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Terrorist Fistbump posted:you need to slow down and properly use language to express what's in your head, instead of cobbling together an approximation from stock phrases and rhetorical gestures. big ask imo
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Mar 16, 2020 17:29
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Crowsbeak posted:Very simply. Egotistical goals are at their core about appealing to a limited number of people Austrian. If your policy doesn’t appeal to the majority of those you’re trying to reach. Let’s say. The people’s vote in the UK. You will lose horribly. Which Labour did. Due to egotism coming first over actual policies that benefitted the majority. Now likely millions will die in the UK. All because of the idpol program called people’s vote. It is great I have a example Like that to show what losers idpolers are. ok now define what it means to soothe the egos of the greater number of people.
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Mar 16, 2020 17:29
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Ooops my finger slipped!
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Mar 16, 2020 17:31
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Doc Hawkins posted:they seem like the kind of people whose illness far predates any relationship with politics CS Lewis, profoundly hilarious Catholic reactionary that he was, bullseye'd the entire class to which they belong in the Screwtape Letters. the bug up his rear end was faith in God, but you'll recognize them regardless in his description of Screwtape's favorites. people who were vaguely anti-war not out of a sense of any actual belief- the Enemy can use that- but more out of a sense of contempt for anything the greater mass of humanity aligns with. the bourgeois pop-intellectuals who have built a crude idol out of just how ~iconoclastic~ they are being, because they are smart enough to recognize the shallowness of the circles in which they run but are petrified of ever actually leaving them, and so are content to stew in their petty hatreds forever. oh, how fiercely they howl about bourgeois morality. and oh, how tenaciously they cling to their bourgeois lives. CS Lewis was always at his best when he was writing about himself.
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Mar 16, 2020 17:32
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Doc Hawkins posted:big ask imo I know but it's the only way out of the mania
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Mar 16, 2020 17:32
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Crowsbeak posted:I mean. You are. it was a while back so I don’t remember exactly what they said, but it was what made me stop listening to that stupid podcast. but no, there wasn’t any subtlety to it it was just “the environment is a thing libs talk about so we have to be contrarian and say it’s no big deal” also no one is being “silenced.”
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Mar 16, 2020 17:32
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That that unfortunate creatures fate be a warning to you podcast fandom
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Mar 16, 2020 17:32
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Helsing posted:Ooops my finger slipped! You idpol reactionary!!! how dare you stand in the way of the peoples will!! the revolutionary masses will bury you in the dustbin of history!!!! eh whatevs. i gotta admit i didnt dig the latest episode of chapo too much. trashfuture has a fun reading of jacob rees-moggs lovely book abbout victorians tho.
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Mar 16, 2020 17:34
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gh0stpinballa posted:matt demolishing virgil was pretty funny. the virgin wonk has been bested by the materialist clown yet again. nah, Matt was loving lame (and quite not into historical materialism) problem with having moments like that is the lack of open heart to say "everything went to poo poo and I got wrecked emotionally and I want to cry", which does good and actually is better for the fighting spirit in the long run, but instead, reaction through "lol nothing matters" to hide the emotional wounds is a disservice to his cause and his comrades imho there is some cultural legacy of postmodernism about nurturing and fostering hope that makes you into a naive idiot, and that is the loving idiotic thing to do because you can be hopeful and be highly competent, bold in action and decisive in effort, those things are not mutually exclusive
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Mar 16, 2020 17:38
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OctoberCountry posted:lmao @ listening to Red Scare
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Mar 16, 2020 17:44
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gh0stpinballa posted:matt demolishing virgil was pretty funny. the virgin wonk has been bested by the materialist clown yet again. I didn't watch last night, when during the stream did this happen?
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Mar 16, 2020 17:47
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Yeowch!!! My Balls!!! posted:CS Lewis, profoundly hilarious Catholic reactionary that he was, bullseye'd the entire class to which they belong in the Screwtape Letters. the bug up his rear end was faith in God, but you'll recognize them regardless in his description of Screwtape's favorites. what's that guy who was on verso's podcast a few times, from the platypus group or the plato group or whatever? he was the most shining example of it i'd ever seen, every scrap of his education bent to the sole purpose of justifying his participation in nothing except self-aggrandizement. cool dance moves posted:trashfuture has a fun reading of jacob rees-moggs lovely book abbout victorians tho. the newest patreon episode had them reading from the worst-written book i have heard excerpted on any podcast. i almost didn't enjoy the episode because i wanted them to excoriate it more than they were.
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Mar 16, 2020 17:48
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Yeowch!!! My Balls!!! posted:people who were vaguely anti-war not out of a sense of any actual belief- the Enemy can use that- but more out of a sense of contempt for anything the greater mass of humanity aligns with. Orwell posted:Every left-wing ‘intellectual’ is, as a matter of course, an anti-imperialist. He claims to be outside the empire-racket as automatically and self-righteously as he claims to be outside the class-racket. Even the right-wing ‘intellectual’, who is not definitely in revolt against British imperialism, pretends to regard it with a sort of amused detachment. It is so easy to be witty about the British Empire. The White Man's Burden and ‘Rule, Britannia’ and Kipling's novels and Anglo-Indian bores — who could even mention such things without a snigger? And is there any cultured person who has not at least once in his life made a joke about that old Indian havildar who said that if the British left India there would not be a rupee or a virgin left between Peshawar and Delhi (or wherever it was)? That is the attitude of the typical left-winger towards imperialism, and a thoroughly flabby, boneless attitude it is. For in the last resort, the only important question is: Do you want the British Empire to hold together or do you want it to disintegrate? And at the bottom of his heart no Englishman, least of all the kind of person who is witty about Anglo-Indian colonels, does want it to disintegrate.
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Mar 16, 2020 17:54
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Crowsbeak posted:Good thing this is a dishonorable defeat. Due to dnc rigging. I dunno. Bernie is legitimizing the process with his last minute "get biden to commit to left talking points" tactic instead of burning it all down. If he loses, and then campaigns for Biden that's going to take a lot of the wind out of the sails of any "rigged" narrative.
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Mar 16, 2020 17:57
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dead gay comedy forums posted:nah, Matt was loving lame (and quite not into historical materialism) I think this is why I found the latest episode so meh. Matt cant seem to get over the fact that things are shifting in unexpected ways, so he doubles down on his core hellworld thesis--and he can never admit that thesis was wrong. He'll always shift it to accommodate whatever the latest news is, even if that news went against an earlier vision of hellworld. On the one hand, this means hes never really wrong, but on the other hand it ends up being a self-defeating belief system. And he has these moments of inspiration! But when his hopes get shot down he mopes about it instead of trying to move forward with the experience.
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Mar 16, 2020 18:03
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I don't think it hurts the narrative. He campaigned for Clinton after the primary was rigged against him. He doesn't want the Party to fail and die and leave the Republicans in charge of everything, because he's a much better person than the Party he's pledged to support. As I've said many times in the primary thread, the media will blame Bernie and his supporters for all the Party's failures and demonize him no matter what he does.
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Mar 16, 2020 18:04
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Matt was right to call out Virgil on his trite "wow look at how many young people are thinking of others and selflessly doing their part by self-quarantining" bullshit
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Mar 16, 2020 18:08
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Doc Hawkins posted:what's that guy who was on verso's podcast a few times, from the platypus group or the plato group or whatever? he was the most shining example of it i'd ever seen, every scrap of his education bent to the sole purpose of justifying his participation in nothing except self-aggrandizement.
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Mar 16, 2020 18:08
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V. Illych L. posted:the bolshevik regime really did need to centralise control a lot. the country was in complete ruin and their whole mandate was based on making poo poo better right now. criticism is fair, but i think you're being unfair here - the anarchist way would've simply seen the union splintered and reduced to client states in pretty short order I think the Bolsheviks were slightly unfair when they turned the Red Army on anarchists, Left SRs, left coms and others before the purging turned on themselves with first the Workers Opposition crushed and then the rest. I'm not arguing violence in defence of the revolution is bad but I've got reasonable I think suspicion of leftists who happily other leftists for not sufficiently bending the knee. Plenty of things to say on how the USSR improved on things under the Tsars but that doesn't mean we need to down play the Bolsheviks inability to tolerate any dissent even when it was bang on the money.
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Mar 16, 2020 18:14
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dead gay comedy forums posted:come the gently caress on, the liberals outflanked the left about identity matters and that was a complete shitshow from our side in dealing about that The libs only outflanked the left on idpol because they murdered the leftist who were there first
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Mar 16, 2020 18:18
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OctoberCountry posted:Matt was right to call out Virgil on his trite "wow look at how many young people are thinking of others and selflessly doing their part by self-quarantining" bullshit no, he wasn't, because people are going to be people virgil correctly answered by reversing his cynicism at him in order to check what supports his conclusions, and Matt stuttered before saying I don't know: it's all bullshit in the same way, but because lame-rear end nihilism is """"cooler"""" and """"edgier"""", it is often given a pass
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Mar 16, 2020 18:20
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Yeowch!!! My Balls!!! posted:CS Lewis, profoundly hilarious Catholic reactionary that he was, bullseye'd the entire class to which they belong in the Screwtape Letters. the bug up his rear end was faith in God, but you'll recognize them regardless in his description of Screwtape's favorites. This is the cornerstone of the teeth-grindingly stupid PMC discourse as well.
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Mar 16, 2020 18:21
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forkboy84 posted:I think the Bolsheviks were slightly unfair when they turned the Red Army on anarchists, Left SRs, left coms and others before the purging turned on themselves with first the Workers Opposition crushed and then the rest. I'm not arguing violence in defence of the revolution is bad but I've got reasonable I think suspicion of leftists who happily other leftists for not sufficiently bending the knee. i mean if you want to see where the suspicion of dissent came from you can just imagine the online left, except there literally is a major ongoing international effort to smother them in the crib again, they really needed a state to do stuff, being less centralist would've seen them snuffed out. there's a reason early soviet lawmaking is so incredibly erratic on e.g. the subject of the death penalty and elected red army officers. they were locked in a titanic death struggle and the entire bolshevik party structure was set up for discipline. left-wing opposition was as dangerous to the nascent soviet project as right-wing opposition was, unfortunately. it's a fair gripe to say that they should've fallen rather than taking those measures, but history does show what happens when they're *not* taken with the bavarian soviet republic and the paris commune - they thought it necessary for survival, and i have a very hard time disagreeing with that assessment there were extremely compelling reasons for the bolsheviks to do what they did, is what i'm saying, even if it went to poo poo in a hurry.
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Mar 16, 2020 18:31
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dead gay comedy forums posted:no, he wasn't, because people are going to be people virgil was being a dumbass claiming young people are all being little goodie two-shoes
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Mar 16, 2020 18:34
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Healthy young wonk goes to vote, loses one election, doesn't analyze good and changes - HELLWORLD. Many such cases!
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Mar 16, 2020 18:43
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Crowsbeak posted:I think acting like Noah Berlatsky. Which means idpol above all and ostracization of those who don’t agree or especially offer mild criticism kind of sums it up. Look at all the people who in this thread literally compare criticism to nazism. I mean. I think we have very good examples of the pathetic specimens in this thread. the whip cracks! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mL2tnFwVqyQ
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Mar 16, 2020 18:49
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are we having a battle over the triumphs and failures of the Soviet Union in the podcast thread?
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Mar 16, 2020 19:20
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i think it was just another red scare derail
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Mar 16, 2020 19:23
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a fearsome podcast army was raised and then disbanded all in the span of an hour
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Mar 16, 2020 19:35
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Trabisnikof posted:virgil was being a dumbass claiming young people are all being little goodie two-shoes That was very dumb. Made me wince. People are packing bars and restaurants.
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Mar 16, 2020 19:35
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Can we please bring the thread back to 40k chat? I'm going to report anyone who keeps talking about podcasts.
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Mar 16, 2020 19:40
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MizPiz posted:Can we please bring the thread back to 40k chat? I'm going to report anyone who keeps talking about podcasts. they're heavily hinted that the next big release is gonna be Emperor's Children. I'm pretty excited
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Mar 16, 2020 20:09
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I will talk about podcasts anyway. I listened to some pretty interesting ones lately. One is Cosmopod, the blog Cosmonaut's podcast. They have a new episode on STEM-brain and get into some really juicy stuff on why engineers in the US often end up as libertarians, why econ 101 is so bad and a lot of philosophy of science which often gets too heady for my intellect but is still pretty exciting. http://cosmopod.libsyn.com/stembrain-socialism Another episode which actually fits well with the discussion Ilych and forkboy84 are having is about the book Political Undercurrents in Soviet Economic Debates by Moshe Lewin and how much disagreement there was about the direction of the Soviet Union before Stalin became chief. The Bolsheviks were like anyone else trying to make history compelled by necessity to do certain things and didn't have a free reign to make progressive social experiments. http://cosmopod.libsyn.com/political-undercurrents-in-soviet-economic-debates-a-discussion And yet another podcast called General Intellect Unit which seems to be about technology and socialism here discussing The People's Republic of Wallmart, which I also recommend reading. It goes through some of the problems of Soviet planning, which also to a large extent evolved as the Bolsheviks reacted to events and in some ways worked surprisingly well in spite of the circumstances. Another good one for dispelling historical myths. http://generalintellectunit.net/e/036-the-peoples-republic-of-walmart-part-1/
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Mar 16, 2020 20:28
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V. Illych L. posted:i mean if you want to see where the suspicion of dissent came from you can just imagine the online left, except there literally is a major ongoing international effort to smother them in the crib But then you look at the Spanish revolution to see a good example of the Bolshevik strategy being loving stupid and ultimately ending up with the fash winning. I just do not accept the premise that a revolution only succeeds by purging dissenting voices entirely. The lesson I take away from the Bolshevik coup is that the existence of a left wing opposition is in fact vital to stop the inevitable products of the democratic centralist vanguard party policy, which were the revolution eating its children, until all you had left were the strongman and the yes-men he surrounded himself with, your Molotovs, Kaganovichs, Zhdanovs, idiocy like Lysenkoism where even science is beholden to the decisions of the party CC. Not to mention the growth of the nomenklatura. But it's fine, as a lib-soc I know that the fact the October Revolution succeeded means there will always be people who dream that one day I get purged along with or just after the fash & capitalists.
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Mar 16, 2020 20:28
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Prince Myshkin posted:That was very dumb. Made me wince. People are packing bars and restaurants. it didn't stop anyone at all from going out for St. Patrick's Day
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Mar 16, 2020 20:32
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forkboy84 posted:But it's fine, as a lib-soc I know that the fact the October Revolution succeeded means there will always be people who dream that one day I get purged along with or just after the fash & capitalists.
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Mar 16, 2020 20:41
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forkboy84 posted:But it's fine, as a lib-soc I know that the fact the October Revolution succeeded means there will always be people who dream that one day I get purged along with or just after the fash & capitalists. Taking leftist infighting/theory/history personally is about as stupid as being genuinely upset about guillotine jokes. No leftist is coming for your neck dude, we're as far removed from power as can be.
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Mar 16, 2020 21:21
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forkboy84 posted:But then you look at the Spanish revolution to see a good example of the Bolshevik strategy being loving stupid and ultimately ending up with the fash winning. I just do not accept the premise that a revolution only succeeds by purging dissenting voices entirely. The lesson I take away from the Bolshevik coup is that the existence of a left wing opposition is in fact vital to stop the inevitable products of the democratic centralist vanguard party policy, which were the revolution eating its children, until all you had left were the strongman and the yes-men he surrounded himself with, your Molotovs, Kaganovichs, Zhdanovs, idiocy like Lysenkoism where even science is beholden to the decisions of the party CC. Not to mention the growth of the nomenklatura. stalin turning the comintern into an instrument of socialism in one country was bad, i agree, and the popular front strategy should've allowed a much greater flexibility in terms of alliances thotsky posted:Taking leftist infighting/theory/history personally is about as stupid as being genuinely upset about guillotine jokes. No leftist is coming for your neck dude, we're as far removed from power as can be. well you say that before the revolution... at any rate i think reiterating these old conflicts is often fruitful because we very often get bogged down in reinventing the theoretical wheel. a lot of work has been done in the past, and our movement is only now starting to realise what it is - there's still a lot of theory that basically needs to be rediscovered imo
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Mar 16, 2020 22:05
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cool dance moves posted:eh whatevs. i gotta admit i didnt dig the latest episode of chapo too much. trashfuture has a fun reading of jacob rees-moggs lovely book abbout victorians tho. The Rees-mogg eps and the most recent one with the erotic reading series were extremely Good Content
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Mar 16, 2020 22:54
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Terrorist Fistbump posted:I didn't watch last night, when during the stream did this happen? it was during chapo beltway garage pod ep
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Mar 16, 2020 23:01
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