(Thread IKs:
fart simpson)
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the Hong Kong protests are actually about which factions sees themselves as the most unique snowflake Chinese. Like how the HK people made those political cartoon ads about how they are more civilized and have the right manners unlike those mainlanders.
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Dec 18, 2019 03:25
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| # ? Jun 4, 2024 02:58 |
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可以确认的是，中国人有独特的写作方式中国白人由于缺乏文化而无法效法。显然，这些文件是以“粗略”的方式编写的，即使是小学中国学生也会嘲笑自己！
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Dec 18, 2019 04:35
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https://twitter.com/melissakchan/status/1204032135574765569 https://twitter.com/melissakchan/status/1203355883176185857  
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Dec 18, 2019 05:18
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why do they always go with the inscrutably corrupt foreign government excuse when this happens do they think they come off as more charming when they pretend to be too stupid to make guesses
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Dec 18, 2019 05:24
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I never tried to read this before and I can tell you I'm 100% convinced it's written by an english speaker, or written in english first.
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Dec 18, 2019 06:44
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Typo posted:可以确认的是，中国人有独特的写作方式中国白人由于缺乏文化而无法效法。显然，这些文件是以“粗略”的方式编写的，即使是小学中国学生也会嘲笑自己！ this reads like english put into google translate too edit: I don't mean you messed up a little, it's clearly not written with human intent the mistakes are what a computer would make turning english into chinese like using 自己 instead of 他們 edit2: I was trying to figure out why you wrote 中國白人and I realized you wrote "Chinese people have a unique way of writing chinese White people cannot follow suit because of a lack of culture." and because you forgot a period in between those sentences google thinks you are saying "Chinese white people" as in white people that come from china. I put that into google and get exactly what you wrote. sick Modest Mao has issued a correction as of 09:47 on Dec 18, 2019 |
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Dec 18, 2019 06:48
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Re: CIA dismantling, I thought it was common knowledge that they set up the absolute lamest comms website for their agents short of actually registering CIAinChina.gov.us.eagle.applepie, and then acted surprised when it was noticed. I mean, you could say "hacked" if you like, but going off available accounts, that's like calling people who tilt vending machines to get free food 'hackers'.
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Dec 18, 2019 07:23
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It's like that "Aussie Chinese spy" leak which every mainlander can tell right away he was making up poo poo with known information (not making up poo poo with the help of CIA english speakers, but just a 20-something con man making up poo poo on his own.) The sad thing is at least at least half of the posters on Taiwanese and HK forums insist his is real. They don't even bother to understand the mainland bureaucratic systems. Everything to them is "authoritarian evil doing." What I meant by that is non of these Taiwan and HK threads bother to discuss the technical detail of his leaks.
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Dec 18, 2019 09:03
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https://twitter.com/ChineseBot2B/status/1207168604703051777 also this dude's a liar, it's definitely close enough for the joke to land if you somehow know the names of fonts for foreign languages
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Dec 18, 2019 09:39
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Didn't see it skimming the thread. What are the good sources of info for this topic? I am having a bar level conversation with a guy about the Uyghurs and he shows me a link where the first quoted source is from the "victims of comunism" group. Just maybe some slight bias there. I don't know about any good sources of news/info though. What's the pro click?
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Dec 18, 2019 09:57
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Both sides have a lot of interest now in their own narratives and boosting stories that support those narratives, but I would say in this case Xinjiang is pretty hosed up. Both sides agree there are camps, they are for one ethnicity, and their purpose is reeducation (or, vocational training, mandarin language and cultural classes, and building patriotism). The biggest tells to me are that the defense of the camps usually follows two arguments, one that the threat of terrorism is real and this is the most peaceful way to resolve it, and two that the west has done similar or worse, or is doing similar or worse. Neither of these arguments would I put up with being made by America or any other nation idk why I should allow the chinese to use such poo poo reasoning for this level of inhumanity. The west says stuff like it's anti islam or a genocide which is unsubstantiated. It is a language school program like the US did to native americans so if you didn't like that idk why you'd say this is OK. A pro-click would be to just go there and decide for yourself, afaik Xinjiang is not off limits in any way. Otherwise you have to wade through poo poo like everyone else. Modest Mao has issued a correction as of 10:19 on Dec 18, 2019 |
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Dec 18, 2019 10:15
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Dec 18, 2019 11:25
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Modest Mao posted:Both sides have a lot of interest now in their own narratives and boosting stories that support those narratives, but I would say in this case Xinjiang is pretty hosed up. i've got basically the worst possible news about mandatory 'language school' programs At least this time apparently they aren't specifically targeting children but instead take their parents and leave them destitute
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Dec 18, 2019 11:32
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seems like the media would be pushing that angle more if there were oliver twist style gangs of orphan pickpockets roaming the streets
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Dec 18, 2019 12:14
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You're not far away from the phrase "Kill the Indian to save the man'
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Dec 18, 2019 12:25
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its really not a good analogy most of the indians were dead at that point the main reason why that particular genocide was so successful is because there werent that many left to round up there are a lot more uighyurs by contrast and on a logistical level im not sure the chinese could shove all of them into concentration camps even if they wanted to
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Dec 18, 2019 12:43
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nazis managed to do it just fine, i think you're underestimating the magnitude of resources an industrial superpower has access to
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Dec 18, 2019 12:49
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And if the stuff about "extremely voluntary factory jobs" is true, they'll be paying for themselves, so to speak.
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Dec 18, 2019 14:45
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"the West has done" is excusatory language. The West is literally doing right now as we speak. edit: sorry for being nitpicky, I know you said "or is doing" and it's a good post overall, but starting with "has done" frames it as something that we shouldn't care about anymore when really one of the few tools we have at our disposal is history and historical context. Frijolero has issued a correction as of 16:05 on Dec 18, 2019 |
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Dec 18, 2019 15:56
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Also, "where can I find more info on this???" is entirely the wrong question. You could find all the info you want about the coup in Bolivia and come out thinking that it's actually Evo's fault and that he deserved to be ousted.
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Dec 18, 2019 16:02
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Frijolero posted:"the West has done" is excusatory language Isn't that the central issue at hand? The central debate doesn't seem to be that the PRC hasn't done anything wrong (some will say it didn't), but that they are conducting policies that the West wouldn't/couldn't have done in recent times or are conducting. This is where evidence becomes more contentious: including the number of detained, the conditions of detainees, and if Beijing is conducting policies only hostile to Uyghur culture or intends to wipe it out completely. (As a point of comparison: according to ICE, 350,000 people were detained by it in 2018 alone.) Ardennes has issued a correction as of 16:59 on Dec 18, 2019 |
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Dec 18, 2019 16:05
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Ardennes posted:Isn't that the central issue at hand? The central debate doesn't seem to be that the PRC hasn't done anything wrong (some will say it didn't), but that they are conducting policies that the West wouldn't/couldn't have done in recent times or are conducting currently. I would love to have this discussion. In terms of scale, the detention of indigenous and Latinx people on the border would meet the match. In terms of it being discriminatory, the ongoing "War on Drugs" which is really a white supremacist project to harass and detain Black and Latinx men would meet the match. In terms of islamophobia, well it's clearly established that the US both indefinitely detains and murders Muslims everywhere.
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Dec 18, 2019 16:10
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BrutalistMcDonalds posted:https://twitter.com/melissakchan/status/1204032135574765569 lol china willingly chose not to finish the job
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Dec 18, 2019 17:08
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Syria Negotiating Inclusion in China's Belt and Road Initiative - Assad
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Dec 18, 2019 17:56
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Modest Mao posted:Both sides have a lot of interest now in their own narratives and boosting stories that support those narratives, but I would say in this case Xinjiang is pretty hosed up. Iirc there was some Russian expat who did that and wrote an article about it but I can't find it rn
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Dec 18, 2019 19:39
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Please, Mr Premier, I'm tired of being cured of cancer
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Dec 18, 2019 19:53
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StashAugustine posted:Iirc there was some Russian expat who did that and wrote an article about it but I can't find it rn would be cool to read also are the Uighurs being sterilized
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Dec 19, 2019 01:03
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Frijolero posted:"the West has done" is excusatory language. The West is literally doing right now as we speak. I literally wrote "has done / is doing" and I'm referencing arguments I've heard not my opinion GAIN SOME LITERACY Modest Mao posted:the west has done similar or worse, or is doing similar or worse. what the west is doing has no factual baring on what china is doing and the fact that this is the response leveled tells me there's some indefensible poo poo going on Modest Mao has issued a correction as of 02:39 on Dec 19, 2019 |
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Dec 19, 2019 02:37
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barkbell posted:would be cool to read I think China's project is basically to show that state power is absolute and to 'reeducate' the local populace, and to the end of stopping violent attacks I believe the evidence shows it works which is why the CCP is saying "what's the problem?" One thing that I think is less talked about is that Xinjiang is now about 50/50 Uighur ethnic, around 11mil people, and Han see them as minority. Xinjiang is 'autonomous' and the government does have uighur members. Also from this population of 11 million, the imprisoned officially make up 22% of prisoners in a country of 1,386 million. The government has, since the foundation of the CCP, nominally tried to protect minority groups, excluding them from the one child policy (now two child policy) and giving them favor for getting into good schools, etc. A lot of Han will see these camps as a trade off for those favorable policies, "okay now your people have to learn the official language and support our government, after they supported you." I see that a lot in comments on chinese sites about this topic. I think these facts help me understand the narrative better
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Dec 19, 2019 02:47
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Ghost Leviathan posted:i've got basically the worst possible news about mandatory 'language school' programs oy now, i'm 90% certain i've seen credible coverage where the destitute children are housed in government boarding schools Goatse James Bond has issued a correction as of 03:47 on Dec 19, 2019 |
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Dec 19, 2019 03:44
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The problem of the Uyghur population is that unlike the rest of the minority, they are not willing to integrate into the Chinese han directed culture the same way native Indians submit to the whites in America or the Hui in China. They live in their own section of the city (in Southern Xinjiang, I think historically its called the Hexi corridor) and they don't intermix with the Han population. Even if Xi can temporarily surpass the terrorist/secessionist activities, it will show up again a few years down the road. Frankly, I don't see a permanent solution. The Uyghurs don't want to live under the Han rule but geopolitically the Hexi corridor is not something you can box in and close off physically. And I am pretty sure the reeduction camps will be closed under the new leadership because this was 100% Xi's own project. Notice I don't comment on the validity of the camp rumors because I don't have enough information to know. And I don't think you will get a clear picture maybe in 10 years. There is no unbaise party live in Xinjiang. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Dec 19, 2019 05:27
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Wow, it's almost as if annexing a bunch of land containing culturally and ethnically distinct people because you want the resources there could bring some associated problems. If only there were some historical examples that could have warned poor, innocent China about this possibility. And yes, I guess it's hard to be unbiased when you're being rounded up into camps. *turns to fellow prisoner* "You know, if you consider this in the greater geopolitical-" *gets stripped and beaten with rifle butts*
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Dec 19, 2019 05:43
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whatever7 posted:The problem of the Uyghur population is that unlike the rest of the minority, they are not willing to integrate into the Chinese han directed culture the same way native Indians submit to the whites in America or the Hui in China. lol
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Dec 19, 2019 05:55
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Atopian posted:Wow, it's almost as if annexing a bunch of land containing culturally and ethnically distinct people because you want the resources there could bring some associated problems. If only there were some historical examples that could have warned poor, innocent China about this possibility. The original people who lived there were called the Dzungars who got wiped out by the Qing Dynasty in concert with the hui and uighurs who the Dzungars were extorting lavish taxes from. Ironic appeal to history for someone who has no idea about the history of the region. "East Turkestan" was originally a USSR-backed project that the Americans picked up because it's been 20 years since 9/11 and supporting jihad is now cool and good again
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Dec 19, 2019 06:01
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Genocide justifier
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Dec 19, 2019 06:02
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CAPS LOCK BROKEN posted:The original people who lived there were called the Dzungars who got wiped out by the Qing Dynasty in concert with the hui and uighurs who the Dzungars were extorting lavish taxes from. Ironic appeal to history for someone who has no idea about the history of the region. "East Turkestan" was originally a USSR-backed project that the Americans picked up because it's been 20 years since 9/11 and supporting jihad is now cool and good again Dzungaria is only the north part of Xinjiang. The Uyghurs are indigenous to the southern part. Also did you know that the Aztecs were imperialists? And the Africans sold each-other into slavery? Something to consider. Grape has issued a correction as of 06:18 on Dec 19, 2019 |
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Dec 19, 2019 06:16
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Grape posted:
Historically it is China's turn. rip to a real one
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Dec 19, 2019 06:38
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R Guyovich beams in delight from heaven that there are still comrades defending the Uighur Reeducation
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Dec 19, 2019 07:10
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whatever7 posted:
 quote:And I am pretty sure the reeduction camps will be closed under the new leadership because this was 100% Xi's own project. 
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Dec 19, 2019 07:23
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Atopian posted:Wow, it's almost as if annexing a bunch of land containing culturally and ethnically distinct people because you want the resources there could bring some associated problems. If only there were some historical examples that could have warned poor, innocent China about this possibility. If you look at China closely on a map, you see that it resembled a rooster with Taiwan/Hainan being the 2 feet. You can't very well have a rooster after the tail gets cut off.
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Dec 19, 2019 07:25
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