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Gotta be ISARM, we can't pass up a chance at F15s.
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Mar 22, 2020 05:55
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Vote for Ivanov
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Mar 22, 2020 06:51
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Gonna go with Ivanov.
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Mar 22, 2020 08:34
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IVANOV This is our A2A purchase. We need the best plane wrecker we can get. We can get some bomb trucks to do our A2G as necessary. Discount the single engine jets, they have too small payload/ poorer kinematics and most importantly insufficient range and payload in this theatre. They are trap options, although they have excellent loadouts. The twin engine jets will be able to out loiter whatever single engine jets and when they RTB the twin engine heavyweights will still be there. The SU35s have superior range and kinematics than the F15s, and they have a decade more modern avionics suite and carry 10 A2A missiles over the 8 that the eagles carry. That 2000s era modern PESA, ESM/ECM suite makes a huge, huge difference compared to a 1990s pulse doppler. Especially in any EM contested environments. We need the best A2A plane we can get, we can get our multirole bomb truck later. Edit: the Su35s have a: 6x BVR ARH (R77-1) missile load out, + 2 medium range IR homing AA10s. + 2 dogfight heatseekers to mop up whatever comes into WVR. Compared to F15s: 6x BVR ARH (ARMAAM C7) load out, + 2 dogfight heatseekers (Python 4) The Su35s have an extra 2 Medium range missiles, + a decade more modern ECM/ESM/PESA radar - all integrated. Plus larger airframe with more internal fuel. A plane with a missile beats a plane that has run out of missiles Easy pick for our best plane wrecker. Mr Crustacean fucked around with this message at 12:05 on Mar 22, 2020 |
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Mar 22, 2020 11:30
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  In a very close round of voting we have ISARM beating out the Ivanov Brothers. 16 Vs. 13. The fine folks at ISARM are scrubbing the IAF roundel off the wings and we'll have the aircraft shortly. This particularly stings for Ivanov as they used to be the sole source of IAF surplus. Next round should be particularly competitive.  All parties involved are headed in for negotiations. Once we have the pamphlet ready I'll post it up for votes. Here is a link to a .scen file with the aircraft and some sample targets in the neighborhood. A boat, 4 drone F-16's, and some ground targets to the north of Gjader. Scenario Link
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Mar 22, 2020 14:31
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Do we get to keep the fancy tail art?
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Mar 22, 2020 15:53
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Z the IVth posted:Do we get to keep the fancy tail art? Absolutely. Though most have basic colors, those were the show models.   Ivanov is really gunning for this work. We realized they are willing to up the ante in order to get future (read insurance) work. ISARM appears to be throwing a bone to the brothers and backing off. BFLM has a decent offering, as does K&P, but neither seem pleased how round 1 went for them. The support packages will include a tanker, an AEW bird, a drone package, and an OECM package. As usual, let me know if there's any questions!
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Mar 22, 2020 16:07
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BFLM. 8000lb of laser-guided weaponry each and an utterly ridiculous combat radius. The bomb-truckiest bomb trucks to have ever existed.
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Mar 22, 2020 16:13
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Ivanov’s offer of the Su-24s is more tempting for me.
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Mar 22, 2020 16:25
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BFLM. I could never say no to an F-111.
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Mar 22, 2020 16:37
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This is going to be a toss-up between BFLM and Ivanov. Actually, I can! IVANOV! Radio Free Kobold fucked around with this message at 21:55 on Mar 22, 2020 |
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Mar 22, 2020 17:40
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BFLM because F-111s are in my top 5 planes.
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Mar 22, 2020 17:40
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Hey, do we still keep the Shackleton?
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Mar 22, 2020 17:44
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Radio Free Kobold posted:Hey, do we still keep the Shackleton? Negative, all previous air assets are now tax write-off to help offset the expected incoming profits.
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Mar 22, 2020 17:48
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Yooper posted:Negative, all previous air assets are now tax write-off to help offset the expected incoming profits. 
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Mar 22, 2020 18:04
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Ivanov
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Mar 22, 2020 18:12
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Does anybody have a link to a database with these aircraft? I'm leaning Ivanov right now, but I want to be sure it's not crippled by, say, extremely low combat range.
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Mar 22, 2020 18:18
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Part of me wants to go ISARM because I have an unhealthy obsession with Mirages and J79s, but these poor things just don't have anything that's standout. If you picked them over BLFM then I'd have to look twice at you. However... I think some folks are sleeping on the Viggen here a little bit. Sure, no LGBs, but on the other hand the main thing that's propping these boys up is mineral exports, and nothing would make them collapse quicker than, say, some RB 15s into some bulk cargo ships... But all in all, I've got to go for Ivanov. Only aircraft with an ARM and we might not be able to go and perform SEAD via SDB for too long.
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Mar 22, 2020 18:31
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Davin Valkri posted:Does anybody have a link to a database with these aircraft? I'm leaning Ivanov right now, but I want to be sure it's not crippled by, say, extremely low combat range. Su-24M2 Fencer D - 2009 KFIR C.7 F111 AJS 37 Viggen
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Mar 22, 2020 18:49
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Yooper posted:Negative, all previous air assets are now tax write-off to help offset the expected incoming profits. Petition to repurpose the Shackleton as a gate guardian.
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Mar 22, 2020 19:02
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The F-111 has an insanely large combat radius, but I think the Su-24 has enough to exceed our CAP radius of the Eagles anyway, so Ivanov.
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Mar 22, 2020 19:05
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Quinntan posted:Part of me wants to go ISARM because I have an unhealthy obsession with Mirages and J79s, but these poor things just don't have anything that's standout. If you picked them over BLFM then I'd have to look twice at you. glynnenstein posted:The F-111 has an insanely large combat radius, but I think the Su-24 has enough to exceed our CAP radius of the Eagles anyway, so Ivanov. IVANOV For the above reasons. We need a bomb truck. We also need a good munitions toolbox for that bombtruck. Once again, the single engine jets are trap options. Limited in their range and payload. - Too small a truck, and their tools suck apart from the viggen having some good ASCMs The F111 is a gigantic truck with amazing range (significantly more than our F15s) , but it has a limited toolbox. It's pretty much LGBs and Dumbbombs. It can carry a ton of them, but it's missing critical standoff munitions and Anti Radiation missiles. If we pick it, it's good for dropping LGBs on static targets but if there's any contested SAM presence we'll have to compromise some half assed SEAD package with our F15s and SDBs. And forget dropping gravity bombs on things when there's hostile fighter cover present. The huge positives for the F111 are immense range and the sheer payload of LGBs it can carry, however the benefit of the immense range from the F111s is diminished by the fact that it will vastly outrange its fighter cover and both F111 and SU-24M can also aerial refuel to extend as necessary. The only bomb truck which is dual engine, good range, which also has a good munitions toolbox are the SU-24s. It has mass shortrange EO guided weapons/LGB analogues. It has ARMs. It even has KH59Ms for a versatile cruise missile option (anti surface, anti ship, mobile targets) The reason why the SU24 even has a limited options munition is because that Anti Radiation KH-31P is so really really loving useful. The Ivanov option is the only one which has a complete toolbox, whilst also being a decent truck. Mr Crustacean fucked around with this message at 21:20 on Mar 22, 2020 |
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Mar 22, 2020 20:09
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Well, baloogan is down, so instead I have to pull loadouts from cmano. Will take a bit longer to compose a summary.
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Mar 22, 2020 20:19
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Ivanov. (at first look at least.) Cruise missiles and ARMs complement the Eagles nicely, and they worked in Angola so why not.
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Mar 22, 2020 20:22
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IVANOV A vote for anything else is a vote for ARM reduction.
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Mar 22, 2020 20:25
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BFLM Can't say no to the aardvarks.
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Mar 22, 2020 20:38
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SU-24M2 Fencer D (2009) Loadouts: A. (BASE) 2x AS-18 Kazoo A (60nm cruise) 1. 4x AS-10 Karen (6nm laser) 2. 2x AS-11 Kilter (60nm ARM) + Emitter Locator 3. 4x AS-12 Kegler (20 nm ARM) + Emitter Locator 4. 2x AS-13 Kingbolt (35nm Anti-Ship) 5. 3x AS-14 Khedge (6nm laser) 6. 3x AS-14 Khedge (6nm EO) 7. 3x KAB-1500Kr TV/EO (2nm EO bomb) X. (LIMITED) 2x AS-17 Krypton C (60nm ARM) + Emitter Locator Problems: If you're happy with A2A then this is the full might of the Russian war machine Key Features: Terrain Following, Night Nav/Attack, Probe Refueling, 80nm Radar, Self-Escorting with 2x AA-11 Archer Range: 600-700nm Strike Kfir C.7 (1993) Loadouts (all BASE): 1. 4x Python 3 (10nm A2A) 2. 2x Maverick EO (6nm) 3. 2x Maverick IR (8nm) 4. 2x GBU-15(V)1/B CWW (15nm EO glide bomb) Problems: No truly advanced options. Key Features: Night Nav including missile attack, Probe Refueling, Boom Refueling, 40nm Radar, Self-Escorting with 2x Python 3 Range: ~400nm Strike F-111F Aardvark (1995) Loadouts (all BASE): 1. 12x Durandal (anti-runway bomb) 2. 4x Paveway III LGB (4nm LGB) 3. 2x GBU-15(V)1/B in EO and IR (15nm glide bomb) 4. 2x GBU-28 Deep Throat LBG (4nm 5000lb LGB) Problems: Lots of fairly dumb bombs and no true standoff options. The Ivanov option is better in almost every way. Key Features: Terrain Following, Night Nav/Attack, Boom Refueling, 40nm Radar Range: 800-1000nm AJS 37 Viggen (1997) Loadouts (all BASE): 1. 4x Maverick EO (6nm) 2. 2x RB 15F Mk1 (45nm anti-ship) Problems: This aircraft doesn't do anything. Key Features: Night Nav including missile attack, 60nm Radar, Self Escorting with 2x AIM-9L Range: ~400nm The Fencer D is very attractive with cruise missiles as a base option and older ARMs to cover off the limited ones. Frankly none of the other aicraft have features that make them more attractive in any way. As such I feel comfortable in voting for Ivanov e: BIG NOTE: We will NEED a recon asset with all of these options. e2: Also the eagles are boom refueling which is likely going to be incompatible with the Fencers but oh well. TheDemon fucked around with this message at 21:01 on Mar 22, 2020 |
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Mar 22, 2020 20:56
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PenguinSalsa posted:Ivanov. (at first look at least.) ARM put me over the edge. Ivanov. Give the brothers a bone for putting together a nice package for us. TheDemon posted:e2: Also the eagles are boom refueling which is likely going to be incompatible with the Fencers but oh well. I'm hoping this won't be too large of an issue since our strike package shouldn't need to loiter too much. They're not flying around providing CAP and dogfighting. Plus, there are tankers that are equipped with both. Yooper, does our support package include a tanker that supports both refueling methods? Warmachine fucked around with this message at 21:13 on Mar 22, 2020 |
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Mar 22, 2020 21:07
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ivanov
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Mar 22, 2020 21:15
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Ivanov
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Mar 22, 2020 21:20
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Our aircraft are so long legged that I don't think it's an issue. F-15Is especially I would be pretty comfortable covering a normal op without refueling, but SU-24M2s are likely not going to be providing CAS and need to loiter either. It's the 24-hour operations like we've run a handful of times where I'd want refueling for our F-15Is especially those we've paid to put AIM-120s on. So I would probably favor refueling for the strike eagles over the flankers, but would be perfectly okay with neither. Since these are real assets rather than 3DP garbage we can also probably surge ops up more CAP or CAS if necessary.
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Mar 22, 2020 21:40
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Changing my vote from BLFM to Ivanov!
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Mar 22, 2020 21:56
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Ivanov. I'd prefer some stand-off weapons.
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Mar 22, 2020 22:03
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I'm convinced! Ivanov it is. Sorry Viggens 
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Mar 22, 2020 22:04
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Warmachine posted:ARM put me over the edge. Ivanov. Give the brothers a bone for putting together a nice package for us. Yooper is sensible, if it's a poo poo gameplay experience to have to juggle boom/ drogue refuelling then there's ways for that to be mitigated, i.e tanker supports both.
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Mar 22, 2020 22:12
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I just hope we don't have to pick between a suitable tanker and a recon asset.
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Mar 22, 2020 22:19
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Ivanov Really digging the variety of weapons offered by our russian comrades.
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Mar 22, 2020 22:20
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Recon asset is needed hands down, I'd pick recon twice before I picked a tanker.
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Mar 22, 2020 22:20
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I bet our Support choice is going to boil down to: 2 decent recon assets decent recon, boom tanker decent recon, probe tanker 1 really good recon
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Mar 22, 2020 22:26
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Ivanov
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Mar 22, 2020 22:30
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