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The reason burner phase sucks in vanilla is cause it's so short that there's no point in even developing the infrastructure around it, like belting coal over to your burner drills or whatever, it's ultimately faster and more efficient to just hand feed everything and put all that iron into beelining for electricity, even though it's kind of a tedious pain in the rear end Industrial revolution turns the burner phase into a proper phase, so that's it's worth actually doing things the right way. You've gotta belt coal all around to feed your burner assemblers, science labs, inserters, and everything else, which is actually kind of an interesting logistics challenge that's normally just a waste of time in the vanilla game... And then getting power generation actually feels more impactful, because you can replace all those coal belts with power lines, and really simplify and tighten everything
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Sep 12, 2019 14:29
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Well, I've done it. It's taken me four years since I bought the game but I finally automated blue science  Also this game I've fallen out of my own idiot trap of using electric versions of the stone and steel furnaces - fuel consumption is the same but because you're running it through boilers and steam engines first you have to build up your power infrastructure far earlier Every other time I got distracted by the need/desire to create a mod before getting as far as blue science. Ratzap posted:I decided not to suffer the burner stuff too much and installed Burner Leech. Yeah it's borderline cheaty but if I wanted to play with coal I'd move to Australia. I don't mind the burner phase normally since it has a purpose and is short but IR really drags it out. Leech just cuts down on the number or coal feed lines you need. Side Inserters are also good for dealing with burner poo poo, and the ability to select insertion lane will probably help a lot with all the dual-belting you'll be doing
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Sep 12, 2019 17:05
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I got out of the burner phase when I gave up on automation (it just costs too drat much extra materials for the extra inserters and belts), slammed down assemblers which I hand fed, and set up iron products with assemblers hand fed with coal (until I could replace them with electric version). I want to like the burner phase, but I detest this one more than vanilla.
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Sep 12, 2019 23:44
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Apparently the mod author of Industrial Revolution is a bit nutty like the space exploration guy. He's interpreting the non commercial license as it can't be played on streams or monetized YouTube. He flat out told Nilaus that he's an anti capitalist and asked him not to stream his mod.
RVWinkle fucked around with this message at 05:00 on Sep 13, 2019 |
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Sep 13, 2019 04:53
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Can't help but respect someone who professes anti-capitalist beliefs, tbh
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Sep 13, 2019 04:55
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Hello nerds, so the recent train talk inspired to attempt a tutorial on understanding trains. Almost all tutorials I see glaze the gently caress over goddamn errything beyond THIS IS A RAIL AND THESE ARE THE SIGNALS then immediately jump into complex designs with barely any screenshots that usually are just regular screenshots or its in video form which has a 2-3 minute segment talking about something not even related to trains. So I am going to attempt to start from the absolute basic signaling and work my way up with some basic diagrams drawn in paint because for some reason GIMP still does not have common/basic shapes built in after all this time. Also, there was some people talking about wanting to know how to load and unload, so I am going to share my designs. Honestly in all my experimenting I find it hard to get anything more efficient, hopefully someone can post their designs so I can be proven wrong. At the end I have all the blueprints used in this somewhat tutorial, rails I feel are the one situation where you can only really do things a couple ways and have it working so I almost feel the blueprints are a requirement. I do highly encourage instead of just copying and pasting people copy them and fiddle with them. A great way to do this is using the [href=https://mods.factorio.com/mod/InfinityMode Infinity Mode] mod in the freeplay scenario, it really is great for just loving around experimenting without needing to focus on anything else. Key for Rails: S# - Regular Signal C# - Chain Signal T# - Train (Used for more complex setups) STOP - Indicates a train stop Arrows indicate direction of rails and thus trains. Key for Loading: C# - Chest I# - Inserter A# - Arithmetic combinator Table of Contents: 0. Understanding Rail Signals 1. The Basic Rail 2. The Single T Junction 3. The Double T Junction 4. Roundabouts 5. Train Parking 6. Single T Junction - Stop 7. Item Loading 8. Item Unloading 9. Liquid Loading 10. Liquid Unloading 11. Blueprints 12. Examples 0. Understanding Rail Signals (Use as a reference, go to 1. for actual tutorial.) ----Regular Signals - These are your standard and used everywhere signals, they essentially break up segments between each other. Say we have 2 signals and 20 pieces of rail going in one direction. If a train enters any portion of those 20 rail segments broken up by these 2 signals, the first signal will go red until that train has exited past the second signal. So in this hypothetical if a train approaches the first signal while a train is between these signals it will stop. If you do not use these then imagine the entire rail line as one giant turd that oozes all over the place, a signal is pinching that loaf so to keep segments separated. The most basic use is when a train branches off the rail to prevent another train from entering, and when a train merges back onto a rail that is going the same direction to wait before going if another train is going by. If you are network centric, imagine these breaking up broadcast domains, at least thats how I think it. States are that of a traffic signal: Green, go. Red, Stop. Yellow I am actually unsure, mostly seems to be there to give other color if not configured correctly. ----Chain Signals - These are used entirely for when rails intersect, they are used in conjunction with regular signals. They will read what the next signals are saying. So if a train wants to merge onto a rail that goes over another segment that goes that goes either either up or straight (See '2. The Single T Junction') they will check the state of all the signals in the section of well signals. If the signal going straight detects a train then it will be red, if a signal going up detects a train then it will be red. These allow for complex crossing to be broken down into a 'True/False' scenario that can check many directions while regular signals only check what is exactly straight ahead of them. States are mostly the same with one difference: Green, go. Red, Stop. Blue, one or more direction is blocked. Essentially if the route straight ahead is green but the direction upward is red it will be in this state. Train can go straight if it is heading that way but will have to wait for it to clear. Essentially, trains are dumb as poo poo and will just slam into each other unless told otherwise. Signals are your way of telling them HEY rear end in a top hat STOP IF SOMEONE ELSE IN FRONT OF YOU. 1. The Basic Rail As most nerds will tell you, 2 way rail is the only way to go. Attempting to use a single rail is feasible if you only have it going one direction or really fuckin' love stupid complex logistics that do not function nearly as well as a 2 rail system no matter how good you are. Rail signals indicate which way a train is going, you put the signal on the right side of which direction you want it to go. In this image the signals are on the outside of the rail which makes them 'drive' on the right. If you want to go full  put them on the inside which would cause them to 'drive' on the left, I would suggest against this.I always prefer to make my rails 2 rails apart, the rails between the trains indicates this. It is wide enough to put power lines and still have room for other things including signals for intersecting rails. All the blueprints are 2 wide apart.  2. The Single T Junction I lied when I said we would not immediately jump into complexity, but unless you intend to have all you 2 way rails end in a circle loop you need to understand the concept between crossing rails. This is hopefully as 'easy' of a introduction to realistic crossing rails I can think of without making a single way 2 rail setup with a merge rail. NOTE: 'S3' in this is actually not needed, I will be ignoring it but I am too lazy to redo this and edit a image. pls b nice In this scenario trains from both sides of the rail are able to merge onto a single rail, the reason for this would most likely be a mine stop right off the main lines with a similar but reversed merge for the exit. As we can see a train has merged from the bottom rail going towards S1, C1 is red so the train on the upper rail is stopped, S2 is green and C2 is red. C1 has detected from C2 that a train merging over the rail, to avoid a collision C1 has gone red to force the upper rail train to stop. S1/S2/S4 will remain green as there is nothing ahead of that signal.  A flip scenario would be the upper train going from C1 straight through to S2, with the lower train wanting to go from C2 to S1. Due to the chain signal, C2 would be red as it would detect from C1 that a train has entered the crossing segment. 3. The Double T Junction Now the difficulty really ramps up, the use case for this is when you want to have a major branch from a main line or merge 2 completely disparate lines together. Imagine the top segment connects to your base and the lower segment runs to mines heading both directions. In this scenario, T1 and T2 are heading straight in opposite directions while T3 wants to either head in the direction of T1 or T2. We will notice that C1/C2/C3/C4/C5 are all red. C5 of course is getting signaled from both C1 and C4 that trains have entered junction and it needs to wait patiently until both of those signals have cleared not just one. You will also notice that C1/C2/C3/C4/C5 all face entrances. T1--C4 can go straight to R3 it can also go up to R1. T2--C1 can go straight to R2 it can also go up to R1. T3--C5 can go left to R2 or right to R3. T1--C2 and R1 signals to C4 from going up if a train is present. R3 also signals to C4 if a train is straight ahead. T2--R1, C2, and C5 signals to C1 from going up or straight if a train is present. R2 also signals to C1 if a train is straight ahead. T3--C1, C2 and C3 signals to C5 from going down/right or left if a train is present. Interestingly R3 does not actually do anything to C5, C3 would get a stop from R3 if a train was straight ahead which then would subsequently signal to C5.  This is a lot to take in to just make train go toot toot, honestly writing this tutorial is the first time I really sat down and thought about the logistics of this design, I just use a blueprint for when I need it  4. Roundabouts There are some arguments of roundabouts vs 4 way stops. I prefer roundabouts due to their simplicity. Also I am a big dumb and have never hosed with 4 way stops. The use case is of course allowing trains to do complete U turns or just having a lot of rails converging into one another. A train can come in at any direction and leave at any direction. They still need to follow the direction the rail is going but once in the roundabout there is only one direction which is of course 'driving' on the right. Due to how basic these are really did not put much effort into making a image. Trains enter from all ends and exit from all ends. The chain signals will cause the entrance signals to go red if a train is past one. Theoretically prolly around 2 trains without cargo wagons could be in the circle if they are entering and exiting at opposite points but the more realistically trains will wait for .1 seconds before the one currently occupying slams through it at full speed.  5. Train Parking Often times nerds will talk about needing to have obscene throughput, these usually only start to show up when you are making a megabase and you have several dedicated trains that are all assigned the same stop. This takes advantage of pathing with trains. Trains politely queue up and wait their turn to go to the stop. It is a first come first served basis with trains desiring the farthest right rail. This may look complex but it is really basic, it just has a lot of signals due the need of accommodating at least 4 trains. The best part of these is that they can infinitely be expanded. The only requirement is the entrance and exit must be a single rail. In this scenario the train approaches at C1, the stop is currently occupied by a needy little piggy. As you can see S3/S4 are currently occupied, but S1/S2 are open. Due to logistics, the train will enter S2, if another train approaches it will only be able to enter S1. Also of note, C6 is sending the signal to C2/C3/C4/C5 that the rail (and subsequently the stop) is currently occupied.  The situation has advanced, the hungry little piggy has hosed off. Due to the first come first serve basis of trains the furtherest right and thus the first train to arrive into the queue is the first to go to the stop. The train located at C1 is now able to take the S4 position as it has been freed. Once the train that was occupying S4 exits from the stop S3 will be up next, followed by S2 then S1 then back to S4. Trains are very polite when they are given direction  6. Single T Junction - Stop NOTE: C3 should really be a regular signal as the train located at it would never be approaching the stop from that direction due to C4, S6 and the stop all making the rail only approachable from the right side. It is fully functional this way but incorrect. I usually use something like his for when I want a small stop right off a main line. Generally either a temporary setup or if I need to unload ammo and the main line is circling around walls but not serving any other purpose. Many would argue that you should at least do a single T junction that then branches far away or in a more realistic case a double T junction where the entrance is for getting to loading and the exit is used for trains leaving the stop. Now that you have gone through all the other parts of the tutorial this should not be that big of a deal. It is literally 2 single T junctions in close proximity to each other. They are completely independent in their signaling. Arguably this is better example of the single T junction as the signaling is very clear for both entrance and exit use. In this scenario neither train on the lower and upper track are able to get to the stop due a train occupying it. The stopped train is able to exit on either rail assuming no train is occupying C3 to S5 for upper track and S1 to S2 to C1 for the lower track. C4 gets it signaling from C3, S5, S1, S2. Assuming it wants to go towards S5 and S1 to S2 to C1 is occupied it will still be able to take this route. C4 of course would be blue to indicate that one route is closed but the other is open. C2 to S4 and C3 to S5 dictate the straight route for the upper rail train. C2 to S6 dictate if the stop is open, in this scenario C2 is red due to S4 being red as a train is occupying the space between S4 and C3 S1 to S2 to C1 to S3 dictates the lower track train, C1 reads from S6 and C2 to tell if the stop and intersecting rail are clear while C1 reads from S3 to tell if the track going straight ahead is clear.  Again this is just really 2 single T junctions in close proximity of one another. All their signaling manages to be completely self contained with the outer exits overlapping but only causing the exit tracks to need signaling to tell them if a train is in the process of taking the exit. 7. Item Loading Now that we have covered signaling on the rail I would like to talk about train loading as this was brought up before. I have attempted to modify this design but I always come back to making this exact thing as I am unsure if there is a more efficient design (arguably 2 extra inserters could be placed on either side, I feel this design is easier to manage). I cannot recall where I stole this design from and the circuits were added at a later point using this same design. If you do not feel comfortable using circuits, they can be completely omitted. In fact I only added the circuits to the design somewhat recently. The reason they exist is to force all the chests to maintain the same amount of items in them. If C1 has 50 iron ore but C2, C3 and C4 have 40 iron ore. The C1 inserter will shut off until C2, C3, and C4 have at least 50 iron ore. This solves a problem that happens with this design where a single chest can sometimes become overfilled, this will affect throughput as the train is waiting on one chest to be emptied. This of course can be mitigated by having the stop disabled until the chests are all full but I prefer to have all my trains running waiting till at least they get a certain amount of items with a 120 second timer. Arguably this design would still help with waiting till all chests are full as it would force them to fill evenly instead of C1, C2 getting full then C3, C4 following. This may seem like a overtly convoluted mess of wires, and it is, but we will only be focusing on one section, all the other sections use the same wiring and logic system. This could possibly be improved but it works well enough that I have never tried.  This will be more straight forward than rails as I will only be focusing on the wiring and logic as the design is straight forward from just looking at it. We are focusing on the chests and how they are wired. As you can see C1/C2/C3/C4 are all wired together with a green wire. This means all of them share the same signal network (shown in the red box), this is then connected to the INPUT of A2 (shown in the green box) which will cause it to take in the total of all the chests, in this case it is iron ore, we then divide the total iron ore by the total amount of chests which is 4 chests. This is then passed to the OUTPUT as 'O' (shown in the pink box). The OUTPUT is then connected to the INPUT of A1 (also shown in the green box). So the formula is: iron ore / amount of chests = 'O'  This now focuses on A1 and its relationship with the circuits. As you can see I1/I2/I3/I4 are all wired together with a green wire (shown in the red box) which is then connected to the OUTPUT of A1 (shown poorly in the green box). The only purpose A1 serves is to take from its INPUT from A2 and add 1 to the 'O' signal then OUTPUT that to the inserters. The reason we do this will be explained next. Current formula: 'O' + 1 = 'O', literally add 1 to value 'O'. If 'O' is zero it now becomes one.  We finally cover what the gently caress the inserters are doing. We can see that all the inserters are wired with a red wire to each of the chests they are inserting items into (shown badly in the red box) so the inserter keeps track of its own chests amount of iron ore. The OUTPUT of A1 is connected to all the inserters (shown in the green box). As we can see (in the pink box) the inserters only enable if 'O' is more than iron ore. Current formula: if 'O' > iron ore, then activate the inserter to put iron ore into the chest otherwise if 'O' < iron ore then disable the inserter.  This shows the expected results that come from this setup, they are not labeled but as you can see C1/C2/C3 in total have 6 iron ore but the current OUTPUT of A2 is only 1, hand waving away math aside, 6/4 = 1 in factorio logic. Thus the final result of 'O', after passing through A1, becomes 2. The other inserters then read their chests contents which comes out 2, this is then compared to 'O' which is also 2. 2 > 2 = False as of course 2 is not greater than itself. But I4/C4 is evaluating is 2 > 0 = True which of course is then causes it to activate. Final formula: iron ore / amount of chests = 'O' + 1 = 'O'. if 'O' > iron ore then activate inserter.  I attempted to go into excruciating detail as many people struggle with circuits, honestly this is as complex as I really ever get. I am sure this design can be improved like all things in factorio but it works quite well. Of course you can sub in anything other than iron ore, just change the checked INPUT on A2 to pistols or whatever and the checked items of the chest on the inserters to pistols or whatever. 8. Item Unloading This one is essentially the same as loading but without any circuits and all the belts are reversed.  9. Liquid Loading NOTE: I changed the design after taking this screenshot, see 10. Unloading liquids for the new design. Again this is mostly a design without much in terms of explanation. All the pumps that connect to the train have a buffer tank, the filling is really uneven but the only solution I can think of to fix this is having dedicated pipes all running to the pumps that go into the buffer tanks which creates a huge mess for little gain.  10. Liquid Unloading This is identical to the loading but with all the pumps reversed.  Now that you have gone all the way through hopefully you at least have an idea of how the rail system works in Factorio. With that knowledge comes the ability to make loving horrid abominations of spaghetti rails that fully work in stopping trains from slamming into one another but are honestly the worst way to do things.  11. Blueprints Here are the 2 blueprint books of all the designs used in this tutorial. -Rails code:code:These are a couple screenshots with small blurbs about what is going on. Double T Junction, this is showing that a train merging onto the upper rail going left will only affect the lower train if it wants to merge up. This is not ideal but would require a shitton more signaling. The bottom train is still able to plow through going straight. The upper train of course is not allowed to continue. Again not ideal but it is a minor inconvenience that would only really affect trains for .2 seconds.  Roundabout, shows that a train occupying the space between 2 chain signals does not disrupt any other traffic depending on where it be heading. The train above could easily go left at the same time the train in the roundabout goes down. 
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Sep 14, 2019 17:55
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The single most important piece of information [for me] that let me break through and finally gain a much deeper understanding of train railing was actually a very simple function of the signal/chain signal that is just absent in almost all talk of trains. Signals allow entry: when a train can enter the next block Chain signals allow entry: when a train can clear the next block* *multiple chain signals will extend this until the next regular signal
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Sep 14, 2019 22:33
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That is bad roundabout signaling. A train heading from west to west for an U-Turn won't stop at the bottom signal if a train is heading from east to north at the same time. If then there is a train heading north to south that one will halt at the western chain signal. And now you are gridlocked.
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Sep 14, 2019 22:42
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I need a good layout for red ammo and usually I can google a layout pretty easily but this has me stymied.
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Sep 14, 2019 22:45
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I make my red ammo as part of my milsci build. Make the yellow ammo off the belt feeding the grenade line (half iron half coal) and then have a copper/steel belt. Assume bus to the left and science to the right. pre:=========> Copper/Steel Belt v v v [ Red ammo ] [ ] [ assemblers ] v^ v^ v^ =========> Ammo Belt ^ [ Yellow ammo ] [ Grenades ] [ ] [ ] [ assembler ] [ ] ^ ==========> Iron/Coal Belt
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Sep 14, 2019 22:55
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VictualSquid posted:That is bad roundabout signaling. A train heading from west to west for an U-Turn won't stop at the bottom signal if a train is heading from east to north at the same time. If then there is a train heading north to south that one will halt at the western chain signal. And now you are gridlocked. Remember: chains signals on the entrances and midpoints, regular signals on the exits.
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Sep 14, 2019 23:02
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And definitely chain signal at every single point where a rail splits into 2 routes.Elendil004 posted:I need a good layout for red ammo and usually I can google a layout pretty easily but this has me stymied. This is what I'm using right now:  I'm cheating a little bit, those long arm inserters on the yellow ammo are set up to only turn 90 degrees with side inserters - but if you don't have side inserters you can easily do that with 2 yellow inserters to just drop some items on the ground. Taffer fucked around with this message at 00:53 on Sep 15, 2019 |
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Sep 15, 2019 00:48
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Should a train stop at this signal? Yes: regular signal No: the signal before should be a chain signal
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Sep 15, 2019 01:55
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This is my favorite train unloading layout: It works with yellow undergrounders too, they fit in the empty space below where the top side belts are. The uncropped screenshot shows part of a second set of belt balancers - I have a spread out set of balancing up there that effectively makes it 16x16 balanced. Duodecimal fucked around with this message at 03:45 on Sep 15, 2019 |
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Sep 15, 2019 03:41
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Duodecimal posted:This is my favorite train unloading layout: I'm stealing this for my future use. I've been playing a new vanilla run off and on since I last posted, and I've learned that there's really like, 4 main stages to the game. Burner phase, with hand feeding things, then early game, where you're belting things all over in spaghetti-like fashion, then bus phase, where you've got everything on a bus and blueprinted and working nicely, and then finally, megabase phase, where you train everything everywhere, have separate areas of factories producing specific stuff to be trained places, and are generally much larger and more spread out as you strive for multiple rockets per minute. I've also discovered that I'm gonna have to start a new map on a trainworld with RSO so that I can actually evolve up to that 4th stage.
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Sep 15, 2019 13:26
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GotLag posted:Should a train stop at this signal?
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Sep 15, 2019 15:40
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GotLag posted:Should a train stop at this signal? World Famous W posted:This has been the simplest way I've heard it put and I now understand it, thanks The first part is wrong though. (I've heard this thing repeated often, its always been wrong) Its always the signal before that determines whether or not a train has the possibility of stopping, because chain signals ensure that the train can pass completely through the bloc before its allowed to enter. Its also the wrong way to think about train logistics. You don't create signals so that trains have a place to stop (this is stations), you create signals such that trains have to stop as little as possible. Reverend Dr fucked around with this message at 18:00 on Sep 15, 2019 |
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Sep 15, 2019 17:46
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Reverend Dr posted:The first part is wrong though. (I've heard this thing repeated often, its always been wrong) Chain signals let your train pass when the next upcoming signal is green. That only matches your description if the distance between your signals is always longer then your trains. For example in the pictures that were just posted the train length can never exceed a single locomotive without any wagons. Your trains will stop. You can't avoid it. And if your network gridlocks to easily all your speed advantage will be gone quickly.
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Sep 15, 2019 18:34
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VictualSquid posted:That only matches your description if the distance between your signals is always longer then your trains. Always make the distance between standard signals be able to hold a train, is some basic railroad advice (context, we are talking about a railroad tutorial). You've missed the point entirely. "use a standard signal to make a train stop" is, despite something that has been repeated often, fundamentally wrong and should not be told to anyone trying to learn. VictualSquid posted:Your trains will stop. You can't avoid it. And if your network gridlocks to easily all your speed advantage will be gone quickly. Trains stopped at a station (or a stacker, but hey context, we are talking basic railroad tutorial) are fine, but trains stopped at intersections is absolutely not *unavoidable* and when it happens (which real world situations, it will often happen) can be engineered out.
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Sep 15, 2019 21:20
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Reverend Dr posted:Always make the distance between standard signals be able to hold a train, is some basic railroad advice (context, we are talking about a railroad tutorial). How do your intersections look like? I really can't imagine a junction that won't lead to a train stopping. For example if trains from two directions both want to continue towards the same direction at the same time.
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Sep 15, 2019 21:32
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VictualSquid posted:We are talking about a specific railroad tutorial which suggests that trains should be only locomotives without wagons. Oh, okay sure yeah, I got you now.
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Sep 15, 2019 21:44
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On a more high level subject, I definitely recommend setting up a dual track system and having stations branch off from it on one-way tracks. It scales much better than individual point-to-point loops. No matter how far you are from home, you just know that you have to hook an outpust up to the mainline and somehow there will be a path to anywhere else in the network You could run a single track main but your throughput would be terrible and making sure it runs safely is a lot more complicated.
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Sep 16, 2019 00:24
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World Famous W posted:This has been the simplest way I've heard it put and I now understand it, thanks Correction: Should a train stop at this signal? Yes: the signal before should be a regular signal No: the signal before should be a chain signal As originally stated it only applied in the case that all your other signals were regular Reverend Dr posted:Its also the wrong way to think about train logistics. You don't create signals so that trains have a place to stop (this is stations), you create signals such that trains have to stop as little as possible.  Clarification for the contextually-challenged: "Should a train be allowed to stop at this signal?"
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Sep 16, 2019 08:45
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Quick update on the Big Beautiful Factory pack: Something's causing saving to take an awful long time and occasionally freeze for a few seconds at a time once the game gets farther along, so I'm going through and (very slowly) testing disabling one pack at a time to figure out what it is. Hopefully it's not one of the important mods for the pack.
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Sep 16, 2019 13:47
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Anyone else trying Industrial Revolution? I'm in the process of setting up green science and so far the biggest hurdle has been finding ways to bring coal to all the inserters. Most specifically the ones taking finished products out assemblers and furnaces. For input I can just split a belt with 1 lane of coal and 1 lane of whatever input I need, but the inserters don't take coal from assemblers even if they need it. My current idea that I'll try tonight is this (Made with vanilla stuff in a blueprint editor since I'm at work)  Does anyone have any better ideas since all these undergrounds take forever to craft since I only have red science automated so far.
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Sep 16, 2019 15:57
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I bought this game because I enjoyed building things in Infinifactory but one of the big differences is that any thing you test here gives excess materials that clutter your inventory after a bit. I guess I should add boxes/inserters into projects where I know those items will be used? Are there any materials that cant be repurposed I need to watch out with?
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Sep 16, 2019 17:17
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Everything is useful in some way. some things, like small power poles become outdated. Others, like stone furnaces become outdated but still have niche use cases in some later recipes. Unlike infinifactory your goal isn’t one specific puzzle. It’s the whole chain of puzzles and logistics to beat the game and keep going. I think the new tutorial campaign teaches the basics pretty well. I think you still have to manually tell steam to update to the latest 0.17 beta to play it though.
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Sep 16, 2019 17:36
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Usually i'll have an area in my factory that's just a square of crates filled with odd bits and pieces. Don't worry too much about using the entire buffalo, there's usually plenty of resources for what you need to progress. You can always just put whatever you don't want to deal with any more into a wooden box and shoot it (point your mouse at it and hold C) which destroys it, but i don't think i've ever really needed to do that for stuff that isn't wooden power poles and obsolete armour/guns.
Wallrod fucked around with this message at 17:46 on Sep 16, 2019 |
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Sep 16, 2019 17:41
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Mindblast posted:I bought this game because I enjoyed building things in Infinifactory but one of the big differences is that any thing you test here gives excess materials that clutter your inventory after a bit. I guess I should add boxes/inserters into projects where I know those items will be used? Are there any materials that cant be repurposed I need to watch out with? Everything has a use except for burner drills. Wooden electric poles can be used as fuel.
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Sep 16, 2019 17:53
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I think they changed the wooden poles thing. Have they changed it back?
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Sep 16, 2019 17:56
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Truga posted:I think they changed the wooden poles thing. Have they changed it back? They did? Fools!
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Sep 16, 2019 18:14
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Freaksaus posted:Does anyone have any better ideas since all these undergrounds take forever to craft since I only have red science automated so far. -Yellow undergrounds are 4 long, so there is enough space to put 2 exit inserters (plus the 2 inserters to fuel them), which would half the number of undergrounds. -Run a coal line further away and have a long handled inserter do the fueling -For inputs from belt, you also have the option of only running a half belt materials with a half belt of coal/fuel -Sushi belts are great for this mod and will require only 3 inserters per machine (1 input self fueled with coal on the belt, 1 exit inserter and 1 to fuel that inserter) (also wire created via blueprint cost nothing, so there is no cost other than getting circuit networks and a handful of wires to make initial blueprints and the splitters for each input) The unfortunate thing is that in all of these cases there is going to be a dramatic cost of material increase to automate in the burner phase (maybe not as much with sushi, but a lot of people tend to shy away from that), the phase that you have the least amount of materials as well as the least amount of pre-existing automation. I think, just like vanilla, that it is tremendously faster and less difficult to speed past the burner phase via hand-feeding than it is to try and automate with burners.
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Sep 16, 2019 18:24
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Reverend Dr posted:The unfortunate thing is that in all of these cases there is going to be a dramatic cost of material increase to automate in the burner phase (maybe not as much with sushi, but a lot of people tend to shy away from that), the phase that you have the least amount of materials as well as the least amount of pre-existing automation. I think, just like vanilla, that it is tremendously faster and less difficult to speed past the burner phase via hand-feeding than it is to try and automate with burners. That's kind of the big problem with the burner phase - it takes more material to properly automate it than it does to progress beyond it, so it's not worth even beginning to. I've had thoughts before about making a mod to change all the Burner objects into Mechanical ones, powered by rotating axles that you can hook up to each other and to a burner motor. So you could automate stuff without needing massive amounts of belts and inserters but still harder than electric. It'd also include mechanical assemblers (can only craft with 2 items, but smaller size so they're still useful later for layouts) and labs (unlocking electricity as a tier-2 tech to make all this worthwhile to use). Never got round to starting it though.
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Sep 16, 2019 18:33
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Wallrod posted:Usually i'll have an area in my factory that's just a square of crates filled with odd bits and pieces. Don't worry too much about using the entire buffalo, there's usually plenty of resources for what you need to progress. You can always just put whatever you don't want to deal with any more into a wooden box and shoot it (point your mouse at it and hold C) which destroys it, but i don't think i've ever really needed to do that for stuff that isn't wooden power poles and obsolete armour/guns. Can wooden power poles no longer be burned?
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Sep 16, 2019 18:41
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I think they changed the wooden poles thing. Have they changed it back?
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Sep 16, 2019 18:43
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Vic posted:I think they changed the wooden poles thing. Have they changed it back? They have changed and changed back repeatedly. Currently they cannot be burned.
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Sep 16, 2019 18:56
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Tenebrais posted:That's kind of the big problem with the burner phase - it takes more material to properly automate it than it does to progress beyond it, so it's not worth even beginning to. To repeat myself once more: Burner Leech You still need to feed coal around but at least the inserters sort themselves out because they can take fuel from anything they can reach.
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Sep 16, 2019 19:42
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Vic posted:Everything has a use except for burner drills. Wooden electric poles can be used as fuel. And pistols.
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Sep 16, 2019 22:06
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Vic posted:Everything has a use except for burner drills. Wooden electric poles can be used as fuel. Stone furnaces upgrade to steel but steel doesn't upgrade into electric furnaces, also. Steel still well worth leaving in place alongside electrics once you get them, if that kind of thing doesn't bother you. Tear them out to make space for beaconed electric furnace arrays once it is time.
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Sep 16, 2019 23:28
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| # ? May 19, 2024 23:19 |
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Iron crates are the worst item in the game and I never build them anymore. Wood crates own because you can put other things in them and shoot them to dispose of them quickly.
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Sep 16, 2019 23:45
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