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Al! posted:hot take: world war 1 was essentially a war fought over which empire was going to become the new roman empire. it essentially ended in a stalemate, which is why ww2 happened and the united states somehow got the title away from europe Ottomans + Vatican were the heirs of the roman empire in 1914 so yeah. Ottman Sultan even had as one of his titles, Caesar ruler of rome or some poo poo. on the other side it's the roman church
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Sep 5, 2019 02:13
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Modest Mao posted:Ottomans + Vatican were the heirs of the roman empire in 1914 lol no
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Sep 5, 2019 02:16
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"heirs to the roman empire in the 20th century" is mostly a nonsensical statement but if you have to assign meaning to it, the Ottomans, Russians, and Vatican are the leading candidates
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Sep 5, 2019 02:19
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The heir to the Roman Empire is Israel.
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Sep 5, 2019 02:24
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i am the last caesar, bow down binch
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Sep 5, 2019 02:27
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The only way to beat the Romans was to use one weird trick like convincing them it was a good idea to send a column through the Teutoburg Forest
etalian has issued a correction as of 02:56 on Sep 5, 2019 |
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Sep 5, 2019 02:29
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etalian posted:The only way to beat the Romans was to use one weird trick like convincing it was a good idea to send a column through the Teutoburg Forest or starve the armed goths at Adrianople
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Sep 5, 2019 02:52
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Scionix posted:I was listening to the ancient history podcast i was recommended and yooooo the minoans sound tite as gently caress most of what pop history tells us about them was made up or heavily embellished by a shellshocked ww1 vet to present a more 'civilized' ancient culture than the mainland Greeks the art was 'restored' by a pair of art deco artists, which is why it looks so much like art deco
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Sep 5, 2019 03:20
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Modest Mao posted:Ottomans + Vatican were the heirs of the roman empire in 1914 so yeah. Ottman Sultan even had as one of his titles, Caesar ruler of rome or some poo poo. on the other side it's the roman church "There is a Third Rome!" -A voice in Moscow, orthodoxly.
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Sep 5, 2019 03:40
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I thought the Ottomans called it Rūm.Captain_Maclaine posted:"There is a Third Rome!" -A voice in Moscow, orthodoxly.
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Sep 5, 2019 04:26
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Uranium posted:I thought the Ottomans called it Rūm. and the Romans called it Roma, it's a word like any other and varied by language
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Sep 5, 2019 04:38
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Uranium posted:I thought the Ottomans called it Rūm. Depending on the map it's variously the Sultanate of Rome/Rum/Rūm. All callbacks to that older empire who's glories everyone was trying to appropriate for themselves.
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Sep 5, 2019 04:40
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edit: I retract my dumb comment
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Sep 5, 2019 10:04
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Pretty sure the Turks in Anatolia called themselves the Sultanate of Rum because they made it in the land of the Romans, not because they were claiming to be the new Roman empire.
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Sep 5, 2019 13:04
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What is the etymology behind the Roma people group vs Rome and all that
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Sep 5, 2019 13:08
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mastershakeman posted:What is the etymology behind the Roma people group vs Rome and all that Roma people are the true descendants of the Roman empire and are roaming their lands to this day
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Sep 5, 2019 13:11
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Rome-ing the lands
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Sep 5, 2019 13:13
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Flavius Aetass posted:Pretty sure the Turks in Anatolia called themselves the Sultanate of Rum because they made it in the land of the Romans, not because they were claiming to be the new Roman empire. apparently Rum was what the turks called greek, so its more like Kingdom of the Greeks although i guess they called them that because the byzantine greeks considered themselves roman anyhow
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Sep 5, 2019 13:16
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Dalael posted:Roma people are the true descendants of the Roman empire and are roaming their lands to this day Somehow I feel like this isn't how they got their name because everyone who hated them (everyone) would have erased that name Unless that's the reason they got called gypsies?
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Sep 5, 2019 13:17
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mastershakeman posted:What is the etymology behind the Roma people group vs Rome and all that got roman hands
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Sep 5, 2019 13:18
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mastershakeman posted:Somehow I feel like this isn't how they got their name because everyone who hated them (everyone) would have erased that name I was making a bad joke and i really have no idea how they got the name Roma. It would be purely accidental if what I said was right, and it would really be sad if true.
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Sep 5, 2019 13:50
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Hentai Jihadist posted:apparently Rum was what the turks called greek, so its more like Kingdom of the Greeks yeah, the romans of the greek-speaking world called themselves romanoi long after the western empire fell it was a cultural signifier more than anything to do with rome, the city Dalael posted:I was making a bad joke and i really have no idea how they got the name Roma. It would be purely accidental if what I said was right, and it would really be sad if true. it's unrelated to rome. the term "gypsies" came about from europeans thinking the romani people were from egypt
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Sep 5, 2019 14:23
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How does everyone feel about the term "Dark Ages" and the associated connotations? I have to say I'm in favor of it as it in the sense that Europe really did plunge into widespread anarchy and depopulation for centuries (i.e. it wasn't just a cultural blending/transition, but was violent and resulted in dramatically decreased quality of life for nearly everyone in Europe), but on the other hand it's a very regionally specific term to use for a broad period of time (e.g. the Muslims weren't sharing that experience).
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Sep 5, 2019 14:33
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Nice try Otto III, but I know that's it really TYOOL 1722
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Sep 5, 2019 14:38
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twoday posted:Nice try Otto III, but I know that's it really TYOOL 1722 this is the weirdest conspiracy because it relies on the chinese etc. also being in on it somehow
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Sep 5, 2019 14:42
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There's also that one that it's even more ridiculous that was written by some Russian guy that conflates the Hunnic and Mongolian invasions, among other things, and suggests that all of recorded history prior to the French revolution took place over a span of approximately 500 years I like the term Dark Ages, because it emphasizes how sunny it must have been during the Roman and Early Medieval warm periods which bookend it
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Sep 5, 2019 14:52
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global warming is good now according to history scientists typical LIEberal logic 
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Sep 5, 2019 14:55
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Just wait until the post-Brexit economy has a glorious resurgence once British wine exports return to 12th century levels
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Sep 5, 2019 14:59
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Flavius Aetass posted:How does everyone feel about the term "Dark Ages" and the associated connotations? There's nothing wrong with it. It perfectly describes the time period and even is a much better term for the same period compared to competing terms like "information age" or "21st century"
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Sep 5, 2019 15:34
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Mostly I wish we'd specify Dark Age of Europe or something, cuz plenty of the rest of the world was bangin' during that time period. Buncha whities chasing each other around the woods with axes hardly matters to China, etc.
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Sep 5, 2019 17:09
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I'm of two minds about the term. On the one hand it is reasonably descriptive of the early, chaotic centuries following the collapse of the Western Empire, but on the other it comes larded down with loads of moral opprobrium from the Renaissance authors that came up with it as a way to brag up how awesome they were versus the presumably barbaric mud princes of the preceding medieval period.
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Sep 5, 2019 17:27
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Speaking of podcasts and roman sucessor states, Lars Brownworth's 12 Byzantine Rulers isn't bad for learning about the Byzantine empire at an armchair historian level. I enjoyed his Norman Centuries podcast as well.
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Sep 5, 2019 17:39
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If it wasn't for the Normans you'd all be speaking German
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Sep 5, 2019 17:49
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I actually just got done reading Cathederal, Forge, and Waterwheel about medieval technology which was an interesting read. What's the perspective on it now? I get the impression some of it was more groundbreaking when it came out, like tracing inventions to China and such
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Sep 5, 2019 18:18
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ikanreed posted:If it wasn't for the Normans you'd all be speaking German Ya.
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Sep 5, 2019 20:45
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mastershakeman posted:What is the etymology behind the Roma people group vs Rome and all that i think it has something to do with their passage into europe via romania but idk for sure Flavius Aetass posted:How does everyone feel about the term "Dark Ages" and the associated connotations? its bad imo, coined by the same people going around talking about "the light of civilization" and "barbarian hordes" the average european sees a generations long evolution to a new economic system but no cataclysm. people that believe in a dark age are mainly bemoaning the loss of a small cadre of plantation owners with the parasitic leisure to write poetry and treatises late antiquity was a vibrant time ignored by academics until like the 1980s
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Sep 5, 2019 21:28
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Uranium posted:I thought the Ottomans called it Rūm. 
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Sep 5, 2019 21:52
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I thought about asking this in the Roman, Ancient History thread, but I'm only 18 pages into that one. What exactly determines the transition between BCE and CE? I know that they're "Before Common Era" and "Common Era," respectfully (I guess?). But why?
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Sep 6, 2019 00:43
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Astoundingly Ugly Baby posted:I thought about asking this in the Roman, Ancient History thread, but I'm only 18 pages into that one. It's just a rebranded version of BC\AD for the secular crowd, while also having a vaguely universalist claim to dates, sort of like a global metric system for history that just so happens to be exactly like the entrenched western european christian calendar edit: AD stands for "Anno Domini: or basically "Year of Our Lord", and basically people wanted a way to say "it's the year 2019" without Christian overtones but also without having to change anything because last time the West did a calendar change was revolutionary France and messing with calendars is now associated with guillotines Fuzzy McDoom has issued a correction as of 00:53 on Sep 6, 2019 |
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Sep 6, 2019 00:48
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Astoundingly Ugly Baby posted:I thought about asking this in the Roman, Ancient History thread, but I'm only 18 pages into that one. those names are modern academic parlance for ad and bc which was the cusp of what the council of nicea in the 300s ad decided was jesus' birth year. the era system is just to strip the religion out
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Sep 6, 2019 00:49
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