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That’s just half a pint of gin lmao.
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Dec 3, 2019 00:07
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Comb Your Beard posted:I agree holding all other variables equal, including drink volume, ice quantity, length of time, shaking will both chill more and dilute more. But if you stir long enough you can get equal chilling power and less dilution. The pros will say if it doesn't contain dairy or citrus stir it just long enough to reach a full chill. According to Arnold's studies, getting equal chilling power and less dilution is simply impossible unless you use something other than normal bar ice to try and chill it (or don't flick the water off the surface of bar ice). The chilling comes directly from the ice melting cold water into the drink and ice always has the same chilling power no matter how fancy it is. The only way you can get more dilution with ice is to use extremely small pieces like crushed/shaved ice and use it for the same time period as normal shaking or stirring, as it'll make the drink very cold very fast and going much farther will result in severe overdilution, or intentionally let ice melt over a very long period of time before stirring. Here are some recipes from his book that actually have the final composition listed so you can see the difference: quote:CLASSIC DAIQUIRI INGREDIENTS quote:OLD FASHIONED INGREDIENTS quote:BLENDER MARGARITA The Daiquiri gets a standard 10 seconds of shaking, the Old Fashioned gets 5 seconds of stirring, the Margarita is blended until the ice is fully crushed. He also has a Negroni and Manhattan experiment where he stirs for 15 seconds and the final drink is 27% alcohol; I didn't include them because the recipe is for making two drinks and didn't want confusing numbers. But you can clearly see that the amount of time it would take to stir a drink to get the same dilution as a shaken drink is way too long to be worth the effort when you can just shake it or lower the proportions of ingredients, while blending gets you similar alcohol content as doing a shaken drink with the same amount of liquor. Also, note that the Margarita recipe is unusual. Arnold has found that simply putting a shaken drink recipe into a blender creates a drink that's too tart and diluted and not sweet enough, so he uses more liqueur to let him increase the sweetness and reduce the liquid by comparison.
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Dec 3, 2019 00:30
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Yea - how do you get equally chilled with less dilution? That doesn’t make any sense.
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Dec 3, 2019 01:27
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Fleming's taste for dry cocktails always seemed odd for someone who spent so much time in the Caribbean.
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Dec 3, 2019 01:58
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Halloween Jack posted:Fleming's taste for dry cocktails always seemed odd for someone who spent so much time in the Caribbean. His taste was consistent between a few things. He liked dry Martinis (especially with vodka and shaken), and whiskey with soda or ice (preferably bourbon) the most. He would branch out to things like brandy and ginger ale, brandy and soda, Old Fashioneds, and champagne but always came back to his two primaries. He drank as much as a bottle a day for much of his life, which (combined with smoking 4+ packs a day) led to his heart attack at 54. There's one letter he sent to his wife where he listed every gin & tonic he drank as he got to it, and by the end he was at something like 6.
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Dec 3, 2019 03:06
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It makes sense that a navy officer must have had a horse's neck here and there.
Halloween Jack fucked around with this message at 03:25 on Dec 3, 2019 |
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Dec 3, 2019 03:15
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This is going to make me sound like a douchy cocktail snob but I don't think I'm entirely out of line. I was at my company holiday party at an event space and we had 2 full bars with 6 bartenders. They seemed to have a full bar set up so I asked a bartender for an old fashioned using the bulleit bourbon behind him. He asked me to wait for the other one as he didn't know how to make one. The next guy said they couldn't because they had nothing with which to muddle fruit. I told him that I didn't need muddled fruit and to just give me the bulleit bourbon with the angustora bitters (which were also visible behind him) with simple syrup over ice. They couldn't do that as they had no simple syrup or sugar. I ended up with just a glass of bourbon. I don't understand how a major event space in NYC could have a bar set up without any kind of sweetener. I'm kind of stunned. It was bizarre.
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Dec 6, 2019 01:32
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Expecting a bar to have sugar doesn't make you a cocktail snob
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Dec 6, 2019 01:53
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Yeah that’s like thinking someone is a snob because they asked for a Martini and were told they could only have it with Southern Comfort.
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Dec 6, 2019 01:58
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His Divine Shadow posted:I prefer darker liquors as well, or maybe not since I like gin, any cheap old gin. I do like juniper, the local smokers do a nice juniper smoked ham too. I'm sure theres a vodka/gin/tequila out there for me. ONE DAY I'll find it.
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Dec 6, 2019 02:09
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A true cocktail snob would have took one look at the bar and knew they couldn't make a proper drink in the first place and just ordered the bourbon neat right off the bat
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Dec 6, 2019 14:00
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Looking at batch making some Jack Rose cocktails for a party tonight, so I'm not stuck making em over and over, is there an issue with that? If I put the correct amount of lemon + grenadine vs Applejack and combine before hand and stir the poo poo out of it before serving over ice Thanks
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Dec 6, 2019 15:07
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Tiny Chalupa posted:Looking at batch making some Jack Rose cocktails for a party tonight, so I'm not stuck making em over and over, is there an issue with that? Shouldn't be an issue
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Dec 6, 2019 15:12
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Tiny Chalupa posted:Looking at batch making some Jack Rose cocktails for a party tonight, so I'm not stuck making em over and over, is there an issue with that? Conveniently, Dave Arnold also talks about batching drinks in his book (and his bars have done a ton of batching). There should be absolutely no problem with what you're doing, but you can also utilize your freezer to avoid having to stir anything per drink. The thing to note is that standard home freezers are too cold to just shove the whole pitcher in because all the non-alcohol components will freeze, but you can account for that by freezing everything and then adding cold water to the pitcher for serving. This is an example of how he does Manhattans: quote:Manhattans by the Pitcher I would just increase the amounts proportionately to how many cocktails you expect to serve; this is a recipe for 7.
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Dec 6, 2019 16:01
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Thank you! I assume the added water in that recipe is to lower the ABV? I need to look up more of Dave Arnold. I believe I have his liquid intelligence but haven't browsed it in a while I need to make more batch cocktails that isn't just punches
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Dec 6, 2019 16:30
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Tiny Chalupa posted:Thank you! I assume the added water in that recipe is to lower the ABV? Yes. Stirring or shaking dilutes as well as chilling, so you need to add cold water to do that with your batch or people are drinking raw applejack with some juice in it.
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Dec 6, 2019 16:35
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Here’s a fun drink to make for the holiday season when you want to kill the end of your bottle of bitters: https://www.seriouseats.com/recipes/2016/10/tradewinds-angostura-negroni-sweet-vermouth-cinnamon-cocktail.html
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Dec 9, 2019 04:31
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poo poo like this is why you get the big bottle of bitters
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Dec 9, 2019 04:45
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Trinidad Sours 4life
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Dec 9, 2019 18:35
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Everything gets a sequel
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Dec 10, 2019 18:28
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Anyone have recommendations for rum or bourbon based cocktails that include a salty element, or classics that are improved with added salt/saline? My partner takes her martinis as dirty as can be, and I recently made her an old fashioned that was sweetened with bacon orange marmalade and she was real fond of it. I’ve made the Benton’s old fashioned, but to be honest I wasn’t amazed by it and, especially given the time and planning involved in making it, I prefer the old fashioned with bacon marmalade (I just wish it didn’t leave scraps of bacon in the drink.)
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Dec 10, 2019 18:52
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None off the top of my head, but I would whip up a little saline solution and just add a drop or two to a daiquiri or whiskey sour
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Dec 10, 2019 19:01
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Something important is that the "few drops of saline solution" often recommended won't make the drink salty. It suppresses bitterness while making the sweeter and fruitier elements "pop" more. One suggestion for something other than a salt rim could be to do a whiskey sour with egg white and float some salt on top. Madison in San Diego does a mezcal-based drink dusted with black lava salt for a more appealing look.
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Dec 10, 2019 19:06
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Add a couple more drops and it’ll be salty.
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Dec 10, 2019 19:18
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Or pair it with a pretzel.
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Dec 10, 2019 19:28
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Which home bar items should be refrigerated, both for shelf life and best use? Various juices obviously, maybe the fresh citrus? I've got the Mixel app and it puts syrups in the fridge which made me wonder. I don't plan on making my own syrups right now so just have the store bought stuff.
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Dec 16, 2019 17:49
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Admiral Joeslop posted:Which home bar items should be refrigerated, both for shelf life and best use? Various juices obviously, maybe the fresh citrus? I've got the Mixel app and it puts syrups in the fridge which made me wonder. I don't plan on making my own syrups right now so just have the store bought stuff. I keep syrups in the fridge, yeah. Wines such as vermouth and sherry SHOULD be refrigerated as well, but not everyone does.
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Dec 16, 2019 17:52
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Everything below 20% abv in the fridge, everything above it at cool room temp and out of direct sunlight, don’t juice your citrus beforehand unless you’re clarifying it, and change your ice frequently to avoid odors.
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Dec 16, 2019 18:05
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I should be refrigerating my aperol (~11%)?
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Dec 16, 2019 18:18
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Thanks for the answers; while I'm here, any good alcohol based podcasts? Something historical maybe, and something about modern stuff maybe? Edit: I'm now heavily invested in the idea of a podcast that gives a history lesson on an "unusual" alcohol and also reviews it and gives a cocktail recipe. Like Benedictine, or Malort. Edit edit: Also when bitters or other stuff gets oxidized, what does that mean exactly, and does it mean I need to throw whatever it is away? Admiral Joeslop fucked around with this message at 18:39 on Dec 16, 2019 |
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Dec 16, 2019 18:27
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I’ve been working my way through recipes trying to find a pleasing holiday cocktail, and I’ve been mostly unimpressed so far. They’re either classic staples I drink throughout the year anyways, seasonal drinks I’ve found unpalatable like the hot buttered rum and the hot toddy, or just obviously trash recipes. The one I’ve come upon that I did like was the Tradewinds Negroni, which is a nicely spiced, bracing winter tincture. That being said, I’m trying to formulate something loosely based on an old fashioned that approximates gingerbread, particularly the Latvian style which prominently features black pepper in the spice blend. Here’s my thinking at present: 2 oz Rittenhouse Rye .5 oz Licor 43 (a vanilla citrus liqueur) .5 oz ginger syrup rim with sugar, lemon zest, and ground black pepper Stir over ice, serve neat and garnish with a cinnamon stick There are too many elements here, I’m sure. I may nix the cinnamon stick garnish (I’m also interested in a candied orange peel, maybe). I’m going back and forth on using white or demerrara sugar for the rim. Demerrara would fit the profile better, but the clean taste of white sugar may serve the rim better. I’m also debating if the vanilla flavor of Licor 43 is an appropriate addition, and whether it will over-sweeten the drink. It certainly bears reformulating and experimenting with a bit.
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Dec 16, 2019 18:58
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Scythe posted:Everything below 20% abv in the fridge Everything that is wine based and below 20% should be in the fridge. Things that are spirits based and below 20 don't need to be refrigerated, like the aforementioned Aperol.
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Dec 16, 2019 19:21
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Dr Cheeto posted:I should be refrigerating my aperol (~11%)? Nah. The other thing to consider here is sugar content. Enough sugar will act as a preservative. Aperol is plenty sweet enough to hang out on your bar cart and not in the fridge. Admiral Joeslop posted:Edit edit: Also when bitters or other stuff gets oxidized, what does that mean exactly, and does it mean I need to throw whatever it is away? I have never heard of bitters oxidizing. Oxidation is most frequently a concern with wine, usually due to a defective bottling process. Oxygen exposure will dull the wine's nuances and give sort of a flat, cardboardy impression to it. I don't know how the hell you would store your bitters that would make that a possibility. Anonymous Robot posted:2 oz Rittenhouse Rye One ounce of sweet in a stirred drink is way too much. Also, an Old Fashioned with no bitters? Angostura has all those classic holiday baking spices, it makes perfect sense to include it here. If I were trying to make this cocktail work I might nix the ginger syrup and maybe infuse fresh ginger into Angostura and use a large amount of it, maybe a half- or full teaspoon. A generous portion of bitters like that would be nice against the sweet, rich Licor 43 (an underrated bottle in its own right, I like that you're using it) and the assertive Rittenhouse. Garnish-wise I agree that cinnamon sticks are a bit much. Maybe twist a swath of orange peel around a piece of candied ginger and spear with a cocktail pick. I'm personally against rimmed cocktails pretty much across the board, but I'll concede that they can be done tastefully. However I'm picturing taking a sip of an Old Fashioned and encountering sugar and black pepper on the rim and it just doesn't seem pleasant to me. I guess you could make a black pepper tincture and spray it on top of the drink if you wanted to but I'm not sure it makes sense here.
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Dec 16, 2019 19:35
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prayer group posted:
Leaving out bitters felt like an odd omission, but there’s already so much going on that I was hesitant to add any more. I do think that dropping either the ginger syrup or the 43 is a must, but I hadn’t thought about infusing fresh ginger into bitters (in fact, making a batch of ginger syrup is what initially set me down this track, so I was biased in that direction.) Is that as simple as immersing some fresh cut ginger slivers into bitters? For how long would it take, overnight? I had considered garnishing with candied ginger but I was already getting pretty overboard. If I drop the ginger syrup and the cinnamon stick, it would serve a better role in the recipe for sure. Regarding the rim, it is an unusual choice for this sort of drink (I thought about switching over to a martini glass to make it feel more natural,) but what I’m really looking for here is the incorporation of the black pepper, which I couldn’t think of another vector for. I’m not aware of how to make something that I could put in an atomizer (maybe using a food-grade essential oil, but ordering an ingredient like that online is a bridge too far for me at this moment.)
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Dec 16, 2019 19:45
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Anonymous Robot posted:I’ve been working my way through recipes trying to find a pleasing holiday cocktail, and I’ve been mostly unimpressed so far. They’re either classic staples I drink throughout the year anyways, seasonal drinks I’ve found unpalatable like the hot buttered rum and the hot toddy, or just obviously trash recipes. The one I’ve come upon that I did like was the Tradewinds Negroni, which is a nicely spiced, bracing winter tincture. I would try a black pepper infusion and a ginger liqueur. Also, as mentioned, add angostura bitters and skip the rimmed glass. And mess with the proportions. You might also want the bready part of gingerbread. I would try genever. Take a quarter teaspoon of ground black pepper, infuse 8oz of genever for an hour or two, strain through coffee filter. 1.5 rittenhouse .5 black pepper genever .25 licor 43 .25 ginger liqueur (Canton or Kings are both good, but can be pricy, so you may want to stick with ginger syrup, but if you do, you’d probably need a little amaro or something to help balance) 3 hearty dashes of Angostura Garnish wise I’d stick with an orange or lemon twist. Maybe do a pinch of salt or drop of saline solution in the cocktail as well.
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Dec 16, 2019 19:50
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Ginger liqueur is a very easy infusion to make, too. (Put 8 oz. of candied ginger in vodka for a month, strain, make syrup with the ginger, mix syrup and liquor to taste.)
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Dec 16, 2019 19:53
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Anonymous Robot posted:Leaving out bitters felt like an odd omission, but there’s already so much going on that I was hesitant to add any more. I do think that dropping either the ginger syrup or the 43 is a must, but I hadn’t thought about infusing fresh ginger into bitters (in fact, making a batch of ginger syrup is what initially set me down this track, so I was biased in that direction.) Is that as simple as immersing some fresh cut ginger slivers into bitters? For how long would it take, overnight? Both the tincture and the infused Ango are best done with an immersion circulator, which I realize is not a setup most people have available to them. 140 for two hours is our usual method at work IIRC. Basically the difference between a standard infusion and a tincture is the ratio of ingredients to base spirit. For a tincture you'd want to use a smaller amount of spirit, usually at a higher proof. The Maestro's suggestion of black pepper genever is much more achievable for the average home enthusiast. It sounds tasty, too.
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Dec 16, 2019 19:58
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I do have an immersion circulator available to me, actually. Would it be possible to kill two birds with one stone and infuse both the ginger and pepper into the bitters? Failing that, I imagine I’d want to use vodka or some other neutral spirit as the base? I wouldn’t want to buy genever for this purpose, would Plymouth gin a suitable substitution if I went that route?
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Dec 16, 2019 20:10
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Oh, hell yeah. Ginger-black pepper Ango sounds like a great idea. Do that.
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Dec 16, 2019 20:13
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prayer group posted:Oh, hell yeah. Ginger-black pepper Ango sounds like a great idea. Do that. Rad. For a ballpark measurement, let’s say I’m shooting for a quarter cup of bitters tincture. .25 cup of Angosturra, .25 cup of slivered ginger, 2 tsp of ground ginger sound like an appropriate ballpark?
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Dec 16, 2019 20:19
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