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Mordja
Apr 26, 2014

Hell Gem

Fallom posted:

Sick, it’s got single player content? I don’t bother with most mods because there’s no way I’m doing multiplayer with 30-year C&C vets or skirmish AI that can’t handle new units.
As shown, it's got a shitload of SP content. And I'd say the AI handles the new units just fine, though of course "spam" tends to be their modus operandi.

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Mordja
Apr 26, 2014

Hell Gem
I'd also say that "newer" mods for TS and RA2 put a bigger emphasis on singleplayer than a lot of other RTS mods. Off the top of my head, I can think of Red Resurrection, Dawn of the Tiberium Age and Twisted Insurrection.

Bonus points: those last two don't even need you to own any of the original games to play them.

habituallyred
Feb 6, 2015

Fallom posted:

Sick, it’s got single player content? I don’t bother with most mods because there’s no way I’m doing multiplayer with 30-year C&C vets or skirmish AI that can’t handle new units.

Spoiler alert: the single player content was made by those 30-year vets. The missions I tried were insanely hard. I swear the slowest game speed was equal to the fastest in vanilla.

Mordja
Apr 26, 2014

Hell Gem
I only played the co-op so far but those seemed fine. Not sure what was up with the speed, it uses the same options as normal YR (I usually play one above the middle) so that might have been a bug.

Soul Reaver
Mar 8, 2009

in retrospect the old redtext was a little over the top, I think I was in a bad mood that day. it appears you've learned your lesson about slagging our gods and masters at beamdog but I'm still going to leave this av up because i think its funny

god bless
Can someone explain the appeal of the C&C series to me? Is it that multiplayer is particularly fun?

I've never been enamored of C&C in single player. The non-fighty bits are too slow, while fighty bits felt too fast (ie, units seem to be made of tissue paper) and too unit-spammy to me to actually rate as enjoyable. I liked the concept/setting (particularly Tiberian Sun) but never really seemed the enjoy the execution.

The only one in the series I actually liked was Red Alert 3 and that's largely because of how ridiculous a lot of it was and the sheer amount of ham on display in the cinematics. I literally only bought the game because of Tim Curry.

habituallyred
Feb 6, 2015
In retrospect it may have just been super speed compared to normal, lagging, Yuri's revenge. Which would in turn make the missions impossible.

Does it work well on Windows 10? I might double check for myself.

Davincie
Jul 7, 2008

Soul Reaver posted:

Can someone explain the appeal of the C&C series to me? Is it that multiplayer is particularly fun?

I've never been enamored of C&C in single player. The non-fighty bits are too slow, while fighty bits felt too fast (ie, units seem to be made of tissue paper) and too unit-spammy to me to actually rate as enjoyable. I liked the concept/setting (particularly Tiberian Sun) but never really seemed the enjoy the execution.

The only one in the series I actually liked was Red Alert 3 and that's largely because of how ridiculous a lot of it was and the sheer amount of ham on display in the cinematics. I literally only bought the game because of Tim Curry.

the incredibly over the top story and fun varied campaign missions really. whether its cultists vs globalists or soviets vs capitalists watching all the over the top cutscenes and pretending i was invading america brought me a lot of joy when i played them as a kid

C.M. Kruger
Oct 28, 2013

Soul Reaver posted:

Can someone explain the appeal of the C&C series to me? Is it that multiplayer is particularly fun?

I've never been enamored of C&C in single player. The non-fighty bits are too slow, while fighty bits felt too fast (ie, units seem to be made of tissue paper) and too unit-spammy to me to actually rate as enjoyable. I liked the concept/setting (particularly Tiberian Sun) but never really seemed the enjoy the execution.

The only one in the series I actually liked was Red Alert 3 and that's largely because of how ridiculous a lot of it was and the sheer amount of ham on display in the cinematics. I literally only bought the game because of Tim Curry.

Now admittedly I haven't played once since I was a kid, and I only ever played single player, but:
The games had a fun cinematic feel. You'd have some guy yelling at you to do XYZ in a cutscene and then go into the mission with scripted events and so on.

There was a good balance of regular missions where you'd build up a force while defending and then crush the enemy bases, and "puzzle" ones where you had to work with limited resources like Tanya or started out with limited resources and damaged units like that mission where GDI gets their funding cut.

Cool unit design. GDI had the Mammoth Tank and Orca fighters, NOD had flamethrower/stealth tanks and rocket buggies and so on. Red Alert was more conventional but still had stuff like the Tesla Tanks and so on. Tiberium Sun gave GDI mechs and more super tech while NOD had cyborgs and tunneling tanks. RA2 went further towards camp and had stuff like rocket pack infantry, airships and mind-controlled giant squids. Generals came right around when modern military shooters started taking off in popularity and had all sorts of poo poo like super weapons, anthrax missiles, nuke shooting bunker tanks, unit upgrades, etc. In all cases this resulted in some level of asymmetric gameplay, everybody had tanks yeah but they're not equal so you have to play a bit differently.

Good music.

I haven't played the more recent games, I was always more of a fan of RA2 over TS and in the time between Generals (which wasn't very "charismatic" compared to the other games) and Tiberium Wars I lost interest in the series, and when RA3 came out it looked overly silly and had SecuROM.

Cynic Jester
Apr 11, 2009

Let's put a simile on that face
A dazzling simile
Twinkling like the night sky
Is the new faction icon a grenade? It kind of looks like it in the trailer.

Mordja
Apr 26, 2014

Hell Gem
It's some sort of shark-sphere...thing.

Beefeater1980
Sep 12, 2008

My God, it's full of Horatios!






Soul Reaver posted:

Can someone explain the appeal of the C&C series to me? Is it that multiplayer is particularly fun?

I've never been enamored of C&C in single player. The non-fighty bits are too slow, while fighty bits felt too fast (ie, units seem to be made of tissue paper) and too unit-spammy to me to actually rate as enjoyable. I liked the concept/setting (particularly Tiberian Sun) but never really seemed the enjoy the execution.

The only one in the series I actually liked was Red Alert 3 and that's largely because of how ridiculous a lot of it was and the sheer amount of ham on display in the cinematics. I literally only bought the game because of Tim Curry.

“Behind me, war-torn Bialystok...”

Mordja
Apr 26, 2014

Hell Gem
I guess if you like Warcraft 3...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2REJkiLHds

Davincie
Jul 7, 2008

i got in the beta and despite several tries i was never able to find another player, probably doa

Dandywalken
Feb 11, 2014

Mordja posted:

Time for another effortpost, this one on Mental Omega.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmYE3JDL59g

Mental Omega is, by my money, one of the most fully-featured mods around. Billed as an "unofficial expansion pack" for Command & Conquer: Yuri's Revenge, the sheer amount of content in this thing eclipses that moniker. It's got a staggering number of new units, new missions, new maps, and new gameplay mechanics.


How many new units? Well, I didn't count them but the mod's got four factions, each faction is divided into three subfactions, and each subfaction has a mostly unique set of units. Diversity is the name of the game here, and while there are definitely shared archetypes across the races, they tend to play quite differently. For example, while both the Soviet's Latin Confederation and Epsilon's (Yuri) Scorpion Cell are fast and cheap, the former harasses with suicide and debuff units while the latter contaminates the battle with poison and strikes from below.


Anyone familiar with Yuri's revenge might have noticed I mentioned "four" factions because MO 3.3 added a completely new one to the game, the Foehn Revolt. They're this expensive, high-tech army that's got nanotech, plasma weaponry, and wind manipulation, and borrow a few designs from the original C&Cs and even Dune 2.


As for the number of missions, that I will count. As per the website, this mod's currently got a whopping 66 campaign levels, split into two acts, 16 side missions, and 36 co-op ones. I'm pretty sure that's more than any existing commercial RTS on the market though I'd love to be proven wrong. On top of that I'm gonna say the game probably has well over a hundred different skirmish and multiplayer maps, including PVE challenge and 1v3 Fortress maps.


The entire mod's built for CNCNet, meaning its got multiplayer support right out of the box and a much more customizable front-end. If you own Yuri's Revenge, you should definitely give Mental Omega a try. The latest version can be downloaded here.

Mental Omega loving rules but Foehn and Yunru are lame as hell.

The SP campaign is terrific though.

LordSloth
Mar 7, 2008

Disgruntled (IT) Employee

Happy Hedonist posted:

I would like to play co-op AI War. I just reinstalled it a few days ago and realized it's been a long rear end time since I've played it because I'm completely lost. Anyone else interested in trying to schedule a clueless newbie game?

Hmmm... I've got a busy couple of days in front of me but after that I could entertain the ideal

So, Fantasy General 2 briefly popped up on my radar with good reviews, but then dropped back off my radar hard. I've seen more Dominions 5 streams than FG streams in the past week. Any goon opinions?

Chas McGill
Oct 29, 2010

loves Fat Philippe
We've been playing Zero K (freeware Supcom/Total Annihilation-like) and enjoying it a lot. Are there any fantasy themed games with similar gameplay out there? I'd love to play a crazy RTS like Supcom but with the flavour of Dominions.

Tiny Timbs
Sep 6, 2008

Chas McGill posted:

We've been playing Zero K (freeware Supcom/Total Annihilation-like) and enjoying it a lot. Are there any fantasy themed games with similar gameplay out there? I'd love to play a crazy RTS like Supcom but with the flavour of Dominions.

Total Annihilation with a fantasy theme, you say? Perhaps Kingdoms?

ZearothK
Aug 25, 2008

I've lost twice, I've failed twice and I've gotten two dishonorable mentions within 7 weeks. But I keep coming back. I am The Trooper!

THUNDERDOME LOSER 2021


Fallom posted:

Total Annihilation with a fantasy theme, you say? Perhaps Kingdoms?

I fully acknowledge Kingdoms was pretty bad and derivative - though not moreso than 99% of fantasy -, but I still have a soft spot for it. The artwork and designs was pretty good? It is definitely a game I'd love to see resurrected.

Mordja
Apr 26, 2014

Hell Gem
Some brave soul is still modding TA:K, trying to make it somewhat balanced. New Era I think it's called?

Mordja
Apr 26, 2014

Hell Gem
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjbtTJ3sNe0

Soul Reaver
Mar 8, 2009

in retrospect the old redtext was a little over the top, I think I was in a bad mood that day. it appears you've learned your lesson about slagging our gods and masters at beamdog but I'm still going to leave this av up because i think its funny

god bless
Hah, I just reviewed the Unification Mod for Dawn of War - Soulstorm (basically the be-all uber-mod that combines bugfixing and allows you to easily use all the major race mods) and realized they've incorporated my armour pierce fix by default.

I don't know if anyone really cares, but I'm going to talk about it anyway because I find the story behind that fix interesting.

As I was doing some bugfix modding, I ran into some very odd values. Most of those weird values came from the first expansion for Dawn of War (Winter Assault), but the same values have been kept in every iteration of the game.
The values were concerning 'armour penetration'.
Dawn of War assigns different armour penetration values for attacks, depending on the armour type they're hitting, and they'll affect the damage of attacks and abilities accordingly. Normally, armour penetration ranges from 0-100 (0 will mean it does minimum damage, 100 means it'll do max)
However, I ran into a number of values where armour penetration was over 100 - right up to 300, in fact.
The game itself just rounds those numbers down to 100, but when I started thinking about it, I realized that the developers had almost certainly intended (but never properly tested/implemented) for those attacks to, in fact, do multiple times more damage to certain unit types than they were doing. Affected abilities/weapons were almost invariably ones that were surprisingly underwhelming in-game.

For those that have played the game: do you notice how the Imperial Guard General's "Stafing Run" ability is really underwhelming? It sucks against buildings, it sucks against infantry (except knocking them over) and it has a long charge time. Tech wise it's comparable to the Eldar's Psionic Storm or the Force Commander's Orbital Strike, but it totally and utterly sucks in comparison.
Thing is, according to the armour pierce values, it was supposed to do 300% as much damage to infantry than it does in the vanilla game. And when you test it with that, it actually feels like it suddenly makes sense: in much the same way that Orbital Strike can nuke buildings, Strafing Run can nuke troops that don't get out of its way (which they usually can if they're paying attention). It suddenly became a much more useful and interesting ability.
The Tau Crisis suit's missile pod (which just pales in comparison to the mutually exclusive flamer option) is supposed to do a lot more damage to light/medium vehicles if you go by the buggy armour piercing value, giving it some utility.
The Hellhound's flame cannon is supposed to burn down light buildings (like listening posts) much faster than it does, which makes sense from a fluff perspective and makes them better 'hit and run' units.
The Eldar Harlequin's Riveblade should make them into commander-killing assassins, even moreso than they already are. Assuming they live long enough to get that close.

I found it interesting that all this was likely intended, yet never really implemented. I find it shocking to what extent the creators of the game/expansions didn't understand their own engine, and how little they cared about correcting this sort of stuff over numerous iterations and patches.

Thank god for community modding/bugfixing, I guess?

Cicero
Dec 17, 2003

Jumpjet, melta, jumpjet. Repeat for ten minutes or until victory is assured.
Relic's games always felt fairly unpolished compared to Blizzard's RTSes. It took them like a year to fix Jeeps loving with Kettenkrad pathfinding in CoH. Like if you just ordered the Jeep around the krad, the krad would slomo freak out and barely move. HUGE bug for competitive play, but they took forever to fix it.

Samopsa
Nov 9, 2009

Krijgt geen speciaal kerstdiner!
relic had/has the best ideas and made the most fun games, but polish was never their strong suit. blizzard is the diametric opposite: bog standard ideas but amaaazing polish and balance.

LordSloth
Mar 7, 2008

Disgruntled (IT) Employee
AI War came up a while ago; following up on that with this:

AI War 2 is out, got it on a pretty major markdown between the sale (till november 1st) and steam coupon. It's good, though the changes to a fleet system are taking a while to soak in.
There's already a Thotmix LP in progress, though I haven't seen a general games thread yet.
https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3901855

Samopsa
Nov 9, 2009

Krijgt geen speciaal kerstdiner!
Seconding the ai war 2 recommendation! For ten bucks it's a no brainer.

doctorfrog
Mar 14, 2007

Great.

LordSloth posted:

AI War came up a while ago; following up on that with this:

AI War 2 is out, got it on a pretty major markdown between the sale (till november 1st) and steam coupon. It's good, though the changes to a fleet system are taking a while to soak in.
There's already a Thotmix LP in progress, though I haven't seen a general games thread yet.
https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3901855

Fantastic. I don't have time yet to play it (though it was an immediate release buy for me), but an LP I can sneak in now and then.

I plan on campaigning for one of my preferred features from AI War 1: on loss of focus, auto pause and drop CPU/GPU usage to a minimum--for that extra "should really not be multitasking right now" goodness.

Deakul
Apr 2, 2012

PAM PA RAM

PAM PAM PARAAAAM!

AI War always looked like a clusterfuck to manage everything, how user friendly is their UI this time around?

StrixNebulosa
Feb 14, 2012

You cheated not only the game, but yourself.
But most of all, you cheated BABA

Deakul posted:

AI War always looked like a clusterfuck to manage everything, how user friendly is their UI this time around?

Very! I couldn't grok the first one but in this one I did the tutorials and now I'm losing to the AI in an understandable way. (I overspent my metal)

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012

When I tried to play ai wars I got nowhere because trying to understand anything meant reading a god drat book for every mouse over tooltip. Has the information overload been improved at all?

Samopsa
Nov 9, 2009

Krijgt geen speciaal kerstdiner!
Yeah it's way simpler, in a good way.
From the wiki:

quote:

A Note To Players from AI War Classic
Please note that pretty much every mechanic you are familiar with has been changed to at least a minor degree.

Every mechanic is more flexible now, with ranges of how they can function rather than just being on/off gates. Additionally, mechanics are now heavily dependent on the 8 basic stats of every ship, which are mostly new in this game (note that metal is discussed on that page but not counted as one of the 8 basic stats).

There are no longer any generalized "immune to tractor beams" (or whatever along those lines) properties. Instead, everything is more physically-based and the attacking system would instead say "I can only target ships with xyz physical property."

This does a few things:

Firstly, it makes it so that ships don't have a ton of immunities and single-use stats (like engine health or paralysis resistance amount) defined. This makes tooltips simpler and more consistent.
Secondly, it allows for variable-quality systems. Some tractor beams can be allowed to grab more powerful targets than others, for example.
Thirdly, it makes it so the relevant stats needed to understand how a ship with a special ability functions are all on that ship itself; you can see what sort of ship stats it can hit with its ability, and what its ability does, all in one place. This again increases readability.
Lastly, this future-proofs ships to a certain extent, which is particularly important in a moddable environment. The various physical stats are not arbitrary, but instead define physical properties of the ship. So long as someone who made a custom ship has defined those in a way that makes sense for their ship, then any new weapons introduced in future expansions, other mods, or similar will all "just work" with the custom ship with no changes.
In AIWC, we would have had to evaluate every ship to see if it needs new immunities to the new ability, by contrast, meaning that if a modder didn't do that their ship could act in unexpected ways with new features.

and some other changes:

quote:

In general, AI War 2 is not as micro intensive as classic, and many things have been removed due to redundancy, clutter, or making things easier to understand.

Instead of producing Strikecraft and Frigates immediately, they are bound to a Flagship. You can't just, say for example, immediately build 150 Fighters, Bombers, missile frigates and a bonus ship. Instead, you must have a Flagship that has those units attached to it. Once built however, there is no limit to how far a Strikecraft or frigate can go across the galaxy, like AI War Classic.

Flagships are captured much like Golems from Classic and they are what lets you expand your military power. Flagships come in 3 varieties, strike (generic transport Flagship, but many Strikecraft and Frigates), officer (Flagship has a gimmick or is very powerful on it's own) and Lone Wolf fleets (no supporting Strikecraft or frigates, but the Flagship is INSANELY powerful).

Flagships cannot die. Instead, when they reach 10% health, they become crippled. While crippled, a Flagship cannot have Strikecraft or Frigates assigned to it built and if it has a weapon, can't shoot. The Flagship can still move however and be repaired back to full strength.

Scout Strikecraft no longer exist. Scouting as a whole has been reworked.
Hull and ammo types are gone.
You no longer spend knowledge on individual unit upgrades, but instead on categories divided into weapon types and hull types.
Colony ships no longer exist: in order to build Command Stations on planets, you must have a Flagship on that planet as well as no AI Command station.
Supply mechanic no longer exists, so feel free to build whatever wherever.
Energy collectors do not exist anymore. Instead, Economic Command Stations produce 2 energy collectors' worth of energy, Logistical Command Stations produce 1 energy collector's worth of energy and Military Command Stations produce no energy at all.
Science labs have been removed: Command stations automatically collect science.

Mordja
Apr 26, 2014

Hell Gem
Has anyone played the Homeworld Remastered campaigns with the 2.3 fan patch that lets you adjust/completely disable the dynamic difficulty? Does it break the game, make it too easy? Because I'm on like the 4th or 5th mission and they just spawned Destroyers on me. I guess one option would be to retire my whole fleet every mission but that's real cheesy.

doctorfrog
Mar 14, 2007

Great.

Samopsa posted:

Yeah it's way simpler, in a good way.
From the wiki:


and some other changes:

I’d also add that the game has a pretty good internal AIWarapedia and I haven’t had to look at a Wiki yet.

Fanatic
Mar 9, 2006

:eyepop:
Age of Empires II: Definitive Edition comes out on 14 November and it sure has alot of campaigns. :aaa:

quote:

Complete the William Wallace Campaign. 
Complete the Joan of Arc Campaign. 
Complete the Genghis Khan Campaign. 
Complete the Saladin Campaign. 
Complete the Barbarossa Campaign. 
Complete the Attila the Hun Campaign. 
Complete the El Cid Campaign. 
Complete the Montezuma Campaign. 
Complete all Historical Battles. 
Complete the Alaric Campaign. 
Complete the Bari Campaign. 
Complete the Dracula Campaign. 
Complete the Pachacuti Campaign. 
Complete the Prithviraj Campaign. 
Complete the Sforza Campaign. 
Complete the Francisco de Almeida Campaign. 
Complete the Sundjata Campaign. 
Complete the Tariq ibn Ziyad Campaign. 
Complete the Yodit Campaign. 
Complete the Bayinnaung Campaign. 
Complete the Gajah Mada Campaign. 
Complete the Le Loi Campaign. 
Complete the Suryavarman I Campaign. 
Complete the Ivaylo Campaign. 
Complete the Tamerlane Campaign. 
Complete the Kotyan Khan Campaign. 

Also an Age of Mythology remaster teaser!

https://twitter.com/AgeOfEmpires/status/1192223893651697664

PirateBob
Jun 14, 2003

Fanatic posted:

Age of Empires II: Definitive Edition comes out on 14 November and it sure has alot of campaigns. :aaa:


Also an Age of Mythology remaster teaser!

https://twitter.com/AgeOfEmpires/status/1192223893651697664

Ahh sick. Can't wait for AoE2 on Thursday, and AoM whenever they remake that. :D

Edit: did they create a bunch of brand new campaigns for AoE2 DE?

PirateBob fucked around with this message at 20:45 on Nov 10, 2019

Samopsa
Nov 9, 2009

Krijgt geen speciaal kerstdiner!
yeah, a 4 new civs and 3 campaigns. The AoE2 youtubers are already showing off the game, like here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkFJNKk3IFc

PirateBob
Jun 14, 2003
I don't like the UI and font :/

ZearothK
Aug 25, 2008

I've lost twice, I've failed twice and I've gotten two dishonorable mentions within 7 weeks. But I keep coming back. I am The Trooper!

THUNDERDOME LOSER 2021


A Year of Rain is in EA now. Any takers from our steemed forums? Reviews suggest there are quite a few technical problems with the game.

Cicero
Dec 17, 2003

Jumpjet, melta, jumpjet. Repeat for ten minutes or until victory is assured.

PirateBob posted:

I don't like the UI and font :/
Yeah that font sucks. Very 90's, in a bad way. Feels low budget now. And there's a lot of whitespace issues that make the UI feel off.

Cicero
Dec 17, 2003

Jumpjet, melta, jumpjet. Repeat for ten minutes or until victory is assured.
What options are around as far as co-op RTS gaming? Not counting just custom skirmishes vs AI, almost everything has that. SC2's co-op mode is good, though ideally I'd like something that's more of a campaign. Gonna be playing with my 8 year old.

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Gun Jam
Apr 11, 2015

Cicero posted:

What options are around as far as co-op RTS gaming? Not counting just custom skirmishes vs AI, almost everything has that. SC2's co-op mode is good, though ideally I'd like something that's more of a campaign. Gonna be playing with my 8 year old.

Red Alert 3 had them - the campaign were designed so it'll be either the player+AI, or co-op.
Dawn of War 2 did co-op by giving two squads for each player (single, you control all four).
Note that I didn't play either, even if I'm familiar with them, so.

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