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Automate all the things. How does HR manage their workflow for onboarding? Do they use a SaaS application like iCims or Workday? Look at Okta, setting it up with a connection to AD is free. You can do a lot of automation with the base free product. Not to mention it’s SSO capabilities, we are moving everything to it from ADFS by the end of the year.
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Sep 27, 2019 17:44
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ChickenOfTomorrow fucked around with this message at 19:25 on Feb 23, 2021 |
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Sep 27, 2019 18:05
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I have no loving clue how onboarding works because it's not my department! User gets a global account that provides access to the ticketing system, they open a request to get an account on the resources they require. It's all ldap so when they get added to the vo my systems use they just show up and start doing stuff. It's a very nice setup.. for me. Maybe it's complete hell for the people that are in charge of it.
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Sep 27, 2019 18:11
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Our system is some time on a Monday morning we get a snarky call asking why a new user isn't set up yet. We then chase the hiring manager who eventually fills out a user form. We ask which computer they will use. Get told it will be one used by previous user. We ask where previous user will go. Get told they left a month ago. We remind everyone to let us know in advance of staff changes. Then we spend the week getting told to give user access to various things which were not included on the form. Early the following week new user points out their name was spelt wrong on the original form.
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Sep 27, 2019 23:25
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Varkk posted:Our system is some time on a Monday morning we get a snarky call asking why a new user isn't set up yet. We then chase the hiring manager who eventually fills out a user form. We ask which computer they will use. Get told it will be one used by previous user. We ask where previous user will go. Get told they left a month ago. We remind everyone to let us know in advance of staff changes. Then we spend the week getting told to give user access to various things which were not included on the form. Early the following week new user points out their name was spelt wrong on the original form. We got a new HR director recently, and have stopped getting misspellings on forms, and started getting preferred names as well as full names (there are regulatory requirements to have people's legal names some places in our systems).
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Sep 27, 2019 23:35
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Name changes have become the bane of my life. They never go well because our outsourced Indian helpdesk cannot seem to do it right. 
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Sep 28, 2019 01:11
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So I got told to write documents on architecture and logic for services I worked on. The reason being is that currently nobody in the company know the in and out of those apart from me (since I did all of those on my own), and the ones I handed my work over to ran away for better future (wish them luck). I just laughed at them and said my responsibility is done as soon as I handed my work over when forcefully requested by the company in July, so they'll need to chase the ones who left the company for that. Already consulted my lawyer for this way before, and no problem here. Rule number 1 of working in a Korean company as a dev: DO NOT LEAVE DOCUMENTS in case assholes want to get rid of you.
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Sep 28, 2019 03:38
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That is so rear end backwards that it can't be just a cultural difference.
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Sep 28, 2019 04:35
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The Fool posted:That is so rear end backwards that it can't be just a cultural difference. I'd say it's probably the culture of small companies in Korea. Companies would verbally tell people to GTFO, and when people do leave the companies just report to the labour ministry or whatever authority that said people left of their own will. In this case those who got told to leave can't make a claim of forceful severance due to having no documents or any form of evidence. While this is illegal and malpractice of severance, companies do this so they would look good on paper while leaving no evidence of firing anyone. And this is why labour laws in Korea are strict, because there have been far too many assholes finding loop holes to abuse. But luckily for me these loop holes don't apply to me as I'm a full-time employee who's been working in the same company for more than 2 years. It turns out that I am not the first case that the company has told someone to GTFO for no apparent reason (similar reason as mine. 'Don't think we can work with you in the long term') and that there were several cases prior, but I am actually the first to fight back. I'm just lucky enough to be able to fight back (a lawyer in my family), because most people can't. Not just limited to being able to afford to hire a lawyer, but also they just can't afford to be unemployed for different reasons. This is a lonely fight, but I've made my mind up when I decided to protect my rights as an employee. Minor reason being I do not wish for anyone else to suffer as I am right now, because if I don't voice the rights then who else will? 'Do not stray away from conscience even in death' is what my parents taught me when they raised me up. And they're drat right.
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Sep 28, 2019 05:12
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Aesis posted:So I got told to write documents on architecture and logic for services I worked on. The reason being is that currently nobody in the company know the in and out of those apart from me (since I did all of those on my own), and the ones I handed my work over to ran away for better future (wish them luck). I just laughed at them and said my responsibility is done as soon as I handed my work over when forcefully requested by the company in July, so they'll need to chase the ones who left the company for that. Already consulted my lawyer for this way before, and no problem here. I'm baffled by the idea that you can be directed, at your current job, to document your work that you did for your current job, and you can say no and not be fired for nonperformance of duties or insubordination.
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Sep 28, 2019 12:46
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Sounds like a dream to me.
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Sep 28, 2019 14:51
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guppy posted:I'm baffled by the idea that you can be directed, at your current job, to document your work that you did for your current job, and you can say no and not be fired for nonperformance of duties or insubordination. I too am very confused about this entire situation. I get not wanting to get fired out of the blue or for something that is out of your control. But I don’t understand at all the thought of staying at a company that doesn’t want you. Who wants to do that everyday?
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Sep 28, 2019 15:42
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I might be reading this wrong but it sounds like he built a thing and the company turned it around, kicked him off the project, and handed it over to two other people. Those two left and now the company needs him to hand it off again with proper documentation. His argument for not doing it is if he does, the company could let him go at any time. I suspect the real reason is him being butthurt over losing his project. A project without documentation is a dumpster of user stories. Have some pride in your work, finish what you started, fill in your project with documentation.
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Sep 28, 2019 15:46
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Judge Schnoopy posted:I might be reading this wrong but it sounds like he built a thing and the company turned it around, kicked him off the project, and handed it over to two other people. Those two left and now the company needs him to hand it off again with proper documentation. It's because he somehow skated through three sexual harassment claims and doesn't want to make it any easier for the company to get rid of him. Which is rational I guess but honestly this all just goes to show you why it's good and important for employers to have the power to just fire someone.
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Sep 28, 2019 15:49
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guppy posted:I'm baffled by the idea that you can be directed, at your current job, to document your work that you did for your current job, and you can say no and not be fired for nonperformance of duties or insubordination. As soon as the company broke (still are) several labour laws trying to get rid of me, employee holds no responsibility to present his/her work, documentations or materials. Also I've already handed over my work as forced by the company, which means whoever took over last holds responsibilities for such requests. Except 2 of them ran away for better future, so good luck chasing after them. Therefore the company has turned back to me and told me to work on the documentations, but due to reasons stated previously I hold zero responsibilities to do so. The company CAN give back my work and tell me to work on documentations, but only after guaranteeing that it shall not attempt to discriminate or get rid of me unlawfully ever again. Just imagine how many assholes sucked whatever they needed out of employees and got rid of them, then you'll understand why the labour laws are super protective of full time workers. Company also added in the email a request to cease any communications with others apart from 2 designated people (HR leader and Dev leader). I went over to HR leader's desk, asked if he meant what he meant, then told him that freedom of speech is protected by constitution and that he should found his own country if he wants to deny me my constitutional rights. Sickening posted:I too am very confused about this entire situation. I get not wanting to get fired out of the blue or for something that is out of your control. But I don’t understand at all the thought of staying at a company that doesn’t want you. Who wants to do that everyday? Because if I walk out quietly then they'll repeat same unlawful and unjust poo poo that they've been doing for past uh... 5~6 years? I'd rather go down protecting my self-respect and honour than bend over to unlawful and unjust demand. I've done nothing wrong, and I don't want to regret later about caving in. That's just how I am and the way I was raised up. I'm looking for other jobs and getting technical tests and/or interviews too, so it's not like I'm just dicking about  It's just a long rear end process.The Iron Rose posted:It's because he somehow skated through three sexual harassment claims and doesn't want to make it any easier for the company to get rid of him. Somehow skated? You mean I presented the evidence that they were lying jerks. See, it's lot easier to just claim sexual harassment than to prove innocence, because shiiit everyone suddenly screams 'guilty until proven otherwise'. Edit: This reminds me of the time back in UK when I was packing my poo poo up for leave of absence due to military conscription. Went to roommate's room, knocked on door, his girlfriend came out, told me to get lost, told her I need my DVD back as I'm leaving tmr, she tried to shut the door on my face and hurt her finger in the process, then started screaming that she'll report me to the police that I tried to sexually assault her and that she shall see me rot in jail because I'm a foreigner and she's a UK citizen. Good thing my roommate was a sensible person who threw her out of the flat and instead apologized to me. Judge Schnoopy posted:I might be reading this wrong but it sounds like he built a thing and the company turned it around, kicked him off the project, and handed it over to two other people. Those two left and now the company needs him to hand it off again with proper documentation. Gone the moment they told me to GTFO after working until 12 AM every day even on weekends. Overtime pay? No such thing. I didn't complain, just did my work, held pride in my work, then this was the end result. Edit: As I said this is the main reason devs in Korea do not leave documentations when working in small companies. This kind of practice is just way too common, believe it or not. Aesis fucked around with this message at 16:06 on Sep 28, 2019 |
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Sep 28, 2019 15:52
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wendys drivethru etc etc
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Sep 28, 2019 17:25
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I guess I’m having a hard time finding the sympathy in your situation. You didn’t document your work, ostensibly due to some cultural reticence to do so to assure job security, and are now trying to use it as some sort of bargaining chip to make the company do what you want. You keep claiming they’re violating all sorts of labor laws, and have a lawyer, and keep finding ways to browbeat them into retaining you. You don’t get to keep saying “it’s so awful here, and I’m going to do everything possible to make them keep me around.” EDIT: also, are you saying another woman was willing to lie about you to try to get you in trouble? The frequency at which this seems to occur to you seems...suspect. Blue Moonlight fucked around with this message at 18:03 on Sep 28, 2019 |
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Sep 28, 2019 17:56
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A person with 3 separate sexual harassment claims isn’t innocent. Sorry.
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Sep 28, 2019 18:58
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Yeah these stories are absurd. Every time.
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Sep 28, 2019 19:59
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Sickening posted:A person with 3 separate sexual harassment claims isn’t innocent. Sorry. I feel like a lot of you seem to be ignoring his prior statements from a few months ago about how clique-y and insular the Korean working environment seems to be - the bits about essentially some group of people in the company not liking him and making up whatever poo poo they can to get him fired. I have no experience or knowledge of Korean culture or working environments so I'm basically just going off what he's posted in the past, but it definitely seems very different from normal US working environments and not in a good way. (And from reading about the school system and general cultural norm of always fitting in and being part of the group, I can well believe what he's talking about - just look at those gifs of multiple pictures of Korean women who have had plastic surgery and end up looking almost essentially the same). There's also been mentions in the China threads about experiences in Korea where essentially the overriding mandate is to fit in - the unique ones get shunned or told to GTFO. Aesis has said if it weren't for the after-2-year qualification forcing companies to have a real reason to fire employees he would have been gone that same day and not for having actually done anything. I guess this is cultural relativism in one sense and I normally hate that kind of bullshit, but it really doesn't make sense to pretend that a working environment over there behaves exactly like it does in the US or UK. Just google "korean workplace culture" and you get a bunch of articles talking about how rigid, group-focused, and time-intensive it is. I know we complain about how US companies take over your life with work but even here it's only the most insane of startups (or investment banking) where you work until midnight every single day of the week and weekend. I can certainly believe there are US companies with the same sort of cliques and so on, but except for family-run companies it really doesn't seem like the office politics here compare - his claim is that the three people accusing him of sexual harassment decided that would be the easiest way to get rid of him simply because they didn't like him, and I don't see that happening at most office environments in the US (which would be the basis for your comment, Sickening, because you're completely right, in a normal US working environment). Obviously this is all based on what he's stated so we really don't have the other side of the story, but I don't think we should be ignoring the Korean workplace part of it because that seems to be very different from the US and it looks to me like he's being railroaded because he refuses to fit in.
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Sep 28, 2019 20:12
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Sickening posted:A person with 3 separate sexual harassment claims isn’t innocent. Sorry. True this right here. As a woman who's been sexually harassed at work - documenting it officially is hard and scary AF and basically if you're the first person - no one gives a poo poo. You get to keep working with a sexual harasser. It takes a lot of claims to get someone fired. I know directly of a guy who seriously followed women to their cars, left creepy notes. asked to pay off a woman to get her to retract her claim, and then didn't get fired until he asked her to retract her claim a 2nd time when he cornered her in an empty office.
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Sep 28, 2019 20:20
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Aesis posted:Company also added in the email a request to cease any communications with others apart from 2 designated people (HR leader and Dev leader). I went over to HR leader's desk, asked if he meant what he meant, then told him that freedom of speech is protected by constitution and that he should found his own country if he wants to deny me my constitutional rights. This isn't how the first amendment works. While there are rules and laws surrounding what type of communication employers are allowed (and not allowed) to prohibit, these rules are to prevent discrimination and to protect workers' ability to improve their working conditions (e.g. unionize, etc.) - which does stem from the first amendment, but is due to the freedom of association and not speech. Regardless, this says to me that you've got a strong but incorrect idea about how things work and you sound like exactly the kind of person that people in this thread come here to complain about.
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Sep 28, 2019 21:26
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totalnewbie posted:This isn't how the first amendment works. The first amendment only applies in the US.
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Sep 28, 2019 21:34
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Jeoh posted:The first amendment only applies in the US. Other countries are allowed to have constitutions with amendments as well. Especially countries that modeled their modern government after ours. Also, we've only heard op's account of things, and even then he comes across as a goony incel. Best case scenario he's actually right and is not at fault for anything. Even then, his workplace is totally toxic and he needs to get out asap. The much more likely case is that this is just the tip of the iceberg and it's only a matter of time before his employer finds legal grounds to get rid of him. Either way, op don't stop posting, I'm too invested in the drama now and want to see how this plays out.
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Sep 28, 2019 21:40
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The Fool posted:Other countries are allowed to have constitutions with amendments as well. Especially countries that modeled their modern government after ours. South Korea is not one of those countries. To be clear, I mean that their government is not modeled after ours. McNally fucked around with this message at 22:10 on Sep 28, 2019 |
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Sep 28, 2019 22:08
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Fair enough, the extant of my knowledge was that they were also a democratic republic.
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Sep 28, 2019 22:43
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The Fool posted:Fair enough, the extant of my knowledge was that they were also a democratic republic. The USA is a representative democracy/federal republic, whereas SK is a constitutional democracy. There is a difference which really only matters to politics nerds, but boils down to the governments being just different enough to operate in ways that are unfamiliar to the other.
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Sep 28, 2019 23:34
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Not 3 separate accounts btw. It’s 1 account of 3 people in the same team (3 out of 4) making stuff up, while the 4th person refused to participate and quit the company at the end of the week instead. As I said if there are 3 different cases then yeah maybe I did something wrong, but when you get 3 people in the same team being jerks for 2+ weeks then suddenly claiming sexual harassment while shunning 4th person for refusing to participate in false claims that she’d rather quit? I don’t think so. And yeah I keep telling you all this is Korea and not USA. First amendment is that Korea is a democratic republic, citizens hold sovereignty and power comes from citizens. Edit: I’m getting plenty of tech tests/assignments and interviews, so I’m just taking my time choosing right company. I don’t want this kind of stuff to be repeated. But usually it can take like a month for whole process. The reason why I refuse to GTFO is simply because it is unlawful and unjust. I also don’t trust them to report about forceful severance, in which case I won’t be able to claim severance benefits either. And no, I’m not holding documentations as bargaining chips or anything. I myself did not receive any, was told to skip it due to lack of time when I asked, and now hold no responsibilities to do so for various reasons stated. Worst case they’ll probably sign, stamp and give me a paper stating they’re finally firing me, which is good because that’s an undeniable evidence that can be used in court. This is why it’s all been verbal ‘GTFO’. I’m not dumb enough to walk out without papers. Edit2: So the TLDR is that company told me to GTFO verbally without presenting any documents because they’re assholes and want to avoid liability, while I’m not dumb enough to walk out without officially signed and stamped paper stating they’re firing me. I kept on telling them that if they have official stance then make it official, but they want me to walk out without one. Jeez. Aesis fucked around with this message at 01:31 on Sep 29, 2019 |
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Sep 29, 2019 01:10
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dragonshardz posted:The USA is a representative democracy/federal republic, whereas SK is a constitutional democracy. Can you go into this distinction in more detail? Because I know juuuuuuuust enough South Korea doesn't have a monarchy, therefore it is a republic, right? South Korea elects MPs that form the government and vote on matters, therefore it is a representative democracy, not a direct democracy. Both countries have a constitution that is the supreme law of the land, therefore they are both "constitutional" whatevers. I'll give you the "federal republic" thing though since the US, like Australia, was formed from sovereign(ish) entities that still maintain levels of power, while SK (like Japan) is a unitary state. Hell, even Wikipedia says they are both "presidential constitutional republics". totalnewbie posted:This isn't how the first amendment works. Tell us about your tattoos, I guess? Weatherman fucked around with this message at 01:38 on Sep 29, 2019 |
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Sep 29, 2019 01:34
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Korea has both, but direct democracy is currently in the form of impeachment of local (city/province) civil servants (including mayor/governor) as well as certain votes (last one in Seoul was regarding free lunch at schools for all students). However all the electoral votes are done by the citizens, including presidential elections. We don't have 'Electoral College' like USA, so every vote is finalized by total vote counts only. In some cases the vote participation (eg. free lunch at schools in Seoul) has to reach certain threshold to be opened, otherwise it's void and null and discarded without even counting. Edit: Korea is a representative democracy due to how laws are proposed and voted on (there's only one House), and the operations of triumvirate relationship is identical to USA or other countries that have Court, House and Government. Just that the laws are based off Germany, and that first lawmakers were influenced by Japanese laws as they lived during its oppressive occupation. Edit2: Because of triumvirate operations, when the House decided to impeach two presidents the constitutional court was the body that decided and finalized on whether said impeachment was lawful or not. First was void as only 3 out of 9 agreed, while second was a unanimous (8 out of 8. 1 missing due to retirement) agreement. And therefore previous president received the first dishonour of being impeached. Aesis fucked around with this message at 03:00 on Sep 29, 2019 |
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Sep 29, 2019 02:43
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I think you all are missing one really huge possibility: he’s unpleasant and the people he works with decided to get him fired by lying. Then again, I’m bringing my own perspective into it just like everyone else, and my perspective is influenced by something that people would claim is stdh.txt unless I doxxed myself with the newspaper articles and court records.
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Sep 29, 2019 02:55
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22 Eargesplitten posted:I think you all are missing one really huge possibility: he’s unpleasant and the people he works with decided to get him fired by lying. Honestly, I don't even think the complaints themselves matter, as far as the story goes. As best I can tell you can boil it down to: Company: Aesis, we want you to quit Aesis: I'd be glad to leave, but you have to formally fire me The company doesn't want to pay the penalties for firing him, so now it's just a tug of war as each side sees just how far they can push the other.
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Sep 29, 2019 03:33
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22 Eargesplitten posted:I think you all are missing one really huge possibility: he’s unpleasant and the people he works with decided to get him fired by lying. NAH I'm the bastard here! A goony incel! Whatever. I did say this is not the first case the company has done this. They've been doing it for past 5 or 6 years (I doubt they did this the year they formed the company). CEO apparently always said 'we don't think we can work with you in the long term' to others whom he decided to get rid of, from previous stories of GTFO. Honestly I can understand why he wants me gone, because I refused to implement or stopped every unlawful request or decision. Yes, I'm the eye sore  Here's one story. When I found out that there was a serious attempt at breach of Personal Information Protection Act I took necessary actions then reported to the CEO. He just told me 'What's the problem? It didn't get caught, and if it did then we can fix it later on. I think you over-reacted, and shouldn't have taken any actions'. Then why was I in charge of overall security and safety? And this was not the first time regarding such breach attempt. Prior to that I received a request to upload/update data of certain users (who requested consultation regarding the service) to Google Spreadsheet in real time so contractor marketing company could use it to contact said users  Of course I denied them, as the PIP Act states that nobody shall copy user data elsewhere, and that the data should always be stored at designated data storage (certified cloud providers, or physical database inside the company. We don't have in-house servers so AWS it is). And no, you can't store some of the data as plain text. Just implemented a separate restricted page for employees of the contractor to be able to see only designated users (someone in the company designates users to each employee of contractor each day, or it can be done automatically) for the day. This way they have no access to previous data nor any other data that are not designated. If they try to join the data together from each employee, that means they're breaching the law.Another request was for users to input their social security number directly to receive rewards related to reward events for some services. Direct input of SSC is forbidden by law unless your company is a certified company/organization (banks, government, etc), so of course I refused, provided alternative option (users can upload photo of their ID, which is encrypted and stored somewhere safe, then only the accounting people can open through decryption function that only they have access to, verify and send the reward money), and of course they were sour. They even went directly to accounting and asked if what I said was true, and the accounting confirmed that I was telling them the truth and that only certified body can directly request social security code input, otherwise it's a breach of law. Thankfully accounting people are very strict. So I just implemented encryption/decryption (salt it, rub it, do whatever needed) instead, and they were still sour that only certain people had access. They then asked me for OCR implementation because 'technically it isn't user's direct input, right?', which I denied because accounting needs photo or copy of ID and not the drat texts. Also OCR? Oh yeah easier said than done.  Nemo2342 posted:Honestly, I don't even think the complaints themselves matter, as far as the story goes. As best I can tell you can boil it down to: Basically this. But hey, I have evidences since Day 1 stashed up somewhere, so have fun.
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Sep 29, 2019 03:47
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It might be the language and culture barrier, but you do come across as slightly aggressive goon. 
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Sep 29, 2019 09:01
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Nemo2342 posted:Honestly, I don't even think the complaints themselves matter, as far as the story goes. As best I can tell you can boil it down to:  Nice meltdown...? dragonshardz fucked around with this message at 11:20 on Sep 29, 2019 |
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Sep 29, 2019 11:17
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Xarn posted:It might be the language and culture barrier, but you do come across as slightly aggressive goon. Yeah, that’s what I’ve been struggling with the whole time. Like I only know one native Korean, not all that well, she’s a woman from a country with gender roles a good 50 years behind the US (yes I know they have had a woman president), she’s spent roughly 50% of her life in the US, and she’s still pretty drat blunt by American standards, so maybe Aesis just comes across worse than he is due to cultural and language differences. Or maybe he is a rude passive-aggressive goon. I can’t tell.
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Sep 29, 2019 15:22
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Rawr. Nah, it’s probably just how I write. Too much time spent being taught objective third person formal essays in the UK probably. Also I spent way too much time reading books and newspapers in order to keep my English/Korean proficiency in check, which is probably why my family laughs at me when I talk in certain way or use certain words as those are rarely used in conversations. Edit: tbh I was looking for other places as I’ve pretty much finished setting up the operations here + work environment was becoming toxic + got salty on how false claims were handled (but probably was an attempt to get rid of me).I was also quite busy working on new implementations per request between proving my innocence, then I was notified in secret that the company was planning to get rid of me as soon as said implementations were finished. Very rude of them tbh. Anyways my stance has always been that I’ll GTFO as soon as I find a new place so please stop bothering me, or we can do this the very proper and bothersome way as the laws state. Aesis fucked around with this message at 16:42 on Sep 29, 2019 |
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Sep 29, 2019 16:14
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No it’s also the things you do and say to/about people hth
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Sep 29, 2019 16:43
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I have a hard time keeping up on this thread, so I skipped forward like 25 pages and that saga is still going on. I know what it sounds like, but there is a culture I’m never going to understand there. In poo poo maybe pissing me off , I feel like I’m losing some of the coherence I had in oversight of the services I run. Just been exhausted lately and things have been getting away from me. I need a break or a reset or something. I got offered the possibility to move to a real office with a real door though - not sure that counts as a reset .
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Sep 29, 2019 18:40
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Aesis posted:I was also quite busy working on new implementations per request between proving my innocence, then I was notified in secret that the company was planning to get rid of me as soon as said implementations were finished. Very rude of them tbh. Anyways my stance has always been that I’ll GTFO as soon as I find a new place so please stop bothering me, or we can do this the very proper and bothersome way as the laws state. Please understand that this reads as "the company needs to spend a lot of time on complaints against me, so they're planning on letting me finish my project before they let me go. I heard about this so I'm playing stick in the mud and am refusing to do the work to defend my job. If you don't like it I'll talk to my lawyer."
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Sep 29, 2019 19:37
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