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People who are genuinely affected by the anti-semitism accusations are Jewish people themselves. The fear is being cranked up and unless they look outside MSM, then they will pretty well take what they read at face value. I've mentioned a particular friend of mine before. Very much a left, Corbyn-supporting (though not party member), Palestinian supporting,Jewish guy. Unfortunately, he is an avid reader of the Guardian who have been at the forefront of pushing the narrative. When I stayed with him and his family earlier this year he said he didn't really believe it but he didn't know what to believe so he was going LibDem. This is someone who has stuck his neck out in a part of London with a strong Jewish population and been subject to all the slurs Jewish supporters of Palestinian rights who don't think of Israel as the promised land get from their families - Kapo, self-hating, etc. The Guardian really went for it. Earlier this year, two Jewish members of my local CLP brought a motion - can't remember the words exactly but along the lines of the attacks were mostly smears. Another non-Jewish member complained that the motion was anti-semitic and quit the party. That person was also an avid Guardian reader. Several times she had said to me that we must be 'whiter than white' on the subject, deal with it and 'draw a line under it'. A line will never be drawn under it. This must be my 4th page snipe this month! Anyway 95% of Brits have a salary of less than £60k. Jaeluni Asjil fucked around with this message at 00:31 on Dec 7, 2019 |
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Dec 7, 2019 00:23
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Jaeluni Asjil posted:
Was it Tweetman?
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Dec 7, 2019 00:25
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 Excuse me, the general what now?
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Dec 7, 2019 00:25
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biglads posted:Was it Tweetman? erm... no. Apraxin posted:
All I can say is that person doesn't spend much time on twitter. Well unless they think Attila the Hun is a nice centrist dad in which case yeah maybe most of twitter is 'left'.
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Dec 7, 2019 00:27
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^^ the dumber the takes the more desperate they are, hope is real
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Dec 7, 2019 00:27
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I don't really understand why modern day antisemitism is a thing in the first place (I 'get' racism because different colour = bad is simple, which is probably what makes it so accessible and appealing to fuckwits) and I especially don't understand why the U.K. would have a huge antisemitism issue (alleged or otherwise) when Jewish people make up ~0.5% of the population. What's a good resource to educate myself more on this?
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Dec 7, 2019 00:32
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OwlFancier posted:For what it's worth literally nobody I've talked to has asked me about antisemitism and it's not part of our canvassing brief. This for sure. The average person probably thinks so little about Jewish people one way or the other the antisemitism stuff might as well not be going on. Unless a video pops up that has Corbyn doing and saying some wildly racist stuff things will be fine.
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Dec 7, 2019 00:32
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Guavanaut posted:You'll have to reach them via the only medium that they'll respect. Anti-Corbyn op eds in the Guardian. I can do better Gruaniad op eds than most of the op eds writers. I'll do it for half price, even.
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Dec 7, 2019 00:33
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Doesn't Twitter actually lean left purely because it has a relatively young user base compared to say Facebook?
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Dec 7, 2019 00:33
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History Comes Inside! posted:I don't really understand why modern day antisemitism is a thing in the first place (I 'get' racism because different colour = bad is simple, which is probably what makes it so accessible and appealing to fuckwits) and I especially don't understand why the U.K. would have a huge antisemitism issue (alleged or otherwise) when Jewish people make up ~0.5% of the population.
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Dec 7, 2019 00:33
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Apraxin posted:
This also has a secondary effect on potential leftists who sometimes think "poo poo, what if I'm like that" and melt into a centrist compromise, dragging the overton window firmly over to the right. [1] Source: My loving idiot father-in-law Bobby Deluxe fucked around with this message at 00:38 on Dec 7, 2019 |
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Dec 7, 2019 00:36
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History Comes Inside! posted:I don't really understand why modern day antisemitism is a thing in the first place (I 'get' racism because different colour = bad is simple, which is probably what makes it so accessible and appealing to fuckwits) and I especially don't understand why the U.K. would have a huge antisemitism issue (alleged or otherwise) when Jewish people make up ~0.5% of the population. The labour manifesto
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Dec 7, 2019 00:37
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Guavanaut posted:The front wheelers will never viddy what we're govoreeting when we take eggiwegs with the Knight King Bishop Grand Chancellor. 1824. 2468. 5. You’re the ghost of Anthony Burgess and I claim my £5.
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Dec 7, 2019 00:38
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IIRC a bunch of Italians killed this Christ guy (a Jew), and their PR people managed to blame it on the Jews and incredibly it stuck. The rest is history, which as we all know has been almost universally terrible
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Dec 7, 2019 00:38
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Doccykins posted:https://www.twitter.com/YouGov/status/1203072894563213314 oh cool I wonder if coral will refund my bet based on this clearly contradictory information lol i am a dumb rear end in a top hat
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Dec 7, 2019 00:41
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bessantj posted:
https://twitter.com/RandallNortham/status/1192738394696306688?s=19
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Dec 7, 2019 00:44
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History Comes Inside! posted:I don't really understand why modern day antisemitism is a thing in the first place (I 'get' racism because different colour = bad is simple, which is probably what makes it so accessible and appealing to fuckwits) and I especially don't understand why the U.K. would have a huge antisemitism issue (alleged or otherwise) when Jewish people make up ~0.5% of the population. https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/article/smoke-without-fire-the-myth-of-a-labour-antisemitism-crisis/ This is an extremely good breakdown. The key point is the graph of generalised intolerance per %age poulation, where anti-semitism is sitting around 7% but islamophobia around 40%. This is lower than pretty much any other country in the EU. Other topics: I'm still wait on my GoggleBox reacts to #MarrCrash clip, get on it jezza.
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Dec 7, 2019 00:45
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History Comes Inside! posted:I don't really understand why modern day antisemitism is a thing in the first place (I 'get' racism because different colour = bad is simple, which is probably what makes it so accessible and appealing to fuckwits) and I especially don't understand why the U.K. would have a huge antisemitism issue (alleged or otherwise) when Jewish people make up ~0.5% of the population. Youd be surprised. Racism is not just alive and well here, its positively galloping. Door knocking for this campaign I have heard things that would curl your hair. "This used to be a good white street" me"oh dear are they disrupting you?" "No..l but it's not right!" That's where you thank them for their time and walk away. I'm still trying to work out the woman 3 weeks ago that blamed labour for loving over Rolls Royce. The secret to Czechoslovakia vzssing is to impart a lasting message, and follow the fuckers who disagree and deliver a bloody good kicking. I dont care, we will provide a NHS for that
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Dec 7, 2019 00:47
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Round here AS pretty much never comes up on the doorstep directly. (I've heard the word 'antisemitic' once but the bloke a) was incredibly racist himself; b) didn't actually know what it meant.) Like others have said, people have no consciousness of the Jewish experience and thus aren't really able to care. Bit depressing tbh. I do think the relentless negativity around it has seeped into people's brains on some level, but if it hadn't been AS it would have been some other concocted media shite. The difficult doors I get are mostly just completely disengaged and hopeless rather than the 'asking tricky questions about points of policy/scandals' type.
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Dec 7, 2019 00:51
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Failed Imagineer posted:IIRC a bunch of Italians killed this Christ guy (a Jew), and their PR people managed to blame it on the Jews and incredibly it stuck. The rest is history, which as we all know has been almost universally terrible "Society is artless and degenerate compared to some time I pulled out of my rear end. This must be due to our monotheistic faith and joyless invisible god. The god of the Jews, I note."
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Dec 7, 2019 00:53
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RockyB posted:https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/article/smoke-without-fire-the-myth-of-a-labour-antisemitism-crisis/ Trickjaw posted:Youd be surprised. Racism is not just alive and well here, its positively galloping. Door knocking for this campaign I have heard things that would curl your hair. "This used to be a good white street" me"oh dear are they disrupting you?" "No..l but it's not right!" That's where you thank them for their time and walk away. Ty both for the non-snarky answers.
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Dec 7, 2019 00:53
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I genuinely think the right are going to be kicking themselves next week for devoting so much time on the anti-Semitism smears. I've spoken to hundreds of voters this campaign and it's come up maybe ten times.
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Dec 7, 2019 01:05
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History Comes Inside! posted:Ty both for the non-snarky answers. In good faith, if you post, we are yours. Never forget that. Solidarity is key.
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Dec 7, 2019 01:14
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Any of you degenerates want to know about growing up in Apartheid south Africa. Yes , I put Nelson on Robin island. I was / and they took my crayons away
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Dec 7, 2019 01:17
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another thing to remember is this is an online world now, and racist abuse knows no borders. the original story about Labour antisemitism (before it became about the story itself and the fear it generates) related to internal disciplinary procedures, and abuse that some MPs (mostly to the right of the party, so the left was suspected) were receiving - particularly online obviously when you know about the chans with their extreme racism (especially against jews) and far-right tendencies, and their love of organising to attack people en masse... it's very likely that a visible jewish person online will be subject to racism from somewhere, and prominent figures especially. throw in the fact they can troll and pretend to be a leftist while letting loose with the bile and hatred, to really cause some trouble, and it becomes a political act as well. so it's not surprising that some prominent jewish MPs (especially women) get targetted with this stuff, they're an absolute focal point for these fuckers that's not to say there's no other antisemitism - obviously there is, and it's poisonous and needs dealing with like any other racism. the trouble is that never really gets any attention, nobody seemed to care until this whole Labour thing blew up, and it's still only Labour's issue that gets the focus, and there's a lot of that. So because it's a big story, it might feel like antisemitism is more widespread than it actually is, but it's also a weak point that attracts antisemites from all over the world to get stuck in, so we do end up with more of it anyway
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Dec 7, 2019 01:20
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RockyB posted:https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/article/smoke-without-fire-the-myth-of-a-labour-antisemitism-crisis/ This is the problem for Jeremy, it's far less acceptable to the public to be anti-Semitic than Islamophobic. This is a great article. https://novaramedia.com/2019/11/28/who-gets-to-speak-for-british-jews-how-the-myth-of-the-jewish-community-marginalises-dissent/
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Dec 7, 2019 01:21
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Necrothatcher posted:I genuinely think the right are going to be kicking themselves next week for devoting so much time on the anti-Semitism smears. I've spoken to hundreds of voters this campaign and it's come up maybe ten times. I used to work in an office with 3 "ordinary blokes" who weren't fans of Corbyn particularly but we had a conversation that was basically the following: Boss: "What's all this antisemitism thing?" Me: *briefly explains that it's mostly because Corbyn doesn't like what Israel is doing to Palestinians and why he's right" Boss: "Ah right, that makes sense. I just don't get why you would have anything against Jews anyway, I'm not sure I've ever known any" And the other guys in the office basically agreed that they didn't really believe he was antisemitic (though they just didn't like him anyway) and I think that even if he were proven antisemitic, the reaction from those guys would have just been a shrug. Which sucks, because obviously people should care about racism, but obviously anybody who *actually* cares about racism isn't going to be voting for the Tories anyway. I really do not think it's landing like they hope it is.
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Dec 7, 2019 01:23
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bessantj posted:
can't think why the mag of the Jewish KKK doesn't like Corbyn
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Dec 7, 2019 01:25
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Trickjaw posted:Youd be surprised. Racism is not just alive and well here, its positively galloping. Door knocking for this campaign I have heard things that would curl your hair. "This used to be a good white street" me"oh dear are they disrupting you?" "No..l but it's not right!" That's where you thank them for their time and walk away. Had the excellent experience this week of getting to see some of my partner's extended family at a party and while it was a very good time for the most part I also got to enjoy: 1) Her aunt/uncle being maybe actual fascists or maybe just dumbass bigots who've swallowed their talking points. Highlight was 'we went down [street] the other day and it was full of them.. asking for handouts.' Thankfully someone arrived just after that was said and I couldn't get away fast enough. Seriously, dog trumpet not whistle. 2) Partner's sister's boyfriend, who has always been a little haughty around me but never openly hostile, getting steaming and yelling that I was a 'condescending english prick who came up here and thinks he's the kind of scotland'. Impossibly I am actually very much not any of that (you'll have to take my word) and I've lived in the country for over a decade, so getting my first unexpected taste of blood and soil scottish nationalism was very fun! These situations are very difficult to deal with at family gatherings where oh my god all you want to do is not cause a scene especially as her immediate family I get on really well with. Thankfully a lot of people I get on with were there, so it made up for it (and probably avoided an actual fight).
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Dec 7, 2019 01:25
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Necrothatcher posted:I genuinely think the right are going to be kicking themselves next week for devoting so much time on the anti-Semitism smears. I've spoken to hundreds of voters this campaign and it's come up maybe ten times.
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Dec 7, 2019 01:28
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I think the issue with antisemitism is that it gives people moral cover to not vote for Labour, or to actively vote for the Tories despite their record and policies. People might not actually care about antisemitism, but they'll feel good claiming to, and it can be a powerful argument against Labour supporters I dunno how much this translates to a secret vote in a polling booth, but it sure gives people a stick to wear down people who actually do care about racism. If conservatives can suppress the vote a bit (especially among idealistic young people) then it helps them out
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Dec 7, 2019 01:29
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90% of the people citing Labour anti-Semitism do not give one iota of a gently caress and probably loving hate any Jewish person to the left of them another 2% are Jewish and care more about stomping Palestinians than democracy or the country's survival the final 7% are the well-meaning Jewish population who have become radicalised by the previous 2%
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Dec 7, 2019 01:31
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the other 1% is Boris Johnson.
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Dec 7, 2019 01:32
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zhar posted:didn't there use to be a smiley like this? couldnt find it on the list 
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Dec 7, 2019 01:35
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What a disgusting git: (Sorry for not giving better comment I have a headache). https://twitter.com/JulieAForshaw/status/1203099306267435010?s=20
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Dec 7, 2019 01:40
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Lol  https://twitter.com/verge/status/1203080690507698176
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Dec 7, 2019 01:40
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Well done guys you just crashed twitter.
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Dec 7, 2019 01:49
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RockyB posted:Well done guys you just crashed twitter. maybe the queen died for real this time
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Dec 7, 2019 01:49
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Angepain posted:maybe the queen died for real this time Nah fairly sure it was all the anti-semitism hot takes and GoggleBox reshares.
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Dec 7, 2019 01:51
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Hopefully it's all the people calling Musk a pedo guy now we've established it's not libel. E: the British scuba guy lost his lawsuit against Musky. one of the jurors owns 2 Teslas sinky fucked around with this message at 01:54 on Dec 7, 2019 |
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Dec 7, 2019 01:51
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