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Ariong posted:Re the latest TAZ: I enjoyed it for the most part, but the whole secret society thing was absolutely the most boring part and it was disheartening how much time was spent on it. The “everyone at the school has an ulterior motive and the more trustworthy someone seems, the less you should trust them” angle is much more interesting. Yeah, I feel the same way - the whole 'don't trust anyone' angle really should've come into play much later in the campaign, after a bunch of friendships have been built up with these characters. Otherwise doing it now is basically like saying "see that guy? Don't trust him! That guy too? Don't trust that guy, he's bad." rather than what it should've been, which is "Hey you know Jim, that guy you've known for like a year and a half and had experiences with. Don't trust him." And it's like, gently caress, what about Jim shouldn't I trust? What kind of secret could be so buried that I haven't seen it yet? Do I believe this person, or my good friend Jim?
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Feb 13, 2020 16:37
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Doctor Reynolds posted:Guess they're not doing Youtube uploads anymore. A shame, that was my preferred method. Guess what! It's late, like Graduation ep 7. I hope this is not a trend https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKsQk-YuyOk
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Feb 13, 2020 17:02
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Doctor Reynolds posted:Guess they're not doing Youtube uploads anymore. A shame, that was my preferred method. This week's just went up this morning. TAZ was super late too, so maybe there's just something wrong with their uploading process.
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Feb 13, 2020 18:09
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Happy to be wrong!
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Feb 13, 2020 19:45
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My feelings about Graduation are almost exactly opposite to Amnesty: love the characters but the plot and setting are not really working for me I think this podcast thrives better when they have good characters to play so I am liking it better. Maybe they’ll find the balance in the next arc. Which, loving ironically will not be the one named Balance
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Feb 13, 2020 22:46
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I'm starting to think Balance was just kind of a lightning in a bottle situation.
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Feb 13, 2020 22:55
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Previa_fun posted:I'm starting to think Balance was just kind of a lightning in a bottle situation. I think they could potentially do it again but it's clear that they've let Balance hang over their heads in a way that hampers every other long-form thing they've tried to do since. Actual play podcasts have managed to do new campaign transitions successfully before. Critical Role, Friends at the Table, and Campaign come to mind in that they've all had second "seasons" that were even bigger than the first one. TAZ is extremely hampered by the ghost of Balance haunting the brothers and preventing them from making a clean break whether it be Amnesty insisting on a tone and stakes it had not earned coupled with Griffin leaning into his worst habits as a GM, or Graduation being a desperate-feeling attempt at recapturing Balance's style (down to a poor use of D&D 5e) with lesser results. Blockhouse fucked around with this message at 23:58 on Feb 13, 2020 |
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Feb 13, 2020 23:55
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Maybe they should just run starter box campaigns and draw from a pool of characters. Creativity can thrive when a few restraints/guidelines are in place.
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Feb 14, 2020 01:24
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they should try and recapture the energy of the best thing they ever did, Elementary 1, and just do dumb one shots every week
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Feb 14, 2020 01:25
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Just go back to killing gerblins in caves again. Alternatively check out Not Another DnD Podcast.
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Feb 14, 2020 01:27
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They just need to go slower. Balance was successful cause they let the characters and situations breathe and didn't constantly try to push into bigger dramatic narratives. Some of the solo stuff in balance was good, but it didn't happen until wayyyy into the series when we actually cared about the characters. They need to just start small, let us learn a little bit about the setting, don't feel like they need a million characters right away, and THEN bring in your big dramatic plot.
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Feb 14, 2020 01:38
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Elvis_Maximus posted:They just need to go slower. Balance was successful cause they let the characters and situations breathe and didn't constantly try to push into bigger dramatic narratives. yeah i agree with you, room to breathe is the issue. keep the party together, keep the stakes low, and let them control where the story goes and the Content will come. i probably like this season more than most itt, but it's clear that immediately jumping into Big Conspiracies and long solo sections just doesn't work when we barely know these people
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Feb 14, 2020 01:47
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Things like “successfully pass notes in class without the teacher noticing,” “break into the weird guys hut,” and “frame the rear end in a top hat upperclassman for something” would be much better initial conflicts for this arc, imo.
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Feb 14, 2020 02:54
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Warbird posted:Maybe they should just run starter box campaigns and draw from a pool of characters. Creativity can thrive when a few restraints/guidelines are in place. I think this may be the best idea. I'm not familiar with the pre-written campaigns, how long did Griffin borrow (or just straight up use) pre-written stuff?
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Feb 14, 2020 02:58
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Sudden Loud Noise posted:I think this may be the best idea. The entire first chapter was pre-written. I believe he skipped some however and just did the goblin cave and jizz mine.
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Feb 14, 2020 03:01
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Sudden Loud Noise posted:I think this may be the best idea. Not too long, to be honest. Everything after Magic Brian was original stuff (or at least plots inspired by video games and other non-D&D sources). And even the content leading up to Magic Brian heavily diverged from the D&D starter set.
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Feb 14, 2020 03:04
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George H.W. oval office posted:The entire first chapter was pre-written. I believe he skipped some however and just did the goblin cave and jizz mine. Yeah, the adventure has a bunch of different story hooks going out of Phandalin (spooky mansion! dragon in a tower! marauding orcs!) that are designed to eventually lead the players to the
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Feb 14, 2020 04:25
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wizzardstaff posted:This post made me question how often Much Squad actually happens and whether this thread (including myself) is overreacting to its frequency. So I found a MBMBAM wiki and threw up a quick chart to see how often each segment happens. Being a fan wiki the data is not 100% complete; it doesn't have Play Along At Home or the one episode (or more?) in 2019 with That's A Christmas To Me. But it has enough to demonstrate that Much Squad is a monster that needs to be stopped. This chart is Off To See The Lizard erasure (episode 457, it was a one-off in which Justin talks about different types of weed sold by Jimmy Buffett)
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Feb 14, 2020 05:00
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Toebone posted:Yeah, the adventure has a bunch of different story hooks going out of Phandalin (spooky mansion! dragon in a tower! marauding orcs!) that are designed to eventually lead the players to the IIRC it wasn't wisdom so much as the players doing something unexpected that let them skip all of that. Charming the bugbear I think?
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Feb 14, 2020 05:03
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Organza Quiz posted:IIRC it wasn't wisdom so much as the players doing something unexpected that let them skip all of that. Charming the bugbear I think? Nah, I think by the time they got to the bugbear Griffin had figured out where he wanted the story to go and didn't want to waste time playing out the rest of the scenario. I distinctly remember at one point him saying "yeah, there's a castle and some other things but I'm skipping you ahead to the good stuff." He also cut 90% of the content in the magic jizz cave; in the original it's more of an exploration zone but he made it a straight march to the boss room. (Which I don't disagree with; it made for better radio.)
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Feb 14, 2020 05:53
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wizzardstaff posted:This post made me question how often Much Squad actually happens and whether this thread (including myself) is overreacting to its frequency. So I found a MBMBAM wiki and threw up a quick chart to see how often each segment happens. Being a fan wiki the data is not 100% complete; it doesn't have Play Along At Home or the one episode (or more?) in 2019 with That's A Christmas To Me. But it has enough to demonstrate that Much Squad is a monster that needs to be stopped. My favorite part of this is that Munch Squad, like, doubled after he said it was subsetting
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Feb 14, 2020 06:19
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omg chael crash posted:My favorite part of this is that Munch Squad, like, doubled after he said it was subsetting You might say it...doubled down.
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Feb 14, 2020 06:53
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I just realized with Graduation we’ve had, what, three actual battles? Maybe 4? I wouldn’t mind if the season was less heavy on combat, but it never feels like they roll for anything. Why make a big deal of bringing it back to DnD if it’s 90% just half-improvised conversations and “What does the firbolg eat for lunch?”
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Feb 14, 2020 07:13
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TheArchimage posted:Going through the MBMBAM backlog, in chronological order. I've never wanted Griffin to suffer more than during the terminally unfunny Roscoe the potato man bit in episode 297. Even Travis' Yukon Gold joke couldn't save it. The brothers have made bad bits before, but this is the first one so excruciating I actually got angry about it. (Yes, I skipped the first hundred shows or so, so this does not include the agreed-upon bad stuff in the early episodes) Couple pages back, but what the gently caress roscoe loving rules.
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Feb 14, 2020 07:41
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dirksteadfast posted:I just realized with Graduation we’ve had, what, three actual battles? Maybe 4? I wouldn’t mind if the season was less heavy on combat, but it never feels like they roll for anything. Why make a big deal of bringing it back to DnD if it’s 90% just half-improvised conversations and “What does the firbolg eat for lunch?” As a matter of fact I don't think dice were rolled once last episode. Which is fine, for most roleplaying games, but it really brings that whole "well D&D is just a series of fun improv prompts" Travis was pushing back into question (because it's a wild thing to say coming off of a system which is mechanically like 99% narrative interaction between players and the GM)
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Feb 14, 2020 07:56
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I really think they went back to DnD because they A: wanted to use the set dressing stuff like the races and monsters and B: already bought so much DnD stuff that they might as well use it. I got back into 5e last year, and even though I like it more than most people in this thread, the cost of buying a few core rule-books does make it a little harder to set it aside once you're in it. Like, I spent $100+ on books for a wizard game, I might as well play the hell out of that specific wizard game.
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Feb 14, 2020 09:11
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dirksteadfast posted:I just realized with Graduation we’ve had, what, three actual battles? Maybe 4? I wouldn’t mind if the season was less heavy on combat, but it never feels like they roll for anything. Why make a big deal of bringing it back to DnD if it’s 90% just half-improvised conversations and “What does the firbolg eat for lunch?” Because it'll still be the system they'll be using later when poo poo actually hits the fan? What's the rush?
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Feb 14, 2020 13:56
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Boy I thought Munch Squad was much less frequent at first and then it escalated, but nope, it's just always on. It would be fine if it was used more sparingly. I feel this way about most/all of their bits. Except Haunted Doll Watch. That was funny only once: the first time.
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Feb 14, 2020 19:26
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The TV haunted doll watch was pretty choice, thanks to the animation. e: gently caress it, I'll admit I enjoy regular haunted doll watch too. I admire clearly made up stories that still desperately cling to the thinnest veneer of truth. A lot of supernatural poo poo talked about online, in our own forum's threads even, comes with its own kayfabe that's always kept no matter how implausible the stories get. Sure, tell me about the doll you own that flies and you're willing to sell for fifteen dollars. Not Operator fucked around with this message at 19:36 on Feb 14, 2020 |
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Feb 14, 2020 19:31
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Crowetron posted:I really think they went back to DnD because they A: wanted to use the set dressing stuff like the races and monsters and B: already bought so much DnD stuff that they might as well use it. Ehh but they aren't playing in person and you can get everything free online
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Feb 14, 2020 19:53
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I enjoy listening to Graduation well enough so this isn't a huge deal to me, but aside from the pacing issues others have raised it does seem like Travis has fallen prey a bit to what I imagine is a common temptation for DMs - he was so excited to tell a story that he went nuts, created everything in really tight detail, and didn't leave much room for his players to contribute to the world-building. Part of what I enjoy about playing RPGs myself in the limited amount that I've done it, and what I enjoy from podcasts like Not Another D&D, is the possibility for a complete non-entity NPC to become a beloved character, or for a player to add in a detail to the world that nobody anticipated and becomes a fun plot hook. There's been a bit of that in Graduation, but to me it seems like more often than not Travis is like, ah yes, let me consult my 13 page biography for this character you haven't met until now. I admire the work, but it's a little stifling.
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Feb 14, 2020 21:05
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I honestly think the best thing they could do at this point is stop listening to their fans, just do what they want to do, and then put it out there. If people like it, great. If they don't, well, you tried. I understand the pressure, really. Four people with no real background in roleplaying or collaborative storytelling outside of improv comedy managed to pull off a story that resonated with a lot of people, and they even managed to successfully stick the landing. And what do they get? Hundreds of thousands of people saying "Okay, that was great but now do it again." Every time they try to do something a little different they get a section of those people saying "But not like that." Every time they try to do the exact same thing they get a positive, if diminished reaction but can feel themselves running out of steam. When you're trying to create something in an environment like that the only thing for it is to just do it and whatever happens happens.
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Feb 14, 2020 22:03
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I'm sure "just do whatever and see what happens" is pretty terrifying advice when TAZ is easily their biggest show and podcasting is their primary income. A recent Tips at the Table had Austin talking about how their show is always going to be smaller because they're making the show they want to make and not the show that would get them the biggest possible audience, and that's an easier decision to make when everybody has a career not related to the podcast.
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Feb 14, 2020 22:47
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Giodo! posted:I enjoy listening to Graduation well enough so this isn't a huge deal to me, but aside from the pacing issues others have raised it does seem like Travis has fallen prey a bit to what I imagine is a common temptation for DMs - he was so excited to tell a story that he went nuts, created everything in really tight detail, and didn't leave much room for his players to contribute to the world-building. Part of what I enjoy about playing RPGs myself in the limited amount that I've done it, and what I enjoy from podcasts like Not Another D&D, is the possibility for a complete non-entity NPC to become a beloved character, or for a player to add in a detail to the world that nobody anticipated and becomes a fun plot hook. didnt Travis bring like 6 pages of character backstory to like the first TAZ? I'd be surprised if there wasn't a novel written about Rattles's tragic backstory by now
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Feb 14, 2020 23:38
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Travis had played with his character before, so it was all established. the justin and clint were playing for the first time I think.
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Feb 14, 2020 23:53
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Tears In A Vial posted:Travis had played with his character before, so it was all established. the justin and clint were playing for the first time I think. Was it? I missed that part, I just remember Griffin ragging on him for it and trying to skip past it as fast as possible
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Feb 14, 2020 23:55
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ImPureAwesome posted:didnt Travis bring like 6 pages of character backstory to like the first TAZ? I'd be surprised if there wasn't a novel written about Rattles's tragic backstory by now He did, and Griffin basically ignored it and he was right to do so. It's part of why the live show one-shots are excellent, and reminiscent of the way they originally made their characters for TAZ. Basically reverse the arrows on that old sitcom character image and you've got all three of em from Balance (maybe Magnus starts at stage 2).  The way they're doing TAZ now, it's basically impossible for them to organically produce a Jizz Cave or a town full of Tom Bodetts. It won't happen, because they're trying too hard.
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Feb 14, 2020 23:56
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Despite my criticism earlier in the thread though, graduation has been way better so far than amnesty was in my opinion. At least they're making jokes again, and there have legitimately been some funny bits that had me actually laugh out loud.
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Feb 15, 2020 00:59
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Does that TAZ holiday brawl episode have an official letter (Amnesty, Balance, Commitment, Dust, etc)? and just checking, we're still waiting on Just Us, right?
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Feb 15, 2020 01:13
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPUmHeuRLws&t=9s
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Feb 15, 2020 04:49
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