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IOwnCalculus posted:Can't call it a renovated bathroom if it's already been defiled. Yeah, now you're obligated to disclose that poo poo. Drives the price down.
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Feb 11, 2020 21:09
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zynga dot com posted:I hadn't considered this part, actually - appreciate the heads up. For the future, anyway, because we didn't get it - the house got 37 loving offers. We don't know the final price yet but we have to assume $100k+ over list. We finally saw what this property closed for, so just adding a data point for the thread: $170k over list. For anyone in a hot market, are you seeing this right now? There's no way the appraisal supports that price, so this is probably $100k+ in cash above the downpayment just to close.
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Feb 11, 2020 23:33
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zynga dot com posted:We finally saw what this property closed for, so just adding a data point for the thread: $170k over list. For anyone in a hot market, are you seeing this right now? There's no way the appraisal supports that price, so this is probably $100k+ in cash above the downpayment just to close. What was that as a % of what it's "worth"/asking and was asking intentionally low compared to comps?
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Feb 11, 2020 23:47
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zynga dot com posted:We finally saw what this property closed for, so just adding a data point for the thread: $170k over list. For anyone in a hot market, are you seeing this right now? There's no way the appraisal supports that price, so this is probably $100k+ in cash above the downpayment just to close. A house on the same block as me listed for 140K lower than what I paid and sold for about 30K less than what I got mine for. The rub is that it was a way shittier house and the guy selling it listed the property so low on purpose to start a bidding war. He still didn't make out all that well and I pity anyone that had to deal with him.
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Feb 11, 2020 23:51
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H110Hawk posted:What was that as a % of what it's "worth"/asking and was asking intentionally low compared to comps? The asking was $799k and ended up closing at $969k. Based on the market, the original price is definitely underpriced for the location, since it's between two major Metro stations and a 10 min walk to the neighborhood center. I don't know if appraisals track the market like that, but let's say the buyers get an unlikely $900k appraisal - that's still insane and $70k out of pocket to close. The reality is, of course, is that the seller's agent absolutely knew that it was underpriced and positioned the property the entire time to generate a bidding war, knowing that every one else knew it too and had to bid anyway because the location was too good. Comps are tough in that neighborhood but I think future sellers are going to be pleased.
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Feb 11, 2020 23:59
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zynga dot com posted:For anyone in a hot market, are you seeing this right now? You must be in a warm climate. Near me, houses going on the market is as dead as I've seen it in a few years. That, however, doesn't mean there isn't demand. I fully expect that when the last wiffs of Winter are gone (early March), it's going to be a rush. Even since last year, the economy has been going absolute gangbusters. They're still handing out mortgages with historically low interest rates to anyone with a pulse.
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Feb 12, 2020 01:43
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Andy Dufresne posted:I don't know your life situation but while all of the things on your spreadsheet matter I think they matter a lot less than macro-level stuff you aren't tracking. Also, a lot of the things you're looking at can be changed by you either quickly or over the course of 5-10 years of general upkeep. I'm looking in the DFW suburbs which is sprawling with lots of different school districts and homes of various ages. I've got a young son and expect another child at some point and I'm looking for a permanent rather than transition home. With that said, here are my criteria: Don’t waste time on top 5% schools, that does almost nothing. Just avoid really *bad* schools. Parental involvement is way way way way more strongly correlated to success than school quality. Terrible schools can indeed be sinkholes though.
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Feb 12, 2020 03:57
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Academician Nomad posted:Don’t waste time on top 5% schools, that does almost nothing. Just avoid really *bad* schools. Parental involvement is way way way way more strongly correlated to success than school quality. Terrible schools can indeed be sinkholes though. I moved around a lot as a kid. Good schools are really good. It would be on my wishlist too if I had kids.
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Feb 12, 2020 04:28
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zynga dot com posted:The asking was $799k and ended up closing at $969k. Based on the market, the original price is definitely underpriced for the location, since it's between two major Metro stations and a 10 min walk to the neighborhood center. I don't know if appraisals track the market like that, but let's say the buyers get an unlikely $900k appraisal - that's still insane and $70k out of pocket to close. Are you in the bay area by any chance We basically take list price, add $25k for every serious buyer/disclosure Comes out to be $125k over typically. First offer went for $110k over list, second offer went for $130k over list, third offer apparently we didn't bid high enough, was not included in the bidding process, went for $140k over list We found another property, expecting this one to go $175k over list If the property is not a lovely one, in a good neighborhood, good light, decent views low total cost of ownership... You will have multiple bidders, agent absolutely is going to work it to get top dollar We've decided to not let emotions get in the middle of it, set an upper limit, and just keep looking for properties, and bid as they come along. While we're waiting for one to go up for bid, typically we're investigating one serious property as a fall back, wash rinse, repeat
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Feb 12, 2020 06:57
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zynga dot com posted:We finally saw what this property closed for, so just adding a data point for the thread: $170k over list. For anyone in a hot market, are you seeing this right now? There's no way the appraisal supports that price, so this is probably $100k+ in cash above the downpayment just to close. Jokes on you. An appraisal most of the time is based on whatever the offer was made on the house.
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Feb 12, 2020 08:42
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zynga dot com posted:The asking was $799k and ended up closing at $969k. Based on the market, the original price is definitely underpriced for the location, since it's between two major Metro stations and a 10 min walk to the neighborhood center. I don't know if appraisals track the market like that, but let's say the buyers get an unlikely $900k appraisal - that's still insane and $70k out of pocket to close. Yeah that just sounds like strategic pricing in action
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Feb 12, 2020 08:54
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El Mero Mero posted:Yeah that just sounds like strategic pricing in action What better indication of the value of a thing is there than how much someone is willing to pay for that exact thing right now? I'm pretty sure appraisals are only there to protect the bank from obvious scams like someone selling a single wide for a million dollars and skilling the country with the "sellers" unless we're talking about cookie cutter houses in a development in a relatively stable market.
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Feb 12, 2020 15:28
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LLSix posted:I moved around a lot as a kid. Good schools are really good. It would be on my wishlist too if I had kids. Okay, but it's also not going to give the kids any significant advantage in life, and given that "good" school in America often is code for "rich" and "white" school (both because of actual segregation and because rich/white people buy their way into "good" school districts) you're potentially undercutting your kid's social development in terms of exposure to diverse types of people. In more practical terms, you're more likely to 1) earn more money over your lifetime, and 2) get into a top college by being the best kid in a mediocre school than then 20th best in an elite prep school, assuming equal parental involvement / educational background / income. True also for college if you're a white guy, though if you're not then an elite college name can for sure open doors with people who would discount you otherwise. Overall we obsess about school quality and teacher quality but those are rounding errors in student achievement and life outcomes compared (correlationally, not necessarily causally) to parental educational involvement and parental wealth.
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Feb 12, 2020 15:39
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Academician Nomad posted:Okay, but it's also not going to give the kids any significant advantage in life, and given that "good" school in America often is code for "rich" and "white" school (both because of actual segregation and because rich/white people buy their way into "good" school districts) you're potentially undercutting your kid's social development in terms of exposure to diverse types of people. Don't worry, I will try my best to be extremely involved and wealthy while also putting him in the best public school I can. For what it's worth the schools in this area are also very popular with Indian and Chinese families, but there's not a lot of Hispanic or black students. At least one of the top elementary schools is 65% Indian. Also I forgot to update from my offer last week, but we were 6th of 22 offers. We're not in a hot market at all right now, that war was just a result of the seller's agent being oblivious on pricing. My agent was too, since all of the comps were pretty similar to listing price but the problem was they weren't actually comparable houses. She was sure our bid of 455 against a 439 list with 2 months of leaseback was overbidding, but I would have gone as high as 480.
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Feb 12, 2020 16:22
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Motronic posted:What better indication of the value of a thing is there than how much someone is willing to pay for that exact thing right now? I'm pretty sure appraisals are only there to protect the bank from obvious scams like someone selling a single wide for a million dollars and skilling the country with the "sellers" unless we're talking about cookie cutter houses in a development in a relatively stable market. Well, simply going off of what someone is willing to pay isn't enough because everyone agrees that scams, chumps, idiots, overeager buyers, emotional bidders in a bidding war, and people with too much money to care about costs all exist. There needs to be some semi-independent mechanism for valuation. Appraisals do work, but really just for the big scams category like you said. I mean comps still kinda work. That was the only reliable indicator I could cling to when in the market.
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Feb 12, 2020 16:57
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Yeah as much as it SHOULD be the case, there's so many other things to consider other than the sale price. Mainly, there a bunch of intangibles like closing date, earnest money, cash vs. mortgage buyer, etc. that are hard or impossible to put a dollar value on. And really, in a bidding war, the real value is somewhere between the highest and 2nd highest bid (assuming we're talking about sale price alone). You could probably even say it's only worth $0.01 more than the 2nd highest bid.
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Feb 12, 2020 17:17
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El Mero Mero posted:Well, simply going off of what someone is willing to pay isn't enough because everyone agrees that scams, chumps, idiots, overeager buyers, emotional bidders in a bidding war, and people with too much money to care about costs all exist. There needs to be some semi-independent mechanism for valuation. Appraisals do work, but really just for the big scams category like you said. It's also wildly variable by market/bank. We've had people in here talking about an appraiser spending hours in their house with a tape measure. Mine never got out of the car. "Comps look like the price per sq. ft. is in line, house exists, ship the report. Done."
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Feb 12, 2020 17:30
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Andy Dufresne posted:Don't worry, I will try my best to be extremely involved and wealthy while also putting him in the best public school I can. For what it's worth the schools in this area are also very popular with Indian and Chinese families, but there's not a lot of Hispanic or black students. At least one of the top elementary schools is 65% Indian. Andy Dufresne posted:Also I forgot to update from my offer last week, but we were 6th of 22 offers. We're not in a hot market at all right now, that war was just a result of the seller's agent being oblivious on pricing. My agent was too, since all of the comps were pretty similar to listing price but the problem was they weren't actually comparable houses. She was sure our bid of 455 against a 439 list with 2 months of leaseback was overbidding, but I would have gone as high as 480.
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Feb 12, 2020 17:58
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Hadlock posted:Are you in the bay area by any chance DC area, but otherwise we're experiencing exactly what you are. We're 0 for 4 so far, with everything going for above to significantly above list and contingencies waived.
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Feb 12, 2020 20:07
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Andy Dufresne posted:Don't worry, I will try my best to be extremely involved and wealthy while also putting him in the best public school I can. For what it's worth the schools in this area are also very popular with Indian and Chinese families, but there's not a lot of Hispanic or black students. At least one of the top elementary schools is 65% Indian. Okay, just for the sake of the country (and your kid) please find ways to socialize your kids so that they personally know black and Hispanic kids as they grow up in Texas of all places. Otherwise bad for children, bad for the country. https://www.keranews.org/post/continuing-impact-school-segregation-texas https://www.tpr.org/post/segregation-still-exists-texas-schools And desegregation resulted in substantial improvements in educational attainment overall with no downside for white students before we collectively gave up in the face of hysterical white flight and anti-bussing zealotry, so don't listen to anyone hand-wringing about you "sacrificing" your kid in any way. https://www.nber.org/digest/may11/w16664.html As a white guy who went to good public schools but in a de facto segregated area, I would have been a lot less of a turd the first year in college if I'd had a broader exposure to the world before then. Don't get me wrong, I'm not sending my kids to a crappy school either, but if you find a great house in a neighborhood with a decent, integrated school district your kid will have every opportunity and also dodge rich kid, pressure-cooker, and segregated culture. On other topics, house hunting sucks. We almost put in a bid last week but it would have required basically all our non-retirement investments and all our non-emergency cash, and that's a crappy place to be. Now we have to watch this really awesome, rare place go away in the name of responsibility. Also the agent wanted us to pay for a quickie-inspection before bidding so we could waive that, but that's like a $600 bet that I have a near-best bid, which seems nuts to me. Academician Nomad fucked around with this message at 21:06 on Feb 12, 2020 |
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Feb 12, 2020 21:04
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zynga dot com posted:DC area, but otherwise we're experiencing exactly what you are. We're 0 for 4 so far, with everything going for above to significantly above list and contingencies waived. Apparently some lenders offer a "qualified home buyer" credential that allows to waive contingencies, worth looking into
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Feb 12, 2020 21:13
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I'm so happy I didn't have to consider schools when buying a house. If you have a kid, throw them away.
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Feb 13, 2020 06:21
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Inzombiac posted:I'm so happy I didn't have to consider schools when buying a house. Yeah it sucks. Homes in “good” school areas cost around 20% more in my area. Granted most districts are good if you live in the deep burbs but since we’re committed to true suburbs (areas that are a mix of housing and shopping) it’s tricky and expensive.
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Feb 13, 2020 15:21
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Inzombiac posted:I'm so happy I didn't have to consider schools when buying a house. Problem is, most people buying houses (of a certain size) have, or are looking to have, children. So, buying a house in a poo poo district will affect your ability to sell it later. It's like buying a house with a high-tension power line running overhead: you'll get a discount, but when you go to sell, you'll eat a similar discount, and it will likely take longer to sell.
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Feb 13, 2020 16:59
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Our realtor told us that its relatively cheap and easy to have dampers installed near the HVAC trunk to help keep the temperatures between multiple floors in a house the same. Anyone have experience with that or other solutions? Our current rental is two stories and there's at least a 5 degree difference between floors most days. Enough to be noticeable when going up/down the stairs and we would prefer that not be an issue in the new place.
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Feb 13, 2020 23:10
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LLSix posted:Our realtor told us that its relatively cheap and easy to have dampers installed near the HVAC trunk lol Don't listen to someone who's best interest is waving away problems in order to get you to buy. This goes for both the seller and buyer agents. No, it's not relatively cheap unless you have an exceptionally lucky situation. First of all, you need a several hundred dollar zone controller. You attach the furnace to that, which looks like a thermostat to the furnace. You then attach your existing, probably downstairs thermostat to one "zone" of it, and then..........you hope you can get wires upstairs or buy a $600+ wireless thermostat for upstairs. And that was the easy part. Now you need to hope that you have a clear and easily accessible trunk that goes upstairs and upstairs only (or wherever the problem is) as well as one that feeds the res of the place. Now depending on size we get into the cost of the dampers you need to install in each of those. Add drywall repair if they aren't immediately accessible. You also need to hope you have sufficient returns and/or correctly placed ones to make all of this effective. None of this is trivial in most cases. It's not at all cheap nor easy in the bulk of situations. And then you find out that you simply don't have enough unit capacity for cooling upstairs even if you send it all up there......... If any of this were cheap and/or easy it would have ALREADY BEEN DONE. Motronic fucked around with this message at 00:10 on Feb 14, 2020 |
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Feb 14, 2020 00:08
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Forget about that “correct” foo fah. Because of the phrase “near the HVAC trunk” I think the person might be talking about something I’ve seen a few times lately — when you have two (or three) main feeds coming off a unit with flexible ducting, you basically cinch a belt around one of the ducts. I’ve heard one person say it worked to rebalance temperature, and four or five that say it didn’t do jack.
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Feb 14, 2020 00:35
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There are a lot of variables to that question, like what type of heat is it, and is the main trunk in an easily accessible area like an unfinished basement. Best case scenario, your trunk runs in the basement, it is all metal ductwork, it has obvious branches, and it is an oil or gas furnace that isn't picky about static pressure. Even still, it will be a challenge to get it perfect. Most houses have at least a few degree difference between up/down and possibly closer/farther from the furnace, which is why many larger homes have 2+ units split into zones.
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Feb 14, 2020 01:52
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LLSix posted:Our realtor told us that its relatively cheap and easy to have dampers installed near the HVAC trunk to help keep the temperatures between multiple floors in a house the same. Anyone have experience with that or other solutions? Ya it's relatively cheap and probably legally requires a permit, so it's a minimum of $5000 in the bay area and more like $9000.
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Feb 14, 2020 04:59
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Just found this thread so I thought I'd throw my 2 cents in. My wife and I bought our first house in September of 2018 without using a buyer's agent. I lived in the area for 5 years beforehand and my wife is from the area, so we knew which neighborhoods to look for and which to avoid. I was also happy to find all the listing myself on Zillow and, eventually, Redfin. If you can do these things, I feel like using a buyer's agent is still massively over-valued, provided you can negotiate worth a drat. We ended up getting the house for 15k under asking (asking matched the Zestimate FWIW) and the seller's agent, acting as a dual agent, reduced their commission by 2k to induce the deal. Granted this was in the Midwest, but it is still primarily a seller's market. We also got a 3k credit from the sellers as a result of the inspection. I doubt even the most savvy agent could have done better, honestly. We are also in the process of refinancing through better mortgage which I highly recommend. If you have an american express card they will give you a statement credit for $2500 if you apply through the amex link. I had them match the lowest rate/fee I could find online so I'm going from 4.5% to 3.375% with about $700 in closing costs (not counting the $2500 credit). Looking back I got taken for a pretty big ride on my first loan costs. Live and learn. Hope this can help some of you guys and gals.
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Feb 14, 2020 21:35
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I'm finding it hard to commit to buying what would be my first home on my own. I'm currently renting a shared 2BR1BA with 1 roommate and pay ~$700/mo for my half. I'd like to live without a roommate and build equity. However, from doing the basic calculations, I estimate I'd spend $75-100K more over 10 years, assuming I sold the house after 10 years, versus renting over that time. My estimate is derived heavily from the NYT buy vs rent calc which includes an optimistic 3%/year home appreciation rate. Right now I'm trying to convince myself if the non-economic benefits of buying would be worth $75-100K over 10 years. If the answer is yes, buying would be pretty clear, but it's a hard question for me personally. Were any of you single income buyers? How did you come to make the decision? Inner Light fucked around with this message at 22:31 on Feb 14, 2020 |
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Feb 14, 2020 22:23
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I'm looking at the NY calculator and trying to figure out at what point renting makes less sense than buying. I set the calculator to say this: which is roughly what my apartments have been monthly so far. Does that mean this is the equivalent home price I'm paying for infinitely, and that's the price of the house I might as well have bought?  I'm trying to wrap my head around how all this poo poo works, and it's not really sticking so far.
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Feb 14, 2020 23:12
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Inner Light posted:I'm finding it hard to commit to buying what would be my first home on my own. I'm currently renting a shared 2BR1BA with 1 roommate and pay ~$700/mo for my half. That is the value you're placing on living alone, more or less.
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Feb 14, 2020 23:21
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Inner Light posted:I'm finding it hard to commit to buying what would be my first home on my own. I'm currently renting a shared 2BR1BA with 1 roommate and pay ~$700/mo for my half. A roommate/renter would bring in 84k over 10 years assuming the same rent you're currently paying. Looks like the main cost here is wanting to live alone. I guess it depends on how much value you place on that. I'm not familiar with that calc, but remember that as a home owner you're accepting a lot of risk and will be paying for repairs and upgrades.
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Feb 14, 2020 23:28
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Good thoughts so far. Here's the NYT calculator: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/upshot/buy-rent-calculator.htmlH110Hawk posted:That is the value you're placing on living alone, more or less. LLSix posted:A roommate/renter would bring in 84k over 10 years assuming the same rent you're currently paying. Looks like the main cost here is wanting to live alone. I guess it depends on how much value you place on that. Yes, both of you are right for sure. Trying to decide if it's worth it... leaning towards yes. Pollyanna posted:I'm looking at the NY calculator and trying to figure out at what point renting makes less sense than buying. I set the calculator to say this: The rent vs buy decision has been complicated for me, and there are a number of ways to use the calculator. What I did: 1. Set the 'staying for this long' slider to 10 years 2. Set the home price to a reasonably priced home I would be interested in buying, in an area I like. For me this was around $400K. Then, look at the total 'buy' costs on the right. 3. Move the home price to get a "lower than this rent" that is equal to my current rent. Now, look at the total 'rent' costs on the right. 4. Compare the two totals. The difference for my situation is roughly $80-100K. Does that make sense or is it cockamamy? Inner Light fucked around with this message at 23:41 on Feb 14, 2020 |
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Feb 14, 2020 23:37
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Inner Light posted:The rent vs buy decision has been complicated for me, and there are a number of ways to use the calculator. What I did: I think so? That's basically what I'm doing. But I don't think that's actually correct. Most apartments around my area are 2k~2.2k per month to rent. According to NYT, that is equivalent to a 15-year mortgage on a $710,000 house. That sounds wildly incorrect to me: $2200 / month * 12 months/year * 15 years = $396,000. Not even slightly close to $710k.
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Feb 14, 2020 23:42
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Pollyanna posted:I think so? That's basically what I'm doing. But I don't think that's actually correct. Personally, I'm not seeing where it's wildly incorrect unless you can explain more? It's possible I'm misunderstanding. Keep in mind the totals on the right are talking about total costs after 10 years, assuming you sold the house. Opportunity costs are about $100K greater in your example with the buy option vs. renting due to the differences in appreciation of home prices vs. equities. Basically it's asserting that you could buy a house UP TO $700ish K without spending more over 10 years, dependent of course on a butt ton of factors. 
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Feb 14, 2020 23:52
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Pollyanna posted:I think so? That's basically what I'm doing. But I don't think that's actually correct. The financial difference is, at the end of 15 years you end up owning a whole house. Compared to renting where you own nothing.
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Feb 15, 2020 00:32
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esquilax posted:The financial difference is, at the end of 15 years you end up owning a whole house. Compared to renting where you own nothing. This in a nutshell. Home ownership is key to our plan of retiring on time/early.
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Feb 15, 2020 00:57
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But my goal isn't to use the house as a financial vehicle or investment, it's to have a place to live in where I don't have to worry about constantly paying rent and not having to depend on dipshits to make repairs or let me keep just one cat. I've heard all sorts of horror stories about people using houses as a way to make money and then getting beefed circa 2008 (e.g. my parents, to an extent). If I'm just trying to live, am I opening myself up to that same bullshit?
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Feb 15, 2020 02:06
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