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It really isn’t too much of a surprise that this is a bit of a hot mess. I recently re-read Crisis and it barely made sense even to someone familiar with the comics of the time. There are so many parts that are just clearly there to serve as tie-ins for ongoing series and which begin and “end” without affecting the main story in the least, parts where the Anti-Monitor’s plans and the points to them are vague at best, and so many characters that most characters who aren’t a Flash or from the House of El is lucky to do more than appear on-panel and have their name mentioned. I can’t imagine someone reading it nowadays without any knowledge of the comics. What I’m saying here is that it’s exactly the glorious trainwreck I expected and wanted. If the Williams score plays during the Routh introduction I will mark out even harder.
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Dec 9, 2019 19:59
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Space Fish posted:Is the batarang high tech, or did Ray add a light element enchantment to it that deals +1 damage to shadow beings? It's a little bit of both, Ray boosted the batarang, but they were already high tech. There was a plot point earlier in the season that they were still tuned for Bruce's arm length so Kate was loving up with them.
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Dec 9, 2019 20:00
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GreenNight posted:He could have been 1 of the billion that escaped. 3 billion escaped. Monitor estimates that 1 billion of them were due to the extra time Oliver bought.
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Dec 9, 2019 20:50
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Bruceski posted:3 billion escaped. Monitor estimates that 1 billion of them were due to the extra time Oliver bought. Australia gonna get full.
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Dec 9, 2019 20:58
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GreenNight posted:Australia gonna get full. That’s the tip of the iceberg, think about the impact in a generation or two and they’re dealing with a few billion bogans running around
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Dec 9, 2019 21:29
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Shove em all to nazi Earth. Problem solved.
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Dec 9, 2019 21:32
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Hey so forgive me but I don't know all my TV tropes. But Ollie died in the first episode and not how the Monitor thought. Johnathan "Superman's Son" El landed, of all random places, in another Green Arrow's timeline/universe/city. We had ZERO reason to have that Oliver be part of this show (but he really acted the hell out of it!). Is this not a Chekhov's Ollie?
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Dec 9, 2019 21:38
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If the Arrow Beyond folks jump back to the future I want the Glades (or the reverse-Glades depending on what time travel managed to stop) to have a large second-generation refugee population. Team Flash tries to put meta-dampening cuffs on an alien. Supergirl becomes an ambassador/symbol for all the "38-ers" instead of just aliens forcing her and Lena to do press appearances together.
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Dec 9, 2019 21:39
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Feenix posted:Hey so forgive me but I don't know all my TV tropes. But Ollie died in the first episode and not how the Monitor thought. Johnathan "Superman's Son" El landed, of all random places, in another Green Arrow's timeline/universe/city. We had ZERO reason to have that Oliver be part of this show (but he really acted the hell out of it!). Is this not a Chekhov's Ollie? It would be weird to end the show Arrow with an Ollie who doesn't have the memories of the Ollie we've been following this whole time. Unless you mean the new Ollie could die the way the Monitor saw Ollie would die. But, like...isn't Arrow not quite done yet? Just going to have the last episode of Arrow have no Ollie in it?
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Dec 9, 2019 21:42
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Yes, it's to kick start the spinoff. Plus it was pretty obvious he was passing the mantel to the new Arrow. Show is called Arrow, not The Adventures of Ollie.
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Dec 9, 2019 21:48
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Arrow has two episodes left once the crossover is done, the Arrow Beyond pilot and the series finale. Amell is obviously going to be in the finale, but nothing says it can't be in flashbacks only. Honestly that would be pretty on brand for Arrow.Bruceski posted:If the Arrow Beyond folks jump back to the future I want the Glades (or the reverse-Glades depending on what time travel managed to stop) to have a large second-generation refugee population. Team Flash tries to put meta-dampening cuffs on an alien. Supergirl becomes an ambassador/symbol for all the "38-ers" instead of just aliens forcing her and Lena to do press appearances together. I'm still guessing they're going to slam that reset button hard and the major universes, like Earth-38, that get wiped out are brought back.
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Dec 9, 2019 21:56
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No, the backdoor pilot is the second to last episode. We get one more to wrap it all up. The concept of 3 billion duplicates showing up on Earth is pretty nuts. Suddenly you have two wives only one has a weird accent or something.
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Dec 9, 2019 21:58
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Rhyno posted:The concept of 3 billion duplicates showing up on Earth is pretty nuts. Suddenly you have two wives only one has a weird accent or something. Another version of your wife shows up, except this time she looks like your mom or something.
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Dec 9, 2019 22:06
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Or she's a cyborg! With laser eyes!
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Dec 9, 2019 22:17
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I mean, not a lot of alien activity on Earth 1, so it's gonna be a surprise for everyone.
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Dec 9, 2019 22:19
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Rhyno posted:No, the backdoor pilot is the second to last episode. We get one more to wrap it all up. No, you only have one wife, there's just someone else who looks like her and may or may not be married to someone who looks like you. I'm a near-identical twin, I know how this stuff works, it's two people no matter how similar they are.
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Dec 9, 2019 22:19
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Unless they merge the world but the timing is off so the alt version of you SO is only half merged so they have to share a torso and have 3 legs.
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Dec 9, 2019 22:24
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thrawn527 posted:It would be weird to end the show Arrow with an Ollie who doesn't have the memories of the Ollie we've been following this whole time. Unless you mean the new Ollie could die the way the Monitor saw Ollie would die. But, like...isn't Arrow not quite done yet? Just going to have the last episode of Arrow have no Ollie in it? I don't know what I mean. I just mean, kinda random to introduce rand-Ollie AND kill Ollie-prime in the same ep. (which is the first of 5 ep series that includes a farewell of Oliver altogether. Sooooo... maybe something there?
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Dec 9, 2019 22:32
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Bruceski posted:3 billion escaped. Monitor estimates that 1 billion of them were due to the extra time Oliver bought. I think this was the only thing that was really off about the episode for me, because the editing cuts immediately from Oliver charging forward to hold his ground to a shot of the tower crumbling and the wave hitting. To the viewer there was no "extra time", it really needed a longer last stand but I can imagine having him alone hand to hand fighting ghosts would have looked terrible. Or the Monitor was just saying that to make everyone feel better, who knows.
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Dec 9, 2019 22:38
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Holy crap did that satisfy. I wasn't expecting it to get out of the gate so fast, I figured it would be a Suprgirl-centric episode, then poo poo gets real, then some of the rest of the gang shows up. Nope, just quick bits of Harbinger showing up and saying "you, you're coming with me" to everyone, and off we go! Ray loving up trivia night, Kate decking Harbinger, and old fat Robin walking his doggie. Flash fact: Burt Ward spends his retirement running an animal rescue and has 50 kajillion dogs, so no doubt he probably asked to be walking a dog in the shot. Knowing that bit of irl trivia made me all  I got teary af watching both future Ollie and regular Ollie scenes, which was probably a good thing because I hadn't blinked during the rest of the episode and my eyes were threatening to dry up and fall out. I really wasnt expecting the death scene, since I knew we had 2 more Arrow episodes coming, so that was sheer wtf for me. Like, I knew Arrow was almost over and Amell wasn't gonna be around much longer*, but to pull that out on an episode of Supergirl? The first ep of Crisis? Absolutely did not see that coming and was blind-sided by it. *That said, we always have The Time gently caress-ups of Tomorrow, I'd bet my full run of 52 that he shows up sometime for A Very Special Episode of Legends in the future. (Well, our future. Their past. Or, something, it's complicated. Speedforce, I ain't gotta explain poo poo)
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Dec 9, 2019 22:53
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STAC Goat posted:Yeah, I liked the way they justified the Supergirl focused episode by having Earth 38 in the path of the wave first. It let them do some good stuff with Kara and Clark, Lois, Argo, etc, probably helped set up that spinoff, and allowed people like Nia and Kelly to show up for the crossover. Its gonna be a little more awkward to justify a stopover at Gotham before heading to Star Labs (and the Batwoman supporting cast will feel less earned to have a visit) but I thought they did a good job balancing last night so I'm optimistic for tonight. It wasn't that first crossover that was all awkwardly "Here's a Supergirl episode... oh yeah, crossover." That's true I suppose. I guess, especially since Supergirl has been dealing with its own plot this season (rather than Flash and Arrow which have basically been entirely Crisis preludes), it is important to point out "hey our plot still exists but is now on hold" rather than ignoring all that and just coming back in January without acknowledging it. Space Fish posted:Is the batarang high tech, or did Ray add a light element enchantment to it that deals +1 damage to shadow beings? Batarangs are much like Green Arrow's arrows, in that they do whatever the gently caress the plot needs them to do at any time.
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Dec 9, 2019 23:04
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So what are the chances that dead Oliver is actually future alternate Oliver (for 20+ years in the future he really doesn't age much) who was brought in last second by the Monitor to make the sacrifice he was inspired to make by Sarah, who was only there to inspire him because the Monitor redirected the baby ship to his domain? He may have been asked to play the part so that "real" Ollie can come in later and make the sacrifice he was supposed to make when he needs to make it, and to inspire the others to fight in Ollie's honor until the time is right...
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Dec 9, 2019 23:25
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The Legends time traveled Future Ollie to past Elseworlds to generate the Flash speed clone. So Future Ollie Past Flash Speed Clone is the one who died
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Dec 9, 2019 23:40
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SardonicTyrant posted:He had a kryptonite arrow. Somehow. There isn't even kryptonite in his universe. He synthesized it but had to use tar as a substitute for an unidentifiable component.
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Dec 10, 2019 01:14
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WhyteRyce posted:The Legends time traveled Future Ollie to past Elseworlds to generate the Flash speed clone. So Future Ollie Past Flash Speed Clone is the one who died I was gonna say something like this, a Flash AND a Green Arrow dies, very economical.
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Dec 10, 2019 01:20
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Future Ollie subbing in doesn't make a ton of sense to me when the Monitor could probably just like plug Oliver from a second before his death or give him alien magic or whatever to have him show up for the finale. But then again I have no idea what the purpose of sending Superman's kid to an alternate Earth in 2046 with a crazy Ollie. So I have no idea what thread that is. For a second I thought it was gonna be a screw up and the kid would have been there for 27 years and was now Superboy or something... or that it would be the Arrow Beyond timeline and we'd be closing the loop on that timeline... but I dunno what's going on now so I'm just gonna wait and see.
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Dec 10, 2019 01:45
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Seeing Oldiver might just be a way for them to give him some closure, since it was kinda left in the air back in Legends S1. Then again, time bullshit might get even shittier, so who knows?
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Dec 10, 2019 01:50
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I kinda promised our crew they’d never have to do another crossover...
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Dec 10, 2019 02:02
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Yesssss
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Dec 10, 2019 02:03
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Yesssss, AI Snart
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Dec 10, 2019 02:03
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So this is the Legends epsidoe
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Dec 10, 2019 02:04
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Oh man, 7 paragons made me think lantern corps for a second.
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Dec 10, 2019 02:06
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Bruce Wayne is Batman? 
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Dec 10, 2019 02:07
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Kate being smug about her cousin being Batman feels appropriate. Same with Ray being thrilled about finding that out.
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Dec 10, 2019 02:07
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Lex is so predictable.
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Dec 10, 2019 02:11
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Of course Lex would take the opportunity to kill all Supermen when he gets the chance. And Barry, no, Lazarus pits are a bad idea.
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Dec 10, 2019 02:11
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I feel like the team are already going way off-mission
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Dec 10, 2019 02:12
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howe_sam posted:Of course Lex would take the opportunity to kill all Supermen when he gets the chance. So exactly on brand for Barry
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Dec 10, 2019 02:13
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Xelkelvos posted:So exactly on brand for Barry I mean, it's better than going back in time at least
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Dec 10, 2019 02:15
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Constantine!
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Dec 10, 2019 02:18
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