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AlexanderCA posted:BAH GAWD, THAT'S DAHIR INSAAT'S MUSIC! lmao i had the same thought
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Jan 9, 2020 05:36
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Captain von Trapp posted:At a certain point, "stuff at F-22ft in the air" includes electrons jiggling around in the sensor electronics that look like stuff at F-22ft in the air. From a detection and tracking standpoint, the universe is filled with tiny flecks of noise flying around and looking like small signal targets. I would think sidelobes are likely a bigger issue. While a radar will transmit and receive most strongly along a certain direction, the radar is still sensitive to signals in directions outside the main beam. Even if you're aiming straight up into the sky, some of that energy will be radiated into ground clutter and picked up through a sidelobe. If you set the sensitivity too high, all you'll see are phantom images from stuff that's not really in the direction that the radar is pointing. 
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Jan 9, 2020 05:39
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AlexanderCA posted:BAH GAWD, THAT'S DAHIR INSAAT'S MUSIC! 
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Jan 9, 2020 05:53
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I believe I read somewhere that Canada had been in negotiations with Iran to buy those F-14's at some point in time. Dunno what happened there.
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Jan 9, 2020 07:34
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Nucken Futz posted:I believe I read somewhere that Canada had been in negotiations with Iran to buy those F-14's at some point in time. Some kind of caper no doubt Linky https://tacairnet.com/2015/02/15/the-cf-14-eh-tomcat/ priznat fucked around with this message at 07:47 on Jan 9, 2020 |
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Jan 9, 2020 07:40
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Nucken Futz posted:I believe I read somewhere that Canada had been in negotiations with Iran to buy those F-14's at some point in time. Ever since those buried spitfires in Thailand fell through, we had to look elsewhere for a hornet replacement.
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Jan 9, 2020 08:11
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Blistex posted:Ever since those buried spitfires in Thailand fell through, we had to look elsewhere for a hornet replacement. 
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Jan 9, 2020 08:59
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NightGyr posted:F135: 40 inches longer, but about the same diameter as the Mig-21 engine? I'm getting stupid ideas again.
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Jan 9, 2020 13:03
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Also, thanks for the radar answers. Not entirely sure I understand it all, but it's close. On a related radar/Cold War question... Are SPAAGS like Gepards and Shilkas supposed to operate on the move (rushing with the tanks or whatever), or would they have to do some sort of... bounding overwatch?
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Jan 9, 2020 13:12
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Shilkas are notorious for shaking themselves to pieces even when parked. I doubt firing on the move would help.
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Jan 9, 2020 17:47
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Iran 'mistakenly shot down Ukraine jet' - US mediaquote:Iran mistakenly shot down the Ukrainian plane that crashed on Wednesday near Tehran with 176 people on board, US media report.
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Jan 9, 2020 18:33
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Could the missiles have been launched by rogue actors or hackers? I know that would be dumb, but this is a dumb timeline.
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Jan 9, 2020 19:19
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Probably just an incredibly nervous local ADA commander.
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Jan 9, 2020 19:25
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That's a really bad fuckup
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Jan 9, 2020 19:26
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Especially since taking out Soleimani wasn't internationally popular, but Iran turning around and taking down a civilian flight that just departed their own airport without even any US citizens on board is a pretty bad look.
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Jan 9, 2020 19:31
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Shilkas were supposed to directly accompany the tanks, they really don't have the range to setup and stand off.
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Jan 9, 2020 19:33
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Smiling Jack posted:This is all completely hypothetical but EW has probably progressed to the point of hitting enemy electronics with loving code injection broadcasts. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Outside_the_Box Israel's been hacking radars for 15 years. Who knows what they're up to these days.
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Jan 9, 2020 19:34
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RandomPauI posted:Could the missiles have been launched by rogue actors or hackers? I know that would be dumb, but this is a dumb timeline. I'm going to say it's unlikely just given the proximity to Tehran. But that's pure speculation, especially given that nobody's taken credit for it.
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Jan 9, 2020 19:40
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It's almost inevitable that this incident is going to be Iran anti air defense accidently targeting a civilian aircraft thinking it could be a US counter attack.
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Jan 9, 2020 19:44
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Question. Can SBIRS/STSS actually detect a launch of a missile as small as the Gauntlet? And if yes, would that information be published so easily (thus revealing the capacity)?
Dante80 fucked around with this message at 19:59 on Jan 9, 2020 |
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Jan 9, 2020 19:46
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Kafouille posted:Shilkas were supposed to directly accompany the tanks, they really don't have the range to setup and stand off. Yeah, the Shilka / Gepard / Sgt York  were supposed to be accompanying armored units. They didn't have very long range for AD units, being gun based.
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Jan 9, 2020 19:55
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Dante80 posted:Question. Can SBIRS actually detect a launch of a missile as small as the Gauntlet? And if yes, would that information be published so easily (thus revealing the capacity)? You don't need SBIRS if you've already got Tehran under heavy satellite / drone / ELINT surveillance.
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Jan 9, 2020 20:00
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NightGyr posted:You don't need SBIRS if you've already got Tehran under heavy satellite / drone / ELINT surveillance. Well yeah, but the Pentagon report talked about catching two missile launches on infra-red. That is SBIRS/STSS, unless we are trying to say that the US had another RQ-4 in the area (pretty slim chance, given what happened six months ago). Dante80 fucked around with this message at 20:13 on Jan 9, 2020 |
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Jan 9, 2020 20:10
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Dante80 posted:Question. Can SBIRS/STSS actually detect a launch of a missile as small as the Gauntlet? And if yes, would that information be published so easily (thus revealing the capacity)? That's the definition of ”anyone who knows won't say, and anyone who says doesn't know."
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Jan 9, 2020 20:24
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Yeah, guess so. It just seemed weird to me, since the Pentagon could have used slightly different language to say the same thing. Without having to hint at certain capabilities.
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Jan 9, 2020 20:29
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aphid_licker posted:That's a really bad fuckup At least we probably won't give the commander a medal this time.
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Jan 9, 2020 20:31
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Dante80 posted:Question. Can SBIRS/STSS actually detect a launch of a missile as small as the Gauntlet? And if yes, would that information be published so easily (thus revealing the capacity)? The US, or people speaking from sources in the US government, claimed that we detected the lunch(es) associated with MH17 by those means.
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Jan 9, 2020 20:36
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Dante80 posted:Yeah, guess so. It just seemed weird to me, since the Pentagon could have used slightly different language to say the same thing. Without having to hint at certain capabilities. I mean you can certainly read the press release as an indirect answer to your question, and it's your judgement to find that credible or not. You likely won't get a hard answer saying "yes they have this capability," you certainly won't get someone saying "here's the limit of detection, which a certain system does/does not fall within."
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Jan 9, 2020 21:16
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Smiling Jack posted:This is all completely hypothetical but EW has probably progressed to the point of hitting enemy electronics with loving code injection broadcasts. Semi-related, I do wonder the degree to which equipment designed for export (like all those Russian AA batteries) also contain backdoors to prevent them from being used against the manufacturing nation.
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Jan 9, 2020 21:17
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Kesper North posted:Semi-related, I do wonder the degree to which equipment designed for export (like all those Russian AA batteries) also contain backdoors to prevent them from being used against the manufacturing nation. I'd speculate that a few of them may have back doors to keep them from being used against the offending nations. https://www.wired.com/2011/10/virus-hits-drone-fleet/
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Jan 9, 2020 21:26
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glynnenstein posted:The US, or people speaking from sources in the US government, claimed that we detected the lunch(es) associated with MH17 by those means. Ah thanks, I didn't know that.
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Jan 9, 2020 21:31
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hypnophant posted:you certainly won't get someone saying "here's the limit of detection, which a certain system does/does not fall within." It doesn't matter at that point since you can extrapolate the lower end by crunching the semi-confirmed capability against a known asset.
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Jan 9, 2020 21:33
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glynnenstein posted:The US, or people speaking from sources in the US government, claimed that we detected the lunch(es) associated with MH17 by those means. That must've been a spicy meal! 
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Jan 9, 2020 21:35
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glynnenstein posted:The US, or people speaking from sources in the US government, claimed that we detected the lunch(es) associated with MH17 by those means. Imagine, right now, in a server deep within Langley, is a database that contains the fact I had Noodles and Co today for lunch because a satellite spotted me leaving there on my way back to work. I'm of course joking. I paid by credit card, so the government knows what I eat basically every day without needing a satellite. Edit: gently caress, just beaten.
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Jan 9, 2020 21:39
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A.o.D. posted:Probably just an incredibly nervous local ADA commander. This. As I recall the President mentioned the number 52 from the embassy, and the Supreme Leader followed up be saying he could remember the number 290 from the airliner shootdown. Which is a fair cop as far as it goes, but I bet we won't hear it again. Side note for this page in general: in a forum like this where there are some people in the know, we should all be a good sport and try not to elicit stuff that shouldn't be elicited.
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Jan 9, 2020 22:53
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At this point, I have to reveal that I am a spy for the Holy See armed forces.
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Jan 9, 2020 22:56
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Dante80 posted:At this point, I have to reveal that I am a spy for the Holy See armed forces. Post pics of your halberd
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Jan 9, 2020 23:06
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meanwhile, in Egypt...  just a pair of Russian-made KA-52s lining up in front of US-made AH-64s on a French Mistral LHD from https://defence-blog.com/news/russian-made-ka-52-and-apache-helicopters-meet-face-to-face-in-egypt.html
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Jan 9, 2020 23:11
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So annoyed Canada didn’t buy those mistrals  Not that we could afford them, crew them, or have aircraft to put on them.
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Jan 9, 2020 23:15
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if only there was strapped-down avenger in the background, i could have had a bingo 
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Jan 9, 2020 23:19
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