|
Crimson Flower is absolutely the most interesting and unique of the 4 routes, even if you disagree with Edelgard, and you miss out on a lot if you don't play it for yourself.
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 18:42
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 21:28 |
|
|
Cythereal posted:Between my AM game, reading ahead about VW, and watching a LP of CF (since I just can't bring myself to play that route), I think I realized something about Dimitri that I don't think I've seen this thread discuss: They try to execute him almost immediately, he just uses his hulk-like strength and Dedue to warcrime his way to freedom, turbo-ptsd, and more warcrimes
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 18:49
|
|
|
Yeah in every route but the one where he's protected by Rhea and the remaining Knights TWSiD have Cornelia try to execute Dimitri ASAP. While it is true they definitely didn't want Dimitri and Edelgard to team up, the whole "well maybe Dimitri and Edelgard will at least kill each other" thing was just a Plan B after Dimitri slipped the noose. The main problem with TWSiD is that they're really poorly executed on in the game. Their overall goal is more or less coherent, but they way they go about trying to execute it is so loving meandering and senseless. Why they needed Flayn's blood or what if anything it's ultimately used for is never explained. What the hell the point of destroying Remier Village was is never explained. Why Kronya though unleashed four random beasts in a chapel to kill like two randos is never explained. Why does Temple of Doom'ing Kronya's heart allow Solon to summon an evil dark spell that can seal Byleth for eternity except oops not really? Why after centuries of careful manipulation and puppeteering from the shadows is Thales content to just hang around and engage in normal combat in the mission where Dimitri goes to save Claude, which predictably gets him killed? Who the hell are guys hanging around Edelgard's palace in the final AM chapter, and why do they all gently caress off when you kill one guy who we've never seen or heard about before but is treated like he's a big deal? Why at the end of VW is it revealed they just had a backup Nemesis and 10 Elites this whole time? Why sit on such an incredible trump card in the other routes? Also why are they all besides maybe Thales just dipshit Saturday morning cartoon villains who smugly gloat about how evil they are and revel in death and torture? These are supposed to be the technologically advanced genius masterminds who've guided events from the shadows for a millennium to rebuild their strength, integrate with the Empire, and use it to topple the Church. But like 99% of them come off as short-sighted mustache twirlers who couldn't plan their way out of a paper bag. TWSiD are legit the weakest aspect of the entire game. Don't try to analyze them too much because there's nothing there.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 19:34
|
|
|
Twsid being poo poo is why azure moon is the best route
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 19:37
|
|
|
Azure Moon sucks though. Mostly because of Dimitri going through a major mental health crisis where he completely dissociates from reality on the regular for half of it while everyone around him is like 'Yeah, we just gotta put him on the throne and give him unlimited power. This will solve all his issues' and then it does. If Azure Moon was the same but Dimitri went on to live as a normal person and someone else got the throne it would be so, so much better. Let Dedue take over, or Felix or literally anyone but the guy having episodes where dead people (who are figments of his imagination and desires) are telling him to murder all the time. Zore fucked around with this message at 19:46 on Jan 8, 2020 |
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 19:39
|
|
|
The monastery phase of their actions kinda makes sense if you imagine it's them trying to poison the well to make Byleth not team up with Edelgard. ...which only makes them make sense on the Eagles routes but it's something.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 19:43
|
|
|
Zore posted:Azure Moon sucks though. AM is fun because it plays up the "holy" part of the Holy Kingdom and ends in a final battle between God and Satan. Edelgard even unleashes war, death, famine, and plague on Faerghus. But yeah lol that everyone insists on tossing Dimitri back on the throne because well he's the king and it's a kingdom and then Claude immediately gives up and gives the alliance back to the kingdom also
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 19:48
|
|
|
Dimitri is actually cool and good because he becomes a tortured repentant king who vows to live his life making up for his own crimes and throws himself into making amends instantly. He also spends 2 months sane before he gets crowned, during which he displays his part 1 kindness and duty mentality very well. And then he ends the game on the note of 'if I ever lose myself, I have my friends to put a stop to me'.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 20:01
|
|
|
I like dimitri but he's really stupid
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 20:16
|
|
|
Manatee Cannon posted:I like dimitri but he's really stupid He's p dim
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 20:20
|
|
|
KittyEmpress posted:And then he ends the game on the note of 'if I ever lose myself, I have my friends to put a stop to me'. Yeah how'd that work out for him the first time around
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 20:32
|
|
|
Remire has a bunch responsible explanations but since TWSITD never feel like sharing you're just left with presumptions. So: Isolate Edelgard from Byleth. And anyone else. Piss of Byleth and get them running straight into Zaharas. Send a message to Edelgard that they can do this anytime, anywhere if she defies them. Test out whatever the hell it was they were doing there anyway. Incite paranoia by showing anyone you know can suddenly be a secret mole man.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 20:33
|
|
|
Just hit the time skip on my playthrough and man, I love the character designs so much. Except for Ingrid's hair, and I still don't like Hubert, but everything else is great. Edelgard being so happy to see me is nice and makes me feel a bit bad I'm ignoring her to S Rank Dorothea(let me S Rank Petra you cowards!  )
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 20:47
|
|
|
KittyEmpress posted:And then he ends the game on the note of 'if I ever lose myself, I have my friends to put a stop to me'. Those same friends who completely enabled him when he lost himself the first time? lmao.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 21:00
|
|
|
Zore posted:Those same friends who completely enabled him when he lost himself the first time? lmao. Double or nothing I always say
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 21:00
|
|
|
"This time if we feudalism hard enough everybody will be happy!"
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 21:05
|
|
|
McTimmy posted:"This time if we feudalism hard enough everybody will be happy!" On the plus side, they actually DO have the mandate of heaven this time
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 21:06
|
|
|
RBA Starblade posted:On the plus side, they actually DO have the mandate of heaven this time The Yellow Sky will rise!
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 21:08
|
|
|
FrozenPhoenix71 posted:I still don't like Hubert please reconsider
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 21:39
|
|
|
I didn't like Hubert at the start, but by the end he was pretty great.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 21:41
|
|
|
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 21:47
|
|
|
Hubert is loving great. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Inlv-206H2I
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 21:49
|
|
|
Hubert is a wonderful fab, totally extra, goth boy.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 22:10
|
|
|
RBA Starblade posted:On the plus side, they actually DO have the mandate of heaven this time The Azure Sky is dead; the Yellow Sky will soon rise. When the year is Jiazi, there will be prosperity under Heaven.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 22:17
|
|
|
Zore posted:while everyone around him is like 'Yeah, we just gotta put him on the throne and give him unlimited power. This will solve all his issues' Well, except for Felix. And Rodrigue. And Sylvain. And Dimitri's S-rank with the PC admitting that none of his issues have gone away and he's still constantly hallucinating the dead, he's just learned to deal with it. I don't think Dimitri is ever fixed. But you do help him learn to cope and not let his PTSD define him.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 23:28
|
|
|
he's not my favorite but I do appreciate that hubert is basically intsys trying to humanize a mid boss from any other fe game
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 23:28
|
|
|
CF replay update: Managed to have Felix personally kill Rodrigue and Ingrid so that was neat. The dialogues he has with both are kinda weak but whatever. I remember the special dialogue he gets fighting both Dimitri and Sylvain in the next chapter are a lot better, so I'll try to make him go 4/4.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 23:33
|
|
|
Hubert is among the best on CF and I love to hate him on other routes. His morality is entirely Edelgard dependant but he is insanely entertaining. Also the analysis that TWSITD are trying to have Dimitri and Edelard kill each other seems entirely supported by the text, and I've played every route. Even if they intended to have him excecuted, it seems like this was their plan B. Uhhh, what else. We as the audience know that Edelgard is working against TWSITD, but even though yes, she logically couldn't have been responsible for the Tragedy at Duscur, but she is visibly working with them against the Church for crimes the Church has committed that only she knows about, it's not insane for people who possess zeroof her knowledge (and people personally harmed in Duscur) to assume she is willingly collaborating and not be willing to hear her out. That isn't her fault, and is sad. Note: I am pro Edelgard, and I feel the above problems are more problems with shoehorning TWSITD into the game weakening the writing than problems with her. It's definitely a believable tragic flaw that she can't reach out, just like it's a believable tragic flaw that Dmitri can't move past his need for revenge. My only problem with Best Boy Claude is also writing, they shoehorned him in as a main character without having time/energy/willingness to write a story for him on the GD route outside of changing some interstitials, and it weakens the whole route, especially on the second half. GD should absolutely be a route where you can distance yourself from Rhea and the Church, and Claude's story doesn't work because it's about breaking down the borders between Alymra and Fodlan, and you never get to actually GO to Alymra, and they are barely involved. Meanwhile the goal of changing Fodlan's culture is accomplished by Edelgard in all routes via her willingness to start a revolution, so players are left with nothing. I don't buy the idea that Claude has no investment in Fodlan and the Alliance because he has a stake in it due to his heritage, being the source of his ill-treatment in Alymra and if he really was 'treating it as his gap year' he had every opportunity to gently caress off back to Alymra when the war started and refused in every route until he feels the chaos in Fodlan is managable and the immediate danger to the Alliance is passed or can be addressed by whoever Byleth is with. I still say his main problem is his route isn't written for his character, which both Edelgard and Dmitro DO get, and is the reason that he seems like a more interesting character and strategist in other routes\in the first half of his own route. TL;DR Edelgard was right but did do some things wrong (and her route is best), Dmitri's assumptions aren't as insane as they seem, he also did things wrong and was less right, Claude should be able to cut ties with the Church or be in a game where he could actually have the story written with him in mind.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 23:53
|
|
|
Cythereal posted:Well, except for Felix. And Rodrigue. And Sylvain. And Dimitri's S-rank with the PC admitting that none of his issues have gone away and he's still constantly hallucinating the dead, he's just learned to deal with it. Just because they grumble as they march behind him on a suicide mission doesn't mean they aren't appeasing him.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 23:54
|
|
|
Edelgard is Cao Cao. Ultimately the victor, but questionable as a "Hero" even in their most glorious viewing of Three Kingdom media. Dimitri is Lu Bei, a noble figure that in actual history was a scumbag poo poo that pillaged and raided villages while lying his way to the top. Claude is Wu family, who were just kinda there in the ROTK story. Kinda did stuff in the beginning but like, who cares after Lu Bei died.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 23:55
|
|
|
CF is the best route tbh
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 23:58
|
|
|
I'm mostly just salty Claude has so much potential that the game does nothing with on his own route, and that splitting him off into a different game would both improve him and let the Edelgard\Dmitri conflict has space to be a little better written but overall this FE game was super ambitious and nailed it in a way Fates didn't. So it's easy to be more understanding about the flaws due to running out of time to work. Like imagine if instead of shoehorning Claude into the Church route, him in Almyra was a sequel game that engaged the fallout of Fodlan's changes and addressed the changes he wanted to do in Almyra, meanwhile Three Houses got a full 22 chapters for Crimson Flower.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2020 23:59
|
|
|
Hunt11 posted:Just because they grumble as they march behind him on a suicide mission doesn't mean they aren't appeasing him. True. The Blue Lions don't abandon their friends even when things are hard. It's one reason why I don't think I'm ever going to play CF. The Blue Lions are my kids, dammit, and I'm not going to play the route where they're the antagonists.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2020 00:03
|
|
|
they're antagonists in every other route to an extent tbh the antagonism thing is entirely one-sided with dimitri. edelgard barely cares that he exists
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2020 00:04
|
|
|
Cythereal posted:True. The Blue Lions don't abandon their friends even when things are hard. They just abandon everything else.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2020 00:04
|
|
|
Cythereal posted:True. The Blue Lions don't abandon their friends even when things are hard. Recruit them all. Bring them to the winning side.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2020 00:06
|
|
|
CF is by far the best route and you're a coward if you don't play it.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2020 00:07
|
|
|
Plus I'd argue the Blue Lions are more antagonistic on VW than CF.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2020 00:08
|
|
|
People say recruiting everyone defangs the sadness, but have to kill the house leads makes me sad enough that I don't feel that that is true. I just want to save all my idiot students, let me have this. (It is good that there is no way to have a golden route, but I like saving everyone I can).
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2020 00:09
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 21:28 |
|
|
Orcs and Ostriches posted:Recruit them all. Bring them to the winning side. The AM is the winning side, I agree. RevolverDivider posted:CF is by far the best route and you're a coward if you don't play it. Just watching an LP of it makes me feel unclean. I agree with Dimitri's view that war itself is a crime and there is no such thing as a justified or necessary act of killing.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2020 00:09
|
|