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Fuzz posted:nWoD had a Bloodline that could do this specific type of thing with their entire Haven. Was a really neat idea. I think Geist: The Sin-Eaters has a power where you can sorta animate an entire junkyard or a similar place and use it to see and attack people.
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Nov 21, 2019 09:19
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Venmoch posted:Sounds pretty similar to what they did in nWoD with its “Hunters” line, which was slightly more “You and your friends vs evil” rather than oWoD’s “God had chosen you to fight vampires” approach. the best hunter group is and remains VASCU from the Slashers book. I cannot wait for Hunter 2E. Being a government suit charged with bringing in vampires for tax evasion or werewolves for building code violations is hilarious and awesome.
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Nov 21, 2019 20:19
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Dawgstar posted:Even the Lasombra like to play Social Darwin with their prospective childer. Seeing just how far they can push them until they break. It’s basically Library at Mount Char until you start behaving properly I think.
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Nov 21, 2019 21:04
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Soonmot posted:the best hunter group is and remains VASCU from the Slashers book. I cannot wait for Hunter 2E. Being a government suit charged with bringing in vampires for tax evasion or werewolves for building code violations is hilarious and awesome. A psychic suit who gets their powers from radical drug therapy.
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Nov 21, 2019 21:08
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It's a good thing Bloodlines 2 has been delayed, Half-Life: Alyx is being released in March2020 when BL2 was first scheduled, and the last thing we would have needed is a repeat of the first release.
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Nov 21, 2019 21:30
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Tetrabor posted:It's a good thing Bloodlines 2 has been delayed, Half-Life: Alyx is being released in March2020 when BL2 was first scheduled, and the last thing we would have needed is a repeat of the first release. Alyx appears to be VR only. I doubt it'll really impact any other game's release that much, since I don't think VR headsets have that much market penetration.
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Nov 21, 2019 21:35
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Source 2 is coming with tools for map making and modding, and has VR built in from the ground up. Still uses Hammer for maps. I smell forward ports of Source 1 stuff.
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Nov 21, 2019 21:38
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Would've been hilarious for them to come out at the same time again. But yeah hardly anybody has VR gear so Alyx is a non-issue.
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Nov 21, 2019 22:12
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I get that it's VR, but still I wouldn't want to be in the same release month. The Half-Life series is a nostalgic juggernaut and I could easily see it thieving popularity from the lovable but janky Bloodlines. Not saying HLA will beat BL2 in sales, but I guarantee reviewers, news, & nerds are going to be focused on Valve's title come this March.
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Nov 21, 2019 22:23
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Tetrabor posted:I get that it's VR, but still I wouldn't want to be in the same release month. The Half-Life series is a nostalgic juggernaut and I could easily see it thieving popularity from the lovable but janky Bloodlines. I think they’re far enough away from each other genre-wise that it’ll work out fine.
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Nov 21, 2019 23:12
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Fortunately they already, wisely, moved it to either clean up or get it the gently caress away from Cyberpunk. Releasing a game in Q1 next year is nuts. Doom Eternal, Alyx, and Cyberpunk all come out within like a few weeks.
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Nov 22, 2019 00:24
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Grand Fromage posted:Fortunately they already, wisely, moved it to either clean up or get it the gently caress away from Cyberpunk. Yeah, Cyberpunk would be the game I'd worry about more than Half-Life.
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Nov 22, 2019 03:08
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I mean it’s a partly nostalgia driven release, they’re probably most worried about going up against Final Fantasy 7.
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Nov 22, 2019 04:48
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stop bringing up new bremen. it burns.
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Nov 26, 2019 02:31
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I remember the chatrooms before New Bremen. Met some good people there I kept in contact with for a long time afterwards.
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Nov 26, 2019 05:39
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Bea Nanner posted:stop bringing up new bremen. it burns. I thought the Mage room was truly abysmal, but if memory serves there was an Aberrant room which was just a lot of 13 year olds trying to be edgy.
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Nov 26, 2019 05:43
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if ur not in this list get out http://thenewbremen.tripod.com/whitepage.html
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Nov 26, 2019 05:59
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The real game in New Breman was hanging around for hours in the character approval room hoping a GM will talk to you and give you the okay to play.
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Nov 26, 2019 18:28
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Dawgstar posted:While LaCroix's own Generation is debatable (it's probably 7th as if you're a Ventrue you can't Dominate him) the real piece of work is the Sheriff who is most likely an obscure Tzmisce bloodline from Africa and is also at least 7th Generation. We later find out from Becket's Jyhad Diary that Jeanette/Therese is the 6th generation childe of the Methuselah Jacob/Esau from Milwaukee. Also, since this is set in Seattle I want the option of playing as an indie rocker embraced by a Daughter of Cacophony
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Nov 29, 2019 05:58
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Entorwellian posted:I think the toreador has a feud with the nosfeatu during the Victorian times when beauty was prized above all else and high society dominated, which made the nosferatu even more shunned to the point of hostility by the toreador than they already were. The nosferatu who were around then haven’t forgotten that. Beauty was prized above all else most of all in Ancient Greece, and guess what, Arikel (the Toreador antideluvian) is often thought to have made her haven in Minoan Crete. Previous to that she was the Goddess Ishtar in Mesopotamia.
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Nov 29, 2019 08:17
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ProfessorCirno posted:The Gehenna stuff mostly just reminds me of why I ended up souring so hard on oVampire, which is that, real fast, it just...stops being about vampires. The problem was one a lot of long running games have. You have the lore nerds who are invested in it and HATE the idea of it going away and they buy all your books so you do not want to alienate them. D&D still has loads of players butthurt over Greyhawk, Blackmoor, Dragonlance, and Birthright not being supported. The oWoD also has it worse because the nature of the game meant that splatbooks had to keep building the metastory because new disciplines require new clans or bloodlines. The other options are citybooks which oWoD created and seem laughably dated now. Written when the Internet was not really much of a thing yet they seem obsessed with describing city districts and teaching city history. It made sense when learning about a city meant going to the library but in the days of Wikipedia they seem silly. The other option is fleshing out the meta plot and a lot of that happened because it is easy but some of it was just stupid. Writers also went overboard with the sophistication of evil and tried to make the Tzimisce and Lasombra ultra cool And edgy without factoring in how they work in the overall universe. The creation of the Red Star which heralds the end was also a metaplot thing across all the lines. They basically had no choice but to blow it all up and I am sure there were other reasons for it. The nWoD annoyed all the old players. A lot of them were Middle or High schoolers when the game came out and there was almost a kind of mythos about how the game should be run. Most people were terrible at it as the pretentious way the books described running the games meant you had to be a master storyteller or a pretentious rear end who thinks they are one so the game was more often discussed than played except by people who just knew how to have fun and the boring tabletop and LARP games trapped in perpetual stasis. I remember one LARP I joined where the storytellers seemed ethically opposed to anything actually happening. I was bored so I had my character form a well armed religious blood cult based around an evangelist radio show my Malk ran and tried to kill everyone. When I died I quit. Everyone asked why I left when the game had just gotten interesting as they all scrambled to rebuild the Masquerade. In any case a lot of people were keeping informed about the setting without playing. I was one of the lore nerds and I disliked the nWoD, particularly Vampire. I liked the clan system and the ancients hiding in the background. The problem is no one ever used them very well. The greatest powers of the ancients are mysteries and how they subtly move people around to fulfill old vendettas and goals. A methusaleh or two involved in the city adds a weird element and lets you sneak in some inexplicable stuff. It creates some of the paranoia that makes for a good Vampire game. You always wonder who is manipulating who. In the bad games like those that use the Diablerie sourcebooks it becomes an insane power quest to eat your way up the generational tree. Bad games were also stuck in stasis with the players unable to change anything. I had a rule of thumb that every third or fourth game session I had to “flip the table”. Something big has to happen that changes the setting. Sometimes the players kick it off and sometimes it just happens. A coup has been launched against the Prince, Sabbat War Parties are raging through the streets, a Justicar calls a conclave to deal with an important elder the party uses as a patron or hates, a fragment of the Book of Nod is being auctioned off and out of towners show up to nab it,, werewolves have massacred several vampires in the city, etc. I find you cannot do as much of that with nWoD even though I believe the system is objectively better. It is locally focused but there is not as much room for bleedover from a larger world. In an oWoD I felt I had more playthings to throw in. If my politics adventure is getting dull I thrown in a revenant who is a wanted fugitives from the Sabbat who has knowledge of Sabbat war plans and a smattering of Thaum and Vissicitude. Do you hide him and get him to teach you? Turn him over to the prince for a pat on the back? What if the Tremere have a more lucrative offer? A thinblood with strange powers shows up. Do you protect her? Turn her over to the Scourge? Try to learn this strange power? She utters a prophecy about the Prince’s weakness. Do you act on it? Blackmail him with it? Sell it to the Prince’s enemy or the anarchs? In nWoD it seems to be more politically fluid on a local level but I did that in oWoD and I want my weird metaplot playthings. Of course all this might just be an excuse because I am a lore nerd and hate all that knowledge suddenly being obsolete.
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Dec 2, 2019 17:25
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Charlz Guybon posted:We later find out from Becket's Jyhad Diary that Jeanette/Therese is the 6th generation childe of the Methuselah Jacob/Esau from Milwaukee. Yeah, she was probably one of the most powerful kindred in LA. Bloodlines was smart in keeping the power level low with the vampires you fight to maintain plausibility. Lacroix was an Ancillae (vampire teenager basically) and not a true elder. Grout is suggested to be about the same age (whining about Freud). Gary was even younger. All of the Anarchs are less then a hundred years embraced except Jack. Andrei is suggested to be old but was probably from revenant stocks so that may not mean raw power and he is just old. Strauss is 7th gen and probably the most individually powerful vampire in the game outside of Caine. Most of the “leaders” would be laughable in a more developed Camarilla city and considered almost neonates in Europe.
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Dec 2, 2019 17:39
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Xenocides posted:
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Dec 3, 2019 06:05
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Xenocides posted:The problem was one a lot of long running games have. You have the lore nerds who are invested in it and HATE the idea of it going away and they buy all your books so you do not want to alienate them. D&D still has loads of players butthurt over Greyhawk, Blackmoor, Dragonlance, and Birthright not being supported. Just buy the V20 books, they're incredible and they're metaplot agnostic with lots of options on how to continue on if for example the week of nightmares happened in your game world, or if they didn't happen. If the Gangrel left the Camarilla or they didn't. If the Assamites joined or didn't, etc.
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Dec 3, 2019 06:09
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Xenocides posted:Stuff I agree with a lot of this. nWoD was mechanically better, but the setting was bad. There wasn't the depth or the metaplot hooks to really give anything any purpose, or to recommend it over any other game. I would've loved if they would've just kept the old lore stuff and updated the rule set. Like someone said that oWoD was a 90's conspiracy game and nWoD took that away-well without the whole conspiracy bit you're just a bunch of blooddrinking assholes. Like the whole fundamental thing about oWoD is the conspiratorial aspect-not knowing if someone's out to get you, if you're being used, etc. That said I always thought Vampire was better built for LARP than tabletop because outside of Sabbat, or maybe a group of Tremere, there's little reason for a group of random Cam to work together for any notable time period. It seems a very PvP game, with occasional outside greater powers that force some PvE behavior. I'm also not sure how you could integrate that political feeling into video games. Maybe something like Morrowwind where you have mutually exclusive factions, with some light strategic overlay to represent gaining influence and power bases? I just feel that Bloodlines I for all it's charm was too combat focused to really grab the feeling, even though it dripped atmosphere. Combat should be an option, but there should be other paths (and not just the generic stealth/persuasion stuff you see in other first person RPGs)
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Dec 3, 2019 09:07
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Charlz Guybon posted:Just buy the V20 books, they're incredible and they're metaplot agnostic with lots of options on how to continue on if for example the week of nightmares happened in your game world, or if they didn't happen. If the Gangrel left the Camarilla or they didn't. If the Assamites joined or didn't, etc. This. V20 with Beat house rules is honestly the best the game has ever been.
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Dec 3, 2019 14:41
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Fuzz posted:This. V20 with Beat house rules is honestly the best the game has ever been. I have it and if I ever play again that is what I plan to run it with but I do not have a group anymore. Everyone grew up and has spouses and kids and responsibilities now. Losers. alansmithee posted:I agree with a lot of this. nWoD was mechanically better, but the setting was bad. There wasn't the depth or the metaplot hooks to really give anything any purpose, or to recommend it over any other game. I would've loved if they would've just kept the old lore stuff and updated the rule set. Like someone said that oWoD was a 90's conspiracy game and nWoD took that away-well without the whole conspiracy bit you're just a bunch of blooddrinking assholes. Like the whole fundamental thing about oWoD is the conspiratorial aspect-not knowing if someone's out to get you, if you're being used, etc. That said I always thought Vampire was better built for LARP than tabletop because outside of Sabbat, or maybe a group of Tremere, there's little reason for a group of random Cam to work together for any notable time period. It seems a very PvP game, with occasional outside greater powers that force some PvE behavior. The Camarilla coterie of neonates make some sense. The idea is that younger vampires band together because they are political (and physical) targets on their own. The coterie may not even really like each other and probably should have some rivalries but it is a little school of small fish banding together because together they could threaten an elder. It also pools their political defenses to a degree. Bob the Ventrue has a sire backing him who has a cool friendship with the prince. Tom the Nosferatu has a few boons with the Nos Primogen in exchange for the computer skills he provides and the Brujah Primogen has a soft spot for Stan, the Brujah quasi-anarch. Pooled they have connections they can use to dodge trouble. Plus coteries are useful tools for those in power because they can get stuff done as a group but their threat is diminished by the conflicting goals within the group. It is hard to do politics in a video game without making it the main focus because most people get annoyed in a video game when a conversation option leads to “you die” which is what can happen if you mouth off to the wrong vampire in a Camarilla city. Actually it applies in the Sabbat too. Bloodlines dodged it by having almost everyone in power in the city living precariously. Lacroix may have wanted to off you for disrespect if you went that route but he needed you so he just dominated you into obedience instead. This game sounds like it has a good approach with a bunch of factions either wooing or manipulating the player character for support. The problem is that unless you have rails to motivate the character to do the same mission for each of the factions you end up cutting off game content for some players. This is fine if there is still enough left but that means having to create a lot more content to have a viable game. Charlz Guybon posted:Those city books fuckin' rule even to this day. They're just not about the city, it's about the city in the world of darkness. They have an atmosphere and flavor to them that can't be matched by google searching. I would have preferred they focus more on the supernatural elements. Too much time spent on the natural.
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Dec 3, 2019 18:07
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Charlz Guybon posted:Those city books fuckin' rule even to this day. They're just not about the city, it's about the city in the world of darkness. They have an atmosphere and flavor to them that can't be matched by google searching. Results may vary incredibly by city. Chicago by Night is influential being the first and honestly is still really good, even if very early 90s. Then you have to wander through the the books where you've got things like certain vampires known more about werewolf culture than the woofs do (if that's somebody's thing, fine, but I was not one for crossovers) and just kind of dumb stuff to things like Montreal By Night, which was the first Sabbat book and therefore is "edgy." In the Revised era we got two other great ones, New York City By Night and Mexico City By Night which I would highly recommend. NYCbN is one that's actually set up to have the PCs become movers and/or shakers because the Camarilla just took it over and you don't have two dozen millennia-old elders squatting at the top.
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Dec 3, 2019 23:18
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The best parts of V:tR were Requiem for Rome and Fall of the Camarilla: two gorgeous stand-alone books about vampires in the Roman Empire.
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Dec 4, 2019 13:23
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Ephemeron posted:The best parts of V:tR were Requiem for Rome and Fall of the Camarilla: two gorgeous stand-alone books about vampires in the Roman Empire. Also the Clanbooks are phenomenal. They're 90% fluff but are absolutely must-buys.
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Dec 4, 2019 14:12
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It's kinda funny people are seeing my post as being anti-nWoD in some way. You sincerely could not be wrong. I am 100% pro-nVamp over oVamp, and nWoD over oWoD in general. Vampire was better because it was about vampires being vampires and dealing with being a vampire. oWoD abandoned the whole "be a vampire" thing real early on. Like, you kinda prove me right with massive long posts about all the lore, because who gives a poo poo, I'm here to actually play the game, not read a lore book on the shitter. "Without the lore you're just a bunch of blood drinking assholes" What do you think vampires are?
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Dec 4, 2019 22:19
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Is there a good completionist LP of the first Bloodlines where the host has a good knowledge of the lore but doesn’t talk over in game dialogue?
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Dec 5, 2019 02:04
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ProfessorCirno posted:It's kinda funny people are seeing my post as being anti-nWoD in some way. You sincerely could not be wrong. I am 100% pro-nVamp over oVamp, and nWoD over oWoD in general. Vampire was better because it was about vampires being vampires and dealing with being a vampire. oWoD abandoned the whole "be a vampire" thing real early on. I think it sparked a reaction because you had a really good critique. I took your post in the way you meant it, and thought you captured an essential difference between the two. Apparently, it also struck a chord with those who really liked 90s Conspiracy Games.
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Dec 5, 2019 02:53
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ProfessorCirno posted:It's kinda funny people are seeing my post as being anti-nWoD in some way. You sincerely could not be wrong. I am 100% pro-nVamp over oVamp, and nWoD over oWoD in general. Vampire was better because it was about vampires being vampires and dealing with being a vampire. oWoD abandoned the whole "be a vampire" thing real early on. It's a crime there will never be a Requiem videogame. But at this point I'll take whatever I can get.
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Dec 5, 2019 07:25
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This is a little tangential, but have any of you watched Being Human? (The UK version, not the US version, yuck) its a bit cheesy but its basically World of Darkness the television show.wiegieman posted:The way I've heard it described is that for werewolves, combat is the payoff for figuring out whichever problem they're faced with. You challenge them by giving them problems that can't be solved with murder, because all werewolves are really good at murder. Also you give them spirits that ban them from doing certain types of murder so they have to bend over backwards to murder the honorable way. Tetrabor posted:It's a good thing Bloodlines 2 has been delayed, Half-Life: Alyx is being released in March2020 when BL2 was first scheduled, and the last thing we would have needed is a repeat of the first release. Cyberpunk is the bigger threat really
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Dec 5, 2019 09:11
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Zaphod42 posted:This is a little tangential, but have any of you watched Being Human? (The UK version, not the US version, yuck) its a bit cheesy but its basically World of Darkness the television show. No it isn't, it's horrendously cheesy and the supernaturals have very little to do with the WoD at all, in form or style. I mean, unless you mean at the most basic level it has vampires, werewolves, and ghosts in it, but that's kinda where it ends. Hell, Supernatural has more to do with the WoD than either version of BH, and Supernatural basically only touches upon Hunters in any meaningfully similar way. It's also odd, the UK one starts really strong and then gets progressively worse really rapidly, meanwhile the US one starts okay but then goes on a totally different direction and actually gets better and better and ends up with the better ending. Fuzz fucked around with this message at 12:11 on Dec 5, 2019 |
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Dec 5, 2019 12:08
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Supernatural is like somebody running a Hunter: the Vigil campaign, and then a few sessions in he starts reading Hellblazer and gets WAY into it.
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Dec 5, 2019 13:46
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Pope Guilty posted:Supernatural is like somebody running a Hunter: the Vigil campaign, and then a few sessions in he starts reading Hellblazer and gets WAY into it.  This is possibly the greatest explanation of the show I've read.
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Dec 5, 2019 14:15
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Xenocides posted:It is hard to do politics in a video game without making it the main focus because most people get annoyed in a video game when a conversation option leads to “you die” which is what can happen if you mouth off to the wrong vampire in a Camarilla city.
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Dec 5, 2019 14:30
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Fuzz posted:No it isn't, it's horrendously cheesy and the supernaturals have very little to do with the WoD at all, in form or style. I mean, unless you mean at the most basic level it has vampires, werewolves, and ghosts in it, but that's kinda where it ends. I remember watching this through to the end, I thought it was fun and inoffensive if a little cheesy for the first season or two, but it was aggressively bad by the end of the series. There was a scene in the final season from the future or something with vampires in control of Britain and it had some obnoxiously heavy-handed allusions to the vampire regime bring Nazis. As in "just finished filming a different show set in Nazi Germany, let's not let these props go to waste"-level bad:  just awful
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Dec 5, 2019 14:34
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