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Specifically because if, let's say, RLB does that, it makes the membership like her, and she wins it, the headline is going to be "Only candidate to tell jewish labour members to eat poo poo has won the leadership, extending corbyn's hitlerian policies" which is probably not great for the party.
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Feb 15, 2020 23:07
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So what happens if we go all out with renew trident, nuke palestine?
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Feb 15, 2020 23:09
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just seems a bit weird to say that we're not prepared to throw trans and marginalised people under the bus for some vague notion of electability but we're ok with throwing Palestinians right under.
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Feb 15, 2020 23:12
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I guess the difference is that the UK has legal jurisdiction over people who live here but none over israel or palestine. The labour party's official position has always been two state and that's what bailey advocated for, but even with a labour government that's not really meaningful, the UK can't do anything about it.
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Feb 15, 2020 23:14
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thespaceinvader posted:I'm so pleased Good Omens turned out to be... you know, good. A big part of this was Neil Gaiman's dogged refusal to compromise to the TV execs. As he put it, after Terry got alzheimers: Neil Gaiman posted:"[Terry said] 'you have to make it, because you're the only other person who has the same passion for and understanding for Good Omens I do, and I want to watch it,'" Gaiman explained. "I said OK, and then he died, which suddenly turned it into a last request." And he decided that as it was a last request he didn't really have any option but to make it exactly how Terry would have wanted it to be. Also, the reason Sabine is called that in Germany is that someone sponsored the storm. Germany has an Adopt a vortex scheme were any individual (not a company) can have a storm named after them, as long as it follows the alphabetical order & the male/female alternating conventions. The money is used to train metrologicial students.
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Feb 15, 2020 23:16
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forkboy84 posted:Wait, what's insensitive about saying "Person killed themselves" when that's what happened? there are ways to convey that information that a) give some sort of warning and don't just leap into the subject - considering that it's a subject that some people ITT may easily find traumatic and b) doesn't condense the entire situation into 4 loving words as if that's all it deserves (I believe "died by suicide" is the general best practice phrasing btw)
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Feb 15, 2020 23:36
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OwlFancier posted:I guess the difference is that the UK has legal jurisdiction over people who live here but none over israel or palestine. The problem is "two state solution" is meaningless at this point. Kushner's recent bullshit solution was technically a two state solution even though it's basically creating Bantustans. We need to demand a much more clear statement than just "I support a two state solution", it's mealy-mouthed. If it doesn't include the right of return it's meaningless. If it doesn't include Palestine being allowed to police its own borders then it's hardly a state. Ditto controlling its own airspace, its own seas, and so on, so forth. It's one of these things where we really need to demand more of our politicians.
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Feb 15, 2020 23:36
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forkboy84 posted:The problem is "two state solution" is meaningless at this point. Kushner's recent bullshit solution was technically a two state solution even though it's basically creating Bantustans. We need to demand a much more clear statement than just "I support a two state solution", it's mealy-mouthed. If it doesn't include the right of return it's meaningless. If it doesn't include Palestine being allowed to police its own borders then it's hardly a state. Ditto controlling its own airspace, its own seas, and so on, so forth. Sure in theory but again, what's britain going to do about any of that? It's as meaningful as asking the labour party to have a detailed plan to fix the water supply in michigan. I care about the rights of palestinians and jews in the UK, because that's really the only thing we can have control over, the UK can't and shouldn't go around being the world's cops, not least because we're historically poo poo at it even if the entire concept wasn't lovely to begin with. Like I believe in government by consent and I have enough issues with how that works in the UK to even begin starting with the UK messing about in places it doesn't belong and doesn't have the ability to solve problems in even if it did.
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Feb 15, 2020 23:40
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thespaceinvader posted:I'm so pleased Good Omens turned out to be... you know, good. eeeeeehhhh the first half was pretty good but it fell off quite steeply in the second IMO
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Feb 15, 2020 23:49
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I think we have an urgent need to use whatever peaceful means possible to try and help create a lasting peace in I/P. But as Owly says our ability as a country to do so is pretty limited; maybe if the Americans were entirely uninvolved we'd be able to take the lead or at least help a group effort to get something done, but as it stands even a thumping Corbyn government would be severely hamstrung on the matter. That said, yes it is deeply disappointing that Labour's prospective leaders are taking this path and I would prefer a united front saying "Corbyn made a sincere effort to root out antisemitism and we've made significant progress, and the media is chatting poo poo on the topic because they found it an effective attack line on a prospective PM they were terrified would hold them to account" but... idk, I think the danger here is that it becomes an eternal cudgel, I'm not sure that it represents a sincere betrayal of Palestinians. Then again, I recognize that I wouldn't be too happy if they were all going "Yeah we have to worry about mumsnet's opinions on trans people" even if I didn't think it was going to amount to anything beyond that.
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Feb 16, 2020 00:04
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Braved the stormy weather to attend the LSW Conference. (Did anyone else in this thread attend?) Never been to one before so went with some caution. Was happy to see a few I canvassed with around. It started out pretty gloomy with some harsh statistics on Labour's election performance, pretty much highlighting there's a huge amount of work to be done to get the swing necessary for a Labour victory next election. Then a bit of discussion on what can be done further to open the dialogue over the next few years. Also heard the Jam man talk in person. He's pretty cool, you know. I particularly liked one line he said concerning the media's coverage of the Labour campaign, about how he read the Daily Mail's election day writeup of him, two weeks after the result, and then said to himself in tongue-in-cheek fashion, "I'm not sure about this Corbyn fellow." Managed to snap a cheeky selfie with him afterwards, too!
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Feb 16, 2020 00:05
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I would also prefer there be a united front on that but unfortunately that would necessitate booting out three of the candidates, apparently half of the remaining MPs, and a bunch of members. You can't create unity where a chunk of people don't want there to be any. Which we may end up doing anyway if RLB wins but it may require a better pretext than just being fans of the JLM because unfortunately that's a pretty mainstream belief. And I don't know that it's worth the faff for what is, ultimately, an entirely symbolic gesture? If labour goes off the rails on something that they actually have control of then I object, yeah, but it literally helps nobody if labour self destructs over this, it's not even theoretically in support of anything. It may end up being an element in the likely coming party civil war, but that will start for practical reasons concerning the labour right's conduct within the party and their effect on its ability to function as one. And having good, practical reasons for starting it is going to be important if we're going to win it. They need to be perceived, if only within the party, as the problem. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Feb 16, 2020 |
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Feb 16, 2020 00:07
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Thanks to whoever gave me my Av back! Love you all lots, keep safe.
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Feb 16, 2020 00:27
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This is a thread, and there's lots more wild poo poo in there: https://twitter.com/ianbirrell/status/1228809833434042369?s=21
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Feb 16, 2020 02:49
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Darth Walrus posted:This is a thread, and there's lots more wild poo poo in there: Roddenberry, more like Rodstradamus. We're going to have a Eugenics Wars aren't we? Khan Cummingsan Singh, the first genetically designed superhuman
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Feb 16, 2020 02:58
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We already did, that's what world war 2 was about. It did not involve superhumans because eugenics is bunk.
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Feb 16, 2020 02:58
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Bunk indeed. Academic achievement is environment environment environment. Sure there's some selection for aptitude, but expose kids to the right resources and encouragement and they loving thrive regardless of cash or genes. We're programmed to grow and learn it's how we got atop the food chain. Buuut cash comes into the equation so welp.
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Feb 16, 2020 03:03
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Someone can and probably has written at length about the liberal technocratic obsession with quantification and its intersection with ideas like eugenics, and its relation to the race science of previous centuries.
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Feb 16, 2020 03:04
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It's coded "rich white people seem to succeed so that's what should be allowed to breed" Star Trek was actually optimistic, this time it's just royal inbreeding, but for politics
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Feb 16, 2020 03:07
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How about we introduce controls on breeding to select against dumb poo poo like believing in loving eugenics
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Feb 16, 2020 03:17
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In a weird coincidence i started listening to this video before I read the thread: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBc7qBS1Ujo
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Feb 16, 2020 03:32
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if eugenics doesn't work how come animal husbandry, check and mate non-fascists 
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Feb 16, 2020 03:47
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Quite possibly for the same reason, you leave a bunch of weird horse fuckers alone for long enough and they start thinking they're on to something.
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Feb 16, 2020 03:49
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So ‘misfits and weirdos’ was absolutely a code word for Nazis. This is going to get bad.
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Feb 16, 2020 03:58
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I mean the belief in eugenics and race science isn't just a nazi thing, it's a pretty standard conservative thing and increasingly a middle of the road liberal thing too.
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Feb 16, 2020 03:59
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forkboy84 posted:The problem is "two state solution" is meaningless at this point. Kushner's recent bullshit solution was technically a two state solution even though it's basically creating Bantustans. We need to demand a much more clear statement than just "I support a two state solution", it's mealy-mouthed. If it doesn't include the right of return it's meaningless. If it doesn't include Palestine being allowed to police its own borders then it's hardly a state. Ditto controlling its own airspace, its own seas, and so on, so forth. I mean it's certainly true that the Republican policy has nothing to do with an actual two-state solution. But at the same time support for a two-state solution has plummeted for the last decade among both Palestinians and Israelis. It polls somewhere south of 40% in both populations at this point, and is largely seen as both impossible and unwanted. Even if a future Labour-led UK had an opportunity to influence regional policy towards a two-state solution, it's unlikely that the people living there would be particularly receptive. Encouraging Labour candidates to battle over details for a fairly hypothetical eventuality seems like a mistake.
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Feb 16, 2020 04:19
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OwlFancier posted:Someone can and probably has written at length about the liberal technocratic obsession with quantification and its intersection with ideas like eugenics, and its relation to the race science of previous centuries. "The Mismeasure Of Man" is sort of this, I read it a few years ago but I remember it being pretty good (newer editions include extra chapters about the bell curve too)
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Feb 16, 2020 07:38
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The UK has more means to pressure Serbia into recognizing Kosovo as a sovereign state, noting that the UK has actual notional responsibility to contribute to Kosovo's defence in its NATO KFOR commitments and still has boots on the ground there today. The should-Kosovo-have-its-own-credible-army-with-sovereignty-within-its-internationally-recognized-borders question is an actual and live evolving question today, rather than in the Palestinian case where it is hypothetical. The UK is an actual major and influential party in that question of whether the Kosovar state, as it actually exists as an imperfect democracy with a, let's say, aspirational attitude toward achieving inter-ethnic equanimity, with several hundred thousand Kosovar Serbs within its borders, should be allowed to police said borders, as opposed to the Serbian position that only the NATO force established by UNSC 1244 should be allowed to do this (with the obvious dynamic that contributors to this NATO mission would like to draw down their missions which would leave Kosovo unable to resist Serbian fait accomplis). And if you enjoy arguing over totally incredible one/two state solutions, Serbia does continue to recognize Kosovo as an autonomous province of Serbia. It goes without saying that Kosovo maintains otherwise, and the peace process will accomplish some outcome that sacrifices some of Kosovo's sovereignty for a permanent settlement which Serbia recognizes; the only question is how much. But are these really the issues of principle that matter so much to you? Nobody expects Labour leadership candidates to voice hardline opinions on the ethics and morality of former Yugoslavian nationhood however; I/P has a special status. Miftan suggested, many threads ago, that the Labour left views it as a white settler colonial question rather than as yet another foreign conflict amongst untold numbers of foreign conflicts; this strikes me as essentially correct. ronya fucked around with this message at 08:09 on Feb 16, 2020 |
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Feb 16, 2020 07:56
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The new attorney general is a member of a cult founded by a prolific sexual abuser https://www.theguardian.com/politic...py_to_clipboard I feel like over the next five years they're not going to even bother hiding it.
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Feb 16, 2020 08:35
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a pipe smoking dog posted:The new attorney general is a member of a cult founded by a prolific sexual abuser She's also a member of the Triratna order.
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Feb 16, 2020 09:24
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Jedit posted:She's also a member of the Triratna order. That's what the... ah, well played sir.
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Feb 16, 2020 10:01
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Darth Walrus posted:This is a thread, and there's lots more wild poo poo in there: Oh so that's why Dawkins was defending eugenics on Twitter https://twitter.com/RichardDawkins/status/1228943686953664512?s=20
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Feb 16, 2020 10:15
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I don't imagine that richard dawkins needs an excuse to be stupid on twitter.
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Feb 16, 2020 10:21
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Why yes, modern dog breeds such as the pug are an excellent example of eugenics 'working'...
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Feb 16, 2020 10:24
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He's right tho
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Feb 16, 2020 10:41
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It is possible, if one's premises were granted, to be technically accurate, but still, holistically, wrong.
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Feb 16, 2020 10:46
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Pablo Bluth posted:Why yes, modern dog breeds such as the pug are an excellent example of eugenics 'working'... Let's be fair and consider the upside, if we ever wanted to create a slave race to be used for livestock or sport it could work
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Feb 16, 2020 10:59
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https://twitter.com/johnmcdonnellMP/status/1228988763264684032?s=19
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Feb 16, 2020 11:29
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a pipe smoking dog posted:The new attorney general is a member of a cult founded by a prolific sexual abuser This doesn't really seem any different to being Catholic? Ban all religion blunt fucked around with this message at 11:47 on Feb 16, 2020 |
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Feb 16, 2020 11:45
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https://twitter.com/pixelatedboat/status/1228964126161920001?s=19
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Feb 16, 2020 11:56
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