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Ema Nymton posted:But the average viewers didn't see the TV show or any EU stuff. What we got in the movies was clone humanoids and the Jedi accepting their use with zero questions about ethics or even who placed the order for the soldiers in the first place. On top of this, the movie itself doesn't appear to be asking the viewer to question any of it. It is a movie about the fall of the Jedi, but Lucas doesn't seem to be making any statements to the audience about the clones or anything else. A character in The Mandalorian has a Kamino tattoo. Make of that what you will.
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Nov 22, 2019 01:29
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Also, the Stormtroopers by the time of the OT aren't clones. They don't have Morrison's voice.
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Nov 22, 2019 01:31
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Ema Nymton posted:On top of this, the movie itself doesn't appear to be asking the viewer to question any of it. It is a movie about the fall of the Jedi, but Lucas doesn't seem to be making any statements to the audience about the clones or anything else. hmm yes, how are we to know that creating a clone army raised from birth to be soldiers for a facist empire is bad if the movie does not tell us this directly
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Nov 22, 2019 01:35
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They switch to recruitment and conscription after the original generations of clone troopers age out of service. They don't seem to be any freer. Especially not by the time of the First Order, who are kidnapping babies. Attack of the Clones features two factories in which slave armies are constructed. The movie's not super subtle about the hypocrisy involved. At the start, Mace Windu says that the Jedi can't fight a war for the Chancellor. At the end, the Jedi fight a war for the Chancellor. We will also recall Yoda, a few movies earlier and a few decades later in his life, remarking that wars do not make one great - and here he is, in a war, being not great. Boba Fett wasn't genetically modified to physically mature faster, and he wasn't subjected to the education process that indoctrinated the clones so thoroughly. He also didn't have the secret chip implanted in his brain which could override higher reasoning and compel obedience in even the most insubordinate of troopers in response to a predefined list of triggers, if you want to bring in the plot device that Clone Troopers used.
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Nov 22, 2019 01:51
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Bongo Bill posted:He's been in the exotic fringes of the galaxy and seen some wild poo poo that is unknown in the core systems, which he appropriated as aesthetic influences when he quit being an adventurer and entered food service instead. holy poo poo hes been to earth
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Nov 22, 2019 03:01
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LOL apparently they already have it ready to ship.
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Nov 22, 2019 03:29
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The MSJ posted:LOL apparently they already have it ready to ship. The Child is actually a Yogurt.
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Nov 22, 2019 04:00
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asecondduck posted:The Child is actually a Yogurt. That’s good!
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Nov 22, 2019 04:01
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For a second I thought I wandered into the cursed images thread.
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Nov 22, 2019 04:03
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Bogus Adventure posted:I need to know why Dexter Jettster has a 1950's diner on Coruscant. Let's have a movie about that. Why is this greasy, aging diner owner so knowledgeable about hidden and remote star systems and the symbolism they put onto poisonous darts? The movie writes itself.
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Nov 22, 2019 04:21
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Alec Eiffel posted:Why is this greasy, aging diner owner so knowledgeable about hidden and remote star systems and the symbolism they put onto poisonous darts? Dexter Jettster is the Star Wars guy we need.
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Nov 22, 2019 04:44
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The MSJ posted:A character in The Mandalorian has a Kamino tattoo. Make of that what you will.
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Nov 22, 2019 10:30
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Ema Nymton posted:But the average viewers didn't see the TV show or any EU stuff. What we got in the movies was clone humanoids and the Jedi accepting their use with zero questions about ethics or even who placed the order for the soldiers in the first place. On top of this, the movie itself doesn't appear to be asking the viewer to question any of it. It is a movie about the fall of the Jedi, but Lucas doesn't seem to be making any statements to the audience about the clones or anything else. Is that an actual concern where the clones grow and age? Is that an actual concern in a universe with shapeshifters and holograms and magic people who can supposedly sense disturbances?
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Nov 22, 2019 11:28
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Alec Eiffel posted:Why is this greasy, aging diner owner so knowledgeable about hidden and remote star systems and the symbolism they put onto poisonous darts? Could also bring Porkins back as a regular to the diner.
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Nov 22, 2019 13:33
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C-Bangin' it 
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galagazombie posted:There is a dissonance in how the Clones are ethically portrayed across various media. Episode II-III portray them as little more than fleshy robots that have been genetically designed to be unthinking automatons. They simply do whatever the person their programed to follow says and will mindlessly start executing their own allies without question if the chain of command orders. Jango Fett had to have Boba special ordered so he would be a normal person instead of a mindless drone. The CG TV shows conversely portray them as completely normal people who even do natural things an army of identical twins would do like mark themselves with tattoos and such to show their individuality. They pal around with and befriend their Jedi generals and only Order 66 them because of a literal chip in their head. They also are portrayed as actually believing in the Republic cause and as having a loyalty to it beyond mere genetic programing. You forgot it addressed battle fatigue, PTSD, desertion.
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Nov 22, 2019 15:22
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Lampsacus posted:Do you have a link or know which? I'm fascinated by how the D handles the prequels and enjoy cataloging the references to them like a huge weirdo. It's not a tattoo, it's a shoulder patch. Dr. Pershing, from the first episode wears it. He's the scientist in the Tarkin Initiative looking outfit.
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Nov 22, 2019 16:20
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galagazombie posted:There is a dissonance in how the Clones are ethically portrayed across various media. Episode II-III portray them as little more than fleshy robots that have been genetically designed to be unthinking automatons. Episode 2 and 3 are told from the point of view of Anakin and Obi-Wan. Clone Wars' POV is more omniscient, often involving neither of them.
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Nov 22, 2019 16:37
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It's very interesting to go from the prequel films, where clones are dehumanized, to the Clone Wars, where clones are humanized but droids remain these pathetic, abject figures. And later on the series plays up how common soldiers dehumanize droids as the only people beneath them.
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Nov 22, 2019 16:44
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Bleck posted:Episode 2 and 3 are told from the point of view of Anakin and Obi-Wan. Clone Wars' POV is more omniscient, often involving neither of them. Clone Wars' POV is a Republic propaganda film (co-funded by Sheev Pictures).
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Nov 22, 2019 18:28
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Son of Sam-I-Am posted:My point is AOTC came out 17 years ago, that ship has sailed so I don't know why you expext the pure moral ecstasy of mowing down Nazis with zero remorse That...is the opposite of what I want or said. AotC purposefully positions clone troopers as an uncomfortable moral compromise the Jedi accept, that we know to be a precursor to the Empire. We're not supposed to approve of it. It's clearly hosed up. In Force Awakens, we instead have this situation where the First Order are fascists, Hux delivers this rousing Hitler speech, the stormtroopers are back to being the cannon fodder they were in the 1977 movie...but one of the protagonists is a child-soldier who escaped his conditioning and tells the audience all about it. I don't want disposable goons, I actually want it to embrace the moral complexity it chose to add to the premise in the first place. Like, maybe it's a bad thing that a few thousand potential Finns also died on Starkiller Base.
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Nov 22, 2019 20:18
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well look at whom you're asking it from though
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Nov 23, 2019 00:33
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Finn's character arc always should have been that of Leader of the Stormtrooper Liberation Front or whatever you want to call it, but... Son of Sam-I-Am posted:well look at whom you're asking it from though Disney sure as hell aren't going to be the people telling that story.
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Nov 23, 2019 01:36
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Escaping with Poe was Finn's last resort. He tried to unionize the stormtroopers, but he couldn't get enough signatures.
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Nov 23, 2019 03:37
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Was Jango Fett a Mandalorian? If so, how was he able to remove his helmet?
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Nov 23, 2019 04:22
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UmOk posted:Was Jango Fett a Mandalorian? If so, how was he able to remove his helmet? well,
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Nov 23, 2019 04:24
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UmOk posted:Was Jango Fett a Mandalorian? If so, how was he able to remove his helmet? Did you think they used their helmets to breathe?
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Nov 23, 2019 04:34
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the tv show guy is a bit autistic about xir armor. jango was a chill dad and didnt care (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Nov 23, 2019 04:39
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Thinking about how Temura Morrison dubbed all of Boba Fett's lines in the OT BR release and am laughing
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Nov 23, 2019 06:34
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Mandalorians are just a particular nationality of human at the time of the films. They come up a couple of times in Clone Wars. The aesthetic of the armor and the jetpack-based fighting style are a traditional element of their culture and martial history, though at the time Jango Fett was around, their government was nominally pacifist and it was only practiced by a reactionary irredentist faction. They took their helmets off all the time.
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Nov 23, 2019 08:07
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Alec Eiffel posted:Thinking about how Temura Morrison dubbed all of Boba Fett's lines in the OT BR release and am laughing His original line reads are so much better it’s insane. I would have accepted that Jango’s son just decided to Tom Waits his voice over the years.
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Nov 23, 2019 08:14
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I don't even remember where I heard it, but I heard Jango wasn't even from Mandalor, they he just appropriated Mandalorian armor and fighting style.
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Nov 23, 2019 12:53
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Detective No. 27 posted:I don't even remember where I heard it, but I heard Jango wasn't even from Mandalor, they he just appropriated Mandalorian armor and fighting style. drat, I guess Jango is cancelled now
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Nov 23, 2019 15:16
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Detective No. 27 posted:I don't even remember where I heard it, but I heard Jango wasn't even from Mandalor, they he just appropriated Mandalorian armor and fighting style. That'd be Mandalore's Prime Minister Almec, although there's plenty of people who think he was lying in order to stay in Satine's good graces and conceal Almec's true nature We can't know for certain unless they decide to flesh out Jango more
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Nov 23, 2019 17:56
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Star Wars is good because you can say things like "traditional jetpack-based fighting style"
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Nov 23, 2019 18:38
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Bongo Bill posted:Star Wars is good because you can say things like "traditional jetpack-based fighting style" speaking of, where the f is the mandalorians jetpack and armbrace missile
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Nov 23, 2019 21:23
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I like how Jango is very non-white, but The Clone Wars series decided that Mandalorian = Scandinavian/Viking heritage and thus all-white.
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Nov 23, 2019 21:25
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Ammanas posted:speaking of, where the f is the mandalorians jetpack and armbrace missile Armbrace missiles are in episode 3 and as for his jetpack he still needs to get himself one of those things
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Nov 23, 2019 22:23
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qphC39PJf4
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Nov 23, 2019 22:55
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Bogus Adventure posted:I like how Jango is very non-white, but The Clone Wars series decided that Mandalorian = Scandinavian/Viking heritage and thus all-white. Rebels has Asian ones (including a main character)
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Nov 23, 2019 23:30
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What's this crap about bad test screening, very late reshoots and the movie still being in editing?
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Nov 23, 2019 23:30
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