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536 posted:Its not? But they are responsible to make sure poor people are getting fed, whether by the gov themselves or aid. They can't pretend nothing is wrong for years and hold their hands over their ears. They refuse to accept """food aid""" from the country currently starving them. comedyblissoption posted:if you're cheering for the side that literally orders tankers full of food to turn back from delivering it to venezuela, you are not in favor of feeding the venezuelan people
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Aug 15, 2019 02:30
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536 posted:Maduro said only a year ago "there is no food crisis, we need no aid". So yeah, he is kinda a big problem. And since then he has said he'd accept any aid given through the UN instead of known CIA front USAID, so perhaps he WAS a problem but he isn't currently a problem, unless you think countries should be obligated to let the CIA smuggle guns to death squads just because they wrote the words 'food aid' onto the box.
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Aug 15, 2019 02:32
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lol remember when that truck full of """food aid""" got set on fire by opposition who I guess didn't get the message, and then its cargo started exploding and poo poo as we all know rice and bread so often does
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Aug 15, 2019 02:33
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it was really big popcorn kernels, don't be a conspiracy theorist haha anyone who's been reading the c-spam venezuela thread had his mind well trained to survive the epstein brain syndrome
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Aug 15, 2019 02:36
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536 posted:Maduro said only a year ago "there is no food crisis, we need no aid". So yeah, he is kinda a big problem. you loving idiot. he said he wont take humanitarian aid from the US while the un and red cross and others were literally operating in the country, you goddamn jackass, you embarrassing buffoon.
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Aug 15, 2019 02:36
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to be fair those US "food aid" shipments were carried out with the intent of helping venezuelans eat eat lead
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Aug 15, 2019 02:40
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Epic High Five posted:lol remember when that truck full of """food aid""" got set on fire by opposition who I guess didn't get the message, and then its cargo started exploding and poo poo as we all know rice and bread so often does I saw the movie "the martian" and they made a bomb using nothing but sugar in zero gravity so obviously that's what happened
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Aug 15, 2019 02:40
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Epic High Five posted:lol remember when that truck full of """food aid""" got set on fire by opposition who I guess didn't get the message, and then its cargo started exploding and poo poo as we all know rice and bread so often does look uh it was obviously uh cooking oil
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Aug 15, 2019 02:40
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536 posted:Maduro said only a year ago "there is no food crisis, we need no aid". So yeah, he is kinda a big problem. Was he talking to a waiter?
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Aug 15, 2019 03:16
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3 posted:they're accepting aid that isn't incredibly obvious CIA arms shipments lol remember how the torched flatbed truck that was full of aid ended up having steel cable laying underneath all those boxes? using steel cable to torture and asphyxiate people has been a favorite of American-backed paramilitaries from Indonesia to Nicaragua. Pener Kropoopkin has issued a correction as of 03:36 on Aug 15, 2019 |
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Aug 15, 2019 03:19
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is it so hard to not crosspost D&D? if you like them so much go post there tia
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Aug 15, 2019 03:27
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im not your auntie
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Aug 15, 2019 03:41
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Destroy the School of the Americas IMHO.
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Aug 15, 2019 04:03
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BEAR GRYLLZ posted:to be fair those US "food aid" shipments were carried out with the intent of helping venezuelans eat
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Aug 15, 2019 04:07
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:remember how the torched flatbed truck that was full of aid ended up having steel cable laying underneath all those boxes? using steel cable to torture and asphyxiate people has been a favorite of American-backed paramilitaries from Indonesia to Nicaragua. lol remember how there was literally a CIA linked plane that had been making constant back-and-forth trips between Caracas and Miami stuffed to the gills with guns and everyone was like 'um look that's obviously a civilian automatic rifle it can't be from the cia!'
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Aug 15, 2019 05:09
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uninterrupted posted:lol remember how there was literally a CIA linked plane that had been making constant back-and-forth trips between Caracas and Miami stuffed to the gills with guns and everyone was like 'um look that's obviously a civilian automatic rifle it can't be from the cia!' Oh yeah, I remember it had to be explained that many standard issue military assault rifles can't even go full auto.
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Aug 15, 2019 05:38
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just remembered that there was an opposition guy photographed with an AR-57 lol if you don't get it, the AR-57 is a specialty upper receiver for the AR-15 that accepts P90 magazines; it's a range toy for rich idiots which means bolton et al 100% armed the opposition with gimmick weapons via the gun show loophole
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Aug 15, 2019 05:47
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MonsieurChoc posted:Destroy the School of the Americas IMHO. Is that a thing that still exists? I sort of figured it was gone tbh. Also I wonder if we lived in a world where China had like, an actual navy, what kind of confrontations we’d see if they challenged a US blockade. I imagine it would very quickly become Cuban Missle Crisis Electric Boogaloo.
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Aug 15, 2019 05:51
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3 posted:just remembered that there was an opposition guy photographed with an AR-57 lol Seeing those guys ineffectually plink off rounds at the air force base from the overpass was so loving funny.
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Aug 15, 2019 05:53
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dayum, the 57th version of the assault rifle
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Aug 15, 2019 05:54
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Lightning Knight posted:Is that a thing that still exists? I sort of figured it was gone tbh. probably not well, the USN is really good at the conventional ship-to-ship warfare which is why militaries like iran's and china's are more focused on Anti Access/Area Denial (A2/AD) strategies/systems (ie overwhelm their billion dollar toys with cheap and numerous unguided missiles) if you want to beat the US you don't play their game
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Aug 15, 2019 06:13
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yellowcar posted:probably not well, the USN is really good at the conventional ship-to-ship warfare which is why militaries like iran's and china's are more focused on Anti Access/Area Denial (A2/AD) strategies/systems (ie overwhelm their billion dollar toys with cheap and numerous unguided missiles) yeah, to be clear I’m not criticizing the decision to not have a heavy navy, I’m just sort of imagining really. It’s hard to ask questions like that without getting a bunch of Red Storm Rising bullshit wankery tho.
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Aug 15, 2019 06:20
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Lightning Knight posted:Is that a thing that still exists? I sort of figured it was gone tbh. It changed name but is still around. Much like Elliott Abrams.
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Aug 15, 2019 06:22
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Lightning Knight posted:yeah, to be clear I’m not criticizing the decision to not have a heavy navy, I’m just sort of imagining really. It’s hard to ask questions like that without getting a bunch of Red Storm Rising bullshit wankery tho. but yeah, i think Venezuelan Empanada Crisis too probably
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Aug 15, 2019 06:36
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MonsieurChoc posted:It changed name but is still around. Or Blackwater. God what a damning fact it is that Blackwater still exists.
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Aug 15, 2019 07:17
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Aug 15, 2019 09:01
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MonsieurChoc posted:Destroy the School of the Americas IMHO. Wow, what do you have against education and learning? At a time of deteriorating public education, you really want to go around shutting down more public schools?
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Aug 15, 2019 09:26
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I remember watching that whole "food 'aid' truck" fiasco live and Bolton et al all live tweeting how horrible it was for Maduro to want so badly for his own people to starve as to order the trucks burned and the US should totally invade and then when the footage of the opposition throwing Molotovs onto them D&D was like "Uh, who care, that was never the point, listen Maduro is the bad guy here and..."
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Aug 15, 2019 10:08
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even if you were a stupid loving idiot who had no idea of the context of american interventions, the spectacle of americans insisting evil maduro keeps denying food aid while the americans at every opportunity try to prevent food from reaching venezuela should be enough for even the most credulous dumbass to realize what is going on here
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Aug 15, 2019 12:37
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My favorite School of the Americas thing is that the Clintons made them require a mandatory class on human rights and international law. The place that got into internal disagreements about which horrible animal to pipe into leftist womens vaginas to kill them. Just peak sadlib lunacy.
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Aug 15, 2019 14:07
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I'm late to the talk about LVH but oh well, the point of the book I thought is that it demonstrates that industrializing empires in the 19th century, especially britain, were able to take advantage of the fact that they could externalize the costs of industrialization on their colonies, reorienting the agriculture and production of goods towards the needs of the industrializing metropolis, such that colonies like india had their normal patterns of consumption and production completely disrupted so that britain could ship in the needed food to meet the daily caloric demands of factory workers at home. this had the effect of killing millions of people in these places as they were exporting the food they needed to live during periods of weather disrupting agricultural production. british administrators knew this and largely did not care. the soviet union and china both went through a rapid industrialization process during the 20th century but lacked the same ability to externalize the costs of the process and it ended up affecting their own citizens -- i guess you could argue that the ukraine was a soviet colony in a sense but again the famine wasn't limited to that geographic region. industrialization isn't pretty but we tend to excuse the gross destruction of millions of lives in the 19th century, while focusing in on the countries that were late to the industrialization game in the 20th century if they don't have the correct ideology when they're doing it. this paragraph is the normal caveat about how one isn't to excuse the loss of life of the other and only a bad faith reading of what I've written would assume that, I"m sure someone is going to ignore it anyway. but there's definitely a double standard being applied here.
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Aug 15, 2019 14:39
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it's pretty easy to find fault with the current Venezuelan government with respect to the food ongoing food crisis -- the price fixing has lead to people reselling cheap food in colombia --- but the idea that if the government got rid of maduro, changed some of its economic policies with respect to food, but didn't install a US-friendly leader that everything would go back to normal is hilarious and wrong.
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Aug 15, 2019 14:43
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Dreylad posted:it's pretty easy to find fault with the current Venezuelan government with respect to the food ongoing food crisis -- the price fixing has lead to people reselling cheap food in colombia --- but the idea that if the government got rid of maduro, changed some of its economic policies with respect to food, but didn't install a US-friendly leader that everything would go back to normal is hilarious and wrong. Yeah i agree here- its not like maduro cant be criticized (I also listened to that RWN interview) but that 99% of the legitiimate criticism is just going to equally apply to whoever replaces him. Like Guiado's people literally, literally can't organize a gently caress in a whorehouse without getting robbed and murdered and yet theyre supposed to reform the oil companies, magic up tax revenue, crack down on corruption, and establish a more (allegedly) democratic system? The US doesnt give a poo poo as long as the money they previously used in bread and circuses instead goes to the Exxon child prostitute fund. Its not that Maduro is a saint but that the forces he represents are good and its not like the opposition is any more competent
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Aug 15, 2019 14:57
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Dreylad posted:it's pretty easy to find fault with the current Venezuelan government with respect to the food ongoing food crisis -- the price fixing has lead to people reselling cheap food in colombia --- but the idea that if the government got rid of maduro, changed some of its economic policies with respect to food, but didn't install a US-friendly leader that everything would go back to normal is hilarious and wrong. The current price fixing scheme seems to have been around since the mid 90s at the least. It may be an unfortunate case if not thinking outside the box, and/or the thought of alternatives had conflicts with different schemes in other parts of the economy. They could have implemented some insane means testing...
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Aug 15, 2019 15:03
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Here's Juan Guaido, who declared himself president and demanded elections within 30 days, taking a strong stance... against holding elections! https://twitter.com/debarra_Toir/status/1161484646582038528 It's actually not surprising at all considering the opposition (on US order) boycotted the last round of elections and used that boycott to declare Maduro illegitimate. It's the same plan again here. Too unpopular to actually beat Maduro in an election, their best bet is to refuse to acknowledge elections, dishonestly denounce the Maduro government for being undemocratic, and keep applying international pressure led by the US's starvation sanctions in the hope that so many people die horrible starvation deaths that the government will collapse and they can, at long last, enrich themselves by giving away Venezuelan's oil wealth to Exxon.
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Aug 15, 2019 15:09
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Dreylad posted:I'm late to the talk about LVH but oh well, the point of the book I thought is that it demonstrates that industrializing empires in the 19th century, especially britain, were able to take advantage of the fact that they could externalize the costs of industrialization on their colonies, reorienting the agriculture and production of goods towards the needs of the industrializing metropolis, such that colonies like india had their normal patterns of consumption and production completely disrupted so that britain could ship in the needed food to meet the daily caloric demands of factory workers at home. this had the effect of killing millions of people in these places as they were exporting the food they needed to live during periods of weather disrupting agricultural production. british administrators knew this and largely did not care. Thanks, that was a great answer to my question! Unsupported developmentalism has pretty terrible consequences, yeah. Not referring to colonies as "supporters", rather referring to the later, not (immediately) colonial European latecomers as well as the countries that became protectorates of the USSR as receiving crucial support from the international frameworks they were embedded in. I'm pretty confident capitalism couldn't have become a complete economic system without something analogous to colonialism alongside it to provide minimal stability. When you think about it, the USSR or PRC could never have developed as they did without historical events requiring the existence of colonial powers first teaching their populations in practice that there was something even worse out there, and an ideology that stressed how it would return without industrial development. There is no authoritarianism strong enough to hold without either immense superiority of arms through production techniques that cannot be taken hold of by the ruled in a civil war, or a level of consent from them.
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Aug 15, 2019 15:12
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lmao importing thread drama 536 posts in this thread bitch
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Aug 15, 2019 16:31
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Fast Luck posted:Here's Juan Guaido, who declared himself president and demanded elections within 30 days, taking a strong stance... against holding elections! Guaido should be elected to the position of Corpse Lying in a Ditch Somewhere imo
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Aug 15, 2019 16:34
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Frijolero posted:Guaido should be elected to the position of Corpse Lying in a Ditch Somewhere imo no point, you kill him and another US-educated middle manager gets extruded out of a tube to say the exact same poo poo and possibly less stupidly.
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Aug 15, 2019 16:37
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I actually think it'd be really funny if they let guaido come back and campaign unmolested, but he never would because he knows he'd lose.
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Aug 15, 2019 17:09
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