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The NFA process is also artificially inflated. They do a regular rear end background check, according to the woman I spoke with at NFA branch. Every gun control measure mentioned disproportionately effect the poor- the very people who need the means of protection the most.
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Aug 16, 2019 03:58
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If we’re talking about reducing everyday gun deaths outside of the context of mass shootings, then I’d rather see a BATFE and DOJ fully empowered and resourced to actually loving go after straw purchasers, which have to be the biggest source of illegally trafficked guns in this country. Obviously this varies at the state level, but the feds fail to even investigate a meaningful number of 4473 denials, let alone prosecute the purchasers. That would go a long way toward actually reducing the kinds of gun deaths that you may or may not see on the news. And frankly, there’s no loving way I’d be in favor of going full UK on our gun laws. Not in the era of Donald Trump and ascendant authoritarian right wing ethnic nationalist movements, not just in this country but across the world. I realize who the audience is here as I’m saying this, but I’ve been to too many conflict and post-conflict zones to think that the US is somehow immune to a situation wherein the state is unable or unwilling to protect parts of the citizenry for political or existential reasons. I’m in favor of UBC for gun sales/transfers and red flag laws if both are designed to be user-friendly and properly codified against arbitrary abuses. I’m with you on storage laws. I don’t question your motives or your frustration with violence in this country. For me, this is just an issue with more nuance than I think the diehards on either side care to acknowledge. And since I get the feeling that McNally is going to come into this thread firing off sixers like a Union soldier charging into battle firing a seven-shot Spencer from the hip, might as well queue me up for one too.
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Aug 16, 2019 04:02
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bulletsponge13 posted:Every gun control measure mentioned disproportionately effect the poor- the very people who need the means of protection the most. Most poor people do not need guns. They need food and medical care more.
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Aug 16, 2019 04:09
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I'm in no way ever going to support any measures which leave enforcement in the hand of a group of heavily armed individuals that already think they have carte blanche to murder minority groups.
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Aug 16, 2019 04:14
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538 has a good breakdown of the various kinds of gun deaths in the US and achievable fixes for each type. https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/gun-deaths/
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Aug 16, 2019 04:14
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pantslesswithwolves posted:If we’re talking about reducing everyday gun deaths outside of the context of mass shootings, then I’d rather see a BATFE and DOJ fully empowered and resourced to actually loving go after straw purchasers, which have to be the biggest source of illegally trafficked guns in this country. Obviously this varies at the state level, but the feds fail to even investigate a meaningful number of 4473 denials, let alone prosecute the purchasers. That would go a long way toward actually reducing the kinds of gun deaths that you may or may not see on the news. Gun owners in this country remind me a lot of the people in those conflict zones the government is failing to protect the citizens from.
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Aug 16, 2019 04:15
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Well, cool dude. You got your one liner in, and I’m taking a break from this thread for a few days. Peace.
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Aug 16, 2019 04:32
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nm i think i read this wrong
Proud Christian Mom fucked around with this message at 04:38 on Aug 16, 2019 |
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Aug 16, 2019 04:33
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socialize rifle ownership
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Aug 16, 2019 04:39
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Ken Bone Comeback posted:socialize rifle ownership That's dangerous--people need training. Universal conscription?
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Aug 16, 2019 05:03
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Maybe socialize riflemanship?
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Aug 16, 2019 05:13
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Free rifle with each enlistment.
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Aug 16, 2019 05:16
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Laranzu posted:Unless the point of that article is that he technically isn't because he is too dementia addled to be held responsible then yeah it's probably Koch funded. It's not a long article. It's about 3/4 talking about why Trump is a white supremacist and 1/4 some guy from the Anti Defamation League saying 
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Aug 16, 2019 05:32
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piL posted:That's dangerous--people need training. Universal conscription? high school marksmanship/safe handling classes but gently caress trying to figure out how to make that safe. I hope that the NRA gets obliterated or implodes at some point and ranges stop getting pressured to be part of their death cult. There need to be more public ranges offering free/cheap education and practice so people get to learn in a safe, healthy, and supportive environment. Scouts got me over flinching even with black powder and 12ga but that was the mid 90s and it was all about marksmanship and scoring rather than anything even alluding to aiming at people outside of the Three Rules Of Gun Safety. It helped that someone covered the cost of a loving van load of .22 so jamboree was basically a weekend of free shooting (the black powder was like a quarter per shot and shotgun was $1 for 6 shells and 6 clays) interspersed with orienteering, firekeeping, camping, and how to pin and kill a pygmy rattler when you accidentally set a lawn chair down on one that was quietly chilling in the sandy soil of Starkey Park. On top of systemic stuff like NICS for every transfer and NFA expansion there needs to be more adolescent exposure to guns in a context that doesn't have space for rahowa poo poo and all the hamfisted abstractions so kids don't get drawn into the racist delusional world of hero vs horde. FAUXTON fucked around with this message at 06:09 on Aug 16, 2019 |
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Aug 16, 2019 06:04
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bird food bathtub posted:I didn't even think of the payouts, I was looking at it from the other side of the exchange. It's always presented as some kind of invisible hand solution that just magics away all the problems because free market while not "infringing" anyone's "rights" and all I can ever think of is everyone darker than a paper bag trying to have the same rights in this magical free market wonder land and hearing, "Well based on your neighborhood, level of education, prior history and all these other completely neutral totally not-racist factors it's going to cost you twenty times as much as Whitey McDrivenSnow over here to have the same access to your rights." Can we at least all agree on hating loving libertarians
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Aug 16, 2019 07:19
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Ken Bone Comeback posted:socialize rifle ownership The Socialist Rifle Association had their membership in the National Shooting Sports Foundation revoked, with no reason given, within a week of it being granted. 
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Aug 16, 2019 08:31
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Not the right kind of american gun owner
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Aug 16, 2019 09:54
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bulletsponge13 posted:
Protection from what? Other people with guns? Having their lives legislated away? Financial serfdom? The other people shooting them shouldn't have guns. The cops ARE going to kill you no matter how many you have - unless you're rich- and you're now just an armed financial slave. I'm not seeing how this train of thought makes any more sense than the normal 2nd amendment fetish of fighting off the US government drone fleet with their AR.
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Aug 16, 2019 10:45
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Laranzu posted:Protection from what? Other people with guns? Having their lives legislated away? Financial serfdom? It's literally the same fetish. Apparently NRA talking points are suddenly valid if we're talking about the "wrong kind" of gun control. Libertarians are dumb because they want everything solved only though the *free market*. That doesn't mean regulations that apply market incentives for responsible behavior can't be a useful part of a larger solution. Or that making gun owners pay into funding that would help victims of their hobby is a bad idea.
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Aug 16, 2019 12:42
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Historically, gun control has never been about safety. It's about keeping guns away from "undesirables" mostly the poor and minorities. The only way we should have training and safe storage laws and other common sense gun control is that if the government will provide training and storage means for the poor.
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Aug 16, 2019 12:54
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bulletsponge13 posted:Historically, gun control has never been about safety. It's about keeping guns away from "undesirables" mostly the poor and minorities. While that may be true, it is not an argument against stricter gun control. Also: Libertarians are just GOP with Pot. They suck.
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Aug 16, 2019 13:02
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CommieGIR posted:While that may be true, it is not an argument against stricter gun control. The same police you can't trust with behavioral profiling because it always turns into racial profiling are the ones who would be executing this.
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Aug 16, 2019 13:08
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bulletsponge13 posted:
The 2A doesn't read "Shall be provided a firearm". If purchasing a gun becomes expensive or onerous then there will be less guns overall in circulation. This also still falls into the same line of reasoning you used above. Why do the poor need to be armed in the first place? What is the benefit to them? *Not trying to insinuate the poor are inherently violent criminals incapable of being responsible. Just trying to get the line of reasoning explained.
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Aug 16, 2019 13:26
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Steezo posted:The same police you can't trust with behavioral profiling because it always turns into racial profiling are the ones who would be executing this. Or we could just fix the police too. Nobody here is pretending that isnt an issue. The argument that gun control would be enforced by police isnt really a good argument against it.
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Aug 16, 2019 13:30
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CommieGIR posted:
This isn't really accurate. Libertarians are sometimes GOP with pot (especially recently). Sometimes they're anarcho capitalists, anarcho communists, collectivist, minarchists, and every level of moderation between all of those extremes. It's still a completely disparate party whose members who pick up and abandon darlings with regularity.
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Aug 16, 2019 13:45
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Don't blame the weed for peoples' poo poo politics. Blame the politics for making people want to smoke weed.
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Aug 16, 2019 13:53
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https://twitter.com/KFILE/status/1162350147956817921?s=19 https://twitter.com/dmartosko/status/1162346520743686146?s=19 At least media discussions haven't focused at all on HOW ARE YOU GOING TO CONVERT THE MAGAS, though HOW ARE YOU GOING TO CONVERT PEOPLE WITH ECONOMIC ANXIETY isn't a whole lot better really.
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Aug 16, 2019 14:14
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CRUSTY MINGE posted:Don't blame the weed for peoples' poo poo politics. Blame the politics for making people want to smoke weed. I meant that as its their only upside.
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Aug 16, 2019 14:26
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Trump wants to acquire Greenland because he knows Puerto Rican statehood is inevitable and wants to counter it with a Scandinavian territory because he wants Scandinavian blood to counter the increased Latin representation, little does he know Greenland has a sizable Inuit population too.
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Aug 16, 2019 15:52
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Nah. He wants an island to stash the concentration camps on, but Guantanamo is too close to Mar-A-Lago. Fake edit: I wonder how long it'll take before Poe's law hits this post.
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Aug 16, 2019 15:59
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truman tried to buy greenland too fwiw
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Aug 16, 2019 16:00
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maybe he was getting a presidential history lesson and the only thing he latched onto was the louisiana purchase because his smooth brain can only see real estate and he asked what land we've tried and failed to purchase because he's all about the deals
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Aug 16, 2019 16:02
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Vasudus posted:maybe he was getting a presidential history lesson and the only thing he latched onto was the louisiana purchase because his smooth brain can only see real estate and he asked what land we've tried and failed to purchase because he's all about the deals thats my thought trying to get a big deal in place for the election
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Aug 16, 2019 16:04
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Buy Greenland now for $100m and flip it in 20 years when the sea ice completely melts. Genius.
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Aug 16, 2019 16:13
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Suicide Watch posted:Trump wants to acquire Greenland because he knows Puerto Rican statehood is inevitable and wants to counter it with a Scandinavian territory because he wants Scandinavian blood to counter the increased Latin representation, little does he know Greenland has a sizable Inuit population too. I'm not gonna look it up, but I'll guess that there are like 10 times as many Puerto Ricans as Greenlanders Vasudus posted:maybe he was getting a presidential history lesson and the only thing he latched onto was the louisiana purchase because his smooth brain can only see real estate and he asked what land we've tried and failed to purchase because he's all about the deals This is what I think, too. The Trump presidential legacy has to be a real estate thing. To him, anyway. Obv, the true Trump legacy will be the rise of facism as mainstream politics in the US and white nationalist paramilitaries carrying out campaigns of violence on our streets
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Aug 16, 2019 16:34
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Amazon has entire department dedicated to tweeting as if they had a gun held to their head. https://twitter.com/dulcedecommie/status/1161962540718366720?s=09
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Aug 16, 2019 16:45
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There's about 56k people living on Greenland in total.
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Aug 16, 2019 16:45
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AY GIYS LET US GIV UP UOR SOCIALIZED MEDICIN UND SAFTY NETS UND JOIN UNITED STATES UF WHITE TRASH BORK BORK BORK!!
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Aug 16, 2019 16:47
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-Anders posted:There's about 56k people living on Greenland in total. Oh ok so like 50 times as many boricuas
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Aug 16, 2019 16:53
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Buying a place that has a lot of water seems at the very least not dumb. Sucks for the people living there. In any case Trump is not going to be able to accomplish it, because it takes work and involves diplomacy.
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Aug 16, 2019 17:02
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