 you're producing to make hugely upgraded ammunition in the meanwhile.
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Aug 13, 2019 00:14
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Nuclear ammo is so good if you have the U-238 but I'd definitely place that in the mid to early in the late game at least. It's really overkill before huge biters and spitters.
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Aug 13, 2019 00:59
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How does one view pollution? I don't see the red cloud in my map mode. I had trouble with biters early on when I was still using burner drills for mining. I built some walls and turrets which were well worth it. In my last session I automated military science; the biters were pretty easy before, now they're a joke and I don't even have a tank yet. I'd like them to be a bit harder, but I know well to be careful what I wish for.
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Aug 13, 2019 11:47
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One of the buttons right below the map displays/hides pollution. Should be on by default though.
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Aug 13, 2019 12:26
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uPen posted:The robot attrition is a separate mod at least so you can just not install but yeah, just busywork with no benefit. Nah, last I checked it's set as an obligatory dependency. And then it's also hardcoded to not let you turn it off. (Though you can set it's multiplier down to 0.01 or 0.001x, which pretty much disables it.) It's the same with the meteors, you can't disable them, but atleast you can make them rare enough that you'll get 1 every couple of hours at most. It just says so much about Earendel that even though you can aaalmost disable the mods, he refuses to let people just flick them off.
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Aug 13, 2019 12:41
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I'm not sure that tweak does anything besides on Nauvis itself though. All of the other planets/orbits/whatever can and will have higher robot attrition.
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Aug 13, 2019 12:50
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I remember a few weeks ago briefly talking about a way to make the environment look polluted rather than just being a red cloud on your map. Now that i've been thinking more about it there isn't really any way to do it besides just have a separate sprite entity with a non-interfering collision mask on top of everything? Does that seem right to everyone who's done more modding than I have.
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Aug 13, 2019 14:48
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You could have an alternate terrain tileset with polluted tiles but the base terrain is already pretty drab.
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Aug 13, 2019 15:21
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Power Walrus posted:Oddly, I'm interested in starting all over again! I want to play with the biters as a threat, but I've got no idea how to fend them off early on. What do y'all do? Wall off everything and expand the wall perimeter as the factory grows? Set up turret posts around the edges of the factory? It sounds like a tremendous amount of work to keep the guns fed. Along with what's already been said, I'd recommend that until you're comfortable with the early-game arms-race :
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Aug 13, 2019 16:18
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I'm curious about trying the basic seablock posted earlier. Does it mess with my current saves?
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Aug 13, 2019 20:49
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Seablock requires starting from scratch, otherwise it's pointless.
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Aug 13, 2019 21:46
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You can turn on and off mods at will and it will never retroactively affect your saves unless you load them and then save again. There’s also a button to sync mods with the selected save
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Aug 13, 2019 21:53
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FnF posted:Along with what's already been said, I'd recommend that until you're comfortable with the early-game arms-race : Thanks for all the advice, thread! I started a Krastorio game with lots of cliffs and a big starting area. I re-prioritized to setting up a small base that makes turrets and ammo before I even automate red science. The game is fun again! Also having all these new recipes forces me off my dependency on blueprints.
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Aug 13, 2019 21:58
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