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oh jay posted:He wasn't running away. He was running towards the bigger battle, intent on killing heroes to protect the villains. Yeah. And Hawks was repeatedly trying every alternative. He offered Twice surrender. No dice. He then moved on to trying for a non-lethal takedown, despite the risk, except that Dabi made that route impossible. And then, when it was kill Twice or let Twice kill a lot of heroes, he did his job. When someone's resisting arrest with lethal force, taking him out isn't murder. It's defense of others.
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Apr 5, 2020 23:49
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TheHan posted:James Bond is like the one example you coulda picked where the narrative criticizes his actions! Sometimes, maybe, rarely. More often the movie just goes "Wow that was hells of cool. Did oyu see that car out race a space laser?"
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Apr 5, 2020 23:49
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oh jay posted:He wasn't running away. He was running towards the bigger battle, intent on killing heroes to protect the villains. If his intent was simply to kill heroes, there was one right there. At the end he was absolutely trying to get away from the terrifying telekinetic knife man intent on executing him for crime of being born with the wrong quirk. (Typical in real-world legal systems, the justifiable use of deadly force in defense of others requires a clear and imminent threat, not merely an assumed potential future threat. (Hawks killing Dabi instead would have absolutely been justified.)) Contrast this situation to All for One, who absolutely represents a bigger danger to the public than Twice, but is still alive because All Might is actually capable of living up to the title of 'hero' on which this entire society is built. Which is why I want to see Hawks's misdeeds exposed, so the entire rotten edifice can come crumbling down and our protagonists can struggle to replace it with something better. Because that's a way more interesting story than "Killer Cop Saves Day, Leaves Trail of Bodies in Wake."
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Apr 6, 2020 00:04
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All Might literally tried to kill All For One before, it just didn't take.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:06
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Nephthys posted:I really don't think you can be called a horrible person for using lethal force against a guy who very much could single-handedly turn the tides of this battle and cause the deaths of hundreds of heroes and civilians. I love Twice but he is a murderer and the stakes here are seriously way too high to mess around. Hawks tried doing it non-lethally as much as he could, but there wasn't any other option at that point. It's kinda funny how killing him is objectively the only smart thing to do and the thread is up in arms because they didn't come up with it first.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:07
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ZiegeDame posted:If his intent was simply to kill heroes, there was one right there. At the end he was absolutely trying to get away from the terrifying telekinetic knife man intent on executing him for crime of being born with the wrong quirk. (Typical in real-world legal systems, the justifiable use of deadly force in defense of others requires a clear and imminent threat, not merely an assumed potential future threat. (Hawks killing Dabi instead would have absolutely been justified.)) In one of his last moments, Dabi told Twice to "go nuts" and Twice replied "yeah." "At the end" he was definitely, 100% going to get clear for enough time to make enough clones to kill a bunch of cops.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:10
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ZiegeDame posted:If his intent was simply to kill heroes, there was one right there. At the end he was absolutely trying to get away from the terrifying telekinetic knife man intent on executing him for crime of being born with the wrong quirk. (Typical in real-world legal systems, the justifiable use of deadly force in defense of others requires a clear and imminent threat, not merely an assumed potential future threat. (Hawks killing Dabi instead would have absolutely been justified.)) Twice's last act was to send out a clone that murdered someone before it fell apart. And he wasn't "executing him for crime of being born with the wrong quirk", he was executing him because he was a terroist about to commit mass murder who refused repeated requests to stand down.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:12
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ZiegeDame posted:It isn't war, it's a police raid. Though in either context shooting a fleeing opponent in the back is not an action one typically considers heroic. He wasn't really running away so much as running to a different part of the battle where he could help kill people. And he did, in fact, shank a guy in the back of the head.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:17
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This chapter makes me think that Dabi's eventually going to be killed by Shigaraki. Dabi doesn't care about the League of Villains, and although Shigaraki wants to destroy everything I think he still does, in his insane way, care about the League members. Dabi's going to do something to endanger or even kill a member of the League (maybe Spinner since I don't think Dabi would consider him useful), Shigaraki's going to see or find out about it, and Dabi's going to be obliterated.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:17
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I like how you have to yadda yadda yadda literally every use of Twice's quirk to get to that argument over it being over being born the wrong way.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:19
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Weird to see the thread swing back from "actually the League of Villains is good" to "extrajudicial murder carried out by a government assassin is fine if you feel like it had a really good reason"
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Apr 6, 2020 00:20
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Viridiant posted:This chapter makes me think that Dabi's eventually going to be killed by Shigaraki. Dabi doesn't care about the League of Villains, and although Shigaraki wants to destroy everything I think he still does, in his insane way, care about the League members. Dabi's going to do something to endanger or even kill a member of the League (maybe Spinner since I don't think Dabi would consider him useful), Shigaraki's going to see or find out about it, and Dabi's going to be obliterated. Oh yeah, I totally see Dabi turning on the League at some point for his own selfish reasons. I see some kind of big confrontation with Spinner happening down the line since he's the other big Stain fanboy of the group.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:21
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ZiegeDame posted:Contrast this situation to All for One, who absolutely represents a bigger danger to the public than Twice, but is still alive because All Might is actually capable of living up to the title of 'hero' on which this entire society is built. Which is why I want to see Hawks's misdeeds exposed, so the entire rotten edifice can come crumbling down and our protagonists can struggle to replace it with something better. Because that's a way more interesting story than "Killer Cop Saves Day, Leaves Trail of Bodies in Wake." In their epic showdown All Might wasn't trying to capture him alive, he failed to kill him because that was the win condition. Its unclear when All Might found out he had somehow survived having his skull caved into his torso like a Goomba.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:25
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Yeah, All Might and AfO were straight up trying to murder each other. I think that was the case in both fights actually, but in the rematch All Might didn't have enough left in the tank.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:30
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If All For One survived getting his skull crushed in by All Might in his prime, I'm not sure what a severely weakened All Might could even do to kill him at that point.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:32
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Rhonne posted:If All For One survived getting his skull crushed in by All Might in his prime, I'm not sure what a severely weakened All Might could even do to kill him at that point. IIRC All For One was also severely weakened, just not as much as All Might was
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Apr 6, 2020 00:36
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CharlestonJew posted:IIRC All For One was also severely weakened, just not as much as All Might was Yeah, recovering from having your face embedded in your own lungs will surely wind you.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:38
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All For One got his head smashed in and is currently held in a prison where he can't move at all and he still regularly has a smile on his face. I wish I had that guy's confidence and cheer. Preferably without the megalomania.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:40
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Gran Torino also mentioned that his Quirk loadout was completely different, so anything could have happened. Although, imagine if he had kept Shock Nullification instead of giving it to the USJ Nomu...
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Apr 6, 2020 00:41
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oh jay posted:Gran Torino also mentioned that his Quirk loadout was completely different, so anything could have happened. We see him use shock reversal at least once in the Kamino fight.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:44
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ZenMasterBullshit posted:Sometimes, maybe, rarely. More often the movie just goes "Wow that was hells of cool. Did oyu see that car out race a space laser?" Hmm fair, but only cause James Bond will always be a power fantasy in the end. In true comic book fashion this is just the “Why doesn’t Batman kill The Joker” debate but anime.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:51
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Anshu posted:We see him use shock reversal at least once in the Kamino fight. Different quirk that has to be actively used. I'm wondering if United States of Smash could have broken through the Shock Nullification. The USJ Nomu wasn't even visibly hurt. It just got knocked away.
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Apr 6, 2020 00:51
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Doesn't All For One mention having doubles and triples of the same Quirks to compound them?
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Apr 6, 2020 00:52
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Funky Valentine posted:Doesn't All For One mention having doubles and triples of the same Quirks to compound them? yeah there's a whole bit of him going '[x quirk] times 5, [y quirk] times 6!' during the big fight
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Apr 6, 2020 00:58
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I thought it was more categories than specific quirks, because when almost everybody in the world has a superpower you're bound to see duplicates and broadly similar abilities, but I could easily be remembering wrong.
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Apr 6, 2020 01:02
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He got a bunch of really strong punching type quirks together so he could beat All Might at his own game(but it was actually all a smokescreen for his impact reversal quirk).
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Apr 6, 2020 01:05
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Blockhouse posted:Weird to see the thread swing back from "actually the League of Villains is good" to "extrajudicial murder carried out by a government assassin is fine if you feel like it had a really good reason" I seem to remember said government assassin asking Twice pretty nicely to just not use his quirk to commit terrorism anymore and turn himself in before killing him TheKingofSprings fucked around with this message at 01:15 on Apr 6, 2020 |
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Apr 6, 2020 01:13
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Really sad that twice got murdered for the crime of having a powerful quirk and nothing else. I love the part of the argument where we're drawing parallels between police brutality/murder and assassinating a literal one man army with malicious intent who is currently in the midst of a war against society at large who has murdered in the past and plans to immediately murder as many heroes as he can en masse as confirmed by both his immediate words and actions and his history. I love Twice, and I would have been incredibly happy to see him murder a lot of heroes in some nice detailed 2 page spreads, but Hawks was more than justified in killing him.
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Apr 6, 2020 01:16
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Dabi saying that he doesn't care about Evil Friendship or anyone else pairs nicely with Twice affirming his loyalty to the League because they're his friends and gave him a place to belong.
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Apr 6, 2020 01:17
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mycot posted:I like how you have to yadda yadda yadda literally every use of Twice's quirk to get to that argument over it being over being born the wrong way. Twice wasn't killed because he was born with his quirk, he was killed because of how he chose to use it.
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Apr 6, 2020 01:18
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Put pretty simply, The guy Twice iced nicely sufficed to ice Twice
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Apr 6, 2020 01:19
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Yeah, there's no one who's a villain purely because of being born with their Quirk; every single villain we've seen could all be perfectly fine and good heroes in their own way. Shinsou's entire character arc is about that very point.
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Apr 6, 2020 01:21
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I think Mina, the girl that looks like a literal space alien and attacks with skin dissolving acid being a hero should be enough to counter those kinds of arguments
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Apr 6, 2020 01:23
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But she has sick moves! No one with sick moves can be evil!
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Apr 6, 2020 01:25
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Though Mina looks like a particularly adorable alien.
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Apr 6, 2020 01:26
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When do we get the flashback to when Mina accidentally melted her little brother's face off the first time she manifested her quirk?
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Apr 6, 2020 01:50
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ZiegeDame posted:When do we get the flashback to when Mina accidentally melted her little brother's face off the first time she manifested her quirk? Maybe she melted herself just like Kirishima. Her skin isn't supposed to be pink, it's just all one big open wound. The horns are all natural of course.
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Apr 6, 2020 01:52
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It'll be pretty funny is the super cool rabbit themed hero dies on Easter. Hoping she'll just end up in the fake limbs club though like the color page.
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Apr 6, 2020 02:12
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TheKingofSprings posted:I think Mina, the girl that looks like a literal space alien and attacks with skin dissolving acid being a hero should be enough to counter those kinds of arguments I don't think Mina's quirk is really anywhere near as 'evil' seeming as like Shinsou's or some of the VA's. Heck even compared to some others in 1A it's fairly normal, Shouji's quirk is to form gross flesh tentacles with eyes and teeth from his back and he always wears a mask because he doesn't want people to be terrified of his face. But even so like among the good guys who have these messed up quirks none of them really seemed to have been shunned by society or fallen through the cracks as hard as the VA guys did, or at least we've never really been shown as such. Shinsou's scary quirk meant everyone immediately judged him unfairly and he wasn't given a fair shake at UA and kept out of the Hero program, but Twice's gave him huge identity issues and left him with a giant existential fear about whether he was real or not with seemingly the only person who cared about him prior to the VA being an underworld information broker. The story just really hammers home how hosed over a lot of the VA were and there's nothing really comparable from the heroes side so far, though granted we've had way more in-depth looks at the VA backstories than most of the heroes.
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Apr 6, 2020 02:15
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Twice also was a one man crime spree before his traumatic clone slaughter experience.
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Apr 6, 2020 02:28
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