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Sorites posted:"If this card has exactly four attached Water Energy, Hydro Pump does 10 extra damage. If this card has five or more attached Water Energy, Hydro Pump does 20 extra damage." "Does 10 damage plus 10 for each attached water energy up to a maximum of 5."
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Nov 1, 2019 18:59
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Sorites posted:"If this card has exactly four attached Water Energy, Hydro Pump does 10 extra damage. If this card has five or more attached Water Energy, Hydro Pump does 20 extra damage." Bruceski posted:"Does 10 damage plus 10 for each attached water energy up to a maximum of 5." What? No, those are both wrong. 3 water 40 damage 4 water 50 damage 5 or more water 60 damage It's not that complicated. Actually, the second one is technically correct if you include the stipulation that it's unusable below 3 water. Sorry for misinterpreting you.
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Nov 1, 2019 19:34
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Maybe they should have given Blastoise three Water moves, like every kid's starter Pokemon. Water Gun, UUU, 30 Surf, UUUU, 40 Hydro Pump, UUUUU, 50
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Nov 1, 2019 19:41
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cant cook creole bream posted:Actually, the second one is technically correct if you include the stipulation that it's unusable below 3 water. Sorry for misinterpreting you. 
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Nov 1, 2019 19:42
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It's weirdly worded, but if you guys are having trouble understanding this move, then you're not gonna like the even crazier poo poo, especially next game.
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Nov 1, 2019 19:46
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Chamale posted:Maybe they should have given Blastoise three Water moves, like every kid's starter Pokemon. The card game is actually pretty consistent in that, while the powers and costs of attacks may change, the special effects of a move with a certain name will generally be the same across different cards. Surf is a vanilla attack, water gun and hydro pump both do extra damage from having more water energy than needed. The Golux fucked around with this message at 03:57 on Nov 2, 2019 |
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Nov 2, 2019 03:53
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Water's gimmick seems to be stacking energy over the top of move requirements whereas Fire's gimmick is discarding attached energy, as such both Blastoise and Charizard have powers that compliment this. Blastoise lets you stack more whereas Charizard will let you chuck in anything to fuel the fire. Not sure why Venasaur gets an energy power though, Grass in this game is mostly about status effects and passive healing more than anything.
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Nov 2, 2019 11:35
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Manic_Misanthrope posted:Water's gimmick seems to be stacking energy over the top of move requirements whereas Fire's gimmick is discarding attached energy, as such both Blastoise and Charizard have powers that compliment this. Blastoise lets you stack more whereas Charizard will let you chuck in anything to fuel the fire. Not sure why Venasaur gets an energy power though, Grass in this game is mostly about status effects and passive healing more than anything. I think it was just to give the three starters Energy-related abilities. That said, Charizard is obviously the weakest of the group. I don't know if he's ever been impressive in the TCG.
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Nov 2, 2019 11:38
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Onmi posted:That said, Charizard is obviously the Big numbers = best card, don't @ me.
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Nov 2, 2019 15:39
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Blaze Dragon posted:Big numbers = best card, don't @ me. do i have the charizard for you 
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Nov 2, 2019 16:38
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What's that weakness, Fairy? I quit during Gen 2 so it's kind of interesting to see where the game went afterwards.
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Nov 2, 2019 16:47
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anilEhilated posted:What's that weakness, Fairy? I quit during Gen 2 so it's kind of interesting to see where the game went afterwards. Yeah. Dragon Type was finally introduced towards the end of Gen 5 (with the gimmick of: it doesnt have its own energy & always takes 2 different types) and Fairy was introduced with the first XY set. They also introduced vanilla, non-special Dark & Steel energy during gen 4's TCG
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Nov 2, 2019 16:51
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rannum posted:Yeah. Dragon Type was finally introduced towards the end of Gen 5 (with the gimmick of: it doesnt have its own energy & always takes 2 different types) and Fairy was introduced with the first XY set. They also introduced vanilla, non-special Dark & Steel energy during gen 4's TCG In the TCG, though, dragons are... Well, there's a Garchomp deck that's very solid in Theme Deck format?  Meanwhile, there's been at least one top-tier fairy deck in pretty much every format since the type's introduction. Usually involving Gardevoir.Edit: Speaking of 'Pokemon that are surprisingly and hilariously good in the TCG: Garbodor. One Garbodor, with Garbotoxin, hoses entire strategies by just turning off all Abilities as long as it's holding an item. It's been reprinted or effectively reprinted a few different times, and it is still a top-tier Pokemon that you absolutely need to have multiple answers for if you're going to use a deck with a lot of abilities. Meanwhile, video game Garbodor is... a good Spikes setter in the Never-Used tier. girl dick energy fucked around with this message at 10:46 on Nov 3, 2019 |
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Nov 3, 2019 10:38
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so, are there specific things that specific types focus on mechanically, kind of like the color pie in mtg, or do they just do whatever
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Nov 3, 2019 13:00
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fluffyDeathbringer posted:so, are there specific things that specific types focus on mechanically, kind of like the color pie in mtg, or do they just do whatever Kinda? Just from googling quote:Fire type typically hit hard, but are slow to build (usually) and you have to discard an energy many times. But most pokemon deck building is around "Who is primary, who is my secondary?" So as an example, a really stupidly good deck that was prebuilt that they sold was Keldeo vs Rayquaza So let's take a look at that Keldeo deck. It's an old one but we can see what it's doing.   Well it's got Blastoise, so we can immediately tell it's an energy build deck, so if we look at Keldeo  Seems obvious, the plan is to stack as much energy on Keldeo as possible to basically just ram through. Best thing is, it's ability is a free swap.  Milotic helps us get back our poo poo when we discard it, while Feebas has an attack that's "Flip two coins, draw a card for each heads." Which helps us dig through the deck.  Octillery is entirely being used for its ability  Lapras is a wall that fetches us Keldeo and any of the basics we need.  Articuno is... mostly for stalling.  And Regice is definitly for keeping your opponents Ex pokemon down. So plan is "Get Blastoise so that we can pump energy into Keldeo, so Keldeo can just one shot things."
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Nov 3, 2019 13:19
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Onmi posted:detailed explanation cheers, much appreciated
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Nov 3, 2019 14:50
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Yeah later TCG gives you a lot more options so you can put a variety of Pokemon in it, but for these games you want as little Pokemon as possible so you can draw into them, preferably with Pokeball or Computer Search.
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Nov 3, 2019 17:37
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If you're still taking deck requests. I'd like to see you use one with as many promo and gbc exclusive cards as feasible, including the two extra special ones. I can't think of a clever name for it. MR. J fucked around with this message at 10:57 on Nov 4, 2019 |
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Nov 4, 2019 10:53
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Random hits as gently caress as a nice ring. The meowth actually was fairly decent when used against a stall Pokemon. It's just a weaker easier to use version of one of the legendary cards.
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Nov 4, 2019 14:44
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Part 4: Technikachu Science Club What up nerds, it's time to go to loser central and swirly some peeps.  LAD: another rare card. I wish I could trade cards like Ishihara.    I'm thinking about trading my Flying Pikachu for one. Do you have a Ditto? Oh wonderful! Then without delay...   Alright, the last Pikachu promo card. Uh, kinda. Also marks the first appearance of Flying Pikachu, being an insert of the Nov 1997 CoroCoro magazine and available in the west through official TCG leagues in Aug 2001. Like the other Pikachu promos it's pretty bad, doesn't even have the consistency of Surfing Pikachu, but hey, maybe we'll find a way to make it work.   Science Pokemon cards! Science Pokemon are exceedingly strong. Would you like to duel against my Science Pokemon deck? We'll play with 4 prizes. Let's begin.  Another club, another new deck. Since there's more clubs than types, they improvised a couple, since there's no Colourless Club. The Science Club uses Colourless and Grass that tend to be Poison types.   For our deck, as you can see, we're using Wigglytuff, because Do the Wave is insane, as well as Clefable, since it's also very interesting. The GB Jigglypuff is very useful to start off with, as Friendship Song, when the coin flip is successful, picks a random Basic from your deck to put on the bench. You'll notice a lot of GB cards have these random effects, which definitely isn't something you could do in an actual irl match. Anyway, this deck was first suggested by PMush Perfect, called Clap! Your! Hands! because there's no emoji for it in the game.  And since we haven't used Psychic energy yet, might as well, Colourless Pokemon are free to use whatever, we could only use DCEs for our energy if we were loving insane.   Arbok is what Erik has the most of, even though it's a pretty bad card, it also has Poison Fang that does 20 for 3 energy and also poisons. Ew. He also has Beedrill and Nidoking, as well as Weezing, but with very little draw support, the chance of him getting two evolutions is rare. He even has 2 Imposter Professor Oak, which only helps us! It makes us shuffle our hand into our deck and draw 7 new cards, it's pretty funny.    It keeps swapping us around, so we get to show off Clefable for a moment. This card is actually insane under the right circumstances, for 1 energy it can use any move in the game without any penalty. But that's the main problem, it is wholly dependent on the opponent. If you're fighting a Charizard, you can hit it for 100 damage for 1 energy AND don't have to discard anything, it's nuts. That's why it's pretty garbage in this game, since you should be knocking out your opponent's Basics before they can do anything, and they usually have terrible moves. We'll see this later. Also it can never proc weakness damage, but still, very quick to set up and kinda tanky, so it's fun to experiment with!   Easy enough since once Wigglytuff gets going, it loving destroys the opponent. I love it.   For some clubs you need to beat every member, like the Water Club, whereas for some you only need to fight whoever's in the way, like this one, but we'll still fight everyone at least once.   Huh? Oh, this? This is a machine that makes decks. It's much better than Dr. Mason's. Hmm... let me see here... do you want to duel against me? Shall we begin the match? It will be a single match for 4 prizes.  Interesting David's deck is named as such, he has 2 Nidoqueen... and 1 Nidoking, which doesn't feel very optimal.   Ah, DCEs are always wonderful, don't have too much on the bench, but we'll fix that.   YESSSSSSSS!!! Farfetch'd is a joke in this game too, but you never know, it could work out.   But uh, yeah, Do the Wave, what a surprise. David had a few Basic Colourless mons but focused on Poison types, with a Pinsir just for the heck of it.   If we only used Wigglytuff that'd be boring, which is why I always want to focus on at least 2 Pokemon per deck, so let's give Clefable a go, I'm sure our next opponent will be just fine!   Alright, onto the actual path.   Joseph's gimmick is Flying types, his entire deck has them, as well as 2 Flying Pikachu! He's pretty balanced between Grass and Lightning energy since most of his deck is fine with either.   Best to set up two of the same Pokemon, since he loves shifting your mons.   Two can play at this game! Not that it's very helpful, we'll be here a while if this is all we can do.   Uh, okay. This game has a lot of different trainers, but I haven't really talked about them since a lot of them are pretty meh and you don't have too much room after Bill, Professor Oak, Computer Search, etc. Like this just means both players get bricked and can't draw support, which seems a little pointless, but I suppose it's useful if you've gotten everything you need and don't want your opponent to get a better hand.   Ain't this just great. It's even worse using it on Pidgey, since it only deals 10 damage!   Begun, the Peck wars have.   Alright this was a terrible battle to use Clefable, Wigglytuff it is!   Alright, one more try, though we could both use Leech Life on each other until the heat death of the universe. It also has Wing Attack for 30 damage.     Clefable got a kill, which is all I care about. Let's get the gently caress outta here.    And... take this. Rick's in the middle of an experiment, so don't bother him too much.  Science rules nature! That is why it is so strong. Do you wish to test the strengths of science by playing against me? Alright, 6 prizes! Let us begin! Club Master Duel   It's me, Dr. Mason. How are you doing, Marco? I have some information for you about Rick's Deck - he's the master of the Science Club. His deck uses Muk's Toxic Gas to prevent your Pokemon from using Pokemon Power! Avoid using a deck that relies on Pokemon Power to attack. His deck's weakness is Psychic Pokemon! Collect Psychic Pokemon to duel his deck! I suggest you study the deck from the Psychic Medal Deck Machine. Hopefully, it will be of some assistance... Win all 8 Master Medals, Marco! Mason Laboratory Doctor Mason    Grimer's paralysis is annoying, but I can reflect is right back at- oh who am I kidding.   After getting paralyzed enough and doing mediocre damage in return, best just fill out the bench and do something useful with our lives.    And there we go, just blow through every Basic he has. Rick can be tough depending on your deck since he can lock down Poke Powers, and he even has a few Mewtwo to surprise someone bringing their own Psychic deck. His other main gimmick is bringing a bunch of Trainers, such as Pokedex and Maintenance, which is why he wasn't drawing into his various Basics and let me take them all out. Sucks, but you can see how effective one half of my deck was compared to the other half due to how the AI works.     Legendary Cards are but a legend! Science is the only truth! I must continue my research of Science Pokemon! Lightning Club Now to fight Lightning with Lightning, with a twist. Of course we had to use Pikachu eventually, but we're bringing along Meowth so the two can work together for once. This deck was suggested by dungeon cousin and called Best Frenemies.   More promo cards? Hell yeah, this is- hey, wait, this is a lower level!!!    Holy poo poo this card is bad, goddamn. But hey, it can be a good shield that does nothing in return, as it's the only Pokemon aside from Charizard and Chansey that can take a Fire Spin! I can't think of anything else it can do. It was available in Japan via the Official Card File in June 1997, whatever that means, and was one of four cards you could get for buying a ticket to the first Pokemon movie. Gotta say, I'd feel pretty ripped off getting this instead of a Mewtwo.   I see those cute little eyes! Hey, do you want to duel my Pikachu deck? OK then! Let's play with 4 prizes!  Well let's have some Meowth action so we're not overloaded with Pikachu like every single game in the franchise.   Ugh, loving Pokeball. This Meowth is a GB one that does 20 damage to a random opponent, so that's neat I guess.    We've fought this before, but I'll always highlight the two Pokemon we're using, no matter what. Nothing too crazy, but it's dependable damage that also keeps you alive and well and that's nice. Might as well always use Pounce, unless you know the enemy won't attack next turn.   But yeah, Pikachu is the name of the Jennifer game, with a few Raichu to evolve her non-Promo ones. Or more specifically, you can evolve Promos, so long as it has the same name as the regular card. Raichu evolves from Pikachu, but that's not what the Surfing and Flying Pikachu cards are called. Also having her lead with Surfing Pikachu is great since she has less Water energy, making her stuck for a bit, though she does have 4 Bill. Maybe the first trainer to do such a crazy thing.   Ugh, she does have a lot of Potions, also, including Super Potions! Discard an energy from a Pokemon to heal it by 50, which is pretty drat good, but I prefer saving deck space.    Lightning mons love doing bench damage, as we see with our first Raichu, as I'll split the card designs if the chosen Pokemon has more than one in the game. This one isn't as useful, but what a happy little bench destroyer this is, even if it's very slow for not much payoff. You'd rather big upfront damage than multiple turns plinking the bench.  Awww! My Pikachu lost! You have to take care of your Pokemon cards!  What? A Pokemon Trading Card Duel? I'll be glad to duel any time! OK, 4 prizes! Ready? Let's do it!  Ah dammit, I hate coinflips. The other Meowth we're using has Pay Day, 20 damage for 2 energy is cool, and the chance to draw an extra is also cool.   Let's get these outta here, the regular Pikachu can do some damage with Thunder Jolt while Voltorb only has Tackle for 10 damage lol   I have 2 Water energy specifically to use Surfing Pikachu, easy enough to find them with Energy Search.   There we go, Surfing Pikachu is pretty consistent. Brandon uses a lot of different Lighting mons and uses both varieties of the mon, with the exception of GB Jolteon. So long as you don't let Magneton explode or Electrode charge up the bench you should be good.   And since I haven't mentioned it, the Club Master won't battle you until you beat everyone else in the club.   Lightning Pokemon are the toughest Pokemon! How about it? You want to duel me? OK! Let's start! 1 match with 4 prizes!  Oh hey, remember when I said watch out for Selfdestruct?   Brandon is exactly what you think, he uses Weezing, Magneton and Golem, all Selfdestruct users, but it also makes his deck a bit unfocused and stocked up with THIRTY energy. He also uses Defender so his Pokemon aren't knocked out by their own Selfdestruct, the prick.   Graveler is a nasty card since Rock Throw does 40 damage for 3 energy, which is very nice, but we just happen to having a Fighting resist here.   And it only takes about 4 turns to knock it out! Woo!   Oh hey this Magnemite is GB exclusive and also weirdly terrible. He could've used Tackle, but I guess the AI looked at Magnetic Storm and thought better of it. It removes all energy cards attached to your Pokemon and then randomly reattaches them. I don't know why they thought that was a good idea.    It's too easy to set this Raichu up in the back and endgame sweep. It deals a lot of damage, but you'll need to keep it healthy if you want to keep using it. Still, while it's pretty drat slow, Agility can help you with setting something else up if Thunder's recoil would KO you. My Lightning Deck lost... I can't believe it... I won't lose next time! I'm gonna zap you!  Got to keep it looking smart! I'm the Lightning Club Master! Sure! I'll duel you! The sparks will fly with 6 prizes! I'll show you what my Lightning Pokemon Deck can do! Club Master Duel  How it's going, Marco? It's me, Doctor Mason. I have some information for you about Isaac's Deck - he's the Master of the Lightning Club. His deck is a Selfdestruct Deck! He uses Selfdestruct for maximum damage! Watch the number of Energy cards on his Pokemon and look out for Selfdestruct. I would suggest using Fighting Pokemon such as Cubone and Rhyhorn to counter Isaac's Deck. The Cubone & Marowak Deck from the Rock Medal Deck Machine is probably your best bet. I hope you find many Fighting Pokemon in this booster pack! Did you find the Pokemon you were looking for in the booster pack? Mason Laboratory Doctor Mason   Oof, you hate to see it, but I've gotta get a better hand.    Let's look at a better Electabuzz than the earlier one. Due to its high HP and ease of getting 40 damage for 2 energy, this fits right into a Haymaker deck, especially since you only need the one Electric energy, so the rest can go to Zapdos. Definitely a dangerous customer, and you can see as we're meeting all the different pieces how they all fit into place.    Well, rip. A dangerous move that nukes most things that aren't Chansey or Charizard. I'm highlighting this different Magneton due to how quickly they stopped the Defender Selfdestruct cheat by making it do more damage than you could stop, but it's still funny to think about.   That put Isaac back to square one since the AI can only focus on one thing at a time, we've been building something in the back. Aside from exploding with Magneton, he also has Electabuzz as his main attacker, as well as some Colourless mons like Kangaskhan and Tauros. Add in Potions and Defenders, he then becomes pretty tricky to take down with all those big HP basics.   Two of us can play at bench damage, we just select the 3 we want to damage and it's good he has 3 on the bench so we get max use out of it!   I got a bit lucky, so we're able to slowly but surely snipe the bench and finish up the match!     And here, take this Booster Pack, too. I'm going to polish my card skills, so come duel again. Rival Encounter  I already won the sixth Medal! I'll see how much better you've gotten! If you win, I'll give you another rare card! Come on!!! Let's duel! We'll play with 6 prizes!   Yes it's another Ronald ambush after the fifth medal. He's getting too Haymaker for my liking, with his only evolution being Dodrio, but he has all kinds of Basics, which makes him very unfocused, especially since he has NO DRAW SUPPORT!!! Anyway, this Mewtwo can be pretty dangerous if you've got a big attacks, but it'll only do 50 damage if you've got the usual 4 energy, and you can fudge that with DCEs. It'll slay Exeggutor but doesn't really have the oomph to take out the big evolutions. You still want to use it, since it'll OHKO a 2 energy Hitmonchan with Pluspower, which is very important.   Well this isn't good, of course the Haymaker comes out when you have a Fighting weak deck.   Still, he keeps retreating and losing energy, and this Raichu can do a lot of damage.   It can take a lot of damage, but hey, if we don't one shot, might as well try Agility, you still do the damage even if you don't get the coinflip.   Ugh, Mr. Mime, that's a pain in the arse that we'll deal with later.  Thankfully we don't need to think about it!     The Legendary Pokemon Cards belong to me!!!  Now this is what I'm talking about! Two cards for 4 discarded energy? gently caress yeah! This was first available in Japan in Apr 1997 as an insert with the Pocket Monster Fan Book, I imagine a lot more copies sold because of it. It only came to the west as part of the Neo Genesis expansion, the first Gen 2 set, so this game was the first English print of the card! It's a shame we can only get one until postgame, I need it!!! Anyway, that's two more clubs down, we're getting through this game. Next time, more decks, more medals and maybe even something else!
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Nov 7, 2019 03:34
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This guy looks weirdly familiar... 
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Nov 7, 2019 04:13
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I got in!  Sorry Clefable was garbage, I forgot how the AI works in this game.
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Nov 7, 2019 04:27
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So let me get this straight. You have a 50% chance to do absolutely nothing on an attack that can only be used once per fight? That only does 30 damage even if it does work? Does the TCG have any cards to let you bounce him back to your hand to refresh that, at least?
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Nov 7, 2019 06:36
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I think trainers called Scoop Up or pokeball can "refresh" a Farfetch.
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Nov 7, 2019 06:54
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rick stop acting like seto kaiba edit: also Imposter Professor Oak is definitely only marginally better than Imakuni?. I guess if you know your opponent has a card that would want to be used but hasn't played yet that can disrupt them?? but "shuffle their hand into the deck" definitely ruins it LiefKatano fucked around with this message at 07:33 on Nov 7, 2019 |
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Nov 7, 2019 07:17
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BisbyWorl posted:So let me get this straight. 30 damage for one energy is the best ratio in the game. The theory is that Farfetch'd can attack on the first turn, then use DCE to attack consistently on the second. It's not a good card, but it's not utter trash. Looks a bit like Scyther if you squint. I've always loved damaging the bench in this game for some reason. Maybe it's because of how the AI floods you with crappy basics and takes forever to build up.
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Nov 7, 2019 07:22
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Chamale posted:30 damage for one energy is the best ratio in the game. The theory is that Farfetch'd can attack on the first turn, then use DCE to attack consistently on the second. It's not a good card, but it's not utter trash. Looks a bit like Scyther if you squint.
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Nov 7, 2019 07:28
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 Wait, why does the TCG call it Lightning type while literally all other media calls it Electric?
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Nov 7, 2019 07:49
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Carbon dioxide posted:
Space concerns I assume? It's like that with lightning vs "thunder" in translations which is usually incorrect.
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Nov 7, 2019 08:13
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Does anyone remember that TV commercial where the kid calls Electabuzz "arguably the best basic Pokemon in the game"? I don't know why, but that never got unstuck from my head. Maybe it was his hammy delivery. I also enjoy how simple Pokemon cards are. The self-destruction effect doing overkill recoil damage is so straightforward compared to "Knock out this Active Pokemon and send it to the discard pile, and if you do, inflict 80 points of battle damage to the Defending Pokemon." Sorites fucked around with this message at 16:11 on Nov 7, 2019 |
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Nov 7, 2019 15:33
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I'd love to see you make a deck around Mr. Mime, because I never really found a good use for it.
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Nov 7, 2019 15:51
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Leraika posted:I'd love to see you make a deck around Mr. Mime, because I never really found a good use for it. loving up the big tier 3 guy with a big retreat cost. Mime literally sits there and takes no damage from them unless your opponent undoes the build up on the dude.
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Nov 7, 2019 16:04
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FoolyCharged posted:loving up the big tier 3 guy with a big retreat cost. Mime literally sits there and takes no damage from them unless your opponent undoes the build up on the dude. Given what we've seen from the AI in this game, I doubt this is even a valid strategy at any point.
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Nov 7, 2019 16:22
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Kikas posted:Given what we've seen from the AI in this game, I doubt this is even a valid strategy at any point. Yeah, that's the thing.
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Nov 7, 2019 17:00
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FoolyCharged posted:loving up the big tier 3 guy with a big retreat cost. Mime literally sits there and takes no damage from them unless your opponent undoes the build up on the dude. I wonder if anyone ever ran a deck that auto lost to Mr. Mime and got away with it because who would expect that. Or does competitive Pokemon have side decks?
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Nov 7, 2019 17:02
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Kikas posted:Given what we've seen from the AI in this game, I doubt this is even a valid strategy at any point. Oh, yeah. No it's useless to the player, but because the player probably has a good deck it's frustrating as hell in an ai deck.
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Nov 7, 2019 17:08
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I absolutely adore the art for Grimer and Koffing.
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Nov 7, 2019 17:32
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Sorites posted:I wonder if anyone ever ran a deck that auto lost to Mr. Mime and got away with it because who would expect that.
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Nov 7, 2019 19:04
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I know I've read that Rain Dance decks were weak to Mr. Mime because Blastoise and Articuno can't touch him, but I have no idea if that was ever significant in the meta. Hitmonchan was one of the most played Pokemon back then, and he crushes Mime in two turns.
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Nov 7, 2019 19:23
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DACK FAYDEN posted:It does not. And matches are best of one. Because that's fun. Best of one in a game with coin-flip first turn and in which most players can draw their whole deck in one turn? I guess I don't know what I expected from the franchise that gave us VGC rules.
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Nov 7, 2019 22:26
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