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Just to be a dickhead and bring back the Dust til Dawn: It'as actually from a drat good music video with a lot of references: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60ruvzfXQoE
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Mar 7, 2020 16:10
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Count me in as not knowing the twists with FDTD or T2 so I guess I won the ruined twist lottery. Also got to watch T2 on opening night with free tickets and peaking on acid so that was pretty great. Re-watching The Irishman which is fantastic BTW and got to the part with the fish in the car and the drive to meet Hoffa. First time you see it, the idea of the wet seat, the fish, what kind of fish and all the bullshit conversation that goes on during the drive makes you think there's something weird going on and ratchets up the tension with who sits where and "what about this fish?" and on and on. But the whole thing is a literal Red Herring and never amounts to anything
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Mar 7, 2020 19:42
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RandomFerret posted:What seems obvious to movie industry insiders and what seems obvious to the general public are two different things. I remember the comic also had a scene that was missing until the director's cut and wondered why it was not in the movie (I think it was the Thorazine scene or where the T-1000 stabs the cop s l o w l y in the eye) The point is, everybody knew beforehand.
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Mar 8, 2020 13:09
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I think the point is that the movie works either way. And the T-1000's behaviour is something the movie explores; it's pointed out that it's basically running on the same directives just with a different goal, and has to be told not to actively kill people, on top of its existing character development and observations on human nature from a robot's POV.
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Mar 8, 2020 13:16
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I watched Terminator years after watching T2, so it never really hit me how utterly loving *horrified* Sarah Connor is when she sees the terminator for the first time in T2. That lady had been through some poo poo (I know this isn't a subtle thing and is basically the point but hush okay)
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Mar 8, 2020 13:31
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F4rt5 posted:It was never going to be a secret twist that Arnie was the god guy. 13 year old me watched You Could Be Mine on MTV, read articles about the movie where it was mentioned right out the bat, and even read the comic (comic adaptations of movies coming out before the.movie are not a thing any more?) before seeing the movie in cinemas. "It wasn't a twist because I read the comic." None of what you you listed has anything to do with how the movie itself is made. The idea isn't that "this was a surprise to general audiences upon release," it's that the movie itself is constructed to allow that to be a shocking reveal. I actually feel like Cameron meant early on for it to be a reveal but abandoned that during the actual production even if it still mostly works. The whole sequence with Arnie in the biker bar is way too fun and there's kind of no way you're not supposed to be rooting for him during it. It even ends with the slow pan up to show you how cool and badass he looks with all the leather. It's incongruous.
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Mar 8, 2020 14:08
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Also, Arnie doesn't kill anyone in the bar even after being attacked. Pretty big give away that he's the good guy this time.
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Mar 8, 2020 14:45
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Baron von Eevl posted:
At some point bad terminator was supposed to be looking like Kyle Reese. I dunno, maybe biker bar scene was originally meant for the evil Kyle? "He's back? And now beats up half a dozen guys without breaking a sweat? What's going on?"
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Mar 8, 2020 17:01
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Sunswipe posted:Also, Arnie doesn't kill anyone in the bar even after being attacked. Pretty big give away that he's the good guy this time. Yeah, but he throws a guy onto a hot stove and nails a guy to a pool table with a knife. Still pretty brutal.
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Mar 8, 2020 22:43
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Might be he just didn't want bloodstained clothes cause those would cause him to attract attention he didn't want.
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Mar 9, 2020 01:44
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Another way you could tell Arnold was playing the hero terminator was because it was Arnold in 1991
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Mar 9, 2020 01:47
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Bad to the bone, b-b--b-bad!
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Mar 9, 2020 01:50
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What a weird argument. I didn't know Arnold was the Good Guy because I simply didn't have a TV and had heard nothing about T2 until one day it was out so I went to see it. I wanted a TV I just didn't have one and one night I took some acid and went to see that movie and it was great - except me and my friends were laughing at all the wrong parts but it still worked out. Somehow I didn't know anything about FDTD either and rented it one day from Blockbuster because Tarantino so "gently caress yeah" and the vampire poo poo surprised me plus I realized Tarantino really had a thing for feet after the strip club scene. Anyway, that's my story about those two movies.
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Mar 9, 2020 02:00
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BiggerBoat posted:What a weird argument. It really is, Len has just decided that the lived experiences of a whole bunch of people aren't true or are an attempt to gaslight them.
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Mar 9, 2020 02:53
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I saw this movie on Netflix the other day called John Carter and holy poo poo the twist when he ends up on Mars!
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Mar 9, 2020 03:01
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Len posted:I saw this movie on Netflix the other day called John Carter and holy poo poo the twist when he ends up on Mars! Ahh, the old "lol I troll u" maneuver, let's see if anyone falls for it.
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Mar 9, 2020 03:51
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Len posted:I saw this movie on Netflix the other day called John Carter and holy poo poo the twist when he ends up on Mars! I'm so sorry you watched John Carter.
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Mar 9, 2020 03:52
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Casnorf posted:I'm so sorry you watched John Carter. Thankfully I can say I didn't and I was just going for Memento posted:Ahh, the old "lol I troll u" maneuver, let's see if anyone falls for it. Because anything is a twist if you go in blind. But that doesn't actually mean it's a twist. Like I get it, you guys went in blind and enjoyed the movie for what it was but that doesn't make it a M Night style twist because it was always a vampire movie. I was being a pedantic dick about it because it was a slow day at work and poo poo posting is what I do but somehow that turned into I think everyone is gas lighting me? I dunno man, I let it drop after a mod posted but y'all keep bring it back up. Can I get a 4 for $4?
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Mar 9, 2020 03:57
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Len posted:Thankfully I can say I didn't and I was just going for I swear I'm not trying to argue here or antagonize you, but you seem to have this idea that "plot twist" means something that surprises the audience and is internationally hidden from them. The thing is it can also mean a part of a film where the plot or premise or tone radically shifts. Like whether or not the marketing for FDTD brings up vampires, it's a radical departure from where the movie started. It is a twist. This doesn't mean Tarantino and Rodriguez ever had the intention that this twist would be kept secret. It's also clearly different from Godzilla and John Carter, which are movies solely about Big Monster and Some Dingus On Mars I Guess.
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Mar 9, 2020 04:11
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Dance puppets dance. I was only trolling because it was a slow day at work, I am the real mastermind here. Fools!!!
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Mar 9, 2020 04:17
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Jaws is way better if you go in without knowing it’s about a shark
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Mar 9, 2020 04:31
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one thing that nobody will argue is that From Dusk Til Dawn is a subtle movie
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Mar 9, 2020 05:20
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Casnorf posted:I'm so sorry you watched John Carter. I really like that movie. 
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Mar 9, 2020 06:17
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It bored me so much
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Mar 9, 2020 07:42
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T2 is pretty good because someone might watch it without prior knowledge and the intro is deliberately set up so that it seems like the T1000 is the good guy. It's also only for like the first 5 minutes so it's actually just a cool thing that James Cameron put in because he is good at making films. I saw T2 recently and noticed that and it enhanced my enjoyment of the movie. Anyway what I like about T1 is that getting shot really fucks people up. Makes the T800 way scarier. It's actually an extremely good film, crazy that it was made on a budget of like 6 million. Probably the only thing I would change is that when Sarah Connor crushes the T800 I wish that instead of saying "you're terminated" it would have been cool if she just spat in the robots face. It's a really human gesture of defiance and I think it would have played well with the themes, as well as being extremely bad rear end.
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Mar 9, 2020 07:52
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Ferrule posted:Stuff like this is always fascinating: I stumbled on another example of this recently. The ABC TV station in Australia had a kids show called Adventure Island which ran from 1967 to 1972 and was always broadcast in black and white but on the final day of production they shot a quick behind-the-scenes documentary in colour: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOvI1a6_AQg
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Mar 9, 2020 09:18
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The transition period for colour TV was apparently interesting. Star Trek TOS was basically used as a killer app for colour TV, and stayed on the air partly for that reason.
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Mar 9, 2020 10:24
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Baron von Eevl posted:I swear I'm not trying to argue here or antagonize you, but you seem to have this idea that "plot twist" means something that surprises the audience and is internationally hidden from them. The thing is it can also mean a part of a film where the plot or premise or tone radically shifts. Like whether or not the marketing for FDTD brings up vampires, it's a radical departure from where the movie started. It is a twist. Yes this is exactly what I was trying to say on Thursday before dropping this conversation entirely. But apparently what I was actually saying was that nobody was ever surprised by FDTD and you were all gaslighting me. Sounds like my definition of twist has been wrong because I reserve it for when media does things that aren't openly parts of the synopsis.
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Mar 9, 2020 11:17
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Len posted:Sounds like my definition of twist has been wrong because I reserve it for when media does things that aren't openly parts of the synopsis. Yes, that's wrong. A twist is when a piece of media leads the viewer to expect that A is happening/about to happen, but then B unexpectedly happens. It's a standard storytelling device and it happens all the time to greater and lesser extents. The fact that external sources (trailers, synopses, posters) sometimes give away the twists doesn't change the fact that they're twists.
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Mar 9, 2020 11:48
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rydiafan posted:I really like that movie. It's a good movie. Not great, but good. It deserved better but got hosed over by marketing, who said it couldn't be called "A Princess of Mars" because boys wouldn't see a movie with "princess" in the title and girls wouldn't see a movie with "Mars" in the title. I read the original trilogy of John Carter of Mars novels recently. They're pulpy as hell but for books 100 years old they stand up remarkably well. I recommend giving them a shot.
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Mar 9, 2020 11:51
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:Yes, that's wrong. a twist is anything unusual or unexpected. what youre describing is a surprise
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Mar 9, 2020 13:43
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Baron von Eevl posted:I The thing is it can also mean a part of a film where the plot or premise or tone radically shifts. Like whether or not the marketing for FDTD brings up vampires, it's a radical departure from where the movie started. It is a twist. beanieson posted:Jaws is way better if you go in without knowing it’s about a shark According to the Baron's definition, Jaws does have a "twist." The first half of the film is a horror movie, the second half is an adventure flick. Once they get on the orca and head out to sea, the music changes and the narrative flips.
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Mar 9, 2020 13:47
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Where does Mad Max Beyond Thunderdome fall on the twist/surprise scale?
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Mar 9, 2020 14:16
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I remember watching the Digimon movie as a kid and it had this amazing twist where the hero was losing to the bad guy in the final fight but then managed to turn things around and gain the upper hand! I did not see that coming!
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Mar 9, 2020 14:19
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Jedit posted:It's a good movie. Not great, but good. It deserved better but got hosed over by marketing, who said it couldn't be called "A Princess of Mars" because boys wouldn't see a movie with "princess" in the title and girls wouldn't see a movie with "Mars" in the title. I had also heard that they dropped "Mars" from the title because of how badly Mars Needs Moms flopped.
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Mar 9, 2020 14:20
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jojoinnit posted:I remember watching the Digimon movie as a kid and it had this amazing twist where the hero was losing to the bad guy in the final fight but then managed to turn things around and gain the upper hand! I did not see that coming! Well I guess you were dumb enough to watch it so target market.
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Mar 9, 2020 14:22
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I have no idea if this is even true, but back in 1993 my buddy excitedly told me that he heard the sequel to Terminator 2 was going to be called Terminator 4 because there would be 4 Terminators. Imagine that world instead of 'My So Called Life: Skynet edition'. My Lovely Horse posted:Where does Mad Max Beyond Thunderdome fall on the twist/surprise scale? Two men enter, one man leave...but they forgot to mention they could still execute the surviving fighter.
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Mar 9, 2020 14:29
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rydiafan posted:I had also heard that they dropped "Mars" from the title because of how badly Mars Needs Moms flopped. Among with most of the other Mars-related movies of the last few years. Does seem like a case where design-by-committee ends up with a title that has absolutely no appeal, though. Though every indication seems to be that executives literally don't understand why people do or don't like movies at all.
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Mar 9, 2020 14:35
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You know what a good movie is to catch without any knowledge going in? Ginger Snaps
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Mar 9, 2020 14:41
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Ferrule posted:According to the Baron's definition, Jaws does have a "twist." That's not a twist because the shift is not a radical one. Many films have a shift from a slower burn to a more action oriented adventure feel. Or the opposite, maybe they start as a fun adventure and then there's a shift into a scarier, more traditional horror scenario. That happens all the time. A gritty Tarantino style crime/gangster flick turning on a dime into an all-out vampire splatter-fest is not so common. It's not something you'd normally expect, even if you've seen a lot of gangster and/or vampire films. The twist in the first act of T2 is a different type. It's a twist based on what came before, so it's a twist that depends on expectations set up by having seen the first film. So it only works when you go in relatively blind, AND you've seen The Terminator. So it's really not a big deal at all, it's a fun little extra throw in by Cameron. But I appreciate that he did it, because like I posted before, he understands that movies continue on and have a life for years and decades after the marketing and press junkets for the theatrical run.
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Mar 9, 2020 15:21
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