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The human animal is terribly equipped for piloting a multi-hundred-pound vehicle at highway speeds. It's astonishing we can do it at all. Just think of how often your eyes are closed from blinking but you never notice the blackness because your brain EDITS YOUR MEMORIES to make it seem seamless. But more to the point I've never agreed with the old saw that "all drivers are out to kill you". There's one or two times I've felt deliberately threatened, sure, but it's not like I'm playing Burnout 3 out there. When I started riding I decided to ride like "nobody knows you're there" and so far I've found it's been helpful. Particularly for lane change stuff, I try to stagger myself with respect to other cars in traffic when possible, so I've got a hole in front of and behind me that can be lane changed into, and I've got holes to my left and right that I can dodge into if necessary. The only time I like being directly alongside a car is when I'm accelerating past them so I can see if they look as stupid as they drive.
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Oct 4, 2019 18:06
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Ok sure but how is it I've been driving about fifteen years and never managed to have a single car accident of any magnitude, despite my admittedly terrible human hardware? How is it everyone on this forum is able to pilot a bike, some is which are deliciously fast and powerful, without falling off constantly? I think biological explanations are valid, but human intellect is able to surpass our terrible equipment. The problem is most people just not caring enough to apply themselves, which is an argument against making everyone drive a car IMO.
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Oct 4, 2019 18:19
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Slavvy posted:
modern Harley’s are extremely good bikes. Below Japanese quality yet, but not far Maybe this is just me being located in MKE, the epicenter of Harley culture worldwide, but I can’t get over the associations one gets with the bikes. Also, dentists cosplaying as pirates on the weekend is such a common sight here as to not even be notable in any sense. Mostly everyone who I don’t personally know who hears I ride assumes I either have a Harley or only have a Japanese bike until I can afford a Harley. It’s exhausting.
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Oct 4, 2019 18:31
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Slavvy posted:Ok sure but how is it I've been driving about fifteen years and never managed to have a single car accident of any magnitude, despite my admittedly terrible human hardware? Nah, it's all in the subconscious imo. There's a reason so many martial arts and meditation schools focus on eliminating conscious thought, and that's because it sucks. It's slow, it lies, it gets in the way. The only reason I won't unreservedly say that people drive best when they're not thinking about it is because people have lovely habits that do need conscious correction. But the bulk of driving is done subconsciously. That said, I think the main reason there aren't more accidents is just an issue of chance; there's millions more possibilities that lead to an accident not happening than otherwise. It's just difficult to notice these because "if I'd turned left a second sooner I'd have got hit" looms larger than the thousand variations on "if I'd turned left 10/11/12/13... seconds sooner/later I wouldn't have gotten hit". And the road system we've designed, and the machines that we run through it, are pretty safe. Not all the way safe obviously, but nothing is. But they are predictable. We know how they're meant to work, and how other people drive, and that makes it easier to navigate an accident-free path without having to dedicate a lot of deliberate thought to it.
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Oct 4, 2019 19:06
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I just arrived at my family's mountain cabin, -8c/18f air temp and 10cm/3 inches of snow in the terrain. It's too drat early for this kinda weather. The new self studded front tire worked nicely, though only tested in on the frozen gravel on the road, not ice or snow.
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Oct 4, 2019 20:33
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Phy posted:The human animal is terribly equipped for piloting a multi-hundred-pound vehicle at highway speeds. It's astonishing we can do it at all. Just think of how often your eyes are closed from blinking but you never notice the blackness because your brain EDITS YOUR MEMORIES to make it seem seamless. I don't think the human animal is terribly equipped at piloting fast vehicles, we are amazing at things like path prediction and object recognition. But we are very fallible. If you're looking for thing A, but thing B is there instead, there's a bigger chance you'll miss thing B, even if impacting thing B is also bad. Phy posted:Particularly for lane change stuff, I try to stagger myself with respect to other cars in traffic when possible, so I've got a hole in front of and behind me that can be lane changed into, and I've got holes to my left and right that I can dodge into if necessary. The only time I like being directly alongside a car is when I'm accelerating past them so I can see if they look as stupid as they drive. A great habit. Renaissance Robot posted:subconscious Doesn't really exist. A phenomenon better founded in science is flow state. A different way of thinking of it is simply relaxed concentration, focus and lack of distractions. If you're in a nice flow state, blaring music doesn't distract you from making good traffic decisions. Renaissance Robot posted:And the road system we've designed, and the machines that we run through it, are pretty safe. Not all the way safe obviously, but nothing is. But they are predictable. We know how they're meant to work, and how other people drive, and that makes it easier to navigate an accident-free path without having to dedicate a lot of deliberate thought to it. This is a good point, at least in Europe. The traffic system has been iterated over for many decades, adapting to human behavior based in large part on accident data, psychology, design etc. Kind of related, wanting to build a computer that navigates a system optimized for humans, instead of adding stuff to the traffic system optimized for computers, is a dead end imo.
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Oct 4, 2019 20:50
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Ola posted:Doesn't really exist. A phenomenon better founded in science is flow state. A different way of thinking of it is simply relaxed concentration, focus and lack of distractions. If you're in a nice flow state, blaring music doesn't distract you from making good traffic decisions. This feels like a semantic point to me. But also I was talking more about the level of driving where there's some awareness of road conditions but absolutely nothing is getting committed to memory, the driving style is more reactive, and "concentration" wouldn't be a property you could accurately describe the driver as having. Because I feel like that's how most commuter miles happen.
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Oct 4, 2019 21:56
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Renaissance Robot posted:This feels like a semantic point to me. But also I was talking more about the level of driving where there's some awareness of road conditions but absolutely nothing is getting committed to memory, the driving style is more reactive, and "concentration" wouldn't be a property you could accurately describe the driver as having. Because I feel like that's how most commuter miles happen. It's semantic if "subconscious" was a figure of speech, but as an actual psychological concept it's not doing too well. You're right about commuters not concentrating, I was thinking about the martial arts people you mentioned and likening it to spirited driving that can seem hectic but is actually very relaxing. As for the commuters, you're absolutely right they are not concentrating. Here's a thing: quote:It’s common for people to tune out during the journey, making many left and right turns, stopping at lights, and even parking the car without really thinking about it. Researchers tend to refer to this behavior as “automatic” rather than unconscious. Most automatic behaviors result from something called overlearning — doing them so many times that they become a habit. The first 10 times a pianist plays a particular sonata, he or she must think carefully and consciously about what each finger is doing. Eventually, however, playing the piece becomes automatic. It’s the way we all learned to ride a bike, or even walk, for that matter. https://www.psychologytoday.com/intl/blog/supersurvivors/201707/does-the-unconscious-really-exist I've had many drives like that, where I didn't remember it 5 minutes after. I remember a colleague used to say it was really dangerous, but I didn't think it was. I'm very passive, the mind is churning pretty slowly, but my reaction times were probably just fine because I wasn't doing much else and I was very used to the route.
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Oct 4, 2019 22:18
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Ola posted:It's semantic if "subconscious" was a figure of speech, but as an actual psychological concept it's not doing too well. You're right about commuters not concentrating, I was thinking about the martial arts people you mentioned and likening it to spirited driving that can seem hectic but is actually very relaxing. As for the commuters, you're absolutely right they are not concentrating. Here's a thing: All this talk of automatic responses etc is moot because most people's problem isn't operating the car, it's not staring at Facebook while they're doing it.
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Oct 4, 2019 22:23
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Jim Silly-Balls posted:modern Harley’s are extremely good bikes. Below Japanese quality yet, but not far Bingo. I have a middle-aged coworker from Milwaukee who immediately assumed I only rode dirt when I told him I don't own a Harley. He started down the "jap crap" route when I said I don't own a dirt bike, either. The people who rack up shitloads of miles touring on their Ultras are cool by me. The ones reenacting this South Park episode can gently caress off.
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Oct 4, 2019 22:47
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All this talk of subconscious (or not) is an odd coincidence because I had one of those weird "thinking about breathing" moments today - coming up on a turn and I was suddenly aware of just how many things I was doing at once and for a fraction of a second it overloaded me and I had to actually consciously do things like opening the throttle and turn the bars. Actually thinking about it it's a miracle it doesn't happen more often - at that exact moment as well as the basic mechanics of riding a bike at slowish speed, I was filtering past slow-moving traffic so having to keep an eye out for any of them suddenly deciding to jump out to go down the turn I was heading for (it's a common short-cut for locals between two main roads), keep an eye out for sudden gaps that a turning car or pedestrian could suddenly appear in, look ahead for oncoming traffic to find a gap I could turn in, and also be mindful of other bikers that might be dumb enough to try and overtake me.
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Oct 5, 2019 00:40
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Centipede syndrome is a bitch.
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Oct 5, 2019 07:56
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I have to turn in my car lease in April next year. Since I got it, my life situation has changed such that I barely do 2000mi in a year, if that. I live alone, save for pets, don't have to carry things often (computer shopping sprees or other rare large poo poo excepted), and in general don't really need or want a car. I do still need transport, though, and I'll be honest I really really really want an excuse to get a Zero  Anyway it's months out and idle musings, yet, so while part of me knows it's a bad idea, the majority is here to post the fated question: How Bad Could It Be? I'm in a hurry right now and haven't sat down to think about it more than a minute or two, but all I can really think of are carrying capacity (cargo and passengers; the latter only matters taking cats to the vet, tbh, I don't get out much) and weather, but I can get away with just not riding on cruddy days
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Oct 8, 2019 22:36
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Have you ridden a motorcycle before? A Zero S actually probably wouldn't be a bad first bike, assuming you left it in eco mode for the first several months and you don't care about learning to ride gas bikes (because you will not learn about operating a clutch and gearbox). It's kinda heavy for a newbie bike, but it's narrow and has wide bars, and it's got ABS, and electric motors have very predictable power delivery (completely linear at all speeds).
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Oct 8, 2019 23:16
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Oh yeah, I actually got my driver's license knowing how to ride a motorcycle; MSF lessons and all that on a beat up Honda Rebel 250. (20 years ago, good god.  )It has been a good ten years since i've ridden with any duration; the last ride was, in fact, a quick test ride on one of the first Zeros a few years back. I've been  over the things since! In any case, it's been a while but I'm confident I'd quickly remember how to ride if I ease in, just like the test ride. It's more the practicality of not having a car nowadays that I'm unsure of.(edit) In fact a motorcycle--2001 Harley Sportster, I think--was all I had the first three years of full-time college, and I was totally fine--and that was over a much larger distance through the wretched Las Vegas heat than I have to deal with now. Ciaphas fucked around with this message at 00:42 on Oct 9, 2019 |
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Oct 9, 2019 00:19
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The Zero owners that I know about here are myself (SR), Ripoff (FX or FXS, I can never remember) and LodeRunner (at least I assume he has one or two). Nfknblvbl has an Energica Ego too. Zero SR verdict: it is a lot of fun and somehow riding it is very different from riding my gas bikes. It is incredible in the city, to the extent that I wish I had a job in the city to ride to every day. You know the phrase "drop a gear and disappear"? With a Zero you skip that first bit. That said it's still just a straight-line shooter and doesn't feel as nimble in turns as other bikes I've ridden. I bet the SR/F and the FX/FXS are better on that score. You'll also want to be ginger on cold tires and wet parking lots as it will happily give you as much torque as you want in all the wrong situations. SR/F has TCS which might have saved me there. Luckily fixing it up after a 5mph slide was relatively cheap.
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Oct 9, 2019 01:45
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Slavvy posted:
Can’t imagine how you would struggle to find meaning in life (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Oct 9, 2019 03:04
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I just got my Ego last night so it's gonna take some serious butt on the seat time for me to say anything without bullshitting. That said, it's a HEAVY bike, definitely not something for a beginner.
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Oct 9, 2019 15:42
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Phy posted:Particularly for lane change stuff, I try to stagger myself with respect to other cars in traffic when possible, so I've got a hole in front of and behind me that can be lane changed into, and I've got holes to my left and right that I can dodge into if necessary. The only time I like being directly alongside a car is when I'm accelerating past them so I can see if they look as stupid as they drive. I can't stand driving next to other vehicles in my CAR, so this instinct is strong for me on two wheels as well.
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Oct 9, 2019 15:53
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Martytoof posted:I can't stand driving next to other vehicles in my CAR, so this instinct is strong for me on two wheels as well. I'm not sure how cars can't see motorcycles directly next to them, but I've had people nearly absentmindedly merge into me when I'm in my car. I drive a bright white Dodge Challenger, so I can't really rationalize that one beyond "some people are never paying attention." In leg news, I just spoke with my doctor, and somehow between snapping my leg and being cleared to start putting weight on my foot in an air cast, I also broke my ankle. An X-Ray (and subsequently a CT scan) showed a crack that wasn't on the original images when I first went into the hospital. So now I have to decide between having another screw put into my ankle, or just leaving it alone and letting it heal on its own. Per the doc, the screw would take 15 minutes to do and not impact my recovery, which involves taking this air cast off in about two weeks. Not doing the surgery would necessitate keeping weight off it for another 4 weeks. Riding motorcycles in two weeks or not walking for four? I'm leaning screw.
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Oct 9, 2019 23:14
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Here's a dumb question that indicates that I've never had any major surgery/injury requiring hardware... Do screws ever come out? Like, I get that they put rods and screws in peoples bodies but ... do the screws ever get taken out or are they there forever? I broke my hand last year playing hockey and the doc was very close to putting a screw in because he was worried it wouldn't heal properly. I was opposed to the screw because I thought it might complicate things down the road. The doc decided against the screw and felt it would heal properly. Now when I do pushups, that part of my hand gives me some issues so I'm pretty convinced it didn't heal 100%. Verman fucked around with this message at 23:22 on Oct 9, 2019 |
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Oct 9, 2019 23:19
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Verman posted:Here's a dumb question that indicates that I've never had any major surgery/injury requiring hardware... Short answer: if they need to. My surgeon told me that if there aren't any complications, they can stay in there forever. A buddy of mine broke his leg when he was younger, and had a titanium rod inserted in his femur. He wound up having his removed because he entered the military and apparently they wouldn't let him enlist with metal in his bones, so they took the rod out. I guess once it heals to a certain point they can remove them, but they probably significantly aid with the recovery. I already have two screws in the top of the bone and two in the bottom connecting it to the rod they inserted in my tibia. I assume metal or not, it's always going to be a little hosed up.
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Oct 9, 2019 23:59
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What I got from this is drivers lack basic concepts of object permanence Martytoof posted:I can't stand driving next to other vehicles in my CAR, so this instinct is strong for me on two wheels as well. e: thinking about that inspired me to finally edit this video I've had for a while. Me being on a bike and always staying on the left side in traffic when in the right lane made it a non event. Totally would have been my fault if I ran into it though, and a big part of it was I was distracted by the truck with the trailer hauling rear end to my left, I hadn't been able to get around and out of the vehicle sandwich for the past mile and it was bothering me. It was a good reminder to me to always look out for unexpected stuff, in all the times I've gone that road no one has ever taken that right turn: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEk2ukVZQlM RightClickSaveAs fucked around with this message at 03:26 on Oct 10, 2019 |
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Oct 10, 2019 02:28
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RightClickSaveAs posted:e: thinking about that inspired me to finally edit this video I've had for a while. Me being on a bike and always staying on the left side in traffic when in the right lane made it a non event. Totally would have been my fault if I ran into it though, and a big part of it was I was distracted by the truck with the trailer hauling rear end to my left, I hadn't been able to get around and out of the vehicle sandwich for the past mile and it was bothering me. It was a good reminder to me to always look out for unexpected stuff, in all the times I've gone that road no one has ever taken that right turn: I think the guy in front of you braked and it made it seem like the truck started to accelerate. The sun's on your back though and kinda washes out his brake lights so it wasn't clear. He also didn't seem to use his turn signals, which doesn't help. Either way, things like this is why I tail much further away to make up for my grandpa reflexes.
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Oct 10, 2019 04:05
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yergacheffe posted:I think the guy in front of you braked and it made it seem like the truck started to accelerate. The sun's on your back though and kinda washes out his brake lights so it wasn't clear. He also didn't seem to use his turn signals, which doesn't help. Either way, things like this is why I tail much further away to make up for my grandpa reflexes. Lane splitting should be legal everywhere, it would have made the whole point moot, I would have split at the light and gotten out of that crush  (  I lane split anyway sometimes but am paranoid about a dumb ticket and aggro angry drivers so do it really sparingly )
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Oct 10, 2019 04:24
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I'd ride to a lot fewer places than I do if I couldn't split lanes, if I'm stuck in traffic I'd rather have AC, comfort, airbags, etc. I'm still amazed it's legal in California and then nowhere else in the US I believe? Someone can correct me if I missed a state, but it's certainly not common.
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Oct 10, 2019 05:38
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yergacheffe posted:I think the guy in front of you braked and it made it seem like the truck started to accelerate. The sun's on your back though and kinda washes out his brake lights so it wasn't clear. He also didn't seem to use his turn signals, which doesn't help. Either way, things like this is why I tail much further away to make up for my grandpa reflexes. I'd say "always increase your following distance" for situations like that where you can't accelerate out, because you can always use more breathing room. Then again there's days on the motorway where trying to do that just results in you constantly doing 50 because people just won't stop inserting themselves into your 2 second gap, which is endlessly frustrating. Renaissance Robot fucked around with this message at 08:39 on Oct 10, 2019 |
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Oct 10, 2019 08:31
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MomJeans420 posted:I'd ride to a lot fewer places than I do if I couldn't split lanes, if I'm stuck in traffic I'd rather have AC, comfort, airbags, etc. I'm still amazed it's legal in California and then nowhere else in the US I believe? Someone can correct me if I missed a state, but it's certainly not common. Utah has a form of filtering as of this year.
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Oct 10, 2019 16:30
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After many years of putting it off, I got a bluetooth comms unit, the Cardo packtalk slim. It took a little while to get set up, but the pairing and playing of music is pretty seamless. I just have to remember to put DND on my phone so only favorite contacts can get through. The jury is still out in my mind how much this was worth it, but I have to admit I loved riding to John William's Scherzo for Motorcycle and Orchestra (From Indiana Jones III) when heading out for lunch today. One thing with the cardo is the music would sometimes cut in and out at random. Is that common?
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Oct 11, 2019 19:58
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I have a sena, but all these Bluetooth helmet speaker things should be the same. Music cutting randomly isn't normal. if it happens to me, it's usually my phone acting up. Can you try rebooting your phone or try someone else's phone to see if you can replicate the problem?
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Oct 12, 2019 04:01
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MomJeans420 posted:I'd ride to a lot fewer places than I do if I couldn't split lanes, if I'm stuck in traffic I'd rather have AC, comfort, airbags, etc. I'm still amazed it's legal in California and then nowhere else in the US I believe? Someone can correct me if I missed a state, but it's certainly not common. One day, Washington State will allow you to ride your 300cc two-stroke through traffic, lane splitting and wheeling through traffic, that's the day before they ban two-strokes for street legal though. All my bieks are 4stroke though so it doesn't matter
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Oct 12, 2019 08:16
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I had enough cops behind me with the plated 300exc to realize that you could ride anything, as long as you were going the speed limit, and they wouldn't give a poo poo in washington state
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Oct 12, 2019 09:39
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Moral_Hazard posted:After many years of putting it off, I got a bluetooth comms unit, the Cardo packtalk slim. It took a little while to get set up, but the pairing and playing of music is pretty seamless. I just have to remember to put DND on my phone so only favorite contacts can get through. The jury is still out in my mind how much this was worth it, but I have to admit I loved riding to John William's Scherzo for Motorcycle and Orchestra (From Indiana Jones III) when heading out for lunch today. Normally that's the Bluetooth signal being interrupted - where are you keeping your phone in relation to the receiver?
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Oct 12, 2019 10:36
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goddamnedtwisto posted:Normally that's the Bluetooth signal being interrupted - where are you keeping your phone in relation to the receiver? It was in my jacket pocket, so pretty close.
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Oct 14, 2019 14:28
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I have a Patcktalk Bold and while I can’t say I’ve had my Bluetooth cut out, I HAVE had my BT cut out with my phone in my jacket on regular BT headphones for reasons unknown, so I’d say it’s definitely possible.
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Oct 14, 2019 17:53
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Moral_Hazard posted:It was in my jacket pocket, so pretty close. On the same side as the receiver? Annoyingly my jacket has it's map pocket on the right side so if I keep my phone there I get quite a lot of cutting out (presumably my helmet and giant bloody head are enough to block the signal, especially as the receiver on my Sena is a little bit behind my ear). Putting it in my left outside pocket or left trouser pocket works fine though, but I'm never 100% certain about the waterproofing of those pockets.
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Oct 14, 2019 18:42
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Does that pocket have RFID blocking material in it? Or is the phone next to a wallet that does?
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Oct 14, 2019 18:55
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My phones in the past (galaxy s6, pixel 3) have always struggled with bluetooth when my phone is in a pocked and im wearing headphones. It seems like when you put a barrier in between two bluetooth devices, they tend to skip. Materials, phones, and the specific devices might differ on the strength of how they broadcast the signal etc.
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Oct 14, 2019 23:39
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My Packtalk Bold will routinely cut out in my left front pocket, but almost never does when I actually use my handlebar mounted Ram Mount. Pixel 2 XL. Edit: left front pants pocket. Carteret fucked around with this message at 02:11 on Oct 15, 2019 |
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Oct 14, 2019 23:46
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I've never had cutout from my left breast pocket to my sena 5.
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Oct 15, 2019 01:43
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