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liberals lack hate in their hearts for america. they lack the conviction that this demon cracker nation must be destroyed. anything can be excused if on a base level you think this system can and should be propped up and salvaged
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Nov 15, 2019 20:51
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Jose posted:look at how this dictator lived. surely he needed stopping A end bench is a mark of ambition. Evo Morales alarmed me by buying one as it showed he craved power.
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Nov 15, 2019 21:03
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Epic High Five posted:ya, the critical thing to understand about liberals is that they don't actually BELIEVE in anything, it's all a narrative to them and they're the ones writing it The bolded is really the biggest reason why it's pointless. They don't care about being consistent, in the same way as conservatives don't care. They might be temporarily embarrassed in a conversation, but all of these topics aren't actually important to them. Their emotional reaction to politics isn't to the politics themselves, but to people. They don't hate conservative ideology - they hate conservatives (or a particular stereotype of them). Same with leftists - they despise a certain idea they have of what leftists are like. Trying to engage with them like they're being motivated by ideology is pointless, because their only real ideology is a sort of risk aversion. Everything else is adopted on the fly to the extent that it's convenient to demonize the people they dislike.
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Nov 15, 2019 21:09
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Ytlaya posted:They are incapable of learning from the past because, at the end of the day, they just don't care. I don't know if these are necessarily true. I almost exclusively lurk but I feel like a combination of the US coverage of Turkey's invading Syria and finding this thread a couple weeks ago has fundamentally changed how I see things. Like another poster up thread called it I guess you could say it was a crack*ping moment and they definitely happen. The later part of your post is absolutely the biggest hurdle. Realizing there just may not be good, accurate information coming out of a source you've generally considered reliable in the past is a hard pill to swallow. It does legit make me feel like a crazy person but I'd rather that than accept the NYT twisting itself into knots to avoid acknowledging the coup. I've low key known that the NYT fawned over Pinochet but seeing the articles shared directly and juxtaposed with the current coverage of the Bolivian coup was loving eye opening.
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Nov 15, 2019 21:11
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I have actually had one specific dude I got into a huge argument with over Guaido's failed putsch PM me a couple days ago apologizing and saying that seeing this go down has made him realize he was wrong about Venezuela, so that was nice, but it was also something he did himself, I did nothing to convince him.
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Nov 15, 2019 21:18
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Epic High Five posted:they either admit that they sympathize and like the Republicans a lot more and would be fine if Trump got a 2nd term in the end, or they admit there's a double standard that they're participating in. Then 5 minutes later they forget the conversation ever happened Sure they'll forget the conversation, but they'll remember that you slighted/embarrassed them. So it's hard to be honest with them and remain friends. When they think of you it's in terms of "the guy that makes me feel bad".
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Nov 15, 2019 21:22
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RIP Syndrome posted:Sure they'll forget the conversation, but they'll remember that you slighted/embarrassed them. So it's hard to be honest with them and remain friends. they're cowards first and foremost, if you best them politically they'll just stop talking about politics around you. Unless you really want to hear what Trevor Noah or NPR had to say this morning, this is an unambiguous good thing. you didn't attack them in these situations or anything, you just asked them a question that their incoherent and degenerate ideology cannot reconcile. If their only response is to attack or shun you because their stupid brains are frictionless then that's on fuckin' them
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Nov 15, 2019 21:25
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If anyone figures out a 100% foolproof way to make people aware of ideology, please make sure to post it. Zizek doesn't count.
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Nov 15, 2019 21:29
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Violence
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Nov 15, 2019 21:30
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https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/11/15/bolivian-protests-unseated-president-so-why-are-they-still-streets/quote:Bolivian protesters unseated a president. So why are they still in the streets?
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Nov 15, 2019 21:56
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Some things about the world are so mysterious.  Mister Bates posted:I have actually had one specific dude I got into a huge argument with over Guaido's failed putsch PM me a couple days ago apologizing and saying that seeing this go down has made him realize he was wrong about Venezuela, so that was nice, but it was also something he did himself, I did nothing to convince him. Nobody ever really convinces anyone of anything. You just have to point out the contradictions and hope that they internalize it themselves towards the correct conclusion. All worldviews ultimately arise from an internal intellectual process even if people aren't aware of it. It takes self-reflection to recognize that you've been wrong and that's not gonna happen in the middle of an argument. Pener Kropoopkin has issued a correction as of 22:14 on Nov 15, 2019 |
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Nov 15, 2019 22:11
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Unrelated note, I'm not crazy for being mostly convinced that Egypt back in 2012 or whatever almost definitely was a US backed coup, right? Like, there isn't enough evidence to my knowledge that I would shout from the rooftops that it was a US backed thing, but the whole "country established democracy, looked like they were going to elect an anti-US government, and were overthrown by the military who formed a very pro-US government" seems like a clear case of the Obama administration being fine with there being a democracy as long as it was pro-US, which it wasn't going to be, so they told their guy in the military that they would back him.
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Nov 15, 2019 22:34
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A good rule of thumb is that even if a rightwing coup isn't organized with US support then you can bet your rear end that the spooks will get involved the moment it's underway.
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Nov 15, 2019 22:41
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Epic High Five posted:Unless you really want to hear what Trevor Noah had to say this morning, this is an unambiguous good thing. I'm going to post my own tweet because I keep seeing this exact bullshit: https://twitter.com/HarikMCO/status/1195457441997238272 There's not even a remote effort to make this believable yet dumb libs engage like this is an actual person holding these very real beliefs. How are they so loving stupid?
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Nov 15, 2019 22:53
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TeenageArchipelago posted:Unrelated note, I'm not crazy for being mostly convinced that Egypt back in 2012 or whatever almost definitely was a US backed coup, right? Like, there isn't enough evidence to my knowledge that I would shout from the rooftops that it was a US backed thing, but the whole "country established democracy, looked like they were going to elect an anti-US government, and were overthrown by the military who formed a very pro-US government" seems like a clear case of the Obama administration being fine with there being a democracy as long as it was pro-US, which it wasn't going to be, so they told their guy in the military that they would back him. The coup against Morsi had broad middle-class support for it so it didn't really need much of a push from the US. The bottom line is that we did endorse it though.
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Nov 15, 2019 23:01
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Harik posted:Why, has there been another massacre of striking miners for him to mock? They're the political equivalents of Wimp Lo from Kung Pow.
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Nov 15, 2019 23:05
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A Gnarlacious Bro posted:Violence
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Nov 15, 2019 23:08
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I read that NYT article and my blood is boiling. They acted as though the MAS legislators didn’t show up to Parliament as a form of protest, rather than because they were being hunted down and disappeared.
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Nov 15, 2019 23:18
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:The coup against Morsi had broad middle-class support for it so it didn't really need much of a push from the US. The bottom line is that we did endorse it though. Fair enough. Again, I was well aware that all that I knew about it was that it followed a pattern and that it was in US interst, but I didn't really know anything about how it was perceived, and it didn't really work in ti howni viewed the world or anything, so I didn't bother learning more. That it was at least after the fact supported by the US was clear, though, as the military aid checks made clear
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Nov 15, 2019 23:19
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there's no hard evidence so take it with a grain of salt but there are again rumors going around that MAS supporters have looted a police armory in El Alto and distributed arms. while it may not be true, multiple different sources have been saying that, and even if it isn't, the rumors themselves have power. they probably played a role in the police actively attempting to disperse demonstrators today, rather than just cowering behind their barricades like they did yesterday. even if they're just rumors, it's something which easily could happen at any time, and the more the coup leaders hear poo poo like that the more urgency they're going to feel. they don't seem to have managed to clear the streets, and indeed it looks like so far they haven't even really advanced past their barricades, but they have fired a lot of tear gas and rubber bullets today.
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Nov 15, 2019 23:30
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420 Gank Mid posted:https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/11/15/bolivian-protests-unseated-president-so-why-are-they-still-streets/ Gharrttgjjkookk
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Nov 15, 2019 23:40
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There's nothing really I can do. My bf did read Manufacturing Consent but that was like 10yrs ago. He completely disengages if I talk about recent Latin American history and US involvement telling me it's not connected. Lol. I'm done. Maybe he'll realize it several years later. Libs are tiring. I'm moving on.
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Nov 15, 2019 23:40
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Definitely rethinking my "don't hoard long guns" lifestyle
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Nov 15, 2019 23:40
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Idia posted:There's nothing really I can do. My bf did read Manufacturing Consent but that was like 10yrs ago. He completely disengages if I talk about recent Latin American history and US involvement telling me it's not connected. Lol. I'm done. Maybe he'll realize it several years later. Libs are tiring. I'm moving on. If reading Manufacturing Consent does nothing maybe try slapping him with it?
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Nov 15, 2019 23:44
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Idia posted:There's nothing really I can do. My bf did read Manufacturing Consent but that was like 10yrs ago. He completely disengages if I talk about recent Latin American history and US involvement telling me it's not connected. Lol. I'm done. Maybe he'll realize it several years later. Libs are tiring. I'm moving on. 
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Nov 15, 2019 23:49
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genericnick posted:If reading Manufacturing Consent does nothing maybe try slapping him with it?
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Nov 16, 2019 00:00
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Idia posted:There's nothing really I can do. My bf did read Manufacturing Consent but that was like 10yrs ago. He completely disengages if I talk about recent Latin American history and US involvement telling me it's not connected. Lol. I'm done. Maybe he'll realize it several years later. Libs are tiring. I'm moving on. drat he didn't break cover, a good rear end cia agent
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Nov 16, 2019 00:08
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https://twitter.com/wyattreed13/status/1194672499272962050?s=21 https://twitter.com/benjaminnorton/status/1195477413121138690?s=21
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Nov 16, 2019 00:16
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is there a reliable way to send money to whatever remnant of Morales’s political machine might actually present some resistance?
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Nov 16, 2019 00:17
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i mean a good thing that might break through to some people that they should consider that the media just constantly loving lies over and over again is to get them to consider the media's coverage on epstein over the decades and recently
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Nov 16, 2019 00:17
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Homeless Friend posted:drat he didn't break cover, a good rear end cia agent tfw ur boyfriend is also your CIA handler
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Nov 16, 2019 00:18
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The Kingfish posted:is there a reliable way to send money to whatever remnant of Morales’s political machine might actually present some resistance? I mean they are presenting a pretty effective resistance at the moment. Especially if they are desperate enough for PR they are showing a bed
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Nov 16, 2019 00:19
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i'm sure these accounts posting pics of a second-rate holiday inn bedroom realize this makes an ironclad case for the violent overthrow of the us president
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Nov 16, 2019 00:20
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Idia posted:There's nothing really I can do. My bf did read Manufacturing Consent but that was like 10yrs ago. He completely disengages if I talk about recent Latin American history and US involvement telling me it's not connected. Lol. I'm done. Maybe he'll realize it several years later. Libs are tiring. I'm moving on. Get him to listen to the Citations Needed podcast.
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Nov 16, 2019 00:21
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Idia posted:There's nothing really I can do. My bf did read Manufacturing Consent but that was like 10yrs ago. He completely disengages if I talk about recent Latin American history and US involvement telling me it's not connected. Lol. I'm done. Maybe he'll realize it several years later. Libs are tiring. I'm moving on. sever ties
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Nov 16, 2019 00:22
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https://twitter.com/solid_bot/status/1195450779508850690
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Nov 16, 2019 00:24
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comedyblissoption posted:https://twitter.com/wyattreed13/status/1194672499272962050?s=21 the whole bed thing is legitimately hilarious to me because that is easily the most modest head-of-state residence I've ever seen, it looks like a room at an above-average Motel 6 or a below-average Holiday Inn. it's actually kind of surprising in its modesty. he was the loving president, ostentatious is what you expect in the bedchambers of a sitting head of state. instead it just looks...functional. it is a room in which you sleep. it has a mirror to check your appearance before going outside and a lamp and a little end table and that's pretty much it.
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Nov 16, 2019 00:25
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Al! posted:tfw ur boyfriend is also your CIA handler He was reportedly caught saying "I love your intelligence"
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Nov 16, 2019 00:26
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Homeless Friend posted:He was reportedly caught saying "I love your intelligence" CIApiosexual
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Nov 16, 2019 00:28
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when he tells you he's drowning in the strategic reserves of your eyes
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Nov 16, 2019 00:30
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